mcoolio

No ? What is it ? I have practically ZERO experience in Avestan spiritual components whatsoever , I have no idea what I'm talking about

Well, I think it is clear that Zhongyongdaoist is talking here about weather magic. And he talks about how he wants to use it to tackle climate change and saving millions of lives. So I think the issues I raise here are completely valid. To me, it seems that the whole issue of climate change (and humans being the cause of it) goes much deeper and weather magik certainly is not touching the source of it. Lairg his idea of human consciousness and the impact on earth and weather, however, seems to me like that does go deeper, is more powerful and perhaps even touches on the actual source of the problem of climate change. But unfortunately that is quickly dismissed as 'new age'. Okay sure, perhaps some immediate threat needs to be addressed right now. Perhaps weather magic is appropriate in that case. However, I personally don't think that. I think climate change is connected to the natural cycles and of the evolution of the earth and humanity. Perhaps it is simply something we must face. And perhaps trying to do some weather magick for it is still to much this idea of hoping that there is some other way to avoid certain things altogether. Things that must be faced to learn certain lessons. Perhaps this time has come. Yeah but perhaps that is a little different, a little more 'local'. More in line with your own 'True will' in life and more in harmony with the natural cycles of change. Then it's okay to do the magic . I will and I already did a little bit, but I don't think that changes much for this discussion and the questions I have. For experimenting and to see how far one can take weather magick to a global level. Sure, it is a good thing and very interesting. But when thinking about how it can be used to actually tackle the climate change issue. Like I already pointed out, it seems to me that perhaps there is some deeper understanding about magic and it's ethics that is missing. And in fact it is not that deep at all. To me it seems obvious that it will not work and perhaps should not even be tried. So I am very curious to read OP's (and anyone else thoughts on that). Perhaps, it's me who is not seeing something obvious here. But I will just read some more of his posts...

I'd be looking a little deeper into Donalds 'published' work here on DBs before making such a statement . Perhaps my wording was a bit strong here, I didn't mean it that way. I just wanted to question his idea of wanting to tackle climate change with magick in this way. Not necessarily .... this IS a Daoist website . Would I use magick 'downstream' to change the course of a river when I can 'nudge' its source in a spring a 'little to the left' . and you say its against nature ????? Ummmm .... how do you think the present climate change situation came about ? ... Look at the the three diagrams I posted . What would ideally be required is a RETURN to the natural balance ( the top image ) Exactly, human behaviour is what caused it is what we say know. Now say we do manage to use some kind magik thing to restore the balance. Did we really give a 'nudge' in the source? Then all of us idiot humans will say, 'oh look, everything seems fine' let's keep doing the way we do. One keeps continuing to exhaust the earth will the other keeps doing his magic stuff to artificially keep the balance. And we don't learn the lessons we are supposed to learn at this point in the evolution of humanity! Then, at one point it is going to explode even worse. Because, let's be honest, the past years it has really become clear how stupid us humans really are, we will find ways to cause even more damage. It is like a doctor being ignorant, treating some symptoms and not looking deeper for the actual cause of the disease. Perhaps sometimes that's okay and it alleviates the symptoms without making the cause worse. But perhaps sometimes it can also do more harm then good. You must have a 'unique perspective' on what magic is then ? I would think that to be truly powerful in magic you have to be able to see the changes of the world on a deep level. And to go with them as much as possible, indeed like you say 'giving small nudges' here and there. Now what I wanted to say is that wanting to tackle climate change in this way, is perhaps seeing the changes on a superficial level. Are you really treating the cause or just a symptom? What kind of karma are you creating with this action? Yes! And this already completely different from trying to change the weather. But I would like to take things even further: Perhaps the ultimate lesson for the magician, who has reached the highest levels, is that he doesn't really needs to use his magic that much. He simply lives in harmony with the changes and let's everything unfold knowing that the divine is in everything. Have you ever heard of the term Fravashi? Do you realise what unbelievable HAVOC that would cause ? Just look at the power of human consciousness though out our history ! Can you truly call that 'human consciousness'. To me that seems more like 'inconsciousness' Then lets all stop the usual Daobums BS and give him a chance fer Gawds sake ! No, like I said, I am glad OP posted, I look forward hearing how his experiments go. Weather magick is still interesting and it is interesting to see how far you can go with it. Perhaps OP only wanted to share with us his weather magic experiment and unfortunately he got all of this crap talk. But this is a discussion forum and I like to criticize and question and challenge other peoples ideas, a little more than is probably good Oh and by the way, I have practically ZERO experience in magic whatsoever, I have no idea what I'm talking about !

