How did your Dark Night of the Soul end?

[Nikolai1]

Anyone here have experience of a spiritual dark night?  

 

I'm not talking about depression, which is usually for some obvious reason.

 

I'm talking about that terrible dry feeling where it seems like nothing in the world can satisfy you or give you joy,  Where you go through life feeling like a robot, with no inclination for anything, and no particular aversion either.  Just feeling like you alone in this world and seem unable to see the point in it all, like you on the brink of death, but strangely aren't at all suicidal.

 

I'm sure some of you guys know this feeling!

 

Well how did it end for you? How did you know you were out of it? What are the tell-tale signs?

 

Thanks to you all!

[Moonbar]

Hello my friend

 

 Depression is hardly at all different than what youve described.

 

As for the dark night - does it ever really end?

[9th]

Anyone here have experience of a spiritual dark night?  

 

I'm not talking about depression, which is usually for some obvious reason.

 

Actually, clinical "depression" is classified as specifically having no reason.

[Nikolai1]

OK, but depression is a time of real pain and suffering, and in depression its very hard to live life as normal.  But I'm not talking about that.  I'm talking about the dark night of the soul - the deep inner dryness, but which doesn't prevent you from your daily business and others might not even realise there's something wrong with you.

[9th]

OK, but depression is a time of real pain and suffering, and in depression its very hard to live life as normal.  But I'm not talking about that.  I'm talking about the dark night of the soul - the deep inner dryness, but which doesn't prevent you from your daily business and others might not even realise there's something wrong with you.

 

Again, that sounds a lot like the clinical definition of "depression"... but Im not trying to imply that you have it, or that you are wrong about the dark night or whatever - but you may want to revise your ideas of depression.  In many cases I think people who are going thru a dark night period end up looking for treatment and being diagnosed as having "depression".  But its hard to say where the dividing line is in this arena, even neuroscientists dont agree on this stuff.  When it comes to "chemical imbalances" its always a question of chicken and the egg to a certain extent - unless there is a genuine physical deformity from birth.

 

In other words, I dont think you can say "oh its definitely not that", because I think they both get mixed up together, and rightly so - even though one may be recognized as a spirtual crisis and the other is not.

[Nikolai1]

I guess for me depression is a time of suffering, something undesirable that you want to recover from.

 

The dark night, and the phase I'm going through isn't really like that.  Its just an absence of will, of inspiration, and a feeling of very deep alienation from pretty much every human being.  Its very lonely, but not painful.  In fact, there is a very deep sense of peace underneath at all and a frequent sense of beauty.  And like I said, unless I talked about it, no-one would realise what I'm going through because its pretty much invisible on the outside. Those who have close dealings with me will notice that I'm quite apathetic and pretty much incapable of making decisions.

 

As for therapists, well I have no need or desire for one, and I know in advance that they couldn't possibly help - unless they were dishing out shaktipat.

[soaring crane]

here's a good read:

 

http://www.cracked.com/blog/5-facts-everyone-gets-wrong-about-depression/

[Michael Sternbach]

You mean, the Long Dark Tea-Time of the Soul?

 

When is it going to end? Will it ever?

Edited March 20, 2015 by Michael Sternbach

[Lth]

depression doesnt mean anytning. you could say that a depressed person doesnt want to express himself, thats all. if a persons reasoning ability is still intact then its his choice if he wants to express or not.

all the traditional psychologists and especially psychiatrists need to be locked up, as they are ruining healthy people with their bull craps

so nikolai may be having energy body awakening? because it seems like attention is shifted from physical body to spiritual. there can be amazing insight during this experience, but also fear. a lot of things happen and information come where you dont understand it, like if its coming from a different dimension. huge insight

[9th]

I guess for me depression is a time of suffering, something undesirable that you want to recover from.

 

Anyhow, to get back on topic - (instead of getting hung up on terms) - I would say that a certain sort of dispassion or disinterest can be an omen.  If you react in the standard way, its likely to seem "bleak" - because the mind will generate stories about it to reinforce old patterns, the same as it does with every situation and event.  The constant stream of thoughts-as-narration going on in your mind will shackle you to a certain experience - it will drive you to either express or internalize a repeat performance of an earlier response, usually tied to a particular "traumatic" event (which can be seemingly not a big deal to us as adults but would be experienced much differently as children).  These stories and thoughts that describe things in your mind are the voice of your own personality, as it continually recreates itself in an effort to maintain stability - as an attempt at permanence.

