Nungali

Yes , that is the other view and 'understanding' that I do not hold . Except I do sorta as a tent pole IS doing something , and if anyone is going to do something .... why not do it well . Your second paragraph I dont consider an outcome of the 'in the world' philosophy. I never suggested one goes and 'does good ' or becomes arrogant about it .

I dont know ..... but they where exorcism poems

Oh sorry .... " the normal 'straw dogs' " then .

Urrrg ... you messed up the quote function . You : " those are with or of power for human being interaction and for most types of beings, but "even worse viscous attacks that are devoid of any human sensibilities or conscience that one would normally have with most human beings. if trying to use spiritual human related virtues where they are not applicable. Surely you already know of some of this...? " I know fake people cant use them with power . But that does not mean that they do not have power of themselves when used correctly . What else triumphs over evil and despair ? This is the day which down the void abysm At the Earth-born's spell yawns for Heaven's despotism, And Conquest is dragged captive through the deep; Love, from its awful throne of patient power In the wise heart, from the last giddy hour Of dead endurance, from the slippery steep, And narrow verge of crag-like agony, springs And folds over the world its healing wings. Gentleness, Virtue, Wisdom, and Endurance– These are the seals of that most firm assurance Which bars the pit over Destruction's strength; And if, with infirm hand, Eternity, Mother of many acts and hours, should free The serpent that would clasp her with his length, These are the spells by which to reassume An empire o'er the disentangled doom. To suffer woes which Hope thinks infinite; To forgive wrongs darker than death or night; To defy Power, which seems omnipotent; To love, and bear; to hope till Hope creates From its own wreck the thing it contemplates; Neither to change, nor falter, nor repent; This, like thy glory, Titan, is to be Good, great and joyous, beautiful and free; This is alone Life, Joy, Empire, and Victory! or even ... for those with 'skill' ( good 'kung fu' ) THE MAGICIAN O Lord, deliver me from hell's great fear and gloom! Loose thou my spirit from the larvae of the tomb! I seek them in their dread abodes without affright: On them will I impose my will, the law of light. I bid the night conceive the glittering hemisphere. Arise, O sun, arise! O moon, shine white and clear! I seek them in their dread abodes without affright: On them will I impose my will, the law of light. Their faces and their shapes are terrible and strange. These devils by my might to angels I will change. These nameless horrors I address without affright: On them will I impose my will, the law of light. These are the phantoms pale of mine astonied view, Yet none but I their blasted beauty can renew; For to the abyss of hell I plunge without affright: On them will I impose my will, the law of light. Like anything , say a sword , it depends on who uses it and how they use it . But no .... some untrained inexperienced new age smudge sticker better not try to dispel a real nasty 'infestation' . However they may be effective for normal " human being interaction and for most types of beings" ( unless the smudge stickers are the cause of the problem ) regarding more intense forces the magician should be well trained and 'armed on all points' . Its very foolish to step into the ring without enough experience .... still that does not mean that boxing gloves or a fencing foil is weak and inappropriate . The normal cattle might be frightened into compliance by 'showing them an inch of steel ' ( a slight partial draw of the sword ) .... but you better know ho to actually use it well when dealing with 'tough customers' .

I suppose each school / type will have a different answer depending on what energy they are working with and where they are working; what the inside and outside places are like . There is a vast difference between martial arts training in the hall than outside , for a variety of reasons . Western traditional magick is often worked inside , in a temple or Lodge , while pagan stuff like Wicca is worked outside in nature and there is a difference and reason behind this . In some initiatory bodies in the west , the first series is done pretty much 'in nature' , even if symbolically * , the next in lodge , then in 'chapter' then in 'hermitage ' . One difference in the energy is the result of the energy coming into you or the energy generated due to the effect indoors or outdoors has on you psychically . * one successful; set up we had was a 'temple' ( cheap and temporary made from bamboo and black building plastic walls, open to the night sky , sand floor ) that was it, no other stuff except some basics in the middle . It worked unexpectedly well ; in the dim lighting from the central candle faded out just as ones vision reached the black walls , allowing one's imagination to extend the space and feel like you where in the middle of a desert wasteland at night * or add whatever the 'imagination' might throw up .... a few saw 'others' in the shadows witnessing the ceremonies ) * the 'scenario' of the first initiation . A Lodge is usually set up to reflect nature as shown to us in the cosmos - the heavens and asterisms , and their confluence of forces .

Oh ? This is a conversation ? I must have entered the wrong room !

Okay then ... what virtues CAN be applied to 'demonic forces' ? And while I am asking you questions ... why are 'demonic forces' equated to 'astral' ??? and why do you consider virtues like reasoning, compassion, kindness, turning the other cheek, compromise, tolerance, etc. without 'power' ?

I'm confused about this .... what where ? if some posts got removed from the thread can we pleased be informed about that . Not what they where but just that some where removed , then any (seemingly ) strange reactions ( that are left posted and not removed ) or any warnings ..... make sense ,

And the same is reflected in our 'selves' within the psyche . When we operate under the illusion we have a single self , things appear to work ok. When parts and nodes of ourselves start to split off and create separate identities the single human begins to operate like the confused mass of humanity does . Its 'interesting ' * to see that reflected in a small community as well . * wow , is my foul mouth being well behaved to day !

