Ilovecoffee

So we are masochists, losers, and are dumb, or dumbed down? Do I understand you correctly?

What words would you really want to use Starjumper?

We are freethinkers, we base our beliefs on the best available objective evidence available to us, we require there to be scientists and medical doctors present in that evidence to rule out fraud, and we also base our beliefs on our own first hand observations. If we are a cult, it is a cult of reason, a cult of rationality. No one accepts anything on faith, and no one drinks the kool-aid. From our perspective it's about as anti-cult as it gets. If you feel differently let's agree to disagree.

I think you are misrepresenting us Brian. All of us meditate, that doesn't mean what we are doing is as productive as it could be. We need months, maybe years in isolation to make it really count, and most of us will use our vacation time to do that each year. Two weeks a year, maybe three is still just a drop in the bucket. A few hours here and there on the weekends, just a few more. I am not going to argue or try and elucidate why 1000 hours of meditation spread out over 30 minute sessions is not the same quality as 100 days at 10 hours per day. Unfortunately none of us are financially at a point where we can sit around all day and focus on training, so we do the best we can. That doesn't mean we all haven't experienced the same types of things. We chose MoPai because there is objective evidence, and scientists and medical doctors present to rule out fraud. We practice something we can verify in this manner as the only other alternative to us is doing nothing at all. That seems stupid to you, so we can agree to disagree.

We have as much as Jim and Kosta were given, and no more. The only other option besides continuing with what we have, would be to just give up and do nothing and wait until a system with at least as much objective evidence, and at least as advanced as MoPai can be found and all levels for that system obtained. We all believe that going as far as we can with what we have been given, will put in in a better position to make further progress.

It's funny you mention that but I have talked to other people like us, that were able to read Kosta's books and were able to "get it", to understand the point of the system, already understood what they were supposed to be doing in meditation, and were really only lacking a few minor details. There was no fighting, no arguing, not fit pitching, no screaming, none of that. Like I said people who just accept things because other people say so, share a very different mindset. I am not saying that we are better and they are worse just that there is a major chasm in how we perceive reality. In my experience people who think like we do have no trouble whatsoever grasping these things, and people who don't have to put up a fight to defend why that can't be so.

Those words are so sterile and empty of meaning, much like the word "enlightenment". Ask 100 people what enlightenment is and you'll get 100 answers, essentially it can mean anything and in doing so means nothing. MoPai is much more specific in what is being done, and why it is being done. The problem is most people I meet that call themselves "spiritual" whatever that means, find the purpose of MoPai repugnant and inherently anti-spiritual. Your description is as good as can be had without starting a flame war.

It's not a conversation that can be safely had here in this environment.

I think the majority will agree with you.

No one needs magic to start a fire. Starting fire, lightning led lights, none of that has anything at all to do with the ultimate purpose of the system. Often the ones we wind up with only want to be Goku, but that isn't the point. How it was explained to me, is that from a babies perspective being able to cook food, drive a car, lift heavy objects and put them on the top shelf, all of that is like magic. Only a infant would think that ooh I want to grow up so I can get that magic power to get the cookie jar on the top shelf. Well that isn't the point of becoming an adult, and while an adult can do that it, and it is impressive to an infant, it's really not the point. The powers in MoPai are very much like reaching adulthood, you can do more because you are more, but the abilities gained are not and never were the point.

So to make sure I understand if someone holds our position, they are "dumbed down"?

We see things differently, not because people who share our views are dumb or dumbed down, but because overall the majority of spiritual seekers don't think like we do. They will believe anything they are told so long as it is marketed well and has a bunch of testimonials, and require no evidence other than placebo. We have no intention of creating a faith based belief system, religion or cult, nor desire to worship any entity, nor desire to become popular, nor desire to profit from this endeavor. We are not attempting to mislead anyone. You are welcome, and best wishes to you as well.

Thanks.

Just to make sure I understand what you are saying here: That if someone holds our position, that they must be dumbed down, or dumb?

Thank you, I think you are as well.

Thank you to you as well.

Best wishes Brian.

Brian as I've said you can argue with the wall for all I care. Best wishes.

I don't think any member of our group myself included would refer to you as a friend Brian.

I believe thelerner already is attempting to do that here: https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/44528-serious-mo-pai-thread-forget-history-lets-break-down-techniques/

Thanks to you as well.

Unfortunately Brian I am not going to play these games, you will need to find someone else. Best wishes.

To you as well, also what I am referring to isn't slang it's literally a brand new word just coined in the US it isn't slang for something else.

Unfortunately I don't think that's a good idea, maybe in a private forum it would be a discussion that could be had, but certainly not here.