Nungali

It is not , or should not be controversial . You have mind and a brain ... or if you like .... God gave you a mind and a brain .... for a reason. In my view you are definitely allowed to ask such questions . According to the Bible ; Quails and ... wait for it ..... the excess sugar that the 'tamarisk manna scale ' (an insect ) excretes out of its anus ; 'honeydew ' . It dries into little flecks that are white and taste like coriander ; Tamarisk trees are considered a problem and invasive here . However I have an affinity with them, often they have provided a little grove or handy camping spot while camping on the edge of a 'desert' or by the remote coast . (in some places WA the dry and baked desert runs to the coast and as little as 20 metres out the coral reef starts " Tamarisk trees (particularly Tamarix gallica) were once comparatively extensive throughout the southern Sinai, and the honeydew produced by the Tamarisk manna scale is similar to wax, melts in the sun, is sweet and aromatic (like honey), and has a dirty-yellow color, fitting somewhat with the biblical descriptions of manna.[15][16][12] However, being mostly composed of sugar, it would be unlikely to provide sufficient nutrition for a population to survive over long periods of time,[16] and it would be very difficult for it to have been compacted into cakes. " Exodus 16 ; 31 The people of Israel called the bread manna.[d] It was white like coriander seed and tasted like wafers made with honey. 32 Moses said, “This is what the Lord has commanded: ‘Take an omer of manna and keep it for the generations to come, so they can see the bread I gave you to eat in the wilderness when I brought you out of Egypt ...... The Israelites ate manna forty years, until they came to a land that was settled; they ate manna until they reached the border of Canaan. " Apparently the flock of quails only came once . Here is another story ; out 'in the desert' early Australian explorers where on their last legs , no food anywhere . They cam over a rise and there where a lot of Aboriginals ; they gave the explorers 'cakes and duck ' and offered big flat bowls of water to the horses . WOW ! Thing is; where did that water come from ? and .... ducks ? in the desert ? Sometimes a bit of common sense is required when reading things instead of just 'glossing it over' or accepting a lame excuse or explanation . On checking diaries of explorers , latitude noted , distance traveled etc . they where in an area of a HUGE amount of water ! What did all those people drink ? What did their animals eat and drink ? " There were 600,000 men over 20 years of age, with their wives and children, and flocks, crossing the border of Egypt that day a free nation. Many Egyptians and other non-Israelites joined the triumphant children of Israel, hoping to share their glorious future. " For 40 years ! Come on now ! IT IS A STORY ! However , many native aboriginals do eat 'honey dew' from insects and such insects whole, or nip of the succulent abdomen as PART of their diet . And 'dessert' / wilderness can be fertile and full of food , IF you know what you are doing . However , scan pictures of 'Sinai wilderness' - VERY barren . if the writer of exodus , knew of such information, they might have written a more believable story .... yes, 'Bedouins' might eat 'Man' (Arabic - aphids) and collect the honey dew as PART of their diet . But, as you suspect , the story just does not add up . Simpler answer : it a myth and never happened religous anser ; it proves God can do miracles and the Jews ehre his people as he looked after them ( but due toi 'technical reasons made them suffer for 40 years ... it gets more tied up in its own shoelaces the deeper we look int it !

I am going to put this here ; a comment from Shlomo because , sometimes people read the last page or post of a thread and have missed the forgoing and previous explanations ... this has been asked about a few times and relates to my opinion in that ' Yes it IS a 'story' ... but there is nothing wrong with that . : " Nevertheless, Sand supports Israel's existence "not because of historical right, but because of the fact that it exists today and any effort to destroy it will bring new tragedies." - this thread is not political nor about current events .... thank you .

