searcher7977

Thank you very much for this! I will def check him out. Some of his classes are only about $15-$20/month which is very manageable. Incidentally, I have also studied a very small bit of the Tirumantiram through the Himalayan Academy. Its awesome to see the common origin! https://www.himalayanacademy.com/view/tirumantiram Thank you again!

Thank you for bumping this thread infolad! I also have been reading some of bodri's work, and just bought Nan Huai Chin's Diamond Sutra.

I would be interested as well, and likely many lurkers as well. If its not with Mizner, then yeah you probably need to start another thread.

You are unnecessarily abrasive, and also wrong. Every blue figure from hinduism is not represented by the medicine buddha or his retinue. Shiva is in his retinue, that does not mean he is medicine buddha. Nor is he painted as blue half the time. By that logic Krishna or blue ganesh are also medicine buddha. They are distinct entities so much so they retain sadhanas even in buddhism, such as Ganesh Puja. I watched an interview where a Tibetan Llama encouraged Shaivite practice and puja as a distinct practice, not "Medicine buddha bc they come from the same source." The symbolism is completely different, Shiva the destroyer. Rudra the Howler. In no way has Shiva been (mainly) described as a healer that heals ailments.There are no nagas, there is no trident, there is no creationism, nothing other than the color blue. Which, has been a symbol for many, many deities and poison. Not only that, there is no historical or scholarly evidence. Why are you being hostile? I tried to play nice. You proceeded to insult me by implication on a subject you are obviously ignorant in. I expected better from you, especially since you claim to be a teacher. Either way, you are wrong. To take your words, Medicine Buddha is not Shiva, but this is difficult to understand, "probably not solidly enough for everybody to see. but on the other hand these things are not for everybody so all good."

Ah silly me I was so fixated on the Shiva =/= Medicine Buddha part, I forgot the original question lol...

That article did not mention the Medicine Buddha at all...

Ah okay lol. That makes a bit more sense, although still a bit sus. Thank you freeform! My aversion to Tate and that side of politics is a personal sticking point of mine. I will forever remember Shinzen Young's "trigger practice" where, for those people who think they are already calm and collected, he suggests practicing equanimity with the news channel for the "opposing side" (however your views are).

I have a very strong dislike for Tate, his followers, and anyone who parrots his ridiculousness. It is surprising (to me) that Damo Mitchell is defending him. It is quite easy, with any small amount of logic, knowledge, or awareness, to see through the mundane BS Tate provides. Can you tell me where Damo posted this? Also, thank you for posting this. Perhaps you have been right about him all along...

Sifu Terry, Even though I was not the person who asked the question, I wanted to thank you for this response. This is the first I have heard about different yogas and kung fu systems having an effect on executive function, and also how some qigong systems might not have it. Would it be possible to explain a little more about that? Or perhaps direct us to a reference? Why is it that the advanced FPCK meditations or Bak Fu Pai Kung Fu can help us with mental focus and responsibility, and not the beginning/intermediate ones? Or the main FPCK and Taijiquan? Is that the martial aspect of qigong? Thank you in advanced and I hope you have a good New Year!

Yes actually!

Ah I understand, thank you! I can actually also offer some experience if this is the case. I used to practice (modern) martial arts, particularly the popular ones like BJJ, boxing, and muay thai. Once I started practicing tai chi and moving from the kwa, I noticed when throwing punches and kicks, I could feel rotation and sinking from the kwa. Honestly I don't know what tf I was doing before, because this seemed like the best way to throw a punch. I've only ever seen this taught once before by a semi-pro boxer. Perhaps at the elite levels everyone knows this, but I certainly didn't. Likewise, even during every day walking I could (still can) feel the weight (or lack thereof) with every step, likely due to the almost complete weight shifting I was taught in taijiquan (100/0 or 90-10 not 70/30). It was a completely new perspective in terms of balance. Thank you again for your response c:

