Uroboros

Soaring Crane- I have been playing with the German Vowels and they are impressive! I can feel them, right away, in the region they are "supposed" to be in. Interestingly, it is also starting to open things up and resonate more the more I do them. Thank you for sharing! The vowel sounds are, from what little I have heard, words of power. A very powerful way of working with reality and the universal force. What has your experience been with them? Peace

Sure, plenty use it together. I spent 10 years using Western Medicine. Now, I am having to repair the damage that was done and heal what was never healed. There is plenty of good in it, for sure. It is not my path, though. That depends on what you consider tolerance. Is tolerance letting people say what they want to say and not saying what you want? If so, then it is one sided. Spectrums of tolerance! Thank you! I wish you good health, as well! Edit- After a bit of thought, I wonder if Tolerance would stem, mostly, from the Yi/Spleen. If the Yi opens potentials and tolerance is an acceptance of other potentials, maybe a Yi imbalance is at play. Peace

Hm.. - is it healed yet- nope-....How do these two statements oppose each other? I was asking if you did not want it to be possible. Much is misunderstood/ missed thru typing. Clarification was the intent. Criticism is a good thing! Your comment seemed a bit strange since you did not explain why what I said was contradictory, then asked a question about validity. That is why I asked to clarify your intent. I have no interest in debating if it is possible. I do not need to prove my story. It is just that, my story. Tests will prove nothing, since the "skeptic" will not be there when I take them. The idea is also not based on my story. It is based on TCM theory. In my experience, liver function tests, which I have had done in the past, told the western orthodox doctors nothing about its true condition. In my experience, there are far more reliable ways to see/ test and those have shown themselves to be accurate when done by a skilled practitioner. Examples- applied kinesiology, the various forms of chinese diagnosis, symptom grouping and channel state. There is peace if I choose to have peace, just as you can choose peace. Peace

My experience is based on observation and symptoms. Eye color, pain in liver area, feelings of sluggishness, temple area headaches/ migraines, nausea, before and after detoxification(liver specific and other) and what various doctors have said (that my liver is weakened/ damaged based on the doctor). Do I have tests to "prove" my argument? No. Do I need to? No. I have no argument to prove. Its just an idea. Something to think about and see if it works for a person in their own experience, if it has any value. If it has none for you, so be it! Is there a reason you do not want this idea to be possible? Quoting what I said in reply to the contradiction comment and asking if I have tests, which wont ever really prove anything to you or anyone else, does not address what you thought was a contradiction and why you thought it was one. Peace

Interesting...i did not see the connection to dreams.. They are restless, looking for action. You must have dreams so amazing, that your mind cannot handle the awesomeness! haha. Very good point. I will explore why my dreams are the way they are....Oh, fun! There is some amount of self actualization, yep. How much? Only the shadow knows....... I can slap the liver area lightly, as you said and it does not hurt. The liver sometimes hurts on its own time. hah! I should fire it! Thank you for your insight and help, Dawei. Peace

Yes, the new system...Grrr!!! I got allot before they changed it. I did have to pay 8 bucks, I spent a month gathering like a squirrel! I got over a hundred books from that 8 dollars. MAUAHAHA! Here ya go! Fresh to order! http://www.biblio.nhat-nam.ru/The_systematic_classic_of_acupuncture_and_moxibustion.pdf

hehe, questions! Fun. I dream almost always. They are wild, crazy, constantly changing. Often times violent in some form. Like an action movie! Courage? Hmm....I have it and I dont. Its a constant pull between knowing what I want to do/ be and restricting my self. Overall, I have quite a bit of courage. I always do what is right for me at the time. No matter how scary. What say you, oh wise one?! Peace

Hahaha! Naww. Not like that. You can get it on Scribd. Thats where I got it. A book worth having, me thinks. Please do let me know what you think when you can read it. Peace

Not a contradiction. There is heal-ing, it is not heal-ed, yet. The aspect of my Spirit that is connected is also not heal-ed, yet. If you still think there is a contradiction, please explain what you think and why. Otherwise, it is not clear and understanding cannot be gained. Peace

Yea! That book. It is interesting. Allot of it is a bit too complex for me, yet. There are pieces I can grasp, which I find fascinating. Its a nice book to have. What do you think, Dawei?

