Geof Nanto

This is true. It’s unfortunate that Dawei who was an otherwise excellent administrator had such a liking for Trump. And with rabid Trump supporter Karen as a moderator, it was too much. To my mind, it was this bias, both expressed and covert, that made this forum such a friendly place for extreme rightwing political views; views that are the antithesis of every major spiritual tradition and especially that expressed by the Daodejing. However, whilst I certainly saw the need for Sean to intervene and redress the bias, he did so outside of the rules of this forum. These minimal rules have served this forum well in that it’s a dynamic site, full of vitality. Dawei, as administrator, was particularly strong on allowing discussion to be free flowing and, to my mind, showed wise judgement (aside from his strong pro-Trump bias) when deciding whether to take disciplinary action against anyone. Prior to Sean’s intervention, all I thought that was necessary was to retire Karen as a moderator and replace her with a neutral or anti-Trump person. Karen herself had already served a long time as a moderator and was very hard working. She put a lot of herself into trying to help this forum run smoothly. However, she had a strong combative streak, and that when combined with her strong political views severely compromised her ability to be an objective moderator. I do not want to see any member banned except when they clearly violate the rules. This is a public forum open to anyone. If Daoism has any validity at all, then we must allow the freedom for the Dao to work its wisdom here. The quality of discussion here is a reflection of our collective de, especially that of those members who contribute the most. When things go awry in my own life, I have learnt through trial and error to examine my own attitudes rather than putting the blame on others. Nothing wrong with expressing animosity, but ganging up on others is outside of what I would hope can be the ongoing spirit of this forum.

Bushfires hit Wat Buddha Dhamma, one of Australia’s oldest Buddhist monasteries I spent over a year living at the Wat Buddha Dhamma way back in the late 1980's. I have fond memories of the place. I hope it has survived without too much damage. The meditation hall there is a beautiful building, as are some of the hand crafted monk's kutis and mudbrick dwellings.

That sounds a bit grim, Nungali. I hope your place is OK. I've been keeping an eye on the RFS "Fires Near Me" website and it isn't showing any fires near you. Here's a MSM article about the impact of the recent devastating fire here in Nymboida: https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/in-devastated-nymboida-dark-humour-keeps-residents-going-20191118-p53bft.html The Nymboida community is spread over an area of about 200 sq kilometres with a population of less than 300 people. More than half the houses our now piles of rubble.

I'm OK. The fire front hit early evening Friday. It was a fast moving inferno propelled by a strong, gusty westerly wind. I was up all night defending my house and studio and managed to save both. But many houses have been lost in Nymboida including my neighbour’s and a number of my friends. We're a rural community with people living on a minimum 25 acres of mostly forested land. About half of the 12 or so houses on the road where I live are gone and more than half in the community at large, at least on this side of Armidale Rd. Many large trees have fallen, some still smouldering. The surrounding forest is devastated, all blackened trunks and bare earth. No understory or ground cover remains. I weep for the wildlife that’s perished. The forest that used to be alive all day with birdsong is now quiet. It’s even sad to see the few remaining birds flying around in a futile search for food. So many native animals have perished, with those few survivors likely to starve. I have a couple of pademelon’s (small wallabies) sheltering under my house. They’ve taken refuge here because there’s still some unburnt grass around my house and I have a small pond for them to drink from. A possum is here too and I’m putting out food for it. I’m slowly recovering from feeling totally exhausted. I feel calm enough as long as I stay in the moment, centred in my breath-body. I've been very much focused on my own situation here and getting some overview of the fires's impact and what it means for myself and the environment. I've been wandering around the surrounding forest, connecting with the damage, and doing a few small, simple things like tidying up some of the mess around my house. Today is the first day I've felt up writing something about it. I've needed to be in my own space. So much emotion to process. It was almost inevitable that such a catastrophic fire would come through here, given how dry the forest is and with fires burning in the region’s forests for the past month. All it took was a very hot day with high winds and low humidity for the fires to break containment lines on multiple fronts. I was well prepared and knew the fire was unstoppable. A recommendation to evacuate came through Friday morning. My plan was always to stay and defend my home but even so I had second thoughts when the fire front crested the hill to the south west of here. It was a fast moving monster. I wasn’t sure I could save my house but I knew I could always take refuge in my fire shelter if I needed to. As it was, the two fire-fighter pumps and several fire hoses I had set up got me through. I was own my own. The Rural Fire Service could do nothing to help. It’s a small community here with much support but, even so, people are in semi-shock. Although fires are common in this area, there’s never been anything like this one before. Even for people like me who haven't lost their house, it's been a traumatic experience. Yet also one that's very connected with the reality of natural forces, with the reality of life. This too is of the Dao, perhaps more so that much of contemporary life. But it's certainly not something I'd ever want to go through again.