Book summary Sand began his work by looking for research studies about forcible exile of Jews from the area now bordered by modern Israel, and its surrounding regions. He was astonished that he could find no such literature, he says, given that the expulsion of Jews from the region is viewed as a constitutive event in Jewish history. The conclusion he came to from his subsequent investigation is that the expulsion simply did not happen, that no one exiled the Jewish people from the region, and that the Jewish diaspora is essentially a modern invention. He accounts for the appearance of millions of Jews around the Mediterranean and elsewhere as something that came about primarily through the religious conversion of local people, saying that Judaism, contrary to popular opinion, was very much a "converting religion" in former times. He holds that mass conversions were first brought about by the Hasmoneans under the influence of Hellenism, and continued until Christianity rose to dominance in the fourth century CE.[18] Jewish origins Sand argues that it is likely that the ancestry of most contemporary Jews stems mainly from outside the Land of Israel and that a "nation-race" of Jews with a common origin never existed, and that just as most Christians and Muslims are the progeny of converted people, not of the first Christians and Muslims, Jews are also descended from converts. According to Sand, Judaism was originally, like its two cousins, a proselytising religion, and mass conversions to Judaism occurred among the Khazars in the Caucasus, Berber tribes in North Africa, and in the Himyarite Kingdom of the Arabian Peninsula. According to Sand, the original Jews living in Israel, contrary to popular belief, were not exiled by the Romans following the Bar Kokhba revolt.[18] The Romans permitted most Jews to remain in the country. Rather, the story of the exile was a myth promoted by early Christians to recruit Jews to the new faith. They portrayed that event as a divine punishment imposed on the Jews for having rejected the Christian gospel. Sand writes that "Christians wanted later generations of Jews to believe that their ancestors had been exiled as a punishment from God."[19] Following the Arab conquest of Palestine in the 7th century, many local Jews converted to Islam and were assimilated among the Arab conquerors. Sand concludes that these converts are the ancestors of the contemporary Palestinians.[20] Jewish peoplehood Sand's explanation of the birth of the "myth" of a Jewish people as a group with a common, ethnic origin has been summarized as follows: "[a]t a certain stage in the 19th century intellectuals of Jewish origin in Germany, influenced by the folk character of German nationalism, took upon themselves the task of inventing a people "retrospectively," out of a thirst to create a modern Jewish people. From historian Heinrich Graetz on, Jewish historians began to draw the history of Judaism as the history of a nation that had been a kingdom, became a wandering people and ultimately turned around and went back to its birthplace."[18] In this, Sand writes, they were similar to other nationalist movements in Europe at the time that sought the reassurance of a Golden Age in their past to prove they have existed as a separate people since the beginnings of history. Jewish people found theirs in what he calls "the mythical Kingdom of David". Before this invention, he says, Jews thought of themselves as Jews because they shared a common religion, not a common ethnic background.[18] Return from exile, Zionism Sand believes that the idea of Jews being obliged to return from exile to the Promised Land was alien to Judaism before the birth of Zionism, and that the holy places were seen as places to long for, not to be lived in. On the contrary, for 2,000 years Jews stayed away from Jerusalem because their religion forbade them from returning until the Messiah came. According to Sand, the ancestry of Central and Eastern European Jews stems heavily from mediæval Turkic Khazars who were converted to Judaism, a theory which was popularized in a book written by Arthur Koestler in 1976.[21] Overall intent of the book Sand explained during a newspaper interview his reasons for writing the book: "I wrote the book for a double purpose. First, as an Israeli, to democratise the state; to make it a real republic. Second, I wrote the book against Jewish essentialism."[22] Sand explained in the same interview that what he means by 'Jewish essentialism' is, in the words of the interviewer, "the tendency in modern Judaism to make shared ethnicity the basis for faith."[22] "That is dangerous and it nourishes antisemitism. I am trying to normalise the Jewish presence in history and contemporary life," Sand said.[22]

