ganjaboy

I'm not sure if I understand correctly, but you're saying that I am not I am not "yang" or outwardly masculine enough and this is the source of the problem? Furthermore, to what rejection of traditional values of manhood and womanhood in the West are you referring? Plenty of men look masculine but act like children.

This exactly describes my problem. I am intelligent, polite, friendly, and outgoing to girls and women, but I do not attract them because to them I do not embody a concept of "masculinity" (not muscular / athletic / rugged enough). I think that in the West there is a tendency for attraction to be such a physical one, wherein a partner with otherwise redeeming qualities will be rejected based on appearance alone. I have trouble with the self-acceptance because I crave acceptance and "fitting in" with others.

Thanks. I forgot to mention, I don't align very strongly with any one organized faith or denomination, I find that I never am able to agree with the system of guilt that has been institutionalized. I feel like that if people took half the time they spent feeling bad about something they did in the past, and instead spent it changing themselves, the world would be a better place. Agreed with the points about definition of one's self by spirituality - I think that is a major mistake. The "self" that is apparent to others is just an earthly object anyway, so how could it ever be reflected through faith or spiritual practices? I've known so many people who professed their spirituality openly to make themselves seem good or holy, but the irony is that this is just creating more attachment to the earthly "you" - that which other people perceive. If this philosophy was adhered to, there would really be no need to make others feel unworthy or sinful over their own sexual practices, either, because everyone would just be living on his/her own path and doing what worked best for them. Granted, there are moral expectations from society, but apart from that - where does the pressure come in? Some things just don't change, huh? That makes me glad that I never got hooked on porn while in my mid-teens like some young men do. The immediate benefit is to not be reliant on external imagery to be aroused, and so instead I find myself interested in real women in daily life, in non-sexual scenarios. It really is mind over matter, though, because daydreaming can be equally dysfunctional if it gets out of hand.

Thought I would just throw my $0.02 in as someone who has had difficulties with the relevant issue at hand. I've been on the cultivation path for around three or so months now. Can it help improve quality of life? Yes. Do I still slip up? Yes. Does sometimes life get so overwhelming that I need to release sexual tension in this manner? Yes. Do I need to do it as much as I used to? Not at all. The thing is that I am only 19 years old. At my age most teenaged boys don't give a second thought to something that is seen as so normal and natural. I'm sure I would have enough sex drive to masturbate at least daily if I wanted to. But I don't. I shoot for once every 7 days - two weeks, depending on what my life is like. If I'm taking a class at university, or am working on a creative project, I conserve for longer. This can really help, but I think the honest truth is that it only will if you believe it will. I believe it's a form of self-hypnosis almost, in that by believing that a certain action will manifest in a changed behavior you can empower yourself. Prior to reading about cultivation and all, I didn't give second thought to any of this. I was just looking for answers. I will give a lot of credit to what is said about the beneficial effects that not ejaculating frequently can have for the mind, and I believe they are true. Like anything, though - this has to be done in moderation. Or at least, I do so in moderation. I just think, like anything else, it can be unhealthy to attach so much importance to this sex act. Just as the desire to have sex/masturbate can lead to attachment and hinder spiritual development, can not the desire to be celibate accomplish this, as well? The above point was made to me on another message board. I have been to both ends of the spectrum, having masturbated frequently and very infrequently. What I want to avoid is hating myself and having self-doubt seep in if I slip up and jerk off. I wish I could just see sex for what it was, appreciate it, and move on. That's how it was when I was about 15. But I feel like the pressures of life and society result in this confused emotional jumble that it makes it impossible to see things as clearly. On the one hand, having sex or masturbating too frequently can lead to a lack of horniness and energy/vitality in life, or at least it did for me. Keep in mind that I was screwing up in lots of other ways at this point in my life, however. On the other hand, I think that if sexual energy is never released and there is an excess of yang you are more likely to become sex-starved and do things such as acquire fetishes, watch frequent pornography, or have many meaningless sex partners. The point of balance for me is at which the sex act stops being beautiful, pleasurable, and beneficial in its own right and is more out of compulsion, confusion, or need to eliminate stress. I believe that if it, or any other earthly activity, is used in this manner you will never be able to get enough of it and will just confuse yourself. In short, I agree with you all. What I don't agree with is ANYONE needing to feel bad about themselves if they give in to the impulse to jerk off - for the umpteenth time. Earlier in the thread, someone compared sexual desire to hunger. Anorexics feel bad about eating, so they starve themselves. Bulimics eat way too much and then feel bad about that. Both are a form of imbalance, and they become trapped in the cycle. Is sexual desire really any different?