 

The stories and ideas and thoughts about what is occurring in life (whatever it may be) are exactly the things which prevent it from being another way.  When those stories and ideas and thoughts are gone, what remains is limitless potential.  The implications may not be immediate or all-encompassing to an absolute degree, as we are all subject to the consequences of this world until we die - but there is a fundamental difference that occurs when the core of being is uncovered.  As the source of your own life, it has infinite implications... and thats not even to mention the source of all things...

[Yasjua]

Dunno how it ended. I guess it was a gradual revival of my worldly sensibilities. I stopped caring about enlightenment, started living a more practical, settled, grounded life, and my interest for everything came back and manifested tenfold in intensity. Now I think everything is awesome. In the "Dark Night" I couldn't get into music, relationships, work, purpose, meaning, or anything else. It was just heal, heal, heal, seek, seek, seek, meditate, meditate, meditate, repeat. I'm pretty sure it's a temporary form of dissociative psychosis. Not to label it and write it off as inconsequential. I have no idea why I went through that shit. Was it drugz? Was it a genuine "spiritual crisis?" Am I a sharper, wiser, more intelligent and thoughtful creature because of the pressure cooker I went through? Yeh, probably. It feels like it's in the past so I don't think about it. I just attend to my life and enjoy the hodgepodge of things that come through me and to me and I get jiggy with the infinite folded into form by my brain, "yo."

[Nungali]

It ends by acknowledging soul, offering it appreciation and expression.  

 

But then again I see the classic 'dark night of the soul' as something entirely different from depression.  Depression I see more as 'loss of soul' ... its up to the shaman to retrieve it.

 

Then again, my definition of soul may be different from the normal  (however I find the 'norm' mostly confused about it ) .

[thelerner]

mostly

with long walks

in the dark

past midnight. 

 

 

time.. maturity.. friends.. perspective.. martial arts..

taking advantage of opportunities & long long walks

[9th]

The stone which the builders rejected has become the cornerstone.

 

This is the Lord's doing; it is marvelous in our eyes.

 

- Psalm 118

 

 

 

Yea, though I walk through the valley of the shadow of death, I will fear no evil: for thou art with me; thy rod and thy staff they comfort me.

 

Thou preparest a table before me in the presence of mine enemies: thou anointest my head with oil; my cup runneth over.

 

- Psalm 23

 

[Nikolai1]

Thanks to you all.

 

Yasjua talked about returning to music, art, meaning, relationships. For me I'm pretty sure that won't happen. This is why my future is hard to envisage. I won't go back to all that stuff.

 

Even philosophy which has been my main passion seems completely unable to give me anything I need. Th great philosophers know nothing I don't know myself, the great artists see nothing I don't see.

 

I don't need them now, and I won't in the future. So what comes next? My mind can't even conceive it which is why I wonder if I'm close to death. But I have no desire to die and aren't remotely suicidal. Maybe my heart will just stop beating - this would be a rational outer outcome to match the inner death that seems to have occurred.

 

The worlds activity is geared towards things I neither want nor need. I therefore cannot remotely conceive anything that is worth willing. And when you don't have.a will, when there is nothing to aim for, there is no future that can be imagined. I feel like I mliterally forced to live in e moment because the future is a blank.

 

I hope some of you can relate to this. Don't confuse it with depression. Depression is a very different thing altogether. I read he article that soaring crane posted and the only similarities are memory loss, which for me, is made worse by a weird flattening in time. I sometimes can't distinguish between yesterday and last year.

 

If something good happens I don't care, if something bad happens I don't care. I am immune to suffering, and to pleasure. The depressed person is only immune to pleasure. Maybe this is the best most obvious difference.

 

Apathy, listlessness and I profound inability to understand the world, the future, and your own place in it - this is e dark night of the soul.

[freeform]

I think there's a big difference between the 'dark night' and what most consider as 'depression' although sometimes the borders are blurred.

 

Depression is often characterised by what 9th mentioned - a dissociation from the present, being stuck in mental loops - thoughts and stories. There's often a disinterest in things because they seem to be separate and distant, and coloured by thoughts and by thoughts about thoughts... There's a sense of helplessness and a feeling of being victimised by everything.

