Sudhamma

@freeformYou are right. MCO should not be the starting point for a beginner but as you say, eventually. It took me about 6 -7 years before the eventual happened and even then, progressively from simple micro to macro (not that Matak Chia's cosmo-macro) orbits, from simple to more complicated flow (not that 'figure 8' of Matak Chia's), from contraction to my current occupation, expansion. When I first started with MCO, I was too eager to make the orbit happen and after a fortnight or so, I had a similar experience like Capeador 1. My head was heavy, with constant headaches for most of the day, and my hands were generally weak. That lasted not too long, maybe 3 days as I stopped the MCO the next day and 'sink' my qi down to DT. During those 3 days, I did some acupressure on GV20, Baihui, GV23 Shangxing, EM2 Yintang, and IC4 Hegu. I had only limited success with acupressure (unless with needles!). Since then I was careful with the practice. As to the myriads of qigong systems from structured to spontaneous, from dynamic to static across the 4 main categories, I don't have expert knowledge of all 4 categories to judge any system (compounded by varied breathing and qi-building methods) whether it is good or injurious, and can only take a stand of "innocent until proven guilty", Matak Chia's system notwithstanding. When I first joined this forum some 6 years ago, I did read negative comments and warnings about Matak Chia's system but didn't motivate me to read up on his teachings, until now just to find out who the person is and what crab is he dishing out that hurt so many people. Matak Chia, a Thai of Chinese descent as he claimed was taught the Quanzhen qigong. Quanzhen is the name of a reputable Daoist sect, like Longmen, another Daoist sect of Mt. Wudang is a religious-martial arts Daoist temple. However, I am no expert on the Quanzhen system to further comment on Matak Chia's MCO system except that I find it complicated with his flow patterns, 9 cauldrons, and the energy relationship with the planets and cosmos (emphasizing the Daoist SanChai, Trinity of Heaven-Earth-Man). That itself gave me a headache! And spared me from having migraines from his exposition on sexual qigong (changing jing to qi). SanChai, and Jing-Qi-Shen are typical Daoist energy cultivation concepts. Anyway, to cut to the chase, say what you like, I won't judge unless it is a system that I know intimately and will give every supposedly genuine (established) Qigong system, the benefit of the doubt, and one should not forget the role of the other unknown factor, the student, the affected party in the matter. Caveat Emptor!

Thank you, Capeador 1 for your confirmation. MCO is actually simple to understand, yet complicated and complex in practice and should be approached with caution. The three videos by Damo Mitchell posted by virtue, laid down the do's and don'ts in Daoist abdominal breathing method. Damo Mitchell has also an introductory video (on Youtube) on Micro-cosmic Orbit to dispel the ignorance (and fear) surrounding the subject. Of course, you could join his MCO class ( I am not his marketing agent, just in case...) if his introductory video rekindled your interest in the subject. Thanks to your question, I now realized that there were different "variants" of MCO practice. Matak Chia's MCO is most complex (with the Tao light and all that cosmos-planetary stuff), some will benefit from his instructions, and of course, some don't and some, unfortunately, 'injured' from the practice. Some other qigong systems could likewise cause damage to mental health or the nervous system if the instructions and practice are incorrect. Just like, why a particular qigong system was proven effective by some while others found it ineffective. There are different approaches in Qigong which is a collection of various cultivation systems, each with its own purpose and objectives, and we shouldn't be judgemental and condemn any system because it differs from one's preferred practice or the teachings are incomprehensible. For example, you are now practicing Win Hoff breathing system, and if you go through the Damo Mitchell videos (posted by virtue) you will find that you are warned not to hold your breath and should sink your breath and 'cheese'. As said, we should not be judgemental as both systems are correct in their respective context. Incidentally, never consult a western doctor on any qi-problem, you will raise a laugh but a TCM physician whose business is to understand qi, and the meridians (perhaps not mco). As commonly said, little knowledge is dangerous, and so is ignorance. Happy practice.