I'm posting this because I constantly find myself in conflict between two main fulfillments of my own - athletic activity and more artistic pursuits, such as music production, composing, and performance. I love to create and write music, and even more I love to perform it and see it in its completed state being appreciated by an audience. In another thread, some speculation was offered on this, to the conclusion that the act of composing music might be a more yin pursuit. The act of composing is what I spend the majority of my time doing. Surprisingly, I find that the creative act itself saps a LOT of mental energy - it takes a lot out of one's self to really generate good ideas, and even more to see them through to completion. This is even harder for me because I have another passion, and that is running. I train regularly and competitively for long-distance, and the regiment that I have to keep often involves running for an hour or so most days. Undeniably, this is an overwhelmingly yang activity. In theory, the two should be able to balance each other out, but with the added constraints of life, school, work, etc...I usually find that, at best, I am tired at the end of the day, and maybe can work at 60% productivity in my creative pursuits. It gets depressing, because these are two things which really mean a lot to me. Mainly I'm trying to bust through the precept that athletes can't have artistic insight, and the inverse, that artists can't possess great physical will and determination. Are there any specific recommendations anyone out there can offer that might help? Thanks! EDIT: This should be in the General forum. Apologies!

Thanks so much. I hadn't really consciously that about it that way - the idea that each pursuit can feed the other in a beneficial fashion. I guess I have subconsciously noticed it, in that sometimes during a training session, I might get really good creative ideas that I will remember. Likewise, when I'm working on music for too long I tend to grow restless and wanting to do something with my body. After doing something physical I can usually get back to other activities refreshed, but it definitely depends on how tired I am. I'll be paying special attention to my energy levels in both activities. Thanks, interesting points! After thinking about it, I guess I really did fall into the trap of using a "model" of what could or should be. I think that's a very Western tendency. It must come from some inner desire on my own part for order, logic - the ability to categorize one's self readily and easily. Increasingly I'm coming to the conclusion with Taoism that that is impossible, and is only really matters when you are comparing yourself to others anyway. It's a hard mindset to get out of, for me, because at times I feel that identifying with one type of people can be a lifeline if I feel rejected by groups. But it can also come at the expense of uniqueness and individuality, I fear. Beyond what is considered "socially acceptable", I guess there isn't a lot of pressure to "be" any one particular way. Ideally, people would accept me for who I am, but there are those who feel threatened by someone who is unique and not easily pigeon-holed. I guess these people don't matter anyway if they are unwilling to accept diversity.

