ViscountValmont

I would just like to start an archive of everyone's favorite sayings and so forth, as well as accompanying discussions and interpretations of them, how the lessons are applied to life, and why they're particularly your favorites. I apologize if there is already such a thread, and this may be merged with it, if so. One of my favorites is this story by Lieh Tzu- On the way to Song, Yang meets a man at the town of Ni. The man has two wives, one is very attractive and the other one is quite plain. But the man favors the not so attractive one. So Yang asks him why. The man answers:"The pretty one knows she is pretty. I don't. The plain one knows she is plain. I don't. A bad person knows he is bad. I don't." Yang says:"I will remember what you just said. The Saint behaves as a Saint, by his own volition." How does everyone see this? I also very much like the painting, The Vinegar Tasters. It perfectly shows how Tao's approach is starkly different to the other school's of thought.

Wow, my chart is scary close to Cayce's (Tropical). My inner planets, Sun, Moon, Mercury and Mars all the same. Only Ascendant and Venus are different- Libra and Aquarius, respectively. Edit: Also, my outer planets may also be coincidentally the same as well, but I don't recall their placement.

Describing enlightenment to someone who is not... is an idea to them. Which is why they must dispense with words to experience it. But, no one lives outside of words, and especially an experience so profound WILL be described to others. I already explained that an awakening is a reinterpretation of your subjective world (and before you bog all of us down with a bunch of New Age terminology designed to avoid defining what something actually is... yes, this is what enlightenment actually is- reinterpretation of your worldview. It isn't mystical, as much as you all want it to be). You guys need to read and connect more deeply. Telepathy is a big deal, because you're on a Forum, using text based words to communicate. If you could communicate telepathically, you would. Case closed.

JoeBlast, It's a matter of wording, my god. Are you all really like this? No one said that growing muscle adds ENTIRE CABLES OF FIBER. Muscle growth occurs when tearing results, which is then filled in with chains of protein, increasing the size of the muscle fiber. Now, in densifying these fibers, you are NOT increasing the diameter!!! In fact it is DECREASING IT, as evidenced by the OP! So, what's your counter-theory to this? David, Yes I have spent PLENTY of time around body builders. I have trained them, and trained with them in martial arts. How is it so hard to see my meaning here? They train for LOOKS. Clearly this has an effect of their overall strength. No one said they have NO strength. I have muscle strength! Christ! But the difference in the TRAINING is either a more attractive muscle which is stronger by proxy, or a STRONGER muscle which is its main focus. The purpose of these classifications of different muscles is because the muscles of the body ADAPT to what you're doing!!! So if you're not pushing the muscles for strength, rather than just an increase in size, then the muscle conforms to this! Yes, SOME strength results from body building. But I would choose my own Internal Strength over theirs any day. And as I've stated before... I'm 150 lbs.

Is it funny because you apparently don't understand it? I'm going to go with yes... As increase in fibers is EXACTLY what muscle growth is. You may want to know what the fuck you're talking about before you laugh at something. Superficial strength refers to the fact that, though the muscle appears to be much stronger as per it visually looking better, it doesn't actually gain much strength overall as compared to the yield of other specifically targeted strength training exercises. This is why body builders aren't pulling semi-trucks. *Edit- You whining babies. There, everyone happy? How's it feel to win by exerting force of rule rather than of reason? Yes Soaring Crane, increase in fibrous tissue occurs with all muscle growth. And yes, this process of increased density happens with all static, standing exercises like this. Deep Horse Stances (yes, feet directly straight ahead, not angled outwards, haha) and the like all create more dense muscle.

Most are unaware of the different types of muscles they can cultivate. There is toning, which is light, rapid contractions- this gives good definition but no strength, and an endurance for quick successive movements. Then there is endurance training, like long distance running- this is defined mostly by its cardiovascular quality increase. Then there is strength training, like Strongest Man challenges that are lifting semi-truck tires and such. There is body building, which is lots of toning, but also work that increases the "belly" and size of the muscle, but only gaining superficial strength. Then there is fast twitch muscle- this is training the ligaments/tendons/nerves and their corresponding muscles to contract as hard and as quickly as possible from a relaxed state (This is cultivated by Internal Martial Artists), and a subtle, refined control over them. Then there is what you're doing- Increasing the number of fibers inside the muscle, and compacting what is already there. You are creating a more tightly packed, denser muscle. This muscle is designed for holding its contraction for long periods. Notice this is quite different than any other muscle function previously mentioned. It is a distinct form of muscle/training, and it is heavily cultivated by martial artists of all kinds. The endurance of this muscle has further degrees of endurance than the previous muscle types, and it has the added benefit of being far more capable of taking repeated strikes from an opponent... meaning you get more bang for your buck all around in terms of effort and energy, time used to train, and the result itself creating multiple benefits, rather than just a targeted one. Keep it up.

