Nungali

IMO both are needed. The first to evaluate , then if favourable the 2nd method to operate . Just because you a shaman doesnt mean you aren't fucking up . I've seen that - bad ju-ju , you dont want to be around it - it devolved to 'black magic; and tribal war . Nasty stuff . again, they have indications and tests . maybe time to put this up again (synopsis ; Professional psychiatrist discovers ways to treat the 'incurably' insane / people who believe they are 'possessed' by observing two types of 'possessing entities' ; some of 'good order', some of 'bad order' and how to tell them apart . http://www.theisticpsychology.org/books/w.vandusen/presence_spirits.htm Meh ... a statement of 'fact' with no explanation . I would say its the relationship between 3 and 4 wanna paper on it ?

It can mean many things on different levels . Try seeing it as unresolved deep emotional complexes . Oh no . Salt of the Earth they are ! I dont think ' the simple folk' are on the slime o meter . Maybe you should read this ( from his main work ; Magick in Theory and Practice ; This book is for ALL: for every man, woman, and child. MAGICK is for ALL. I have written this book to help the Banker, the Pugilist, the Biologist, the Poet, the Navvy, the Grocer, the Factory Girl, the Mathematician, the Stenographer, the Golfer, the Wife, the Consul --- and all the rest --- to fulfil themselves perfectly, each in his or her own proper function. I find the 'simple folk' can be quite complex at times .

Who knows ? You are going to have learn to write more clearly about what you are actually on about, to get a reasonable response . Who told you you did in the first place ? ? ? This is worrying ... I suggest you take Crowley's advice on the matter ; " Be not hasty to condemn others; how knowest thou that in their place, thou couldst have resisted the temptation? And even were it so, why shouldst thou despise one who is weaker than thyself? " Then just see it as balance . Strive for balance . The way I see navigation through that flowery overt prose is this , its a warning about our propensity to avoid our own darkness and not delve into and resolve it , things not resolved can grow and fester ... before you know it, you got a 'negative complex' . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Complex_(psychology) I am used to seeing these ; I am nothing but white light ... I am nothing but a spiritual being .... or even a peace hippy type ... that has obviously not evolved psychologically one iota and sprouts 'love' but abuses the person he loves . because they avoided, refused to acknowledge and help resolve their 'dark nature within' . Good.

Its part of the first operation , water is needed , some use 'dew' . . . morning dew. How to convert it to earth ? Its an 'alchemical operation ' VERY briefly; 4. The basic 'co-joining requirement' - the dew is condensed from the atmosphere and the interplay of Sun Moon / day night energies. 5. It condenses out of the atmosphere onto the ground ( vegetation ) . 6. It contains a high potential 7. The whole process ends in an earth like substance , and in that form its 'power' is released. 8. How the 'dew' is formed in nature but also a very good and brief description of the process and theory in alchemy. It would take a while to give a long explanation, basically it is about the principle of alchemical circulation and in BDs about the use of the two preparations 500 and 501 . 500 is the 'earth component (pictured above ) and 501 is the atmospheric component. This is an example of one usage of the formular ( agricultural alchemy ) , there are many others ; metallic, medicinal, etc . The reason the writing is so cryptic is it describing a base interior process applicable to many areas of operation .

And, I would bet a large amount that you know nothing of the schools Crowley helped developed ! For others that may be curious about this ; I have no doubt at all, from the reading I have done, that Crowley could be a complete arse and a boar and a repressed Victorian deviate and and and .... it comes across in his writings and he admits it himself . he got involved in scams and he was also a psycho-naught. We could go on and list the negatives, and many of the time had them ; including certain racial and sexual views. But the 'schools' are a different matter and anyone that has examined their curriculum , or indeed, has practical experience within them will, or should be able to see the clear distinction between this work and the things I mentioned above , these are not in the rituals or degrees .

A few empty words that do not address the questions about your original claim ; " developed fraudulent and corrupt schools based on false information. " ... I suggest you cough up or retract it .

But you cant , it seems .

yes, I was going to mention that . What do you think is the source of the Picatrix knowledge ?

I tended to avoid most of those works , I did read no 2 a couple of times.

Care to actually name those fraudulent and corrupt schools that Crowley created ? Or are you just going to drop a gossipy random negative suggestion ? And do you know anything at all about Goetia ? What traps ? Ohhh ... okay then .

You may not need to . Stones have talked to me .. The time lag operates in an interesting way. But night falls, - more tomorrow.

YES ! from 6:20

maybe you are a natural geomancer ? Geomancy (Greek: γεωμαντεία, "earth divination") is a method of divination that interprets markings on the ground or the patterns formed by tossed handfuls of soil, rocks, or sand. The most prevalent form of divinatory geomancy involves interpreting a series of 16 figures formed by a randomized process that involves recursion followed by analyzing them . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geomancy The sixteen geomantic figures.

It depends . Are they from a 'valid source' or from 'the lower astral' ? A Bodhisattva or a Hungry Ghost ? Your highest genius or unresolved unconscious emotional complexes ? There are ways to tell, and that is part of magical / shamanic training . They may need to be accepted, resolved or dealt with , in some manner . 'Wild ' animals seem to be able to do the job pretty well eg. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Willie_wagtail#Cultural_depictions Totems ... now there is an interesting subject ! Here is two I have been given ; "He stands out from the others , that felalh ! " " He a cheeky bugga ! - He's a balligunbellingupfrombellingen ! " (if you think that reads funny, you should hear it in a Gumbaynggirr accent ! )

You dont know what to proceed with or what you need help with and I dont know what you need to proceed with or need help with . I guess we are at an impasse .