Hello. As I mentioned in another thread, I am a 19 year old male seeking answers, particularly related to sexuality and problems it causes within my life. I should preface this post by saying that I do not know a lot about Tao practices. The little I do know I have gathered through my own reading, and I have never received instruction. Like most men my age, I have a very high sex drive. Around 14 I became conscious of the energy that the desire itself possesses, and experimented with masturbation - all very normal behavior. There seemed to be scheduled a balance to the buildup of tension and the release afterward. At 17, however, I began to have trouble. It was a very stressful time of my life due to some serious changes within my life and family, and I began to doubt myself. Subconsciously, I assumed that more release would relieve the stress, and I gradually began to masturbate more, until at one point I would be up to 9 orgasms a day. This is when my life fell apart. Though I was getting more "release" than ever before, something seemed to be missing, and there was no sense of satisfaction. For many months I was "dry", with no ejaculate whatsoever, and was concerned for my health. The act became little more than rote for me, and I felt compelled to orgasm a certain number of times per day and would panic if I failed to do so. This uncertainty extended over into other areas of my life, as well. Previously an excellent student, I began having a hard being motivated to complete my studies or get good grades. Additionally, I was feeling driven physically. The appearance of mybody and my fitness became of utmost importance to me, though when I considered why this would be I never could come up with a logical answer. I became crabby and irritable, and had difficulty concentrating on abstract concepts. Formerly a fan of classical and downtempo, I was unable to listen to any music other than fast-paced, loud rock. My bizarre behavior alienated a few former friends and nearly cut me off from my family. It has only been recently that I have attempted to make changes within myself. It started when I head someone say the famous phrase "it's not the destination, it's the journey". While a now-tired sentiment, it resonated deeply within me. When I realized how applicable it was to my life, I broke down in tears. I was spending every day merely waiting for the next day, for no reason that was apparent. The way I eventually broke out of this behavior was by recalling some of my early experiences with sexuality. I remembered that release had more meaning when it was not careful and not at a whim all of the time. Around this time I also learned of the concept of "jing", which I understood to be indicative of human "essence" and energy, which, by some beliefs, I was needlessly expending multiple times a day in the form of semen. Gradually, I began to masturbate less, and began experimenting with retention. I did Kegel excercises and performed "edging" as often as I could in effort to hold in my semen. After the first week, the effects were already becoming apparent. I had a great deal of energy instead of my previous lethargy, found myself having idle conservation again, and began to feel more relaxed. My grades picked up. I stopped exercising like a manic, and while I still worked out, I did not feel compelled or anxious about doing so. The girls and women in my life seemed more drawn to me, and while I could not perceive the specific affect that was causing this, they obviously did. The problem I encountered, however, was balance. I felt myself sinking into a trap of excess sexual energy. My masturbation became more and more "kinky" by conventional standards. Though I am straight, I found my sessions would have a predominately anal focus as if my penis did not provide enough stimulation. I feel that I would have sought increasingly bizarre sources for pleasure the longer the period between emissions. All the while, I avoided ejaculation, fearing the depression and self-doubt that I had come to associate with it. Though the means were polar to my previous behavior, I felt that I was still finding myself unable to be satisfied; with ejaculation or without. Which leads me here. Again, I am new in the philosophies and methods conveyed here, and will appreciate all and any knowledge. What is a good starting point for me to balancing my life again? What are the basics I need to learn? I am desperate to sort these problems out, and while I am stable for now, I fear my quality of life degrading again. Thank you for your input.

thanks. I now do this no more than twice a day, after waking up and before going to bed. No pain or discomfort or anything, which is a good sign. sexual urges seem to have subsided, but I'm feeling more energized elsewhere. I was able to complete a 5 mile training run on only four hours of sleep, something I definitely don't think I could have done if I was losing essence regularly!

Mental observations made after two weeks of retention: high energy level, increased motivation, etc. My thinking seems to be clearer and I am a lot less horny and distracted than before. I've been using both physical exercise and breathing exercises to relieve tension and hopefully draw fluid up and prevent stagnation. One additional observation: I am able to hold a full bladder very well, yet it seems to take additional time to urinate. If I am doing testicular breathing and abdominal / perineum exercises, is prostate massage necessary as well? My main concern is preventing any possible health problems. Thanks

I'm a runner, and I head out at 6 or so in the morning, unless I was up really late the night before, which I avoid. Something I don't do often is wear a watch. For me it's a training tool, not a crutch, and I hate to be dependent on it. I've heard that running is really good for circulating energy and fluids, promoting digestion, clearing your head and all sorts of other things. These, along with the health benefits, are the main reasons I do it. I haven't personally tried meditating before or after running, but now I want to, haha. It seems like something that would integrate nicely with yoga / stretching exercises pre or post-run.