OK, I understood now where you are coming from. MCO of both micro and macro are practised by me for many years now, and what was described by Capeador1 was typical of qi-stagnation in the head caused by over-focusing of qi attempting to cross over baiweique, the meeting of hundred pressure point. I had gone through those problems when I first began Micro-Cosmic Orbit. My experience gives me the confidence of stating my assumption and also the solution to the problem. It is my sharing of what it is worth in this forum. Of course, it is up to Capeador 1 to confirm whether my assumption is correct and if incorrect, then my solution is also simply not valid. MCO if not practised properly under proper guidance is dangerous and more so for people initiating and attempting it at an advanced age and those with hardened blood vessels.

What theories have I propose?

Hi, Capeador 1, I've not read Matak Chia's books and don't know how he teaches micro-cosmic orbit. MCO (both micro and macro) is an essential qi-development technique to clear blockages and qi flow to the 8 extraordinary meridians. But from what I read of your posting, perhaps your breathing is not in sync with your mental intent during mco causing a qi stagnation in your head. Somehow either you lost concentration or too much forcing of qi-flow into your head during your practice. Question: Did you end the practice with 'Sou Gong'? The solution: 1. stop the use of MCO during your practice, just use natural abdominal breathing unforced and relaxed. During closing/ending the exercise (Sou gong), breathe in and with mental intent down to your dan tian, but focus the passage of your qi down to 'Forever Spring' Yongquan que. Do this either 3, 6 or 9 times. 2. If the headaches still continue, consult a TCM acupuncturist to release your excess qi from the head.

Hi, Escott, you already are practicing Zhan Zhuang and Baduanjin. In both these systems, you can visualize your qi-flow, especially Zhan Zhuang if you go deeper with micro or macro cosmic orbit. And, a breathing system must be employed to 'control' the orbit. For want of a moving system, yet simple to master initially, I would recommend Taiji Longevity Ruler (with 6 movements, some other TLR could have more movements).

I have not read that essay, and so would not be able to add anything relevant to what Damo Mitchell is saying. However, the sense of insecurity would arise, as it did with me when I am unable to 'breakthrough' in the expression of the routine (toulu or exercises) to bring it to a higher level of understanding or training. What I did then is to talk to practitioners from other systems on the particular problem in my training or watch videos on how the routine is done, or come to this forum for instance, and state my problem.

@darkflame, you can go to this link: youtube.com/watch?v=_QYngRrbsKo There is a warning that if you suffer from any of the pre-existing medical conditions you should not practice this set of exercises. As with most qigong videos they are not perfect teaching aid and inexperience practitioners should seek proper face-to-face qigong instruction, and in this case, seek a Daoist qigong system instructor. You will find that some of the movements are familiar with other systems. What are some indications of Kidney Yin deficiency? In my search for the answer from the internet, the indications are sore lumbar and knees, dizziness, ringing in the ears, hearing problems, dry mouth, hot palms, soles and chest, spontaneous sweating, constipation, and seminal emission. Hope you find this post useful. Meanwhile, stay safe from the covid-19, be well and happy always.

@Vajra Fist, You are right...I should not have made that remark. I am sure that Falun Gong is still practised secretly but the pseudo--Buddhist philosophy of Falun Dafa especially the outlandish claims would not be tolerated. It was their outlandish claims that got the society into trouble with the authorities.

Very good! Soon you can levitate, go through walls, and perform miracles.

@angstg, Continue to focus on directing your energy down to the LDT. It is normal for the energy-flow to happen at 1 am from the back to the head and by 3 am, it should be in your abdomen. The chattering of your teeth and violent movements of your limbs happen because you allowed your energy to flow as it like. Have a strong mental focus and you can stop the chattering and movements. There's no way that you will and can cause death and injuries to the people around you because of your leak. Those people whom you do not know have no karmic link with you. It's their time. You are over-thinking.

