Anzhi

It is a bit blurry and quite a while since I have had the book, I'm sorry. But I would say, with respect, if you are looking for something with the flavor of your serious and detailed questioning, she and you are not recipricol, in the way she approaches the Yi. You appear in your reponses more 'fire', direct and with a seeking burn, and I recall she is more 'water', very fluid, and intuitive. That maybe furthering if you want that change to explore with her, via her book. Or not, according to your own seasons. I am not a very good book reviewer nor an accomplished academic. More a psychologist or poet in my approach. Perhaps there may be a proper review on Amazon?

Why he may not be widely known I don't know, especially in the scholarly area. As you are likely aware, there is a plethora of Yi Jing material on the internet. Online Clarity is a well known and well attended forum on the Yi. Second hand assessment goes only so far. It may or may not suit your needs. I have read widely on the Yi and as I say it remains my main reference. The published books were expensive.,so I only purchased the matrix copy.

I have read this a while ago. I haven't a copy now. And I am not sure which edition it was. But the edition I read, was valuable and written well. It is not a big book, but is serious writing on themes the author sees in the Yi.

Thank you for your interest in this rather impressive man. His site is well worth a good explore. His grasp of detail is very good. His two YiJing volumes are excellent in my opinion. One his translation, the second the fully referenced script of the Chinese version. You can download both of these free. He has also presented a similar with the Lao Tzu. His writing is very articulate and temperate, while his aquaintance and intimacy with the works becomes quickly obvious. I only know his written acquaintance of the language, but I would be very surprised if he wasn't a confident speaker. A remarkable man. https://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/answers/2020/06/19/bradford-hatcher/

I am saddened to hear this news, somewhat belatedly. His work on the Yi was unique , thorough and very furthering. A central reference for me. Sorry, I have been away from the Forum. I recommend his free offerings on his site. I purchased his second volume, with full details on every gua on Chinese characters. Use it often. Grateful for his life and work. "Please forgive the lack of updates and any dead linkson account of my having proved mortal." from his site https://hermetica.info/

I find this good read on the major significance of the Ta Chuan, part of the Ten Wings. It is where the rich description of the yarrow method is found. "...Edward Shaughnessy in his retranslation of the Great Commentary based on the Mawangdui materials echoes Peterson’s evaluation of its importance in observing that “the worldview of its Xici or Appended Statements Commentary—integrating man and nature through the medium of the Yijing—is arguably the most sophisticated (it is certainly the most subtle) statement of the correlative thought that has been so fundamental to all of China’s philosophical systems.” Shaughnessy is not exaggerating when he says that “indeed, so central has the Yijing been to Chinese thought over these two millennia that a history of its exegetical traditions would require almost a history of Chinese thought.” The Yijjing as a text is itself an object lesson in the worldview that it attempts to present. That is, when we reflect on the nature of particular “events” within this process worldview, the relationship between these particular foci and their fields lends itself to a holographic understanding of world systems..." https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s40636-015-0013-2

Very rich thread and lots of furthering possibilities. I have pondered the outputs of various methods and whether they detract or add. I think from experience the yarrow (or their probabilities in a suitable method of casting) appear to be closer to the "mark" in responses, sometimes as has been mentioned freakingly so, down to exact words/phrases used in question. But the role of our intuitive field is important It is not just the book but the interaction, as with all synchronistic events. There is something mysterious in this. I do not discount other methods of approach for synchronicity and our intuitions can work with all things, as does the Tao, but just clearer perhaps rather than a slight fog. Holographic properties are inherent here I think. With holography if the original plate for projection is shattered any piece will project the original but not as clearly. I see holographic qualities in the Yi. Ritually and preparing the receptive spirit, nothing beats the yarrow stalks. I'd like to get real ones, not skewers however, though painted.

Well done and informative, shall follow on YouTube. Thank you Harmen.

My take on it is that the Yin and Yang are not equal in that sense. That sort of equality necessarily means stagnation and lack of movement. The Yang is higher greater and more active than the Yin, which is submissive by definition. The Tai Chi symbol is perhaps best thought of as mobile with the small spots growing and lessening in turn. I regard the unequal probabilities as better reflecting and corresponding to this movement and change within life. All energy we know flows via differentiation.

May I share one remarkable synchronicity. I did a reading for my daughter and family about making a decision about a dog they had acquired to be a companion to their other one. It was untrained and causing numerous problems. They didn't know whether to persist or not. The casting gave understandable allusions to both if it was kept or if they passed it on, to consider. It helped them to crystallize their thinking and decision making, bringing to light unconsidered possibilities and views of the overall situation. They decided to give it to someone on bigger property and "Larry" and the new owners are very happy. They weren't "told" to do it by some "mumbo jumbo" but assisted as a good counselor would, helping to see the possible aspects and changes around the issue. Anyway, on the way home shortly after leaving their place and doing the casting, a car was in front of me with the license plate "Two Dogs". I have never seen before or after such a number plate. It can be explained as just a coincidence. Perhaps. But when such things happen often around the intentional us of the Yi you do begin to wonder. I wasn't looking for it.