Hey T.S! I certainly didn't intend my problems to inspire others, but I'm so glad for you that it has! I've only been doing this for several months - more heavily in this past month - but I've definitely seen benefit in that span of time. This practice has changed my own sense of sexuality from physical to spiritual, i.e. not mentally dependent on ejaculation. Since my sense of sexual self-worth isn't event-oriented anymore, I'm finding that this energy is just sort of exploding into non-sexual areas of my life. I feel like I'm less tired all the time, too. However, even if you're not mentally dependent on releasing jing, your body will say otherwise. There are some good posts further up the page about methods which you can use to dissipate excess heat and avoid nocturnal emissions. I'm definitely not a great source of experience in this - a beginner, at best, but nonetheless, that's awesome that you were inspired! It's just something I work on, and it keeps me focused and balanced in all areas of my life.

Thought I would add - for the next several weeks I have been commissioned to work on a project that will require quite a bit of creative energy and on my part. Would this be a good beginning opportunity to bring what I have learned into practice? I'm hesitant to rely too much on this technique, though I am glad to say that it and the qi gong practices, articles of which abound on the Internet, are helping me dissipate the energy quickly. I'm already learning that it can be easy to get caught up in. A post in the 100 Days thread said something to the effect that a beginner to this technique can't get down over ejaculating once in a while. It's been over a week since I've had a "real" ejaculation but did accidentally lose a small amount of essence at one point - I felt slightly depressed afterward, but I suspect it was a placebo effect more than anything else (after all, I'm young by most Taoists' standards).

Thanks. Right - I wouldn't want to do this regularly at all, basically as a last resort if I accidentally went past the point of no return. Hopefully, that won't even happen as I get more practiced. In any event, yeah I don't want to get the "bug" so much lol. I think the trick is to manage conserving jing without becoming attached to the act itself (i.e. paranoid about losing essence) as that would defeat the purpose! For now though, with the practices that I have learned, I have felt better than I ever have in my life and am starting to feel motivated for my future again. It blows my mind that something so simple could have been at the root of my problems. Thank all of you so much!

As of this writing I had not orgasmed intentionally in almost a month, even though I had had several wet dreams. Though I am trying to avoid masturbation while still learning qi gong and the Secret Smile practice, I felt the need to relieve some of the tension as it was becoming nonproductive. Nevertheless, I was determined not to release jing. At the regular point of ejaculation, I applied pressure to the perineum with two fingers and experienced the sensations of orgasm, yet did not ejaculate semen. Though I lost my erection initially, I was able to regain it within 5 minutes, and of equal strength, not weak as had happened prior to ejaculation. Was this the correct method? Thanks.

I enjoy composing and playing music, and it is one of my greatest passions. As I may live my life as an artist, I have been wondering, is this activity more yin or yang by nature? This question is in the effort to balance my life. Does it really fall into a specific category? If so, does anyone have suggestions on how I could complement it? Thanks.

What a great response! Thanks so much, this is exactly the sort of info I was looking for. I do find that sometimes music can be over-stimulating; this can sap creative energies if it is not monitored carefully. It's a delicate balance because one obviously has to have feeling to write music, yet it is easy to get carried away and lose any objective interpretation of the piece or composition itself. I'll be looking into the practice you mentioned for sure. I definitely do agree about the energy of live performances, whether one is performing or just attending. Since they tend to be very intense I think it is a good idea to precede this with more yin activity, which will be balanced out. A musician might optimize their performance by rehearsing for weeks prior but not playing at all the day before the performance - I've tried this and I was always able to return refreshed.