I watched half so far . Yes it is interesting , but my I prefer the lecture style as opposed to a ..... ? 'podcast' style . The guy on the right was good , the guy on the left interrupted him too much . However the guy on right was patient with him ( Just ) . lets move on to Shlomo Sand . Who is he ? Shlomo Sand (pronounced Zand; Hebrew: שלמה זנד; born 10 September 1946) is an Israeli Emeritus Professor of History at Tel Aviv University Sand’s best-known book in English is The Invention of the Jewish People It was reprinted three times when published in French (Comment le peuple juif fut inventé, Fayard, Paris, 2008). In France, it received the "Prix Aujourd'hui", a journalists' award given to a non-fiction political or historical work.[34] An English translation of the book was published by Verso Books in October 2009.[35] The book has also been translated into German, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, Arabic, Russian, and Slovene and as of late 2009 further translations were underway.[36][37][38][39][40][41]The Invention of the Jewish People has now been translated into more languages than any other Israeli history book.[ below is a short article about it

Some other writers views on ; Moses, the Exodus, the Ten Commandments The legend of Moses, rather than being that of a historical Hebrew character, is found from the Mediterranean to India, with the character having different names and races, depending on the locale: "Manou" is the Indian legislator. "Nemo the lawgiver," who brought down the tablets from the Mountain of God, hails from Babylon. "Mises" is found in Syria, where he was pulled out of a basket floating in a river. Mises also had tablets of stone upon which laws were written and a rod with which he did miracles, including parting waters and leading his army across the sea. In addition, "Manes the lawgiver" took the stage in Egypt, and "Minos" was the Cretan reformer. Like Moses, Krishna was placed by his mother in a reed boat and set adrift in a river to be discovered by another woman. The Akkadian Sargon also was placed in a reed basket and set adrift to save his life. In fact, "The name Moses is Egyptian and comes from mo, the Egyptian word for water, and uses, meaning saved from water, in this case, primordial." Thus, this title Moses could be applied to any of these various heroes saved from the water. Walker elaborates on the Moses myth: "The Moses tale was originally that of an Egyptian hero, Ra-Harakhti, the reborn sun god of Canopus, whose life story was copied by biblical scholars. The same story was told of the sun hero fathered by Apollo on the virgin Creusa; of Sargon, king of Akkad in 2242 B.C.; and of the mythological twin founders of Rome, among many other baby heroes set adrift in rush baskets. It was a common theme." Furthermore, Moses's rod is a magical, astrology stick used by a number of other mythical characters. Of Moses's miraculous exploits, Walker also relates: "Moses's flowering rod, river of blood, and tablets of the law were all symbols of the ancient Goddess. His miracle of drawing water from a rock was first performed by Mother Rhea after she gave birth to Zeus, and by Atalanta with the help of Artemis. His miracle of drying up the waters to travel dry-shod was earlier performed by Isis, or Hathor, on her way to Byblos." And Higgins states: "In Bacchus we evidently have Moses. Herodotus says [Bacchus] was an Egyptian . . . The Orphic verses relate that he was preserved from the waters, in a little box or chest, that he was called Misem in commemoration of the event; that he was instructed in all the secrets of the Gods; and that he had a rod, which he changed into a serpent at his pleasure; that he passed through the Red Sea dry-shod, as Hercules subsequently did . . . and that when he went to India, he and his army enjoyed the light of the Sun during the night: moreover, it is said, that he touched with his magic rod the waters of the great rivers Orontes and Hydaspes; upon which those waters flowed back and left him a free passage. It is even said that he arrested the course of the sun and moon. He wrote his laws on two tablets of stone. He was anciently represented with horns or rays on his head." It has also been demonstrated that the biblical account of the Exodus could not have happened in history. Of this implausible story, Mead says: ". . . Bishop Colenso's . . . mathematical arguments that an army of 600,000 men could not very well have been mobilized in a single night, that three millions of people with their flocks and herds could not very well have drawn water from a single well, and hundreds of other equally ludicrous inaccuracies of a similar nature, were popular points which even the most unlearned could appreciate, and therefore especially roused the ire of apologists and conservatives." The apologists and conservatives, however, have little choice in the matter, as there is no evidence of the Exodus and wandering in the desert being historical: "But even scholars who believe they really happened admit that there's no proof whatsoever that the Exodus took place. No record of this monumental event appears in Egyptian chronicles of the time, and Israeli archaeologists combing the Sinai during intense searches