To me, that sounds like what I just said . Action is the outcome , but where do speech and action arise from if not via thought ? That is saying volition and choice come before thought . ? It seems backwards to me ; deed speech and mind ..... thought drives action not choice driving thought . Indeed .... and then you are dead . I cant help not appreciatthe mixed up concepts and the sketchy outline and the possibly bad translations . I prefer, when dealing with the three activities to realise ; Feeling, and thought, and ecstasy Are but the cerements of Me. Thrown off like planets from the Sun Ye ae but satellites of the One. But should your revolution stop Ye would inevitably drop Headlong within the central Soul, And all the parts become the Whole. Sloth and activity and peace, When will ye learn that ye must cease? For me 'work/works ' is sorta misplaced here .... the work or 'the physical activities' comes after or as a result of the three primaries and are a pendant to them or a result of them . But still, all this is moved, in the first instance , by thought ( 'higher air ' / 'pneuma' ) " Fixed thought is a means to an end. Therefore pay attention to the power of silent thought and meditation. The material act is but the outward expression of thy thought, and therefore hath it been said that "the thought of foolishness is sin." Thought is the commencement of action, and if a chance thought can produce much effect, what cannot fixed thought do? " And abides therein .... for what purpose ? Bliss ? When will you learn that this too must cease ? As a few know here I do not support the eastern view of 'enlightened retirement from the world ' . I am from the school of enlightened involvement with the world .

yeah .... we got them here a bit further north

To and if there are any women left on this forum .... who happen to be mothers . I hope at least someone shows you appreciation today . Mothers- none of us would be here without them . [ I told a woman friend how I was going to help a little boy make a Mother's Day card for his Mum . I explained the tradition to him and said many give a card , but Mothers really like it if their kid makes the card , no matter what it looks like . His Mom found out and told me " Don't bother , I am not very sentimental, I will probably just end up throwing it in the bin . " Me ; Woman friend ; Then , woman friend goes ; " I won' t be getting anything special R......... (her partner and father of their kid ) does not celebrate or believe in Mother's day as his mother didnt . " ( his family is German and seems to have some unusual beliefs ) Me : " Why on Earth not ? " Her; " His Mother says that Mother's Day was invented by Hitler . "

Thats a curious way to interpret that . You are not being in 'Buddha nature' by being the donkey . YOU are the donkey and the 'Buddha nature' is riding you . Or if you like ( as some one else liked this analogy recently ) ; 'You ' ( 'Buddha Nature You ' ) are up in the light, sunshine and air , floating in your boat . The 'donkey' ( that is you ) is the undersea drone , 'living' observing , reacting, collating information that it sends back up to its operator . Of course, if a clear connection is lost between the two ... all sorts of mischief and 'pointlessness' might start happening. And it is Okay to hit the Ox , as long as that ox is you ... as well . There are three beasts that may run wild in the psyche of Man . How shalt they plow thy inner fields for cultivation if not the yoke constrains them and the whip of their Master guides them ? The Ox, the Horse and the Unicorn are not easily obedient to thy will . The Ox is thought . The Unicorn is speech. The Horse is action. As The Master ( Zuradašt ) taught .... the three central principles : Good thoughts , good words , good deeds . But how to cultivate them ? By practices . As they are , by nature, wild beasts . .

Its weird aint it . Remember Idi Amin ? Talk about a walking atrocity maker ! The British helped him 'evolve' though ( he kept winning them money in army boxing matches ) and kept getting promoted by them . ( To be sung to the tune of Gilbert And Sullivan's ' When I Was A Lad' : " And I punched in the other's heads so violently that they made me a general in the British Army . " ) I cant remember how many assassination attempts he survived , he even survived one when he was touring in a jeep, standing up in back seat waving to people . Some one lobbed a live grenade at him , he hand batted it back at them as if it was a tennis ball. Even the British Foreign Secretary at the time ( David Owen * ) proposed assassination , but Amin 'escaped ' from that as well . * "I'm not ashamed of considering it, because his regime goes down in the scale of Pol Pot as one of the worst of all African regimes". Some type of 'divine providence ' ? ? ? Then, after a lifetime of evil atrocities he gets deposed and exiled to ..... Saudi Arabia , under the sanctuary of their Royal family who paid him a generous subsidy and accommodation on the top two floors of the Novotel Hotel in Jeddah.