Ohh! That is helpful to know! Thanks, Turtle Shell! I will experiment with those.... Peace

It is fascinating, isnt it?! I love the way the Taoist/ Classical books/ systems see the world. Especially how It has a depth to it, in how the universe, our small place in it, is perceived. An example of Spirit->Organ healing in my own life. I have had Liver problems since I was born. I have also had intense anger problems. From what I understand, the Hun has something to do with boundaries and humanity. Also kindness. To ones self and others. So, boundaries is something I have worked on. Also, learning to express anger in a healthy, balanced way. I have noticed that anger fortified personal boundaries. Its very powerful and establishes boundaries that may be weak or broken. In doing that work, my liver changes. It starts to work more, sometimes it gets un-stuck by itself after I work on a spiritual/mental/emotional aspect connected to it. I can feel it move and gurgle. Is it healed yet? Nope. I have experienced a connection, though. When you say a large number of Spirits, BKA, what amount are you talking about? More then just one that is expansive and vast? I would love to hear what you know/ think! Thanks. Peace

Fantastic! Im glad you joined in! Please do share some if you remember. That would be a great addition! I have heard that some QiGong systems, like Dayan and Yi Jin Jing, use the sounds differently. They have their own categorization that does match the 6, yet can be different. Such as pairs, instead of single sounds. I look forward to hearing what you learned, Daojones! Peace

Wooo! Yay for excuses! Let me know what you find out! I am interested to hear what you find by combining all this. Thanks! Peace

I found this in a book I am reading thru- When a disease is in the viscera, choose the well points. When a disease results in a change of color, choose the rapids points. When a disease is sometimes mild and sometimes severe, choose the brook points. When a disease results in changes in the voice or is due to repletion within a channel [a variant version says “connecting vessels”] and (stagnant) blood, choose the stream points. And when a disease is in the stomach [a variant version says “chest”] or is caused by irregularities in eating and drinking, choose the confluence points. Therefore this is spoken of as flavor ruling the confluence points. Together these are called the five changes (associated with the five transporting points). Connecting this theory with the chart above and the sounds could be powerful. What are your thoughts? Peace

The reason I picked Small Intestine 11 was because that is where her pain started. It was the first place that became sore, then it spread down the channel into her arm. So, I started at the first point of pain. It worked quite well. Wonderful charts! Very helpful to have the types laid out so clearly. Thanks, Dawei! Peace

For example- Last night I felt my heart was a bit iffy, so I pressed and massaged Pericardium 6. It felt a little sore, so I did 3 rounds of HA while pressing it. Afterwards, my heart felt better and the point did not hurt. Another time, I was feeling a bit coughy/ sneezy. It was also hard to breathe. Lung 7 often times helps my breathe/ diaphragm to move lower and deepen the breath. So, I rubbed and pressed Lung 7 and did some Si's. My breath felt much smoother and deeper afterwards. My girlfriend had pain in her Small Intestine channel area, so I massaged the point of origin, SM 11, while she did 3 HA's. Afterwards, she felt better. She then did three Kee's/ Xi, Triple Warmer sound. Her arm felt much better and SM 11 did not hurt anymore. This is what I have been experimenting with. Its quite powerful, so far. I have been choosing points based on what they do and if they hurt. It seems to work quite well. Try it out! Peace

Excellent! Thank you for posting this excerpt, Dawei! These breaths are so powerful! Its a fantastic healing system to have on hand. Its so much more then just purging. I have experimented with pressing channel points and using the corresponding healing sound. The channel "clears" much faster. If there is pain along the channel or at the point, the sound helps clear it faster. Tis a powerful combination, breath, sound and channel manipulation. Have you ever tried this, Dawei? If so, what did you experience?

AH! Fantastic find, Dawei!! Thank you for posting it! It is a very interesting book. I keep going back to the 6 Breaths section and experimenting with the different systems it talks about. So far, they do seem to work. An example, my gf was dealing with a state of excess cold affecting the kidneys. So, we tried a few breaths of the Sun Simiao formula. It prescribes Si for kidneys and excess cold in the body! Perfect! Did 3 breaths, felt better. Did 10, improvement. we stopped at 30 forceful breathes and 10 soft. It said 50, then 10 soft. Afterwards, she did feel much better. Her kidneys did not hurt at all! Using them in this way could be potentially life altering. We would have access to the most basic function, breath, and be able to heal our selves with it in a clinical fashion. Thats what I am experimenting with right now. I am so glad your interest in the sounds has been revived, Dawei! There is much gold to be found in them. Peace

So far I have yet to find anything that does "one" thing. Maybe it has one function. Such as gathering. Yet, it can gather a whole range of "things"! It is so amazing! In my limited experience and experimentation with the sounds, they are extremely medicinal. You can use them to heal from specific states that are arising. Bring them to balance. Tis quite fun! Peace

