Nungali

Many women believe men are somewhat the opposite of 'advanced machines' ;

Soft squishy machines .... with blood . ... and dont try to use logic or reasons on demons

Finally ! Someone actually got you to admit that ! So, you now realise this 'God' that is persecuting you and did weird things to you and your 'Aiwass experience' and all that other magical stuff you have been claiming since you came here ...and now all this stuff about you thinking you have an Hermetic Order of the Golden Dawn grade is ... all in your head .

The things , there is only one way it can be proven and that way cannot prove a negative .

So might the opposite belief Did you know that 'choosing certain beliefs' ( instead of developing them and being led by them, from mostly entirely unknown causes and reasons ) can put one in a better state of mind ?

Not in Jyotish , but in western astrology I have seen some deal with this . It gets narrowed down by examining your specific traits - a type of 'reverse engineering . You could try astrology forums or astodienst ( which also has a forum) . https://www.astro.com/h/index_e.htm

Its remarkable how quick I can go from someone that knows nothing , to a respected opinion (although different ) and then.... somehow ... into a Satanic Barak Obama supporter Ummmm ..... Jamdrop .... you are ranting and raving like some internet cuckoo !

Hallelujah ! I hear he also discovered America ! Yea ! I won ! - Tough tough luck 'Jamdrop' . ( slight correction ' I dont particularly 'like' Crowley . I actually wrote somewhere about how he could act like a turd and a real bitch .... maybe you missed that bit ? )

What ? Henry Ford nailed 16 crucified world saviours ? History is bunk ! But apparently 'alternative history' is not . Nor is it bunk if one decides to quote history on wikipedia to show that history is bunk and this forum is about Daoist Texts carry on Bums ....

and I think 'history repeats ' isn't exactly the proposition . But I do prefer this glimpse ; " Does history repeat itself, the first time as tragedy, the second time as farce? No, that's too grand, too considered a process. History just burps, and we taste again that raw-onion sandwich it swallowed centuries ago. Julian Barnes

Yes , that is one of the differences too . I think they might be called 'archetypes' . You probably know of the four major male ones .

hey G . First I note your post is not an attack on mine but usually when peeps do that they edit out my relevant bits and then quote the selcted bit without context and then 'vent their superiority' on it . But they usually dont just copy edit out and copy nearly all of it except " One way of looking at it is " and nothing else ! Dude ! you removed the whole context of EVEN a single sentence ! and eliminated the whole contextual syntax of the phrase ? and you didnt even include the conventional " One way of looking at it is ....... " to show it was an edit . Whats with that ???? But anyway , let's go on . yeah, I often think that . Why aren't I dead already ? FOUR TIMES I should have been , but it didnt 'come off' Once instead , I recovered and ended up with beautiful young GF and her 3 kids ... just when I thought my life was ending . Another time I had to convince the police I was the driver in a car crash they insisted no one could have survived and was hassling poor old Nungers , in his post accident traumatic state " Where is the body ... what did you do with the body ! " God bless that woman witness that intervened and swore I was the only person that got out that car ( via passengers window ) . The still didnt believe and took us to the car and showed us and asked how someone could have done that . Regarding 'running out of gas' . I guess one of these had been installed in me ;

So, they eat ,trash, half dogs with leads , tin cans and rolls of carpet ..... but not Hawaiians ?

No , it isnt helpful . Why ? because this was your previous post here ; " I had already looked up your posts on Khvarenah and read some when you asked this, but I have been to busy to squeeze in a reply. In general I find them an interesting and potentially useful addition to the discourse on the subject. If I can make more time, I may reply in more detail. " I know this is an issue for you; having time to post here , as for a few years, pretty much every post you 'bow out' that way . Thats fair enough . But why use your valuable time to rehash this above ? Especially when you where 'additionally discourse' on such an important subject as the (perhaps) original source of this in Zoroastrianism . Why comment off topic, when you said you where going to comment on topic and then go off as you have ; " better things to do " . Why waste your valuable time on rehashing and old discourse of contention , here within this subject, when the subject at hand might benefit from your valuable input ? I dont get it .