Live everyday as if it were your last.

with what ? Only Nungali . Thats a good idea, I haven't eaten anything today , as yet.

That is right ! Only Granny can ! And it is great entertainment for kids party !

Of course ... according to the Nungali law of 3:4 more 'secrets'

But Wellsie .... how would you know if its a scam or not ?

Excuse me ! Take out an add banner dude and pay for it ! No free advertising here thanks !

Better to experience them personally then get them by 'sharing' but really a secret has two sides the obvious one 'shhh' and the 'not obvious one ' ( we gotta have someone to 'shhhh' with )

No , I dont mind. They might here is one that was removed from old Masonic ceremony. But first, do you promise not to reveal this secret information , under penalty of death ? ( because if this one gets out, we could all be arrested and put to death ) Okay ? <whispers in his ear > the earth actually goes around the Sun , all the planets do ! .. and day and night is caused by the earth turning on its axis .... shhh ! Just to put things in context , as an example of 'defunct mysteries' the modern 10 degree system of the OTO was condensed out of the old Rites of Mephis and Mizriam (and other sources ) that were done over 97 degrees ! Yikes. Lets go to the other end ; the supreme secret and mystery of the OTO (9th degree) .... basically it is a modern tantra technique where the mingling of activated sexual fluids was supposedly some form of the 'Universal Medicine' - health ,long life, regeneration, etc. But even Crowley stated this was misunderstood and primitive, he wrote (back then ) that soon it would not be secret nor magical at all, and it will be done properly and scientifically in a lab. The idea was there is some rejuvenating 'vitality' that can be passed on from within the 'pure and undeveloped seed' . Probable was , it was 'primitive', that was never going to work ... well, work as good as eating a lions heart will give you the courage of a lion . I think more will be revealed about this process as we research and experiment ore with stem cell technology .... this method does seem to work. So much for that secret . But there are more wonderful secrets to be discovered in the process, and what is more important is they are practical real things that one can use to improve their life. Even the 'secret' of controlling people and 'getting them to do what you want'. Controversial topic ? That depends on how one views it ( due to their, perhaps unknown, motivations ) eg . I taught a year 10 class for a while. There was a big prob with them and the school in that they kept getting into trouble for being caught smoking - cigartees are not allowed on school grounds - smoking is banned for everyone . They said to me " You seem to have a great relationship with the kids, perhaps you can get them to stop doing it ?" " Nah . " " Why not ? " " Well, I talked them to about it and they said why should they, some of the teachers smoke at lunch time behind the sports equipment shed , if they cant keep the rules, why should they ? I agree with them. " I was eventually persuaded to do something about it anyway. So the next day I told all my guys what happened and how we really have to stop smoking now, and I took out my packet of tobacco and put it on the desk and said had to be locked up for the day and said cough up ... man sooo many packets came out. I put mine and theirs in a cupboard and locked it. I made a point during the day to say to some of them - man I am really hanging out for a smoke , etc . At the end of the day I knew if I didnt give it back they would never hand it over again, but if I did it was actually a crime to supply minors with tobacco . So , with them watching me like hawks I unlocked the cupboard, took mine out, said 'Of course I cant give you your tobacco back, thats illegal, it will have to remain confiscated. and obviously got the key and put it my desk draw and " and dont you dare touch it ! " and left. next morning, cupboard empty ... and I do the same ... each day . Result - I got the kids to stop smoking at school . Thing was, I was in the same boat as them and they knew it, I wasnt being hypocritical, and I was trying to be fair honest and consistent, and show them and myself respect. I was also tolerant in originally listing and giving credit to their protestations about being hypocritically forced into something . If you want to get on with someone, teach them something, bring up kids, train a dog or a horse ; those 4 things honesty, consistency (very important) , respect , tolerance . Another short example ... you want to get someone to do something ... you can pay them people used to say to my boss ( a different job from teaching ) ' My workers dont do what I want them to, yours do, how do you do that ?" Ha ! by treating us good and fairly .... we loved him !, he was a great guy ! I am still best friends with him today, years after I quit work . Magick can be worked 'nicely' ... it doesnt have to have a gnarly selfish element like many suppose . The best 'secrets' I have found are all the ones 'along the way' .... often 'supreme secrets' are

Yes. But also it is a process of 'individuation' - psychologically . https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Individuation#In_Jungian_psychology But taking note that in the basic pattern, this is the first series of initiations , transforming into a fully developed human. The second series is about transformation into a 'magical person' . There is also the 'social context', that is the group itself is trying to emulate a new type of functional social order that should reflect the advancement of the individual , that is the group itself and its structural form and regulations should be 'advanced and developed '. But anyone that has read the 'politcal' history of the G.D. ...... eye yi yi ! litigations, court cases, lock outs, slander etc etc The preface to Equinox III 10 ( I think - gong off memory here ) by H.B. ( the current international head of OTO ) has a good article on this , title ' Cult Vs. Culture ' which describes the dynamic and how it can go 'good ' (culture ) or bad (cult ) . Not many people realise that some of these groups are involved in 'socio cultural' experimentation' . We operated like that for a while here . It was 'easy' to an extent, for us, as we sorta had a lifestyle that anyway, so it was easily adopted. Actually during a visit here by senior members from US they remarked how we just seem to 'simply do it' (instead of fuss and worry and try to organise and plan and or fight about it ) .