That’s the world where our souls live, now an impoverished place due to too much focus on the intellect. It’s a world that is felt from the heart, an ineffable world that words can only ever hint at. Qi can never be understood through the intellect. We simply kill its reality my making it into a concept. It's an experiential thing. That’s what Walker has well explained in his excellent post above. For me, learning shiatsu helped me enormously to feel my way into experiencing life as a living world of qi flows.

I still find new depth in Jung even after over 20 years of reading his multi-volumed Collected Works. The deeper I go into my own experience, the greater is my understanding of his complex writings. I bought The Red Book soon after it was published and highly recommend it. I've always been surprised and disappointed that topics on Jung's work attract so little interest on Dao Bums. Yes, Carl Jung did not like group work for many reasons, and the teachers of the course Trunk is doing are no doubt aware of that. I checked out their website and liked what I saw so I signed up for their newsletter. They sent me this quotation in an email as an introduction to the course in question:

In memory of Leonard Cohen on the anniversary of his death, November 7, 2016:

And I like reading your posts too on topics I follow. I haven't been adding "Likes" and "Thank Yous" because I've been generally happy to stay as an anonymous reader over the last few months. But I browse this forum daily and it gives me great insight into our human psychology, and hence into my own psychology. Realising my own madness and acknowledging my own mistakes to the extent I have, has given me some compassion and humility that as a young spiritual hero I sadly lacked.

Thank you, Liminal. You write some very insightful comments too. In fact, it was this one of yours as well as Apech’s on his experience in the Manchester bookshop that inspired me to contribute to this discussion. I was going to quote and expand on your excellent second paragraph of that post at the beginning of my previous comment but Steve summed it all up far more elegantly with the response he posted whilst I was writing mine. Yeah, ethical discernment is vital. And those standards you refer to are helpful guides, for sure. But those are the external methods, and whilst they may be generally applicable, that’s not always the case. Every case is different and, as well as the important provisos you mention, condemning people can be a way of controlling something we fear because it’s outside of our own moral conditioning and personal experience. Also these strong, intimate psychic connections are vital in that they can open the channels through which the most powerful teachings flow. Such real life encounters, when coupled with practice forms such as qigong and meditation, have helped me enormously. For me, the inner path is a way to slowly learn to directly feel the harmonies and disharmonies in our subtle patterns of interconnection. When these psychic energies are awry, it feels bad. It feels injurious to my own subtle body as well as other people’s. Good ethical principles have evolved to reflect this, but like I’ve said, they can only ever be generalities. But of course the trial and error process of direct learning also means many mistakes will be made.

Refining my perception of the field of psychic energy that we're all immersed in is at the heart of my practice. That’s where 'God' can be felt as living energy. For me, refinement is an ongoing decades long process of gross to more subtle because I need to work through my own psychic distortions; my own wants and desires. Sexual yes, but for me personally emotional more so. Hence I do not judge others who are on their own path that involves trial and error. A degree of madness is par for the course for those of us who seek a way that's individually appropriate. The crossing ethical boundaries is bound to occur in the process of finding one's own inner ethical standards rather than relying on external teachings. Real spiritual practice involves real danger both to oneself and to those people connected to us. From my perspective, there's no sure path except the path to stagnation and inner death. Of course our ego shields get in the way of admitting error, as my own experience proves. I need look no further than discussions on this forum to see how resilient those ego shields are. And for good reason. Once the ego shield fractures emotional and spiritual devastation follows. And that has to be worked through. For me, I've only been able to work through it with the help of other people and wise teachings. But in retrospect they're the most important experiences I've had. "A teacher can teach you many things, but only life can teach you devastation".

You’ve been in the area longer than me. Some local history for the benefit of interested Dao Bums readers: When I arrived here in 1998 those long running anti-logging protests were still going strong. A number of people I got to know within the local community were in there with you. I had just bought my land and was fully occupied with the basics of establishing myself but planned on joining in later. However, it was shortly afterwards you got results and the protests ceased. It was a big victory and my friends were so happy. The North East Regional Forest Agreement allowed a truce between environmentalists and the timber industry by giving a workable plan for the sustainable management of our region’s extensive forests. It. As well as that, huge areas of old-growth forest that were zoned for logging were converted to National Park and thereby protected in perpetuity. That’s when Chaelundi National Park came into existence. So thank you for your part in making that happen.