I've 2 books, one is published by China Qigong Research Institute, Beijing, in 1985, "Discussions on Chinese Qigong". There are two lists of qigong styles in the book: 1. Jing-gong (stationary) styles - 18 schools. 2. Dong-gong (dynamic) styles: 17 schools. Some of the above list are in this book. Two other popular qigong styles, Da Yan and He Xiang are featured in the book as well. Another book, "300 questions on Qigong Exercises" was compiled by Lin Housheng and Luo Peiyu. In this 2nd book, about 40 styles were featured including hard qigong. This book was printed in Guangzhou, 1994. Ma Wang Dui's Daoyin system was not in the two books. Of course, these two books are not exhaustive in their listings as there are close to 2000 types of qigong. After the collapse of the Imperial Qing Dynasty in1911, there was a hasty and fervent social revolution across China propagating the removal of opium, superstition, and prostitution. Of the three, Superstition was very deeply rooted in the rural population where paper charms and magic spells were touted to cure all ills and evils and as an alternative to proper medicine. China then was very poor and there were not enough doctors and TCM physicians then. When CCP took over the rein of government, opium and prostitution were quickly eradicated, and superstition was the last to be resolved. In time, with education and the improvement of the health system, 'witch-doctors' were eradicated as well. However, when any one or group tilted any established religious teachings for their advantage or claimed to have supernatural powers like distant qi-healing, passing through walls, or with powers of levitation, the Chinese government would intervene and disband the group. And not because the group commanded a huge following. I think Taijiquan has a larger following if you understand what I meant. If you are a Buddhist and have read Falun Dafa then you will understand that Falun Dafa is a serious corruption of the Buddha-dhamma. I was given the book Falun Dafa to read some 20-30 years ago and concluded that it was a serious corruption though some Buddhist terminology was kept, just like some other cult-leaders claiming 'reincarnation' of Buddha. The Dhammacakra is the Turning of the (Dhamma) Wheel, but the 'turning' is not a rotation but a starting, a beginning, an activation; not a rotation in accord with the Cosmos. That's BS.

@angstg, From my limited understanding of Buddhism, "samaya" means a gathering, a moment in time; 'bodhicitta" is made up of 2 words, bodhi which means enlightenment, and citta, a thought. Bodhicitta therefore means, a thought of enlightenment. Of course, samaya has different meanings in Hinduism or even with Vajrayana Buddhism. However, samaya has nothing to do with semen retention. If you are a Buddhist monk, then you are observing the 200+ vinaya rules of conduct, and sexual activities including masturbation, are forbidden. You are not a monk. I read your posts regarding your energy-flow and its stagnation at your spine unable to travel up and across your crown. You need to mentally direct your energy from your spine up and across your crown, down the front and store it in your lower "dan tien". If you do not have a teacher to instruct you on the breathing and energy-flow, I will suggest that you should stop the exercise/meditation before qi-stagnation can cause harm to you. Semen retention/celibacy can increase your energy/qi which in turn enhances your spirituality/consciousness. The Jing-Qi-Shen cycle. You won't cause harm (or death) to others (or the world at large) if you for a moment of weakness take a leak. People die all the time, the when and how death occurs depend on the person's karma not on your semen retention practice. Be assured.

To jmrout, Welcome to this forum. My suggestion for your Chinese lady friend is to seek acupuncture treatment first to dispel excessive qi and remove any qi stagnation from the body. Then lay off any training for a period of time and during the period use acupuncture to regulate her qi-flow. After her qi has stabilized, then look for a good qigong master to further learn to regulate her qi-flow.

The Buddhist Teachings is capable of being entered into, tested, and the person is welcome to come and experience it to know its truths and the Truth. The Pali word is 'Ehipassiko".

Happy Vesak to everyone here!