The current scientific majority accepts a Quantum Field Theory that is a mathematical exercise and does not operate in the real world. This has been known for nearly a century, and everyone from Einstein to Sagan were large critics of the "Universe is the only thing there is" theory, as opposed to the "Universe exists inside a vast nothingness," theory. Black holes, wormholes, etc... are all mathematical exercises that are not real. Einstein himself said that nature wouldn't allow a singularity to be formed like this, but that something called a "black body" was actually what was happening, which simply absorbs light. But it doesn't tear some hole in space-time. All of this can be looked at at one of my favorite sites, SpaceAndMotion.com. Check it out. Either way, the point was that with our current paradigm, it is constantly necessary to CHANGE the theory itself for the continuous exceptions to the rules. Whereas, any sound scientific theory SHOULD PREDICT outcomes, not be so completely thrown off by them that new and special math and branches of the theory must be invented to maintain it. What really blows your all's minds, though... is that the miracle IS THE MUNDANE. You all look for more, when more stares you in the face. There is no magic, no special states. Or rather, everyone forgets JUST HOW SPECIAL where we are right now actually is. The strangeness of this world far exceeds most ability to comprehend it. It only seems mundane because people have acclimated to it, and know nothing else. The miracle is now. The magic is science. Stop looking for answers outside of this endless recycling of energy in wave-states, stated as reality by Tao, and now confirmed by our own empirical methods. What else is there to want? You already live in the land of sacred life and one-energy. Truly, the forest isn't seen for the trees.

I love how I openly offer people the keys to all the traditional skillsets, but explained by physical and scientific means... and no one wants it, lol. It's hilarious. And it's why Laotzu said that the fool laughs at Tao. Understanding it requires a paradigm shift that most people think they've had, but actually haven't. Unless you're totally surprised at the re-interpretation of all the information you've already acquired, you're not doing it right. Everything should change, yet stay the same. And, if real, it will defy all your expectations and inferences. It... ISN'T... what you think. And it is even mundane and disappointing, which is why so many people ultimately reject the truth: they don't like it. It needs jazzed up. It needs magical energies and mystical states of transcendence and god-like consciousness... or it just isn't good enough. It just isn't fun enough. And it doesn't hold their attention. Unfortunately (or fortunately, from my perspective), if you want badass Taiji superpowers... you're gonna need to dispense with the bullshit first.

I could give you everything you want to know about the internal arts, and how to perform each of the skillsets. But I've got news for you, I'll be damned if I teach anyone the "old way" about Chi and all that nonsense. That's a fantasy my man. You're trying to live in a reality that never actually existed.

Right.

You've certainly made a lot of criticisms without actually saying anything meaningful. I already explained the reason for understanding distinctions. To pretend you don't see them at all is ridiculous. And suffering IS something intentionally addressed in Taoism, whether that sounds Buddhist to you or not isn't my concern. And the box comes from people who try to intentionally skip around using a word for what they mean for fear that it will make them look unenlightened. It's a stupid game, and people see through it. Talk about enlightenment openly, stop trying to pretend that the mark of an enlightened person is to not use a label for it. We all get it, labels are not the way to understand reality. But they are a part of it. And if you're so hell bent on dispensing with labels and words, I have NO idea why you're on this site. It's hypocritical. Either discuss things, or don't. But don't come on here to tell people discussing things by using words and labels is the wrong thing to do, as you engage in discussion. Discussion requires words. We're not telepathic. So, until you come up with a better way to represent the overarching idea of what enlightenment is, both incorrect interpretations of it as well as its subjective actualization, words are going to have to do for now.

I label it thusly because it was originally explained to me thusly. However, the deeper understanding allows these terms to be discarded, and replaced with whatever we deem appropriate. Because it is ONLY the defining factors of positive and negative that count. And those are relative, which can be their opposite and contain their opposite at any given moment based on dynamic parameters. All I know is that the ancients grouped masculinity in with light and hardness and called it Yang, and their opposites so on and so forth. It's like asking about astrology. It comes down to, for some reason, universal archetypes. And I do mean universal. Certain types of trait groupings seem to "clump." I also think that this is explainable by math and physics as well, as we have seen the deeper effects of fractal mathematics and even new insights into "chaos" using standard Newtonian Physics and a Double Pendulum... and how unexpected the connections are and how obscure they can be. Or how simplistically a complex mechanism can be expressed in the most seemingly unlikely or counter-intuitive places. Therefore I am sure that there is a larger, over-arching mathematical connection between the traits we view as Yin and Yang, especially because of the apparent ease with which nature seems to accept these archetypes.