Freeform, could you say a bit more about realigning the muscles and ligaments during horse stance? Does this happen with other postures as well? Is this also an energetic thing, or purely physical WRT stretching and biomechanical position? Or perhaps a resource? This is the first I have heard of such things, and I'd like to learn more.

https://www.lakshmanjooacademy.org/ I have heard good things but only have a single textbook. This is Kashmir Shaivism. https://www.himalayanacademy.com/ I have completed about 1/4 of their course. They used to classify themselves as non-dual, but now are more mono-theistic. The end-goal is to merge with Shiva, so it culminates in non-dualism. They have a lineage tracing back to the Tamil Nadu saints. I do recommend this one as its much more comprehensive and does not shy away from (safe) tantras and esoteric discussion. Lots of free material as well.

Are there teachers available in NA for the Nath Sampradaya? I've actually looked quite a bit, and I've only found 2 or 3, but they were small and one seemed a bit...off...the closest legitimate source I've found is actually the Himalayan Academcy in Hawaii, who can trace their lineage in Shaiva Siddhanta to the Tamil Nayanars. Of course there is Siddha Yoga by Muktananda and that is legit IMO but not Nath. Funny, I remember Tibetan Buddhists also revered a Mahasiddha i think it was Matsyendranāth. Edit: Sorry I just realized this was an old thread I'm not sure how to delete my post. My apologies.

So, if you have a tech job, I am going to assume it involves lots of sitting. Then you come home and read and study, and do some anchoring the breath practice, sitting. It sounds to me like you aren't doing enough moving. The calf muscles are like the second heart, since your heart cannot circulate all that blood fully on its own. You need to walk and exercise more. Chunyi Lin of Spring Forest Qigong recommends a ratio of 3:1 (or 4:1 i can't remember the specifics lol) standing to sitting exercises. The Shaolin monastery monks also had those problems and they were solved by kung fu (as the legend goes). Buddhists are advised to spend balanced amounts walking, standing, sitting, and sleeping. You said you felt like you were having a heart attack. Did you actually have a heart attack? Hypertension? If you led a more balanced life, how many of these problems would be solved? As it is, you have already reported you are getting better with a more balanced life, perhaps you just need more time with this healthier lifestyle? Last, if you are taking lessons from Damo, and have gotten some effects from his practices, email him and ask for help. He also just posted a qi deviation series: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TzJUnrEEIe4&t=0s

Spring Forest Qigong or Bruce Frantzis Energy Arts seem to fit your current practice. I have practiced both with good results. Spring Forest incorporates he calls "Energy Breathing" with accompanying visualization, reverse breathing, and slow breathing over all. This, of course, is in addition to the rest of the program involving standing meditations, sitting, diet, teachings on attitude, and even incorporates Buddhist chants such as the six-syllable chant and the Heart Sutra. After a moderate amount of practice, you can easily access what Chunyi Lin calls "emptiness", for us beginners it is likely just jhana or access concentration but who knows maybe he really does guide us towards glimpses of emptiness. Bruce Frantzis has breathing programs also. His are far more technical and detailed, the although the main idea of his breathing teachings is to slow down your breathing to one breath per minute or less. While he has experience in Tibetan Buddhism, his teachings are purely Taoist. One of his students famously healed her mental illness (i believe it was bipolar disorder?) through the "dissolving practice." Also a good starting point if you'd like to learn Tai Chi online. Through his lessons, I had a firm grasp on the basics such that when I eventually was able to attend an in-person class with another teacher, they had remarked that it was obvious I had done tai chi before. There is Flying Phoenix Chi Kung by Sifu Terry Dunn. Very highly regarded. I have the least experience with this one regrettably, although I have benefitted immensely from Sifu Terry Dunn's teachings alone. Does not incorporate pranayama style breathwork (in his DVDs at least), although you are free to practice it separately. He might teach it in advanced classes, I wouldn't know. Integrates well with kung fu and tai chi practices. Damo Mitchell's Lotus Neigong also highly regarded but I have 0 experience.