Yes but can also make a split of a hexagram in 3 parts, earth (1,2) man (3,4) heaven (5,6). I have seen this in books several times. Gotta admit I don't really know a clear practical application of that though.

3 San Jiao Jing Qi Shen Earth Human Heaven Line 1 Line 2 Line 3 (for a trigram) Line 1,2 Line 3,4 Line 5,6 (for a hexagram)

Experiments with weather magick on a small scale I can understand. But when you talk about trying weather magick on this large a scale ... First thing it does is that it makes me question your understanding of magick in the first place. First of all there is the question of having the ability to do this in the first place. Seems to me is that what you are essentially doing is going against nature. To go against nature on such a large scale ... Seems to me like you would have to be an INCREDIBLY powerful magician. And if you would be able to create such a large change, there is the question of what the consequences of such an action would be. I have heard seemingly knowledgable people talk about always asking oracles (yijing ...) about what you intend to do before you use magick to do it, to see what the consequences would be. I can image that when going against nature to such an extent ... She will not be pleased at all :). And to continue with that idea, it would seem to me that to really be a good magician, is to understand it's deeper mechanisms, and that might basically be to understand the deeper mechanisms of life itself. The changes of the world, essentially the Yi Jing. And that the magician understands and sees these changes(as Lairg stated) and knows how to flow with them, not go against (will magick even work in a too strong going against attitude?). So considering all that. The thought of tackling climate change with magick does seem a little bit off to me and even going against the idea of magick itself. The power of the human consciousness (again as Lairg stated), as a large group(large enough) of people going, thinking unified in one direction, however, seems to me that is truly powerful and that could really induce some powerful changes to the world (universe?). Just to clarify, I appreciate OP posting about his experiment here and hope we can discuss it in a pleasant manner. This is my idea of how magick works and if it is wrong, I gladly have someone here correct the gaps in my knowledge.

Must have been quite a steep drop ... So you no longer believe?

Sexuality and sexual energy seems to be quite important from what I have heard from seemingly quite knowledgeable people. And it can be made into a practice that gives you benefit, contrary to what other people here seem to think. Even if you don't have a partner, to suppress it is to suppress a very important part of yourself. This is what I have heard of it, but I don't know the details of the sexual practices. Although I believe there where also some solo practices. Seems to me like you have the right idea. Carry on, experiment (also with frequency), and perhaps you will discover something interesting. No?

You are such a sulky demon! And now you are angry that you can't prove that magick is real? Is there anything that can cheer you up?

