Bindi

As it is stated in the Bhagavad Gita, chapter 8, verse 12, "Mind, including ego, thoughts, and desires, must fall in the heart, while the life-force (or Brahman Shakti) is released to the sahasrar." Beyond ego death there has to be identification with “Brahman Shakti”, and “Brahman Shakti” has to rise to the sahasra via the jiva Nadi. Brahman Shakti is the driver of the rocket, without this it’s all just academic.

I don’t claim to know anything about the Dao, instead I find myself interested in what I can see and know. This child isn’t the Dao (I don’t think it is anyway), so it is evolutionary. Once attained it may remain, impossible to be undone, like I can’t unborn myself, but I am quite certain it needs to be created, it’s not pre-existent, only it’s potential is pre-existent. So it’s not the equivalent of the ‘Self’, or original nature, or any pre-existent unchanging entity. Maybe, but in evolutionary terms as a group we don’t lose our evolutionary gains, instead we build on them. An individual might be born that has lost an evolutionary gain on a personal level, but as a whole we tend to progress. In evolutionary terms, maybe we as we are are not the end of the line, we’re not evolutionarily fulfilled, it seems to me that there is a whole subset of people trying to progress and we have different methods that we’re trying. To me, the best way to know what is at the end of the path is to put one foot in front of the other and see where the path leads.

Yes this is one view, likely the most dominant view here, but one I completely disagree with. Sorting out emotional and mental ‘knots’, which has to be strived for most strenuously, allows new forces to come into play beyond the emotional and mental levels, and these are the forces that produce the child that wasn’t there before, and couldn’t be there without emotional and mental clarity. Once the child exists, I can’t do anything towards it’s teaching and development, I can’t make any difference no matter what I do or don’t do, and at that point only can I agree to any extent with what you have bolded above. To declare there is nothing gained before this child is produced is to declare oneself a winner before the race has begun.

There is the wounded child, and this wounded child needs to be healed, but even if the wounded child within is healed this is not the end IMO. I think the wounded child is the place to start, but I don’t believe it’s the end. I believe the neidan child is the product of the emotionally and mentally healed wounded ‘dual’ child ie. the emotional and mental inner child. To me the best description of the neidan child is as the child of ‘true yin’ and ‘true yang’, they are the mother and father of it, who care for it and educate it. Birthing and then [true yin and true yang] educating this child seems to me to be the point of our current existence.

Also if you think about the dynamics shown in this picture, maybe neidan is not so divorced from the concept of kundalini as some like to think, considering this ‘energy’ comes from the very bottom - though it’s water not fire.

I agree the two side channels are “Yin” and “Yang”, but I don’t agree that they are synonymous with Shakti and Shiva, as Shakti and Shiva are the polarities associated with the central channel specifically and are an entirely separate issue.

I do understand that a state of mental stillness is pleasant, I experienced such a state for a few days, thoughts appeared but flowed away quickly and naturally and seamlessly, but when this state came to an end I saw a single thought that got trapped and lay on a floor that had been apparently reinstated, I watched as a few more thoughts piled on top and very soon I was back to my normal mind, it was as though a momentary opening in the bottom of a channel that collected thoughts had closed over. But this isn’t the fundamental light that I’m referring to.

I have come across the word jyoti that refers to what I’m thinking of: Jyoti ज्योति, jyoti "light", "radiance", "flame", "brilliance", "brightness"; "luminary", "celestial body" This is the light that fills the universe; the light of our consciousness. Also, jyoti is a burning light in lamps (dipas) in Indian temples. In Hindu texts, the prefixing "jyoti" indicates the divine origin of the described objects, phenomena, deities, in other words, appeared from the divine light — the original source of creation. The question remains though, is it literal or figurative, I tend to think literal, as I have come to believe that all ‘spirituality’ is based on physical states, even if that physicality is made of subtle energy.

Like in my quote from Gopi Krishna, after his kundalini experience settled down he was able to see a fundamental light everywhere including within himself, so it may well be possible to see this fundamental thing with a new evolutionary sense developed.

You say the “emptiness” is always underneath our perception of form, but below you state that it is completely visible to anyone who has been shown what to look for. As you are equating the Dao with emptiness, I would then ask in what way is the Dao visible?

Fair ‘nuff, I’ll report if things go awry 🙂

Specifically in relation to karma, I have come to believe through personal experience that this is exactly kundalini’s role in the central channel, I believe that kundalini is the only way we can resolve all karma (in an orderly way following natural laws), and that resolving karma in the central channel via kundalini rising is the natural next step after first resolving the mental and emotional complexes that we are weighed down with from this life. In this approach there is no danger of overwhelm, and only a teacher who inappropriately meddles with a followers kundalini could create an overwhelming karmic situation.

I understand this to mean Yin and Yang are fundamental principles of the Tao as the Tao expresses itself within the natural universe, which includes within oneself as we are part of the natural Universe. If there is a ‘beyond yin and yang’ and a ‘beyond heaven and earth’, if it isn’t expressed in the natural universe is it relevant to us here on earth, apart from as a philosophical notion?

Not exactly Vedanta but this is what “Hindupedia” has to say about similarities between “Hinduism” and Daoism: https://www.hindupedia.com/en/Daoism_and_Hinduism * Dialectical monism Dialectical monism, also known as dualistic monism or monistic dualism, is an ontological position that holds that reality is ultimately a unified whole, distinguishing itself from monism by asserting that this whole necessarily expresses itself in dualistic terms. Wikipedia

Honestly I have no idea, the most we can do is get our subtle energy body operating smoothly, and from then on face adversity in our healthiest way possible.