 

The 'dark night' is characterised by an (initial) experience of complete presence. A complete engagement in the moment and all the magic that that brings... and then... you start to see all the 'stuff' you're holding... You see all that's keeping you from staying in that state - and it's usually a mixture of mundane and awful things, you see in yourself the potential for the darkest aspects of humanity - you see how you've treated people and you see how people treat eachother. And it's a feeling of profound loneliness - and an inability to connect to mundane existence... to have small-talk with your neighbour... to congratulate your colleague on his new car... to celebrate someone's birthday. Because it all seems so trivial, so pointless.

 

How did I get out of that? I'm not sure I did... it's more a case of degrees - sometimes it's there and strong and I feel alienated and sometimes not and I feel engaged with 'mundane' existence as well as the deep, profound existence.

 

What I can say is that at times when I feel the 'bright day of the soul' (just made that up ) - there's a sense of lightness and a 'so what?' sort of attitude. Where you can connect with someone on a mundane level, and still see an interplay between you on a much deeper level.

 

Connect with people.

 

Treat things as entertainment.

 

Be gentle to yourself - you can't meditate yourself out of this.

 

Find that child-like wonder that does not discriminate between the shallow and the deep.

 

Treat life as a constant experiment - the experiment is how can a limitless being experience the world in a very limited body? How can you dance between limitlessness and finiteness and be entertained by the dance - rather than constantly strive for some end-state scenario?

 

It's a sense of 'and that, and that, and that'. - meaning that you don't leave anything out - you wear your sadness on the same sleeve as your sense of profound bliss. Bring the darkest and the lightest aspects of you into the moment.

 

You know you're doing it correctly when the mundane starts to interweave with the magical - when your work colleague shares something deep with you - something she's unaccustomed to do. When fun coincidences show up... The other day I was talking about the night sky with someone I'd only just met - she told me that she'd never seen a shooting star - I said it's easy - just look up with wonder for long enough - we both looked up and within 30 seconds we saw a wonderful example of a shooting star. (Just be careful about reading anything into that sort of thing - remember to treat it lightly - as entertainment, not something profoundly meaningful)

Edited March 21, 2015 by freeform

[Nikolai1]

Thanks freeform - really great post.

 

Do you feel like your bright days are winning out over the dark nights?

[freeform]

In general yes... And I tend to ride out the dark nights easier - since I see it as a sign of progress - of stuff coming up for attention and transmutation. Similarly I've taken the same stance with the blissful days - something to work through. There's a difference between seeing a swimming pool and jumping in and getting wet (if you get what I mean...)

 

Sometimes I have clear, simple, 'uncoloured' days - these are the times I appreciate most.

Edited March 21, 2015 by freeform

[Nikolai1]

This latest dark phase was brought on recently by a week in French ski resort.  I used to absolutely love skiing, and it was an important part of my life, and all my friends.  But this time skiing gave me no more pleasure than walking or even sitting on the sofa.  All was the same to me.  So I found myself looking around me thinking. "Why are you doing this?  Why haven't you outgrown it like I have? Why have you all travelled halfway across Europe at extreme cost for this?"

 

So this is definitely something I have to work on.  Why do I even care what others do for fun? Why can't I come to terms with other people and the way they are?

[freeform]

This latest dark phase was brought on recently by a week in French ski resort.  I used to absolutely love skiing, and it was an important part of my life, and all my friends.  But this time skiing gave me no more pleasure than walking or even sitting on the sofa.  All was the same to me.

 

Ah yes - I completely get that. I've been travelling extensively recently - and I've joined friends who marvel at the sights and sounds and novelty. But for me all sights and sounds and smells seem novel - whether they're at home or in an ancient monastery in a burmese jungle.

 

It's a tricky one. It's also tied into 'what do I do now?' When everything is the same - when all choices and roads seem to lead to presence why would i do anything other than nothing?

 

So one thing I've been toying with is passion... not in the ordinary 'emotionally intense' sense - but passion for the sake of passion... hard to explain. But having passion dictate my choices in life and lead me is proving interesting. Immediately passion is having me do things I'm not comfortable with - like being the centre of attention in social situations... and it's an interesting thing as passion breeds more passion. Being pushed out of my comfort zone is having me experience new parts of myself.

 

It somehow includes the fundamental idea that there's nothing to do, whilst having me spontaneously do things I'm not used to. It requires bravery - and at the moment it's still very early days, so sometimes I follow my passion but often I don't... At some point I imagine one could live 'spontaneously' in passion - maybe it's some approximation of Wu wei - which seems the only way one can live with a constant state of 'awakeness'.