Thank you Old Dog. Yes, not an uncommon view. I share a lot of it too, being highly respectful of science. But like many things there are varieties of what is labelled "synchronicity", including what is so-called but isn't. But however we understand it, and I have a read a book or two about this fascinating subject, it is a "phenomenon" of some sort that strikes 'casters' often when working with the Yi. In many cases I am now of the view it is a particular way our primate patterning searching mind works. Synchronicities are defined by a coincidence of meanings and meanings are projected by us on the outer world. It is no wonder we see so many in the Yi, so full of symbols and allusions in a language of multi-meaning ideographs. This in no way demeans the Yi or the phenomenon, but simply explains how it can be so intuitively helpful and uncovering and "furthering" our quests. Nor am I beyond wondering how sometimes it really is so spot-on in a casting, with even the very words of your question or concern front and centre and the most helpful appropriate allusions. Not always but often. And even if we have the most detailed explanation of causation of the phenomenon, the process and helpfulness of this book and its structure and ideas keep it alive and people responding to its process of "divination", which to me now is just a word we attach to the process. Intuitively the ancients evolved with it and their applications evolved with it, and by that mysterious process of evolution came up with a brilliant process of deep intuitive encounter with life and one's mind and expanded perceptions.

There is both a three and a two coin method of casting. Like the use of 16 objects/marbles the two coin method reporduces the probalities of the milfoil method. https://www.onlineclarity.co.uk/learn/ways-to-consult-the-i-ching/2-coins/ The discussion as to how the probabilities reflect Yang/Yin qualities in life are very interesting (Yin will tend to remain at rest...Yang tends to activity and change more often) but are not spoken about in that manner really (perhaps indirectly though) in the Ta Chuan. The whole number thing is interrelated to months and shamanic type connections via the numerical path to "activating the ghosts and spirits", so there are varying symbolisms with the whole milfoilprocess. "four seasons"..."unique lunar months"...the extreme of Ch'ien sticks is 260..the extreme of K'un sticks is 144...this gives 360. Corresponds to days of the year." etc. Ta Chuan is not an unquestionable "bible", it is an added commentary and ideas from long ago. Correspondences and holistic thinking drips throughout the Yi; this was how they sought to evoke the "spirit(s)" to see and understand the changes and possibilities. This is what is happening when we cast. While any random (three coin) method will bring forth a hexagram of value, (any hexagram has correspondences to the "ten thousand things"), if we believe in the fact of synchronicity then we will seek to "aid it' to appear clearer by as best tuning as possible, not only of the method but also of the mind-heart. I use both marbles and two coin method. A funny memory was going to the toy shop to gather my different colored marbles in specific numbers,while the shop person thought I'd lost mine.

I am not fluent in Chinese, but have Chinese language references and understand the approach to grammar somewhat. I wouldn't expect Master Huang's translation to be necessarily "the best" just because he is Chinese. He is also pretty Confucian in approach. That's OK but it is just one aspect of the jewel. But reading and responding with the heart-mind to the Yi and surviving by it as he did in hard imprisonment for a number years, certainly gives him some cred imo. If we think encountering the Yi is very dependent on an "accurate" translation I don't thinks so, because Chinese is such a many- nuanced lingo there are many opinions. I read Master Huang's work for the info re the original characters and some inputs from Chinese culture that do help. I, like others, have two or three references to get a more complete 'taste' of a gua. Wilhelm's is always valuable but necessarily dated in some aspects. Also very Confucian in stress. My final measure is how the particular version confronts me and challenges. My primary one, with the characters laid out with expanded meanings is the word by word one by Bradford Hatcher. "The Book of Changes" Vol. 2. Meeting with the Yi is not just an academic exercise, but somewhat also of a meditative kind, for me.