According to the latest info on the Rural Fire Service’s fire map, the fire that stopped you was a new outbreak started by lightning. It wasn’t the massive Bee’s Nest fire breaking containment lines but it might as well have been because it’s burning adjacent to the north edge of that fire. It could have been started from the thunderstorm that passed over while you were here, or, more likely, the bigger thunderstorm with massive amounts of lightning we had the night before. You made the right decision in not waiting for the road to reopen. “Probably a 2 - 3 hour wait , at least” stretched a little longer. It’s still closed now and will be until at least tomorrow. Closer to me is another new fire started by lightning from the same storms that’s burning out of control in rugged, difficult to access country in the Chaelundi National Park near Stockyard creek. I can see thick smoke from it billowing over the hills to the south west of here. It’s about 15km away. I’ve been watching the smoke build over the last few days assuming it was from the Bee’s Nest fire and therefore well contained because nothing closer was logged on the RFS “Fires Near Me” map. However, I checked again just now and they’ve added it as a new fire. The RFS don’t seem overly concerned about it at this stage as it’s not posing any immediate threat to anyone’s property. But the eastern boundary of the Chaelundi National Park is very close to me so I’ll definitely be keeping a close eye on its progress. All these fires and it’s still only spring. We’re all hoping for some substantial rain. We normally get good, reliable rainfall here but not this year, the lowest for the year to date in over 100 years. The view from my house looking southwest towards the Chaelundi fire.

Hi Nungali, I was very pleased to meet you. I’ll look forward to taking up your invitation for a reciprocal visit when I’m next down your way. I had no idea that fire had flared up until I read your message just now. That backtrack detour must have added hours to your journey home. A bit of adventure though, albeit resulting in a far less scenic drive than the picturesque meander up and over the forested high country that separates our places. It sure is a bad year for forest fires, the worst in living memory by all accounts. Smoke haze all around again today. And it’s still only springtime. I didn’t show you but I have a couple of fire pumps set up with several fire hoses. My plan is to stay and defend my cabin and studio. It’s my home, my hermitage, and I’d only evacuate in dire circumstances. Yueya

@Nungali You'll be travelling very close to my place on your way back. PM me if you'd like to call in and I'll give you my address.

I’ve previously mentioned how I would like to see some political discussion here outside of partisan politics. Following on from this comment, here are some tentative thoughts shaped around a couple of paragraphs of alchemical commentary written by Marie-Louise von Franz: “In Mysterium Coniunctionis Carl Jung gives detailed commentary on the figure of the old king, who represents the arcane substance and is usually portrayed by the alchemists at the beginning of the process as defective, unredeemed, rigidified, sick, or even evil. The defective quality corresponds to an intensified egotism and hardening of the heart that must be broken down in the alchemical bath. Power hunger and concupiscence often also ingloriously characterise the old king. This attitude of power is characterised by a total lack of feminine softness, of warmth and connection. “The spirit, which in itself is no adversary of the soul, degenerates in such personifications to the level of the intellect, and in this contracted and rigidified form stands in the way of all psyche’s fertile and creative impulses. It is the enemy of emotionality and instinct, but for precisely this reason it secretly lets itself be negatively influenced by primitive impulses.” In contemporary politics it’s easy to see the established parties on both sides as the old kings that have become “defective, unredeemed, rigidified, sick, or even evil”. Both sides are power hungry and prone to concupiscence. More generally, the old king could be seen as the whole moral fabric of society, with our culture pervaded by a “contracted and rigidified” intellectual form of spirit; the intellectual left as bankrupt as the corrupt, patriarchal right. And note how new leaders like Trump and Boris Johnson are unstable, mercurial figures; poison-dripping dragons and tricksters, yet also reconnecting politics with emotionality and instinct, albeit at a primitive level. The intellectual left has no idea how to counteract this, being cut off from acknowledging their own chaotic emotions and instincts. Note how their logical rebuttals, the citing of facts etc, gains no traction in the current political climate. From all this turmoil, with the help of what they called the spirit Mercurius, the alchemists saw the birth of something new; so hopefully our bubbling cauldron of contemporary politics with its mercurial figure-heads can eventually do the same once enough heat is applied. The old alchemists give us some guidance: “The defective quality corresponds to an intensified egotism and hardening of the heart that must be broken down,” as does the “power hunger and concupiscence”; all of which are not only characteristics of our politics but also pervasive throughout our culture. And along with these changes there naturally comes a rebirth of feminine softness, of warmth and connection. Unfortunately, I don’t see any significant trend in this direction. Instead I see the steady rise of a new king; individualism and egotism along with a slow but ongoing reversion to a more historically normal distribution of wealth with a huge divide between a small ultra-rich minority and the rest of us. Multinational corporations are the vehicle for this, their power continues its rise. Countering this there are positive new kings as well, such as the rise of emotional awareness, albeit from a low level. Speaking of our culture generally, our intellect is overdeveloped in comparison to our emotional and spiritual growth.