I read through those essays a few times - very, very interesting! They basically seem to get at exactly what I'm seeking, however, which is moderation and being in tune with myself. I think that if I continue my present practices moderation will eventually come into other areas of my life. I had a wet dream last night, which puts me back at square one again. It is the first one I have had in many, many months, perhaps years - I think this is a (good) sign that my body is revitalizing itself. With continued practice of the energy dispersion methods, will the frequency of these dreams diminish? The urge tp masturbate for me is definitely starting to be overridden by the positive characteristics I notice in my own personality whilst practicing retention. It really does redefine the concept of "getting off!" Thanks once again!

[quote name='anamatva' date='06 July 2012 - 07:59 AM' timestamp='1341525548' post='348099' as the channels between the lower centers and the upper centers open, via qigong, or just via you retention practice forcing that energy through the dormant passageways, or any other practice for that matter, the excess will automatically be transmuted upward as it builds, and you will rarely have to exert effort to draw it up, or be overcome by excess energy in the genitals and lower centers. Thanks! I've already incorporated the MCO, mostly using reading I found in the book suggested awhile back and on the Internet. I think I'm feeling some of the effects you have described above. The conserved energy is a lot less dominating than it was the very first time I tried this, in which case I just felt very horny and distracted for a week. This time, however, I think that my system is slowly adapting. If anything the pelvic floor muscles are getting stronger - the response to "hold in" is becoming automatic and a lot easier...hopefully this will continue as time goes by. Thanks for the help!

As of this writing I haven't ejaculated in one week and have instead been focusing on getting jobs done and practicing a combination of the routines suggested by Harmonious Emptiness and Mokona. Initial observations: 1. Going this route frees up a lot of energy but if not careful you can feel horny all of the time. Getting better at controlling this, though. A couple times in those 7 days I felt as if I simply needed to masturbate, and I did, but was careful to not go over the edge. I'm finding that, with moderation, this can actually bring about increased focus and motivation for me. The trick is to keep it in check. 2. Found myself getting in a lot less petty arguments with people and was generally a lot more friendly overall. Makes it clear to me that "sexual frustration" is a very misunderstood term in the West. 3. Felt as if I cared more about everything in general. When I made decisions I actually devoted thought into them instead of just passing them all off with an "I don't care" attitude as I had sometimes done before. 4. Felt more in touch with a concept of masculinity I have not ever known before. Regarding the energy levels - it's a different type of energy. I definitely feel a lot more physical energy but am not manifesting it in nervous habits or a need to be aggressive. It's kind of a "mellow high".

Thanks so much for your invaluable advice! I have already tried some of the methods you have described, and I am slowly feeling myself coming out of an energy deficit that has afflicted me for some time. I feel that my emotions and thoughts are also coming back under control, and I'm spending more time doing productive tasks - a definite bonus! This is truly a gift to revitalize my life, and I appreciate the help. I'm also spending time reading up on additional spiritual practices and won't hesitate with further questions I have. Thanks!

to anamatva: I was able to download that book online. It's interesting that Tao teachings address sex as something as natural as eating (which is one of the comparisons made), and doesn't make it seem "out of the ordinary" or "dirty". Rather, the goal seems to be to improve health and "vitality" instead of merely indulging one's self. Needless to say this is difficult with masturbation because, as suggested earlier, there is no feedback of energy from a partner that can occur. As of now I've abstained completely for 2 days. Obviously not ejaculating at all is not a good idea, but I would prefer to reach ejaculation through masturbation as opposed to a wet dream. Do you think that as an occasional thing, practicing ejaculation control would be harmful to me? I might not try it until I am more familiar with the energy diversion practices. I feel like I over-intellectualize all this sometimes. Still, would there be potential benefits to being aware of all of this at a young age?