from 1967 to 1982 - years when Israel occupied the peninsula - didn't find a single piece of evidence backing the Israelites' supposed 40-year sojourn in the desert. "The story involves so many miracles - plagues, the parting of the Red Sea, manna from heaven, the giving of the Ten Commandments - that some critics feel the whole story has the flavor of pure myth. A massive exodus that led to the drowning of Pharaoh's army, says Father Anthony Axe, Bible lecturer at Jerusalem's Ecole Biblique, would have reverberated politically and economically through the entire region. And considering that artifacts from as far back as the late Stone Age have turned up in the Sinai, it is perplexing that no evidence of the Israelites' passage has been found. William Dever, a University of Arizona archaeologist, flatly calls Moses a mythical figure. Some scholars even insist the story was a political fabrication, invented to unite the disparate tribes living in Canaan through a falsified heroic past." (Time) Potter sums up the mythicist argument regarding Moses: "The reasons for doubting his existence include, among others, (1) the parallels between the Moses stories and older ones like that of Sargon, (2) the absence of any Egyptian account of such a great event as the Pentateuch asserts the Exodus to have been, (3) the attributing to Moses of so many laws that are known to have originated much later, (4) the correlative fact that great codes never suddenly appear full-born but are slowly evolved, (5) the difficulties of fitting the slavery, the Exodus, and the conquest of Canaan into the known chronology of Egypt and Palestine, and (6) the extreme probability that some of the twelve tribes were never in Egypt at all." The Exodus is indeed not a historical event but constitutes a motif found in other myths. As Pike says, "And when Bacchus and his army had long marched in burning deserts, they were led by a Lamb or Ram into beautiful meadows, and to the Springs that watered the Temple of Jupiter Ammon." And Churchward relates, "Traditions of the Exodus are found in various parts of the world and amongst people of different states of evolution, and these traditions can be explained by the Kamite [Egyptian] rendering only." Indeed, as Massey states, "'Coming out of Egypt' is a Kamite expression for ascending from the lower to the upper heavens." Churchward further outlines the real meaning of the Exodus: "The Exodus or 'Coming out of Egypt' first celebrated by the festival of Passover or the transit at the vernal equinox, occurred in the heavens before it was made historical as the migration of the Jews. The 600,000 men who came up out of Egypt as Hebrew warriors in the Book of Exodus are 600,000 inhabitants of Israel in the heavens according to Jewish Kabalah, and the same scenes, events, and personages that appear as mundane in the Pentateuch are celestial in the Book of Enoch." . . . In addition, the miraculous "parting of the Red Sea" has forever mystified the naive and credulous masses and scholars alike, who have put forth all sorts of tortured speculation to explain it. The parting and destruction of the hosts of Pharaoh at the Red Sea is not recorded by any known historian, which is understandable, since it is, of course, not historical and is found in other cultures, including in Ceylon, out of which the conquering shepherd kings (Pharaohs) were driven across "Adam's Bridge" and drowned. This motif is also found in the Hawaiian and Hottentot versions of the Moses myth, prior to contact with outside cultures. The crossing of the Red Sea is astronomical, expressly stated by Josephus to have occurred at the autumnal equinox, indicating its origin within the mythos. Moreover, the famed Ten Commandments are simply a repetition of the Babylonian Code of Hammurabi and the Hindu Vedas, among others. As Churchward says: "The 'Law of Moses' were the old Egyptian Laws . . . ; this the stele or 'Code of Hammurabi' conclusively proves. Moses lived 1,000 years after this stone was engraved." Walker relates that the "stone tablets of law supposedly given to Moses were copied from the Canaanite god Baal-Berith, 'God of the Covenant.' Their Ten Commandments were similar to the commandments of the Buddhist Decalogue. In the ancient world, laws generally came from a deity on a mountaintop. Zoroaster received the tablets of law from Ahura Mazda on a mountaintop." Doane sums it up when he says, "Almost all the acts of Moses correspond to those of the Sun-gods." However, the Moses story is also reflective of the stellar cult, once again demonstrating the dual natured "twin" Horus-Set myth and the battle for supremacy between the day and night skies, as well as among the solar, stellar and lunar cults. . . . "

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Sorry ... I thought you might be able to tell the difference . I am not quoting, I am citing or referring , the author was quoting from the new testament . if you look hard you will see the OT is quoted from as well Now, where are the complaints I expected that I quoted from OT and not Jewish scripture ? You are slipping up . I'll do it for you . Nungali, that isnt Jewish scripture , its the Old Testament ! there ! I have been suitably self-chastised !

