Aetherous

You think you've been repeating facts here? The opposite is true, and that is clear for you and anyone to see. No hard feelings, SonOfTheGods, but since you've continued to make your discussion personal despite being asked not to, as well as continued to argue pointlessly (by spreading lies and not actually backing up your claims)...I see no use in continuing. Peace. edit: changed how I addressed him from "son" to "SonOfTheGods" so as not to be disrespectful...truly no hard feelings or further argument

You're saying that a person must be illogical when working with the Bible? Even that isn't Biblical. And it doesn't seem to be working well for you, in regard to your interpretations. I have. Your interpretations are simply false.

This is simply false and nonsensical. No one considers doctors to be witches, today...why would they call them that back then? Witches are ones who do sorcery, and use herbs for that purpose. Which is why any Bible you read will say that, instead of condemning pharmacists! lol Especially with the other examples I showed, your interpretation is just incorrect. By the way, I don't profess to be anything. I'm not worthy to call myself a Christian. I've only asked you to clear things up. Making the discussion personal is a diversion away from truth and clarity...why behave like that?

If we can interpret pharmakia to mean something like "pharmacy"...there is still a huge difference between poisonous drugs (something that's destructive to the person's body mind or spirit) and medicine (something that's beneficial). Herbalism or herbology has to do with healing. For a clear illustration, henbane could be an example of something that's forbidden, due to being destructive. There are many things in the bible, such as hyssop, myrrh, Ezekiel's special bread...which could be included in this idea of medicine, so it's false and a misinterpretation to say that herbology is sinful. It's not at all against the Law to study and use things that are good for you. ... Dreaming and prophecy are actually totally fine and mentioned numerous times in the Bible...the purpose of this verse is that the person is trying to get the people to worship other Gods, which is of course against the first of the 10 Commandments. Lets not take verses completely out of context. ... I've asked you numerous times to use specific verses to back up your claims, not just make things up.

Where is alchemy or herbology forbidden in the Bible? Please, use verses.

You make a really good point about sorcery and types of witchcraft being against the Law. That is definitely scriptural. As for the rest...I think Taoist internal alchemy is very similar to the ideas in the Bible of being or becoming living temples of God, as well as perfecting ourselves and making ourselves holy, or becoming children of God. All of these ideas are very prevalent, especially in the New Testament...they are Biblical and represent the religion. Alchemy and philosophy have nothing to do with sorcery, and I think despite being from different religions, are actually in line with God's will. At the very least, I don't think they're in conflict. If we can find verses that suggest they are, though, I think that'd be interesting.

You asked me for a verse saying it's lawful to follow another religion, and right away I can give you two... By the way, please stop attacking me personally.

I'm not defending or arguing from the newage view of Jesus. And of course I'm not saying that Taoism is part of the old Jewish Law (just that it's not in conflict with it, or a form of lawlessness). I simply asked you to back up your (false) claims...that is all. Don't tell me to go do more research or jump through hoops and do a little dance for you...that is disrespectful first of all, is not an actual discussion, and is not you giving any form of answer to a very straightforward question. If you say something is Biblical, prove it by telling what verse it comes from. It's that easy. Don't just point fingers and say I'm clueless about the Bible. That's a logical fallacy. If you can't perform this simple and reasonable task, then it should be obvious to anyone reading that you're just making things up, and spewing out false teachings (perhaps to just get a rise out of people and challenge them). I have no interest in continuing here, if you're just going to keep playing the same old tricks. Simply: back it up with some verses.

Matthew 7:21-23 is about obeying God's will (the Law)...it has nothing to do with the study and practice of Taoism being a sin.

Right. So there isn't a single verse that says that, and it was something you made up and are claiming the Bible says. Just so we're clear.

What verse does this idea come from?