I have been walking this way for 30 plus years. I can still go to DDJ 1 to be inspired and to appreciate how much I do not know, which may be one the most significant things to achieve. I wander off the path due to my own "coming late". I am now a stupid old fool who just done that yet gain. But I come again and find this way is still the same and there is no yea or nay, an emptiness that is endlessy full. I get kindly chided for "coming late" and things go on as before, embraced and embracing. I wonder when I will get tardy again? "Coming late" is a phrase one encounters in the Yi Jing. It is not being present. Not being present for a moment or for a year or two means I do not see or hear what's actually going on. It was still actually going on. You try to find "Sages" of a way that declares that naming or describing is some other way but not this one, as if painted in big letters over the first "door" people often come through to it. Try not to be foolish. But even in your foolishness (and mine) , even if you flee, if you have come near, it may yet come again and surprise. Don't ask me how whatever "it" is does "it". I can't seem to get away from it, no matter how a hard I try to be not present. Even in my "not presentness", like a playful cat I find it whacking at the trouser cuff of my left leg when I thought it was outside. May I recommend the book "Dao De Jing - A Philosophical Translation" by a couple of old fool honkey professors of philosophy departments. The DDJ was first written in Chinese characters, you may need to know furher how that can be a many nuanced way of communicating. It may also help you appreciate the life enhancing richness on DDJ if truly wished to be helped at the present time - to try and be more present. To this end may I suggest more respectful dialogue with your many correspondents, not for their sake, or the Dao's, but for yours. But if you do not wish too, so be it, we will all enjoy yapping with each other around the fire. The Dao is in all things , without exception.

Greetings. I am seeking further translations of the Ta Chuan. I have Richard Wilhelm's translation. I am aware of Stepehen Karcher's translation and commentary. I think that is only available from Amazon, unless anyone knows elsewhere? And I am wondering if anyone knows of other translations of the Ta Chuan? Thank you for any assistance or direction. _/\_

Thank you Shidifen and Daelun for your most helpful further additions. Pardon my lateness of response. I have been wandering. _/\_ In the meantime I did procure a copy of Karcher. It was second hand and smelt like it was from ancient China. Nevertheless it reads well.

Many thanks, Shidifen. Most helpful. _/\_

Aha! This moth that landed beside me this afternoon in the garden to see who I was, needed no practical methods to be authentic or to express its inner force. I had never seen it during the two years under tutelage of a Trika Shaivite Tantric Acharya, as i stared into the eyes of my Shiva Murti. The Guru went mad before I nearly succombed too seeking that which could not be ever seen or touched, and spent many hours with emails rescuing a young innocent from another Guru slicing man. The moth was not present at the year of constant meditation twice week at a Korean Taoist Qi Healing group attired in my robes and my socks. Perhaps it was in the strange sound and power of the Qi Master as he sent me qi after he had developed it in long hours of daily rituals before we arrived. and I felt and knew it for the first time and never forgot it and by which I can now tell the four directions with my eyes closed and without a compass. This qi healed my mind and body and i was renewed. But the taint of the human became excessive again as they then asked for a $1000 for each tree and subtree of my family ancestry to clear something or other. Hahaha! Was it in the rare air of the teachings of Tibetan Dzogchen...much further along the track, Oh Dear Authenticity of Being, I was evntuially to realizing finally it was there all the time and I could finally relax into the freedom of the Path of No-Path. Aha! You do not know it, it is so easy to tell. You are still too full of pride and self yet and that is quite normal. For bBirds and moths and straw dog humans like myself I throw away my life, while I dance and hear the spirits speak as clear as the roaring wind in the trees. The birds gather and sing before me and abundance (not cashy washy) ease my fading body. I honor the Dao to the depths of my being and doubt nothing and everything. May I suggest an early valuable lesson that you should learn quickly to save you valuable time in development on whichever path you choose to follow, and I honor all of their sincere teachings on authenticity, "OF-ITSELF-SO" >> Do not assume so much from a single sentence, you can lose credibility very quickly, but in return you may receive the precious gift of humility, so important if you are sincere in learning about the powers inherent in true authenticity. But then that depends on how open your Heart is. You have still much to learn my young man. Persevere. If you perceive I am being somewhat patronizing that is my full intention, I could be your father twice over, my little moth. If you wish to learn the power of the Dao way you may approach me and I will decide how much and whether I instruct you. there are others here too, I know. Choose your straw dog or your Tao Bum, they may be ready to tolerate your impudent brashness better than I. _/\_ _/\_ _/\_

In a less astute place (not on this site) I encountered once again the reaction of those who appear to to deride any words at all about the Dao on the simplistic pretext that anyone who says anything about the Dao is mistaken because it cannot be described. In answer I posted the following. My second post, to simply share amongst new friends. Others may well have encountered this. Greetings to all. _/\_ "Looking and yet not seeing it we thus call it "elusive." Listening and yet not hearing it we thus call it "inaudible" Groping and yet not getting it We thus call it "intangible" Because in sight, sound and touch it is beyond determination We construe it as inseparably one. As for this "one" - it's surface is not dazzling nor is it underside dark. Ever so entangled, it defies discrimination And reverts again to indeterminacy. This is what is called the form of the formless And the image of indeterminacy This is called the vague and the indefinite. Following behind you will not see its rear; Encountering it you will not see its head. Hold tightly onto way-making in the present To mange what is happening right now And to understand where it began in the distant past. This is what is called the drawstring of way-making" Chapter 14, "Dao De Jing, A Philosophical Translation" by Roger T Ames and David L. Hall. From the commentary of the translators; "...Unlike the things we think we know, cosmic way-making will not yield itself up to our most basic categories of location and determination; bright and dark, inside and outside, and subject and object, one and many. And when we know this cosmic way-making better, we come to understand that we don't really know "things" at all." My further note was: I understand this to mean that saying something is or isn't the Dao is problematical. I would be as unsure to say the Dao is not in this or that, as much as to say it is in this or that. _/\_ "We know it by this." This phrase unqualified and without referral to anything. is found in a few places in the Dao De Jing. What is "this"? Honor the Dao.