It can 'hit you out of the blue ' . Once came around a corner on motorcycle , saw an unusual looking house ; large long and a huge sort of sun room along the back looking out over garden and hills . I immediately got a view from inside out the windows, same view, I was sitting up in an old metal framed bed , heavily bandaged . other men where around me similar ... that was it , gone . I pulled over, turned and went back . Curiously familiar . I eventually asked a local about the strange shaped house and they said that house had been a hospital in the past for war wounded soldiers .

But what if they do come back and tell us there is ? Lots of people think they are doing that . You think they are not doing that . I am gonna go with the less depressed lot thanks .

Naaah ...because not everything that exists is alive . Something has to be alive before it can die . Not to be too bitchy at ya HD but such obvious faulty logic will / is going to get you into deep mental poo poo if you apply t to other areas of your 'figgurin out ' . Like ; going around depressed becasue you 'realised' 'everything dies' .... when it doesn't .

A couple of thousand years difference . Solomon was know for his Great wisdom . And Suleiman was known for his magnificent ...... turban

Yes ... to 'command Djin ' . But that was not the use I was referring to , which is hard to discern seeing as you only quoted a part of what I said . I followed on, after saying it DID NOT WORK I said ; " I made a different version using artistic license ...... nope . I tried using the 2nd one a totally different way (on a hunch ) ..... YES ! It helps to NOT , only cite part of what I wrote , eliminate some, and then comment on THAT . Yes, people do that ... for various purposes . I dont think anyone here is interested in any one from an ancient Sufi brotherhood ... unless it is one embedded in the depths of a religious confinement .

Of course there has been ! As one who has studied cultural anthropology , this is a basic human trait across time and locations , to ignore such obviousness, to me, smacks of some religious or scientific indoctrination . We tried to sweep it all under the caret with 'psychological definitions ' and ideas about 'hallucinations' . I won't say more ( due to the religious turn this discussion has taken ) ... I'll invite Dr Wilson Van Dusen to : A Confirmation of Swedenborg in Recent Empirical Findings ie . scientific observation and recording of findings of a doctor in an asylum . https://selfdefinition.org/hearing-voices/articles/wilson-van-dusen-presence-of-spirits-in-madness.htm The problem with little anecdotes like that is they can easily be discounted .... but when the whole of humanity has a life long and collective history of it ...... ... to deny THAT takes the 'conviction of a religious consciousness ' . ya know, I'm pretty sure many a Sufi had warned us previously about such actions ? Of course, there are also Sufis that where not so radical and safely stayed within the confines of their religion ... yes, seems the very essence of dichotomy eh ? Still, who wants to end up like this :

No ... not after this response of yours thanks . Well, your interpretations and comments on a lot of what I wrote seem obscure and self interpreted to suit your 'corrections' . But no need to 'help out' further thanks . I am sure you are clear on where your own impulses come from , and they have no need of other considerations or valuations . Which is why I presented a landslide of other evidence supported by Judaism, Hermetics, etc diagrams etc to show it wasnt JUST my definitions . But to be blind to that and ignore it all then criticise it as MY opinion is , well ..... 'transparent ' . Its a meditative process , but you want an answer with a result ? Whats the point of that ? Your consciousness will not develop in the way the mediation is designed to effect it if simple answers are dolled out to you. Or maybe this is you having another 'dig' ? In any case , for the curious other reader ; The idea is to get us out of thinking one dimensionally, to stop putting things in a single box or niche of categorisation and a whole lot of other psychic dynamics that I am not going to spend the time on explaining , due to the turn this thread has taken . If one wants to play with the idea , one model is that of the 7 traditional planets and their specific energies interpreted into viewpoints . Its related to Kabbalah in that when one sees ' one thing ' one then realises all the other 'things' that relate to it on the same plane . Its origins in western occultism are from Agrippa , in Islam , from the Alexandrian Synthesis and it probably got into there via Zurvanism from Zoroastrian 'Sufism' . Now you have morphed the subject - on which I commented on and to which you seem determined to 'deconstruct' ie 'knowledge ' Into ' real knowledge ' ... a higher order and something else .... in order to make you critique . perhaps this is a good time for a bit of introspection ? " I'm sorry Captain .... sounds like you are breaking up . " 'Worshipping ' ... What a pathetic attempt to try and twist an example ( which need not be an historical fact' at all as that isnt the point ! ) of Wisdom, as explained , and then say it was put up as a demonstartion of facts , and since it never complete fabrication (as you say ) its a problem for you . You seemed determined to massage things to make your criticisms seem valid . .... whatever . So you should not . Which is why I immediately ut up an example to show t just is noot my opinion .... I note you ignore that part , and focus on me pointing you at it ... but ignore it . ? I am starting to see the problem of religion manifesting here . Might be time to grab my hat and coat and seek less ' harnessed' discourse . If you cannot see he stage of development the human race is in COLLECTIVELY , to which I was referring , and I think you knew that , and need to turn things this way all I can suggest is ..... you try the 'more than one view' way of looking at things ... Even three ways is a good start .