Interesting way of commenting :D. Makes discussing here a little bit difficult though, since you have to watch the whole video and can't quote. But I guess referring to the content of a book without much explanation, like I did too ... You disagree with my statement there: I disagree with your disagreement :). Like I said, when studying the Liu Yao aspect of the YiJing this will become more clear. Just look at Alfred Kee's 2nd Liu Yao book, grasping the changes of the i ching. Where he gives 5 different types of questions and how to interpret them. Some examples: 1. Is it good to do this? ; Should I do this? 2. Will I get this? ; Will I lose this? ; ... 3. Which is better, A or B? ; Who will win, A or B? ; ... 4. How will my relationship with A develop? ; How will this illness, career, ... develop? ; ... 5. When will X happen? When should I do this? ; ... He also (very) briefly talks about how these methods can be combined and how sometimes it is not possible. Many of the questions we ask the YiJing are combinations of some of these methods and I think that it is very good to learn to identify this. Seems to me that especially in the beginning stages of learning YiJing, it can be good to break up your question in multiple pieces and study each casting separately. Even before I started learning about Liu Yao, I have had much benefit from asking my question in this form: What will happen if I do this? What will happen if I don't do this? You talk about how you have to give the YiJing a framework. Well, in my opinion the way you specify your question is also a part of that. YiJing is very flexible and it can probably answer all (logically correct) questions. But being precise in your way of questioning makes interpreting the answer more easy. Since you are then restricting the YiJing to a certain set of answers, you know exactly how you have to interpret the hexagram. And we know there are many ways of interpreting a hexagram... Furthermore, I would say that even when you give YiJing a simple statement like "I will go to war with this country" like in the old books, you are still (implicitly) asking a question, because you are still consulting the Yi Jing and asking for a comment on the situation. No? And finally, I would think that it can actually be possible that the YiJing gives you a wrong answer. Seems to me like it could certainly be the case that in certain conditions or at a certain time or in a certain place, the connection with the YiJing is not good and the hexagram is faulty. This is also something Alfred Kee talks about in that same book. He calls it the 'chaotic hexagram'.

Demon! Don't worry, you haven't reached it I think. If you think you do, I think you need a good slap in the face . No?

I don't think good brain function is directly related to grounding. But sure, for some it will help. However, focusing only on walking meditation and squats is in my opinion ridiculous advice (especially when saying it must be done after 11PM), unless perhaps if you wanna become a dinosaur. More important for your question is the concept of the Yi (mental aspect of the mind), which needs to be functioning properly to have a quiet and effective mind. So for the Yi, it is related to spleen/stomach which means first simple thing you can do is look at your diet. To much trash food -> bad spleen/stomach functioning -> ineffective Yi functioning. Yi is also related to coordination. A well coordinated body requires a properly functioning Yi and doing stuff that requires coordination cultivates the Yi. Swimming is quite good for this and perhaps things like dancing or Taichi where you have to learn (complex) movement and choreography as well. Yi is also related to the capacity of directing your attention to different parts of the body. So can be exercised by putting your awareness in for example your feet and perhaps even each separate toe, then going to your hands, feel each separate finger one by one, feel your skull, ... you get the idea. And of course, this can also be done during any qigong exercise. Is just my understanding of how it all works ...

Don't really know western astrology but looked it up and seemed interesting. Gonna dig a little bit deeper. In four pillars astrology, 'bazi'. Can look at the life and conception palaces. But that's a very simple system and can definitely find more in the zi wei dou shou and qi men divination systems. Don't know much about these though.

Regardless, seems like he had a fascinating life and personality. He must have carried a lot of stuff with him from the past.

Yeah, indeed, cant really do this on a forum. Gonna start with doing some reading on Crowley's life. Seems like he knew how to live one :D. Then maybe some of his works. Besides that Concept of true will. Many traditions have this idea of course. Such a big topic. What surprises me is that the term astrology hasn't appeared in this topic. Should have some indicators of the true will. Wouldn't be surprised that that is also employed in some systems for finding it.

Knew someone who seemed to know a few things about magic. Had a story about this: Imagine your are standing on your street side balcony on 4th floor apartment in a large city. You start shouting at the people on the street. "Hello! Hey you! Answer me!" First one to to respond is the drunk hobo on the corner of the street.

Thanks!