He doesnt like those things, remember .

I'll get to it later , thanks . Hopefully I will eventually find the similar one I saw a while back, its very good and is put out by a Rabbi . of course Daniel will consider him heretical

Thats nearly the exact reverse of how my Uni lecturer explained the running away from learning ' all the religious motivated people did .

This doesn't count because you left out all the other evidence that doesn't match ..... please list all the evidence of wheel making, cultures that used it and archaeological evidence .

What are you talking about ? That Sydney University was run by Gnostics ?

nothing like looking into something with an open mind is there ?

I luv the way you are challenging ME on all this again, take it up with Victor Harold Matthews (born 13 November 1950) is an American Old Testament scholar. He is Dean of the College of Humanities and Public Affairs and professor of religious studies at Missouri State University.

Yeah ... thats because it an exercise in showing similarities ! You are REALLY scrapping the barrel here ! I tell ya what, you make up your list and send it in to ; Victor Harold Matthews (born 13 November 1950) is an American Old Testament scholar. He is Dean of the College of Humanities and Public Affairs and professor of religious studies at Missouri State University.

Yes, a lot and also a lot of 'remedial work' . I urge any teacher to try and teach their students in a way the student can comprehend it ! To this end you might want to look into 'types of learning ' ; some people need visual, some hands on some theory , some need time to digest , we are all different . I liked sometimes to teach with no words used whatsoever .

Oh certainly. I have said a dozen times now - nothing wrong with the Jewish story , and how it has helped them survive and still be here, after all sorts of difficulties and attempted annihilation . Hats off to them ! ( and the story ) ... and I am not worried by no giant tuna ... I got Dali on my side ;

Hey, you know, thats very possible ! The last lecture I went to for 'Comparative Religion' had three present , out of an initial 30+ . The lecturer said it was normal , many 'religious people' just can't handle the course as it isn't 'faith based', its University . Over the weeks they gradually walked out - of course failing . ( The religious people where there as it is a prerequisite for a few religious colleges and a path towards being clergy - they want them to have educated and informed views before they start in their own specific clergy . So, walking out nullified that aspiration. ) Youtubes are easier , you just stop watching But we never had curtains like that .

Even if we accept the 'back dating ' of Israelites .... we are in Egyptian waters . For those of you that dont like a lot of text and prefer a good old Youtube ;

Further on Exodus ; " There are two main positions on the historicity of the Exodus in modern scholarship.[1] The majority position is that the biblical Exodus narrative has some historical basis, although there is little of historical fact in it.[e][5][11] The other position, often associated with the school of Biblical minimalism,[25][26] is that the biblical exodus traditions are the invention of the exilic and post-exilic Jewish community, with little to no historical basis.[27] The biblical Exodus narrative is best understood as a founding myth of the Jewish people, providing an ideological foundation for their culture and institutions, not an accurate depiction of the history of the Israelites.[28][11] The view that the biblical narrative is essentially correct unless it can explicitly be proved wrong (Biblical maximalism) is today held by "few, if any [...] in mainstream scholarship, only on the more fundamentalist fringes."[1] There is no direct evidence for any of the people or events of Exodus in non-biblical ancient texts or in archaeological remains, and this has led most scholars to omit the Exodus events from comprehensive histories of Israel.[29] " That is from Wikipedia - the premise of this thread is hardly radical or unknown !