Thats a great example (and please feel free to correct me if its not ) . Shadow puppets where used to perform Hindu epics . Muslims turn up, Indonesians start becoming Muslims . Oh oh .... those puppets ( some representing Gods ) are not like pictures or statues that are thought to encourage the worship of idols are they ? We better stop that . But .... But ..... Puppet plays ! They are part of our culture ! But they are Hindu Gods that people could mistake as idols . What if we put a screen up so people cant see them ? The they will not be able to see the show . Hmmmm ..... I could adjust the lighting so a shadow is cast on a the screen .... a shadow isn't a picture, a statue or and idol . Wow ! Well, come census time here , many people automaticity tick off their religion as one they do not have much to do with . You might be Church of England or Catholic and that might just define what church you go to once a year at Christmas, or not even that , some only use their church for a wedding or funeral . .... or other 'troubles' . Joke ; " Not many people attended church today Reverend . " '" No . Everything is fine . " " Its fine that no one is coming to church ? " " Oh no . I meant 'things are fine'. Just wait until trouble starts , the place will be full then . "

Solomon's ring stumped me for a while . I made mine according to instructions ..... nope . I made a different version using artistic license ...... nope . I tried using the 2nd one a totally different way (on a hunch ) ..... YES ! Here I was thinking it was supposed to be worn on the finger ! ..... nope .

One would hope that the more one pays ..... the better past life you are told you had .

Learning how to learn is essential . Most think we just do it naturally and we do ... to an extent . But for a lot of us it is ; 'in one ear and out the other ' .... make the same mistake over and over again ....... refuse to follow advice that we know is good , due to endless reasons and excuses .... and so on . Some have that worse than others . Some learn quickly . How shall we tame the beast that is Man ? The most effective methods , we can apply to ourselves , but we should not apply them to others . . . . unless it is requested . - My first few months of sword training ( they are wooden ) " Tuck your elbow in ..... tuck your elbow in .... " constantly ! Very annoying ! " Tuck your elbow in our you will take a hit . " Me; " Just do it then ! " A minute later ... whack , crack ! .... OMG ! Oww owww owwie ouch ... rub rub ..... rest . Start again .... Teacher : " Oh look, elbow in, good form ! " I dont do that any more. Also I am a LOT more aware of what my other hand is doing when splitting firewood kindling ... after I chopped the end of my thumb off ! - So we have to not only learn how to learn but learn what is the best approach , what specific type of 'how' to learn, depending on the situation . - One cant go walking around with a wooden sword or a hatchet in hand .... just in case someone 'needs a lesson ' Another issue is ( and this drives me nuts at martial arts training as the instructor has not a clue about it ,,,, even though I have talked to him about his problem , and that is ; Different types of people have different optimum learning styles and levels . And because a Sufi mediation suggests we try to look at things, exlain things, know things in 7 different ways ( ) I will offer the following - look away now if not interested - ( private joke ) visual. kinaesthetic. aural. social. solitary. verbal. logical. The 'great teachers' knew that to really learn something ... for it to 'get in' .... retain .... effect and change consciousness , thus actions was, if the person is receptive , to combine as many 'learning styles ' as possible . Thats why initiation ceremony and ritual has these aspects in it ; verbal instructions, movement dynamics and 'ritual drama' , song / chant , visuals ( decorations, 'tracing boards ' mandalas) movements / circumnambulations , and all should point towards the one end and focus .