I agree polar forces are being distilled out, but it’s such a complex, worldwide situation I have no clarity on it at all. I can only stand back and witness as an older person, no longer active in partisan politics, in the privileged position of living in a remote location in a country far removed from the epicentre of these events. One distillation that has directly affected me though, is how the heat of the Trump discussions within the alchemical cauldron of this forum has led to a separation out of distinct opposing forces and the creation of a new website mirroring this one being created by disaffected members. Thus one has become two. Who would have thought that when Trump was elected that he would be a catalyst for such a change here? Not only is the political situation ungrounded and hence unstable, so too is the world economy. It’s on a totally unsustainable trajectory. Once the illusion of our current prosperity collapses, then real heat will be applied to the already volatile political situation. Has it ever been any other way. To give just one instance, the profound turmoil of the Warring States centuries in China led to the distilling out of Daoist, Confucian and other principles from the competing chaos of the Hundred Schools of Thought. It has proved to be a seminal period for Chinese culture; a time when “all psyche’s fertile and creative impulses” were in full bloom. Time for a musical interlude I think.

Yes, I've just added a new topic with this same thought as one of my observations.

A general comment on the left / right divide.... From my perspective in Australia, the centre in American politics is well to the right. From what I’ve seen, all of the so called left-wing policies mentioned in the American context are undisputed policies on both sides of mainstream politics here. I suspect this is also the case in most all, if not all, other Western democracies.

An excellent summation of the importance of accepting one's own darkness:

I’m an old recluse who lives in Australia and I don’t want to get involved in American partisan politics. However, I’ll always find, racism, bigotry, misogyny, and homophobia toxic anywhere, and especially on a spiritually focused forum like this one. And it’s a sad fact that these attitudes abound within the pro-Trump camp. Hence, I’d be very happy for staff to always make it known that such attitudes are not welcome here. Personally, I’d like to see more humility and compassion on display. But that’s something that can only come from within. Otherwise it becomes inauthentic, like what’s often found within organised religion, be it Christianity, Buddhism etc. And this site does have a vitality that only a certain level of conflict can produce.

Thank you. I can't take credit for it though. It's the motto of Christian Knorr von Rosenroth. Jung quotes it at the beginning of his essay, The Psychology of the Transference.

Old Dog, I appreciate the thoughtfulness of your contributions on this forum. Thank you. But when I say I don't want to pursue a topic I mean it. My reasons for not wanting to do so should be clear from my previous post.

I’d like to keep a focus on Daoism too, though I’m happy to see “Daoist Textual Studies” changed to a more general “Textual Studies”. But the biggest change I’d like to see is to never again allow staff to become so one-sided politically. That’s something that’s proved toxic for this forum and resulted in a number of members, including myself, no longer feeling comfortable participating here. And it seems a number of good people have left permanently.

I fully agree with your first paragraph. But not: His was very much an exploration of both the individual and collective psyche. And he fully embraced the spiritual dimension, a vital aspect of reality that academia in general has trouble coming to terms with. Hence his work is totally relevant to our contemporary situation because, for me, our contemporary problems are not intellectual - that's our cultural strength - they're spiritual. However, we all find meaning in different perspectives. For me, the perspective of the article you reference in you OP is shallow compared to Jung's. It's too intellectual. But really I'm very content to leave it at that. It's not something I want to pursue. One of my personal difficulties that I seek to overcome is that I get overly caught up in the world of ideas. Intellectual understanding is good as far as it goes, but it's feeling connections that give meaning for me. My feelings allow me to enter the spiritual realm. The Dao Bums discussion format means we tend to pursue difference, as I'm partly doing here, but that's such a problematic way to connect. However, I know we all do our best with what's available to us. And I'm thankful that this forum, which I'd almost given up on, has been restored to a place I once again feel some affinity with since Sean's intervention.