Thank you thelerner. _/\_ When we get to the place of neither easy nor hard, neither simple nor complex, both begin to look like the other. More quickly we see pain's blessing, guide and protection, the complex becomes the textbook for learning to be simple. Then we see through the complex in a flash, ponder on the simple that has swallowed us, and everything into one or two scribblings, and we watch as thing after thing emerges from it endlessly.

Thank you Bearded Dragon. _/\_ Most helpful and clear.

Anna Breytenbach is an animal communicator and has teaching resources. She has had a now well-known and deeply transformative (for me) encounter with a Black leopard. The story is in the link below. She is not a student of the Dao in an overt way. Her way of connection with other animals (remembering we are animals too) much furthered me in understanding and development in my contact with them. Others posting here report the same and very similar to my experience. It is primarily the shifting and opening of the awareness and seeing that it is entirely possible and once one experiences it , it all changes. We don't have to use "Dao language" It is all a mystery but it is actual. It's easy and very simple. All of us at prime level beneath language or other animal communication use image and inner visualization . And even if we use words (in thought) they can work because all basic language (not highly abstract) originate/connect with stored image in consciousness (Dao Field ) both via and beyond the confines of the physical brain, as it appears to me at present. "Cat" is a word, but consciousness links images with that word. We can send out images and even simpler sentences (which naturally have images attached mentally) Many other species can have awareness connection at that level, and we can develop a receptive image receive function too as we build up sensitivity. Mine is improving. One knows by obvious result. But it is not just image, it is also physical, behavioral and by sounds. Story: We have a new cat in the area and it is hunting. Birds are the local species that I am building communication with and very enjoyable. I needed to change bird baths etc to make them more safe.A young magpie was resting in the shade of shrub and I wanted to warn about the cat. I said softly and focus my message towards him/her "Careful little one there is a new cat around". i said it twice. emphasis in thought being on "cat". It immediately flew to its mother nearby. The birds around here are now well aware I am a friend. The next day the young one flew to my kitchen window and tapped it and then made sure I looked and it looked back. then flew away. I knew it was saying thank you. You can do that sort of thing, any of us can. The Dao is easy. Anna says it is easy too. Many of us need to wake up, trapped in the hard cold halls of reductionist materialist science. They are a century out of date. (More and more are jumping the sinking ship but they don't admit it. They just start using quantum language and concepts and never discuss the differences with the old story ) Ifind it endlessly amusing. They are still in the Isaac Newton story (Thank you Isaac) and the we are next chapter (and the next two after) of the Quantum story of the Dao's dance now. Watch the video. Start trying it in simple ways as others suggest. There is more but want to keep the post shortish Everything is Dao-ing without exception. _/\_ .

I find bridging of the chasm between Western Greek philosophical thought forms and Chinese multi-meanings in one character very difficult to cross these days. I must allow others to show the way. All crossings from both sides are much appreciated. I especially appreciate the opening of further nuances within the Chinese characters. Thanks to Crescent Moon. These days I always find myself returning to the side of Zhaungzi, unable to cross. I remember the other side, lots of good thoughts there and still. I think I did it when I was younger, but it may have been a dream, I am not sure now. The venerable Roger Ames, and David Hall have returned with stories to tell in "DDJ - a Philosophical Translation." "Nabo Zikui said, "Where did you learn of this?" Lady Ju said, "I learned it from the son of Aided-by-Ink, who learned it from the grandson of Caught-in-Recitation, who learned it from Look-and-See, who learned it from Heard-in-a-Whisper, who learned it from In-Need-of-Labor, who learned it from There-in-the- Singing, who learned it from Dark-Oblivion, who learned it from Joined-in-the-Void, who learned it from Perhaps-a-Beginning" [Zhuangzi, The Essential Writings, Brook Ziporyn translation: 6:38> ]

Wordless and laughing, I plonk on my bum, before you, still chuckling. I get up and try to bow and fall over. Thanks shanlung