Lets look at a range of things : Ancient Egyptian Text Biblical Text “At the moment of creation, Atum spoke: I alone am the creator. When I came into being, all life began to develop. When the almighty speaks, all else comes to life. There were no heavens and no earth, There was no dry land and there were no reptiles in the land…” – Hymn to Atum, Old Kingdom (2575-2134 BCE) “In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep…” – Genesis 1: 1-2 “The ka-souls of all the living were created in the image of Ptah. All formed in his heart and by his tongue.” – The Hymn to Ptah, 19th Dynasty (1307 – 1196 BCE) “So God created human beings in his own image, in the image of God he created them.” – Genesis 1:27 “Having done all these things, Ptah rested and was content with his work.” – The Hymn to Ptah “God saw all that he had made, and it was very good… By the seventh day God had finished… so on the seventh day he rested from all his work.” – Genesis 1:31-2:1 “He let me choose my own land from among his holdings within the Land of Yaa. It was a land overflowing with figs and grapes. It had more wine than water, honey and oil in abundance.” – Stories of Sinuhe, (1991 – 1962 BCE) “to bring them up out of that land into a good and spacious land, a land flowing with milk and honey.” – Exodus 3:8; 13: 5 “To: Pharoah, Ruler of the Heavens and Earth From: Biridiya, Governor of Megiddo” – El-Amarna Letters, (1391 – 1353 BCE), letters were addressed to Amenophis III and Akenaten by their govenors in Syria-Palestine “The God who made the world and everything in it is the Lord of heaven and earth and does not live in temples built by human hands.” – Acts 17: 24 “Divine plans are one thing. Human desires are another.” – Teachings of Ankhsheshonq, Egypt (c. 4th century BCE) “In their hearts human beings plan their course, but the LORD establishes their steps.” – Proverbs 16: 9 “One day a strong man from Syria-Palestine pushed his way into my tent and challenged me to a duel. He was a warrior without equal. He had never lost a duel… Every heart embraced me as the underdog… He was armed with a shield, an ax, and a whole armful of javelins. One after another, I dodged his javelins and sidestepped his arrows. I waited finally the strong man rushed me, then I shot him in the neck with an arrow. With a loud cry he fell on his face, mortally wounded. I finished him off with his own ax, and then stood on his back and let out my battle cry while all the people of Syria-Palestine thundered their applause.” – Stories of Sinuhe, (c. 1991 – 1962 BCE) “A champion named Goliath, who was from Gath, came out of the Philistine camp…He had a bronze helmet on his head and wore a coat of scale armor of bronze…, on his legs he bronze greaves, and a bronze javelin was slung on his back…Reaching into his bag and taking out a stone, [David] slung it and struck the Philistine in the forehead. The stone sank into his forehead, and he fell facedown on the ground… David ran and stood over him. He took hold of the Philistine’s sword and drew it … After he killed him, he cut off his head with a sword… Then the men of Israel and Judah surged forward with a shout and pursued the Philistines…” – 1 Samuel 17: 4 – 10, 49 – 52 “You are human, not divine. Your task is to live life to its fullest.” “I know that there is nothing better for people than to be happy and to do good while they live.” – Ecclesiastes 3: 12 “Surely, whoever goes to the land of the dead will be wise, will have a hearing before Re the creator.” – A Sufferer and a Soul in Egypt, (2050 – 1800 BCE) “But I tell you that everyone will have to give account on the day of judgment for every empty word they have spoken.” – Matthew 12: 36 “I, Khnum, say to Hatshepsut, The divine potter says to the child of Amun-Re: ‘I have created you from the divine patron of Karnak. I have made you a divine child.’” – Annals of Hatshepsut, (1473-1458 BCE) “Yet you, LORD, are our Father. We are the clay, you are the potter; we are all the work of your hand.” – Isaiah 64:8 “I will extol your name throughout the land…” – A Farmer and the Courts in Egypt, (2134 – 2040 BCE) “I will declare your name to my people; in the assembly I will praise you.” – Psalm 22: 22 “I am you servant. Do