DSCB57, there are indeed many 'secrets' in CMA. In the Daoist tradition, the key to progress either in their internal arts and meditation is mco. Let me share this with you: about 20 years ago, I had a conversation with my sifu and told him that if we did not impart the mco method to the students, they would be stuck at a level unable to progress 'internally'. He gave his approval. However, it took me another 17 years before I could really start my students on mco. Why wait for 17 years from that conversation? My students were not ready then with the 2nd stage of advancement. Meanwhile, students came and go during that period. Some trained for 3 years, and left to teach their friends. You can imagine my apprehension if they started to teach the system plus mco with their half-baked practice. Thus, studying the character and the level of training of the student are important considerations for the teacher. Certain things can't be rushed.

DSCB57, I do read your posts in this thread but I can't comment in reply to your queries as my tradition is not "Flying Phoenix". Please do not feel depressed when there are no responses to your posts; it happens to most people. This is just a forum for sharing o experiences with total strangers and sometimes, what you post may not go down well with some people with different experiences/agenda. Perhaps going under a proper guidance by a good instructor should alleviate some of the problems that you had enquired instead of learning from videos. If this is no good, perhaps, take up a more simple yet effective qigong would help, for example, the simple swing hand qigong exercise (swuai shou) which was very popular in the early 1960s. This traditional form has undergone modification to the current p'eng shou swuai which has become more of a physical exercise than qigong. Or just concentrate on zhang zhuang with mco can also be satisfying.

Deleted for duplication of earlier post.

"San" or "Shen" if written to denote 'spirit' in Chinese do not necessarily mean spirit, heaven, god in the literal sense. One of the many wuxia palance one could find in wixia novels is, "I've 'shen gong' to protect me (from harm, that is)". So, the descriptive "Shen (San) Gong" in Chinese martial arts or in Qigong in the context of the set of CMA/Qigong exercises should mean that the practitioner will reap the result of extraordinary power, invariably, qi-power. Having said that, on the other hand, in spiritual boxing or shen-da, the shen-gong is taken in its literal sense, that the power of the diety protects the practitioner (upon request, with mudras and stompings). Qigong, as you probably know comes in all forms: some standing, some sitting, and some lying in a prone position. Some traditional Daoist sitting exercises are called so-and-so Shen Gong but what is important is to find out why the set is called shen gong from the instructor.

That's the problem with the Chinese dialects, the Chinese word for spiritual, god, is as Bruce said is 'Shen' as pronounced in Mandarin, but if it is in Cantonese, it is 'San'. If in Fujian, the word is pronounced as 'Sin'. The written character is identical though. 'Heaven' is Tien in Mandarin, Tin in Cantonese.

Flying Phoenix Chi Kung is one of numerous systems of qigong. Major systems emphasize different "aspects", for instance, more physical movements at one extreme, to a more static posturing with mindful breathing on the other extreme. As with systems, so are students, some will benefit from more physical movements as their lifestyle is more inactive, while some are physically weak and less mobile will benefit from static forms of qigong. Though the word 'qigong' means, effort and commitment to cultivate inner energy or "breath", systems also differ with no emphasis on any systemized breathing method on one end of the spectrum to disciplined system of a particular method of breathing on the other end. Whether or not a qigong system is effective therefore depends on the quality and depth of instruction, the student's situation and the system that he chose. The religious aspect of qigong, especially in Taoist (Daoist) system is restricted to qi-cultivation and not to cause the student to attain immmortality or supernatural powers; better health mentally, and physically yes.

The Metta Sutta was preached by the Buddha to provide spiritual protection by expanding the virtue of loving-kindness to pacify disturbing spirits. However whoever is chanting the sutta for this purpose must be a proper cultivator. There are instances in the suttas in which the Buddha exhibited his supernatural powers. I do not know what you asked of those Buddhist monks who could not satisfy your query. Perhaps by rephrasing your query you may obtain a satisfactory answer.

The Metta Sutta was preached by the Buddha to provide spiritual protection by expanding the virtue of loving-kindness to pacify disturbing spirits. However whoever is chanting the sutta for this purpose must be a proper cultivator. I do not know what you asked of Buddhist monks who could not satisfy your query.

My apology for warping that time gap. You are right. King Milinda was a descendent of a Greek general who stayed behind to administer the conquered land. Thank you.