[Lth]

its your judging ego that want to survive, because it knows its time is up.

if you decide to "die" and leave your body, dont go with the shadowy figure that lead you through the tunnel. most expert OBEr's tell that these entities are there to trick you, as in they see a person awakening and feed him an end scenario, give him a choice to die. but most likely what will happen if you go through the tunnel youll get a coerced life review and end up reincarnating somewhere else. and since you already awakened that wouldnt be nice to start all over again, at least thats what i did at the last moment, i was being pulled through the tunnel then at the last moment i snapped out of it and so who knows what would have happened.

so thats kind of a warning or heads up if that happens to you

but good luck on your journey

[Lth]

So this is definitely something I have to work on.  Why do I even care what others do for fun? Why can't I come to terms with other people and the way they are?

 

this is definitely what happened to me as well. i think its because during this time when you look at a person, you see directly into his soul. and a regular person that is mind-identified is not aligned with his soul. so you see inside the person and dont understand why is he making decisions not based on his soul, which is actually him, and not mind or any other one part of the body. you see loneliness/suffering in a person but that person doesnt feel that hes lonely or anything else. maybe on a surface level only. but yeah you see a trapped soul inside a body and that pisses you off

[Lth]

Being pushed out of my comfort zone is having me experience new parts of myself. It somehow includes the fundamental idea that there's nothing to do, whilst having me spontaneously do things I'm not used to. It requires bravery - and at the moment it's still very early days, so sometimes I follow my passion but often I don't... At some point I imagine one could live 'spontaneously' in passion - maybe it's some approximation of Wu wei - which seems the only way one can live with a constant state of 'awakeness'.

 

i used to beat myself up if i hesitated to act out on an extreme situation. the more extreme the more i beat me up for not doing it. thats how i managed to progress quickly and obliterated fear completely

 

good stuff, it can be hard at times

[Nikolai1]

Hi freeform - you are totally speaking my language, thank you.

 

It's a tricky one. It's also tied into 'what do I do now?' When everything is the same - when all choices and roads seem to lead to presence why would i do anything other than nothing?

 

Exactly and precisely.  This is why I don't want this to be confused with depression.  Each moment has richness.  There are no highs and lows.  Everything is equally rich - hence the stagnation.  But I do not want to go back to the old ways of pleasure seeking, that would be backward step.

 

So one thing I've been toying with is passion... not in the ordinary 'emotionally intense' sense - but passion for the sake of passion... hard to explain.

 

Yes I'm sure.  If you could explain it, it would be something everyday and conventional.  I guess passion, true passion, has to strike from nowhere.  And because its unexplainable its probably very hard to notice when it comes, because our ears only hear what they have always been conditioned to hear.

 

I think this is my situation.  I can't remember the last time I was impassioned enough to follow any particular path.  Passion is what I'm waiting for! But maybe I need to listen out better; I need to realise that passion is a thing whispered in the moment and then missed, not some grand project me that is going to absorb me, like a 5 year plan.

 

 

 

At some point I imagine one could live 'spontaneously' in passion - maybe it's some approximation of Wu wei - which seems the only way one can live with a constant state of 'awakeness'. 

 

 

 

Yes this is how imagine wu wei as well.  I think this spontaneous inspiration is the only way for me to continue living because I won't ever return to deliberate aims and objectives that 'make sense'.  Unless I do die, of course.

[Nikolai1]

Hi Lth

 

so thats kind of a warning or heads up if that happens to you

 

Got it, thanks!

 

 i think its because during this time when you look at a person, you see directly into his soul. and a regular person that is mind-identified is not aligned with his soul. so you see inside the person and dont understand why is he making decisions not based on his soul,

 

Thanks - I actually prefer that way of viewing it.  In this thread, I looked at the problem from the other perspective.  I am looking from my own soul, but seeing only their mind-based self, and then feeling angst about the separation between us.  Angst about what I have become, and where I am headed.

 

I think the sense of kinship with other humans has always been the antidote to angst, or, if you like, love for humanity is the substitute for divine love.  I think that's why it is scary to set yourself apart, before God has stepped in to replace them.

 

But don't think I had some general love for humanity before.  I loved some people, and thought others were scumbags.  Maybe with God's love I can love all humans without exception!