Thanks once again to everyone who has provided advice. thetaoiseasy: I actually realized recently exactly how true your statement about trying to "schedule" releases of sexual energy was; everyone is different and there is really no other way to do it other than to know one's self! Furthermore, I think that society places emphasis on getting as much as possible - far more than is necessary. The prospect of abstaining entirely, while intimidating, is one that I am heavily considering - I will be eager to see the results. Perhaps this will come sooner than I think, because I (luckily) never became dependent on porn to become aroused. From my experience, this is another result of imbalance. anamatva: I have as of yet found at least one way to divert sexual energy, and that is through exercise (definitely a positive!). Yoga and some of the exercises you mentioned are related practices that I think I would reap benefits from as well, and would like to study further. My other passion lies in the creative arts, specifically music. Any advice on how would I channel "sensual" energies into this? I think that for less physical diversions it may take more concentration. Tom Lin: you say I would not "just" use ejaculation to gain pleasure. Are you suggesting that the build-up or presence itself and the "vitality" are synonymous, and would be found continually as opposed to being goal-oriented? If so I can easily see how that could be a positive motivator in one's life. jconnar: I checked out that link and there is a lot of good advice there. I haven't read through it all but I will post my thoughts once I do.....

Thank you to everyone who has replied: I sincerely appreciate for your input from the bottom of my heart. The prospect of improving my focus, quality of life, and happiness is something that fills me with joy and inspiration. To OldGreen: I shall look further into Chi-Gung (or Quigong), as I have done some light reading on it in the past but have not yet committed. The physical benefits, as well as those to the mind, are what attracts me. Brooks: You hit the nail on the head when you said that I shifted between extremes rather quickly! Unfortunately, for the past few years, this has been the sort of person I have been; unable to handle moderation in an all-or-nothing fashion. With some research, as you suggested, and some time to re-evaluate myself, it is my hope that I can become a new person spiritually and return to the balance that I once knew and now crave. It sounds intimidating, but this is an implied balance in EVERYTHING: not just sex, but relationships, socialization, diet, exercise, work, play.....it is a list which exhausts all human action that I know of. In regard to jing / semen conservation: I admit that it probably is too soon to start into this yet as my brain and body need a chance to re-order themselves. As you have said, I think that in healthy, moderated practice I could see short-term benefits. The main struggle for me is in re-channeling the sexual energy successfully; I have already found that it takes conscious discipline to control arousal and fall into trivial, frequent stimulation. This said, it seems easier to control the less time elapses between ejaculations....so conceivably I could begin with a shorter period (less energy stored) and work forward (more energy stored). Physiologically, the arousal factor seems due to increased testosterone, which peaks on the 7th day without emission, but I know that this is irrelevant to spiritual practice. Gjeken: In response to edging being "bad" - I would love to hear your evidence for this. Mainly I am thinking that it can be difficult to revert to normal thinking and action afterwards if there is no ejac. involved - perhaps with time it could be done. I do not know that I could for a couple months without masturbation. I could attempt it, but at this stage I don't believe I could withhold that long. Short of that, can someone suggest a possible beginning frequency for masturbation and ejaculation, in which I might have an optimum balance of energy / tension / release? Again - thank all of you for your help.

Thanks for your input. I think your first point illustrates the fact that I do need to re-evaluate my way of thinking! If desired, I can remove this topic and seek help elsewhere; I posted it in the "general" sub-forum as it is less related to specific practices. Though I believe some of those who are experienced may have at least some valuable input.

Hello all. I'm a 19 year old guy who somehow found these forums after years and years of questions and answers about my spirituality that went unanswered. I've been reading topics on here in which I found people were experiencing exactly the troubles that I have in my own life, and that was reassuring to me. I realize that I'm slightly younger than the average member here, but hopefully I can still gain answers - or at least insight! - into my questions nonetheless. I have not formally studied the Way, but I am familiar with the basic concept through personal research. Admittedly, I have been hesitant my entire life to adhere to any one particular faith or religion. I found that more often than not, I aligned with some but not all of the core tenets, but sometimes the ones I disagreed with were too strong to ignore. I have suffered from a lot of mental and personal troubles in my own life, including depression, issues of self-confidence, and personal barriers with friends, family, and total strangers. I need a way in which to overcome, or at least see a way around these obstacles. I look forward to learning something new!