Welcome to TTB I think you present a truncated history. There was shamanism, and a spiritual and energetic prior to the more philosophical methods; you simply mention the Religious methods which come later. There have been plenty of discussions on this but my point is always going to be that whatever box someone wants to put around what is Tao[ism] is a box of their own making. Remove any boundary (including historical ones) and then one will be more likely to discover what is Taoism. Yes, I'm aware of its shamanistic history. But you must see the period in which Tao itself came into its own. You cannot present Taoism in any sort of singular form, but rather accept it for its form at the time in which one refers. The shamanistic period is not Tao, it is a predecessor of Tao. It has many of the same or similar energetic systems and even shares similar beliefs. But as it came unto its own definition after people left "the wild," to put it generically, and it became a philosophical method, combined with energetic practices which set it apart from its shamanistic past, and distinguishes it from its religious offshoots and evolutions later. Though I do agree. Putting Tao in a box is like puttin' Baby in a corner. You just don't do it ;-) But that's actually my point. I see that many people on here bog themselves down with factors of Tao that are unnecessary or just flat don't actually belong. Tao fully accepts any practice... but if in this "dream" of Tao, I decide I want bigger pectoral muscles, I cannot practice watchmaking to get them. While in the dream, we must follow its rules to get results we want. Those results do not matter, and our wanting them is unimportant. But we, the one source, play this game for the sake of the thrill of individuality. And so one cannot achieve "awakening" with an incorrect worldview. Hence, those being awake, and those not. We acknowledge there is at least an illusory difference. And while the habit of putting Tao in a box is something Tao is all about ridding oneself of, we realize that there is what works and what doesn't on a practical level. I simply make a point for others to understand that I practice the Tao of Laotzu and Zhuangtzu. The kind they practiced, which was a philosophical Tao, meant to alleviate suffering and to explain the universe. Something that it does beautifully if understood correctly and implemented correctly. However, what I also attempt to do is cut through the bullshit that these early writers muddied their works with. It was a secret, and it still is. And I don't like it. But, the ancients didn't like giving away their insights without making the subject work for it. I think that is something that came from a time period that no longer exists. Or rather, many of our current societies provide a secure enough atmosphere that the walls of secrecy can come down. And I like to try to make the Daojia (not Daojiao) more accessible to the average person. To realize that the Tao that Laotzu and Chuangtzu speak of is not meant to have used Yogic practices until we leave our bodies and so on. We can do those things, and I think they're an important part of spiritual development. But Tao is not meant to be spiritually escaped. We are meant to see the beauty of everyday normal consciousness, the "miracle" (I don't like words that smack of divinity) of our existence, and the strangeness of reality... and just how lucky we are to be here. The enlightenment I have received has been a glorious re-interpretation of the world around me. And all of my insights have been of a "physical" nature, one could say. The allay of my suffering was found in literal, physical relaxation inside my body. Everything I have achieved follows strictly by Tao principles of Yin and Yang, and my Taiji being "internal," it also follows this guideline as well. It's very strange, the irony I have experienced. I have continued my practice over the years, always expecting one thing, only to get the result I want but for a different reason! I never expected these insights, but they have been revealed to me nonetheless. And so, I give them freely to others who would like to benefit from them. I offer an eminently practical and accessible Tao with all the fruits the "internal arts" have always promised- martial ability, health, and the keys to a happy life.

Goldisheavy, I see now what you are missing in your philosophy. You need an "awakening of unity." I myself did not need this, I needed an "awakening of non-judgment." Each of our dispositions and nature have different needs. You do not see the full unity arising from the single source, and therefore equality and sameness. This renders the matter of choice and difference invalid. However, this kind of truth must be felt, realized. Not intellectualized. I hope maybe you will meditate on this, and see what you find. Look inside yourself, as you have for you ego, and find the part of you that TRULY sees that all things are really one, without difference and without distinction.

This is my point. While Yin is inherently emptiness, femininity, darkness, softness... and Yang fullness, masculinity, light, hardness... The point is that there is no truly determining what is what. There is no static definition, because ALL things are both Yin and Yang simultaneously, and fluidly I might add. Always changing toward it's opposite, with no true "purity" of either. That is the rule. Tao just operates this way.