Watching me cook at work would have been aversion therapy ; Some film, cant remember what ; Queensland - stinky hot, sweaty and muggy . Unit have set us up at the end of the car park at the airport ; hot black asphalt , no shade . I am surrounded by two waist high BBQ plates on full bore and three very large boiling cauldron pots ( that go from ground level to mid thigh ). I am in the middle and feeling my body is being cooked as well . Insert cursing, abuse and swearing sounds coming from me to my boss " Just because you come from tent in desert .... doesnt mean .... " ( he is Iranian ) . This part of the car[ark is up the back, next to the fence. near the other side of fence is a runway end . Then a huge jumbo jet starts taxing towards me . Slowly turns around so its back is towards me and then starts powering up for a take off ! Now I have a burning sun overhead , a near feinting heat radiating up off the black asphalt underfoot, getting blasted by 2 BBQs and 3 boiling pots and steam and now .... the close up exhaust blat from a Jumbo jet ! " And NOW ,,, you F*^X#!*X idiot xx*&!% #@*&X*%^ ! ..... etc . " (just as well the blast from the engines drowned out what I said to him . ) - I do like the way that Luke Nguyen ( 'Vietnam Journey' ) cooks in a little canoe or on a rock while his cooker and feet are in the water ... or just sits down on the street and cooks ; One time he was cooking with a group of kids around him and they start laughing . Luke: "What's so funny ?" Kids; " Horse is eating your ingredients ." he turns to the other side and ... yep, a horse has eaten half his ingredients he had on a side table

Yeah ? I am a bit the opposite . I guess its my Cancerian 'homebody' nature ; " No no .... you go off to work , your busy and successful. I'll take kids to school, pick them up and amuse them and dinner, and hot outside fire bath will be ready when you get here . " ... and I will be in heaven . Thing is, its a rare person that can receive that . Many are worried about 'implications' and 'payback' or whatever gets triggered in them . Me ? I am wholly selfish , that's my motivation .... I do stuff like that because I enjoy it and I get a good buzz from it .

I have adopted another one * ..... here she is with Mom . Easy to cook for ... she loves tomatoes or any Moroccan cooking ( her homeland ) and , of course ..... honey . Here she is with 'auntie' , working in the family business ; * or she may have adopted me . - We where at a gathering in neighbor's teepee , I went outside to get a snack off the table there and she followed me ; " Where is your house ?" "Other there . " "I cant see it. " " Walk across the paddock a bit and you will see around the bushes." "I still cant see it, take me there . " So I walk her over and point . "I still cant see it it has trees and bushes around it , take me there ." " Okay, but quickly , I haven't told your mum I am taking you . " and on it went .... " Where is the door , where do you cook, where do you sleep , where this, how that ? " In retrospect I think she was actually 'casing there joint ' ; " Yeah ... I could do okay here ; got food on hand , a nice play area on soft carpet in front of the fire " ..... she had already checked inside the fridge out And now, that's exactly what goes on . I could not even install a new lounge as it intruded on 'her' play area - had to build one myself and design it appropriately . ... luv her to bits though ... we instantly connected .

The last full Moon here on the farm had very strange effects : .

? I thought I had already inherited my 'birth rite' .... that's why I am here and got all this . You mean there is even more to come ? !

No, I think a lot of men like to 'get into hot water re. sex ' ( I am not a fan of it myself ..... all that 'bear hair' keeps cloggin up the filter ! )

I have personally known a great kind and helpful teacher that nearly got into hot water over sex . I got great teaching/ practices from him / them ( Karma Kagyu ). They did have a few homeless youth staying there and the issue was one of homosexual attraction and 'exploration' with young lads ( I think they where 'of age' ... just ) . The reason there was no full immersion (in the hot water ) was after a report and resultant visit by lama , it was hand waved away . ... and this part is my assumption : as that happens all the time in monasteries . However , I felt it did not impact on the kindness and helpfulness of the teachers there . I got benefit , the boys seemed happy , the one eyed cat and the three legged dog ( also homeless that they took in ) seemed well looked after .

... there is nothing worse than a smug cat before breakfast

Noooo ( the first part ) and YES ! ( the second ) Its just because you young and have not experienced .... WOMANOPAUSE ( Men's menopause ) . let me explain ; It starts as a strange sensation in the 'nether regions' and moves up through the body to lodge near the top of the head . Some say it is the brain, returning to its rightful place .

YES! Its a common theme 'on the commune' . Actually, some seem permanently stuck in in hat cycle . Wow . Try working in the film industry for that one ! Conversation with a 'muppet' at work ; Q : " If you could be anyone you wanted to be , who would you be ? " Me; " Look, stop asking stupid questions and get back to work . " Q ; " F*** you ! Why are you always so .... so .... frustrating ! Me: " Okay then ... my answer is 'myself' . I am very happy with being myself . I have put a lot of work into that . " Q, " What ... YOU ! You have to be kidding . Me; " Okay , who would you rather be ... other than yourself ? " Q ; " Ohhhh , I dunno ... someone like Brad Pitt . " Me : " You are a total f****** idiot ! " Q : " Whats wrong with that ? Why are you such an a*** hole .... < rant rave etc > Me ; " Okay ... look I am sorry about that . I take it back . You know what ? i actually hope it works out for you . I hope one day you can become Brad Pitt yourself . " Q : " Really ? ..... Thanks mate ! Geee ... you are not that bad a bloke at all . " But ..... but .... ... now you have hurt my feelings ....