with me what you will.” “I, Amun-Re, promise Ahmose, The divine patron of Thebes says to the queen: ‘I have given you a child, You will name her Hatshepsut… She will reign over the land of Egypt…” – Annals of Hatshepsut “The angel of the LORD appeared to her and said, ‘You are… going to become pregnant and give birth to a son… the boy is to be a Nazirite, dedicated to God from the womb. He will begin to deliver Israel from the hands of the Philistines.” – Judges 13: 3 – 5 Hatshepsut, like many rulers in the world of the Bible was celebrated as a child of a human mother and a divine father. “But the angel said to her, … ‘You will conceive and give birth to a son, and you are to call him Jesus. He will be great and will be called the Son of God… he will reign over the house of Jacob forever…’” “I am the Lord’s servant ,” Mary answered. “May it be to me according to your word.” – Luke 1: 31 – 38 “Her breasts are mandrake blossoms. Her arms are vines, Her eyes are shaded like berries. Her head is a trap built from the branches… and I am the goose. Her hair is the bait in the trap… to ensnare me.” – Egyptian Love Song #3, time of Ramses II (1290 – 1224 BCE) “The mandrakes send out their fragrance, and at our door is every delicacy, both new and old, that I have stored up for you, my beloved.” – Song of Songs 7: 13 “Your hair is like royal tapestry; the king is held captive by its tresses.” – Song of Songs 7: 5 “Do unto others, As you would have others do unto you.” – A Farmer and the Courts in Egypt, Egypt, (2134-2040 BCE) “So in everything, do to others what you would have them do to you.” – Matthew 7: 12 “Birds fly to their nests, They spread their wings to praise our ka.” “The birds of the sky nest by the waters; they sing among the branches.” – Psalm 104: 12 “You massage the fetus in its mother’s womb.” “You knit me together in my mother’s womb.” – Psalm 139: 13 “You count out to each the days of life.”- Hymn to the Aten, (1353 – 1335 BCE) “The days of mortals are determined; you have decreed the number of their months…” – Job 14: 5 “Finally, my students, remember, the wise follow their teachers’ advice, Consequently, their projects do not fail.” “My son, if you accept my words and store up my commands within you, … and applying your hear to understanding… He holds success in store for the upright.” – Proverbs 2: 1 – 2, 7 “Stay away from the women of another’s house. Keep our mind on business, your eyes off pretty faces. Foolish dreamers become causalities of unwise actions. Succumb to love sickness and lust, and nothing you do will succeed.” – “Teachings of Ptah-Hotep, (2575 – 2134 BCE) “This teaching is a light…keeping you from your neighbor’s wife, from the smooth talk of a wayward woman. Do not lust in your heart after her beauty.” – Proverbs 6: 23, 24 – 25 “Do not go to bed worrying, Wondering: ‘What will tomorrow bring?’ No one knows what tomorrow brings…” – Teaching 18 “Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.” – Matthew 6: 34 “Control your temper… Do not let your tongue steer your life. Your tongue may be the rudder of your boat, But Amen-Re, your divine patron, must be its pilot.” – Teaching 18 “Or take ships as an example. Although they are so large… they are steered by a very small rudder wherever the pilot wants to go. Likewise, the tongue is a small part of the body, but it makes great boasts…no one can tame the tongue. It is a restless evil, full of deadly poison.” – James 3: 4 – 5, 8 “Do not bear false witness against your neighbor…” – Teaching 19 “You shall not give false testimony against your neighbor.” – Exodus 20: 16 “Fill your soul with these teachings, Put them in your heart.” – Thirty Teachings of Amen-em-ope (3000 – 2000 BCE) “These commandments that I give you today are to be on your hearts.” – Deuteronomy 6: 6 Source: Matthews, Victor H. and Don C. Benjamin. Old Testament Parallels: Laws and Stories from the Ancient Near East, Fully Revised and Expanded Third Edition. New York/Mahwah, NJ: Paulist Press. 2006. Author cred : Victor Harold Matthews (born 13 November 1950) is an American Old Testament scholar. He is Dean of the College of Humanities and Public Affairs and professor of religious studies at Missouri State University.