It means to meditate: calm the mind and become unattached to sense perception. Chapter one goes into a ton of pretty confusing detail, but I think it becomes more understandable over time with (experience from) practice and study. "Spirit" was the translator's interpretation of "mercury"...and it's kind of an accurate interpretation. Not to get into alchemical symbolism, because I really don't know much about it...but one thing is that mercury was essentially what the alchemists used to describe the "monkey mind", because it was a volatile or unstable element. So: still your spirit, calm your monkey mind, fix your mercurial nature so your spiritual energy stops leaking out...similar ideas. The first few paragraphs of chapter one are some of the most clear in the entire book...I think this is for a reason. We should use what we know, and not get too worried about what we don't understand. Practice alone is the means to success. In "Foundations of Internal Alchemy" by Wang Mu, the first stage is called laying the foundations. People might want to read that as well, but from what I remember it's only slightly easier to comprehend. Unaroused sexual capability...whatever it is that enables a guy to get good erections and produce semen. The key to "unaroused" is not to have sexual thoughts, desires, feelings, and perceptions (such as seeing a sexy woman). When you become aroused, it's no longer the useful generative force for the purposes of alchemy. Qi, or your own healing energy. It is literally experienced as a breath that travels through the body, and is related to the breath...it's a product of good exercise, getting proper nutrients, breathing well (so you get oxygen), and not leaking your generative force (by becoming sexual) or spirit (by over thinking/feeling/etc, bascially never calming down and meditating). Possibly just your own accumulated spiritual energy. I'm not looking at the book right now, so I'm not sure how this term is being used. Just some ideas.

The three together are the "supreme medicine", according to the Jade Emperor Mind Seal classic. You replenish and harmonize these three treasures through emptying the mind in meditation.

Worst President ever award.

Romantic love can be very uplifting, but also destroy you. Beware.

Lets watch Congress vote it down, and Obama rightfully obey the nation he is supposed to serve.

I say this just for consideration, as a former student who is unqualified to talk: External movement and feeling things are not what you should look for in the Kunlun method. I was taught to favor stillness of body and mind, to focus on the one breath during practice...as well as to hold one high intention, such as becoming capable of healing others (for instance) or attaining gold dragon body, so that you can finally be capable of truly helping other people. Compassion for others being an important aspect of any real attainment. This intention gives the energy a purpose, rather than the energy becoming scattered due to an aimless mind looking for low results, such as physical sensations of internal changes, or bouncing around, and then that negative result affecting the body mind and spirit of the practitioner. Basically, it's good to just keep going and keep trying to do your best, if Kunlun is your path. Part of that would involve learning directly from authorized people as well as the main teacher...and really listening to, understanding, and obeying instructions. Or just do your own thing and learn from that.

I found a teacher that I resonated with quite a bit, and made the sensible decision not to mix practices. Whatever provides spiritual progress and good results for you is good, and along the same lines as alchemy. I'm glad to have learned Kunlun...it's enriched me...and may practice again at a later time.

I didn't read all of that...but I agree that some of what is said in the Bible and even attributed to Jesus is very hard to swallow.

The sun "saving" the earth from the planet Saturn, and dressing that up in numerous analogies....that sounds more like a fairy tale, in comparison to a spiritual teacher having been alive at one point in history.

There's this verse: "This is how you can recognize the Spirit of God: Every spirit that acknowledges that Jesus Christ has come in the flesh is from God, but every spirit that does not acknowledge Jesus is not from God. This is the spirit of the antichrist, which you have heard is coming and even now is already in the world." - 1 John 4:2-3 I don't know anything...just throwing that out there.

"I have sworn upon the altar of God, eternal hostility against every form of tyranny over the mind of man." - Thomas Jefferson

Violence will save a friendship long before passive aggressive resentment and bitter silence will. Really. Be very direct and upfront with your friend, even to the point of having a physical fight. Do not let any bruised feelings smolder beneath the surface...release them. Only enemies and strangers hide the truth from each other and wait...so if you do that, your friend will feel like you're acting weird...not like a friend anymore. Air these things out. Sometimes men need to fight each other to grow in friendship and respect for each other as men...you will laugh about it later.

Thanks MPG and Uroboros!

Sources?