That is an excellent point! The little Fire systems, Triple Burner and Pericardium, must not be overlooked! In a book called Daoist Body Cultivation, on the section of the 6 Breaths, it talks about various treatise/ books that talk about the 6 Breaths. In one section, it talks about Sun Simiao in the Qianjin Yifang (supplementary prescription worth a thousand gold pieces) and Xi is prescribed for Spleen, aches, yellow in dreams and infants playing with danger. The same book also talks about the Yangxing Yangming Lu (on nourishing inner nature and extending life). It says in that book, that Xi will drive out all afflictions. This paragraph of this section is what got me thinking about the sounds in a different way- If you want to practice the exhalation method of the long breath, use Chui when you are cold, Hu when you are warm. The breaths are most excellent for curing diseases. Chui will drive out wind; Hu will drive out heat; Xi will drive out affliction; He will make the qi descend; Xu will disperse blockages; and Si will moderate extremes. Since ordinary people are frequently given to extremes, they will use a lot of Xu and Si. Xu and Si are the core of the long breath. ( 2.2b-3a; Ding 1993, 16) I have noticed a trend. The sounds have been assigned different properties/ abilities by different people. Some say Chui will expel excess cold, some say it will drive out wind, some say it will drive out heat. Another says Chui will keep the kidneys at ease during winter. I have experimented with using the sounds in the fashion the above paragraph says to and it does work. I was feeling very cold and I used Chui. After about 3 breathes, I felt much warmer. I find this way of looking at and using them to be very interesting. Maybe these sounds do more then just purge the organs. That has been my experience, at least. Also, the chinese system of thought is not just the western anatomical organ. They are also a system/ function of the whole. Remembering that has helped me to see the function of these sounds in a different way. Hope someone finds this interesting! Peace

http://baharna.com/chant/six_healing.htm This is a interesting compilation.

Interesting...I had not thought of that! The Ascending and Descending organ/ channel connection.... I have heard of different ways of explaining the 6 sounds, which actually seem to be different sounds. One says Hoo and another says Chui for kidneys. They dont actually say Hoo, they say how to make the sound, which is exactly like Hoo. Lips in an O shape, blow out with a whistling wind sound.. Another one explains Hoo and Fu as the same, which they do not seem to be. Fu talks about the F and Oo sound with the whistle, while another explains Hoo as just H and Oo. Both sources say its the same organ/ channel and the same sound. Is it? I wonder if there are slight variations of the sounds, which are actually different sounds themselves! If so, it could expand upon its healing uses. http://www.egreenway.com/qigong/sixhealingsounds.htm This website has exerpts from a few sources. Here is what it says about the Earth sound- Pronounced as the word "who", with the lips rounded and the tongue suspended in mid-mouth, as though blowing out a cande. - Daniel Reid Keep the lips soft and loose, let the tongue float freely in the mouth not touching the inside of the mouth, allow the lips to buzz. "The FU healing sound has three components- the consonant, the vowel, and the wind sound. The consonant is the sound f, and it allows you to release the excessive buildup of heat exhaust in the spleen. The vowel sound of FU is the sound u, and it serves to strengthen the organ. The subvocal wind sound nourishes the organ and is the soud your vibrating lips make when you blow ar through them, such as when you are trying to amke a baby laugh or imitating the sould of a propeller plane in flight." Sat Chuen Hon. What if those are two different sounds? Hoo and Fu? That would be interesting! Dawei- What do you mean by keep it to the front/ back? Do you mean the sound is coming from the lips more then the back of the throat and vice versa? Thank you! Peace

Oh, terrible indeed! We must go put forth such tremendous effort in the pursuit of knowledge and truth!! hah! From the little that I have read/ heard about Yin/ Yang, its comparison based. This is Yang compared to that which is Yin, etc. After more thought, there could be substances in the body that are always Yin, compared to the whole system. So long as you are "human", this "thing" is Yin and this is Yang. Still comparison based, just more constant. Is there an absolute Yin, that is always Yin no matter what it is compared to? That would be neat! I assumed the same about female sexual fluids. Yet, the more fluids there are, the more magic seems to happen, in my experience. Maybe the fluids are conductors of some sort. The more sexual fluids a woman produces, changes how the energy flows..... I want to know how to mix the male and female sexual fluids and create healing/ rejuvination for both! So far, ejaculation drains me a bit. Interestingly, the longer I store sexual energy without ejaculation and have sex, when I do ejaculate, the fatigue is far less. A lot of energy is built up. How to channel and store it efficiently is the problem! Hmm...If the person with the most male/ Yang energy embodies and expresses that energy in the purest way they can and the person with the most feminine/ Yin energy does the same....I wonder if that would create a whole different dynamic? Thoughts! Peace

I respect that! Im quite new to this, as well. Peace