Sup y'all. I always was a bad sleeper, mostly difficulties falling asleep. Starting around 1 year after I started doing some trainings, qigongs, meditations, ... This changed. (BTW, I train 2-4h a day and this doesn't seem excessive to me since I work only part time 60%) Falling asleep goes more easily but, I always wake up super early. Don't necessarily want to focus on a specific hour, but I can objectively say that most of the time, this is between 3 and 4. After that it is practically impossible to fall asleep again. I don't feel super duper tired, but also not refreshed enough to go a full day. I have practically given up on staying in bed and trying to fall asleep again. Most of time I train for 1 or 2 hours, have breakfast until somewhere between 5-7 and then sleep until 9-10. This kinda works but gotta admit it would be more practical if I could sleep in one stretch. Interestingly, if I stop training for a few days, it gets better and I tend to sleep full nights. Yea, I know some basic TCM. 3h is when qi moves to lung meridian. No longer falling asleep can also indicate heart and/or liver problems (not sure if both or one of the 2, but I know its in the books somewhere). And there's some other stuff that can be explored from the TCM point of view... But before going deeper into that, I just wanna ask here if people around here have (had) similar problems, esp after they started their training. Or have some idea of whats going on here. Or just anything interesting to share about sleep rhythm as a practitioner that can help me find my way. mcoolio

Talked to my mom. Most significant thing as a youngster: As early as 2 years old, lots of interest in things with flying: kites, planes, paper airplanes, ... Can say I am still particularly fond of kites, though don't really do it anymore, perhaps because I don't live in a good region. Starting from my teenage years, got a strong tendency towards the concept of gongfu, or better said, being obsessed in acquiring skill and/or knowledge in something: - taekwondo - gran turismo, a racing videogame - skateboarding - counterstrike - soccer - computer science/programming - mathematics - physics - bodyweight training - handstand - buddhism, kungfu - spirituality (all of it) Didn't really 'play' these things. Trained and acquired books and other knowledge to train, study better. Didn't get far for in any of these. Got obsessed and started training, started feeling blocked, frustrated for various reasons, excuses, gave up, played video games for a few months , and moved on to the next thing. Naturally gravitated towards spirituality and now obsessed with that. It's a little bit different from the other obsessions though. Held out much much longer than the other stuff. Seems like I'm not giving this up any time soon. Can even say there is happiness in doing this. But still feels like an incomplete puzzle. So now what? Any next steps to go further in finding the true will? Or any sources I can consult for more information?

I tried that. Wasn't successful. If I recall correctly, during that time, I would stop my practice before 9h latest, going to bed at around 11h. Guess that's still not ideal but earlier than that, it becomes a bit impractical I find. But anyways, falling asleep was not the problem. Twas waking up around 3h and no longer falling asleep.

First and foremost, they have all built a very strong and healthy body. But I'm not earl grey

If that truly is the case, I don't think these were necessarily things with bad intentions towards me. I was scared, but never felt as if in danger. I have a few energetic practices that will be interesting to try out, and might also have a look at the thing you posted.

Interesting! Lot's of stuff to think about. For sure, many people will read this! Gonna ask my mother some questions ...

Hmm yes, this hits home. Took a long time before I could sleep with my door closed. Needed that little bit of light coming in from the hallway. Even after that I was never really comfortable in the dark. Still get that feeling from time to time. As if I'm not alone. Remember that like it was yesterday. Growing up in a very old house, lived in by several generations probably didn't help. Not a new thought in fact. One time not long after I started my training, when I was feeling particularly aligned, in tune, these fears came back particularly strong. But seems like I need to be reminded of that from time to time.

A few years ago I did a 5 week intensive meditation. Meditate eat work meditate sleep repeat Sometimes at the end of a session I would end up tilted backwards, almost like when you look at the ceiling right above you. As a result of my by back attempting to counter the dissolving techniques I used. It did not like what I was doing. Nearing the final weeks, I was exhausted. Couldn't sit more than an hour a day and also got obsessed by food. Started eating compulsively and my evening relaxation before going to sleep was to look up recipes on the internet No idea. Could feel tension all over my back, during those 5 weeks (and still now). But this one spot - and it could very well be the one near the kidneys - was different.