Anyway , moving along and back onto the subject of this thread , I will start this bit with a simple summary and cite J. S Paul , as I think he has an accurate and simple way with words ; " By the end of the nineteenth century scholars were changing the historic landscape in dramatic ways. For one thing, they began to learn much more about the connections between the Egyptians and other cultures in their sphere of influence. Because ofthis, scholars began to learn what the Jews and other cultures had borrowed from Egyptian mythology. "The evidence that Egyptian religion influenced Judaism and Christianity is not far-fetched at all. The Jewish religion has murky Canaanite origins that were strongly influenced by Mesopotamian contact during the Babylonian Captivity. Also, researchers know that Christianity began in Palestine around two thousand years ago as a sect of Judaism. From Jerusalem, it’s only 263 land miles to Cairo, Egypt, the site of one of the world’s oldest and most advanced civilizations. "Even in ancient times, it wasn’t difficult to travel between the two cultures. As an example, the Gospel of Matthew told of Joseph, Mary, and the infant Jesus fleeing to Egypt to avoid King Herod’s slaughter of innocent Jewish babies. " It was a great relief for me to learn that there is no evidence that the massacre really happened. There is also no evidence that Jews slaughtered the Canaanites and or any other tribes as it states in the Book of Joshua. Those seem to be nothing but violent stories to get the reader’s attention and teach cultural lessons. " ... The Egyptians practiced circumcision long before the Jews did, even though it was the distinguishing sign of Jewish adherence to their god’s covenant. "The Old Testament Book of Ezekiel mentions a temple. Some think it was the Temple of Amarna in Egypt, not the Temple in Jerusalem. " The most sacred parts of the Jewish temple, the Holy of Holies, and the sacrificial altar had equivalents in Egyptian religion. " The Ark of the Covenant was similar to an object found in the tomb of King Tut. Historians have also discovered evidence that the Egyptians took a similar “holy” case with winged guardians attached to it into battle for good luck. "Psalm 104 follows the same format and almost paraphrases the Great Hymn to Aten. " " By the late first century, Flavius Josephus, the much-quoted Jewish historian, was already doubting the Hebrew Bible’s tale of the exodus from Egypt. Apparently, Josephus thought the Jews were confusing the exodus with the Egyptian expulsion of the Hyksos people. They were a historical Middle Eastern ethnic group that had ruled Northern Egypt for about a hundred year period at about the time Moses would have lived. " To date, investigator have found no evidence to confirm the biblical exodus actually occurred. The Egyptians kept copious historical records and the closest story to the exodus story they have is when one leader led a small population of Egyptians (not Jews) into the Sinai Desert. " Moses ? " The name Moses is Egyptian in origin. It means something like “child of the water” or “child of the Nile”. It seems the writers of Exodus plucked stories of Moses right out of Egyptian mythology. According to Massey, maybe none of the biblical Exodus is based on actual history. That includes the tales of the pharaoh’s daughter finding Moses floating in the reed basket, the burning bush, the summons from God to free his people, the rod that turned into a snake and parted the Red Sea, the ten plagues, the forty years in the wilderness, the manna falling from heaven, the pillars of fire and clouds that guided the Jews, the golden calf, and even the ten commandments. " Much of this information is very difficult to assimilate into what we learned in church. But as more evidence is becoming available, the story becomes more clear. Now historical scholars know that the Jewish people came from the Canaanite culture many centuries after the Egyptian culture reached its peak. Since they were basically next-door neighbors, Egyptian influence on the Jews was profound. The Jews also borrowed stories like Job and Noah from the Mesopotamians during their captivity. Then, they adapted a significant amount of their theology to Zoroastrianism while in contact with the Persians after the Babylonian exile. The Old Testament didn’t drop out of the clouds as a fully bound scripture. Sages and scribes maintained their mythological history by oral tradition the best they could. The books of their Bible were not all accepted as scripture until around 200 AD. " If people insist on believing in myths instead of evidence that’s their choice. I think it does tremendous harm to our society for people to refuse to trust our cultural bank of knowledge, which comes from the domain of scientists and historians, not theologians and preachers. "