Ah got it! Yes. I'm an advanced beginner at best, but I hold Thanissaro in high regard. His book helped confirm some of my practices, and his other works have also been similarly helpful in understanding the suttas. I read somewhere (might have even been here) that awareness of the breath will lead to it lengthening, but it could take time, the number that was mentioned was around 8 years. I did really like how he said eventually you would be able to feel the breath and its energies throughout the body. I haven't gotten that far, but I managed to touch something like that. Where, you pay attention to the breath for so long, you are so familiar, that, when some other sensations arise, sometimes you say "hey! that feels sort of like the breath!" I think that is the way to start actually feeling the breath energy, and not the breath sensations. Thank you for sharing your experience though! It definitely helps me and likely others stay motivated. I always like reading about people's experiences in deeper states and the techniques they used.

Hi Vajra Fist! May I ask who gave you these Rinzai instructions? I have studied under Meido Moore, student of Omori Sogen. That entire line actually teaches the opposite, or at least to keep your abdomen expanded on the exhale (intermediate instruction). This is very similar to what Allan Wallace says about "vase breathing." Its a sort of zen yogic technique that gets much more in depth in Omori Sogen's book in advanced territory very similar to mahamudra kriya and bhandas. I have practiced in Moore's monastery before, and his teachings are very open, and spacious, almost Tibetan like. Of course, that is almost an insult to Rinzai because Rinzai itself is a complete teaching. Of critical importance was maintaining awareness of peripheral vision throughout the meditation session and even throughout the day. Like Thanissaro, Moore also gives instruction on "breath manipulation," that is, trying to elongate the outbreath such that you don't "count the breaths" but you "breath the count." Oooooonnnnneeeee. Inhale. Twooooooooooo. Inhale. Etc. That is also a critical step. Last, the matter of where to place your consciousness. If I remember correctly Thanissaro eventually talks about "whole-body breathing," or even "pore breathing." Rinzai zen also has something similar: embodied zen. We aim to breath with our whole body, to awaken with every fiber of our being and to exude it in all tasks. As far as distractions, equanimity, etc, I did not receive much instructions or talk on that other than minor things in dokusan. The effort of susokan (breath counting) and doing our chores with all of our being (embodied zen) did enough to relieve us of our hinderances. Meido's teachings were a boon, since never before had I heard of zen teachers talk about energetic practices and the details of zazen, the only other teachers who came close were of Chan, like Venerable Sheng Yen (who Meido also mentions as having similarities with him). Meido is also a shugendo lineage holder. Zen seems almost completely dead in Soto lineage now, but I found life in this particular Rinzai tradition. Perhaps it is different in Japan...I have heard of Soto zen priests teaching practices similar to the microcosmic orbit...I cannot verify though.

Buddhism would say to develop an attitude of friendliness, compassion, and equanimity towards both you and that person. I have used this approach often at work. What it does is cleanses yourself of impure intentions, specifically unconscious ones, such that interactions are not lined with hate and anger. Something as simple as wishing him happiness "may you be happy" will suffice. After all, if he was happy, he almost certainly would not act like that. Happy people are not usually assholes. It would also recommend to abstain from harsh speech, which includes trolling him or insulting him, either starting something or as a reaction. Last, the pali sutras also recommend wise friendships, associating with like minded, "spiritual" people who also follow the same rules you do. The sangha. However, I do not think that alone is what you must do. I would recommend setting boundaries, and directly asking him to stop. If he feigns ignorance, be specific: "I am asking you to stop doing ____ or saying ___." See the book "non-violent communication" by marshal rosenburg. At an extreme end, if he does not stop, then cease contact and end that relationship, or at least minimize contact. Your friends may or may not follow. That is being compassionate towards yourself in the worldly sense. There could be other, also skillful ways. But, they must be in accordance with the Pali Cannon, free from anger, greed, and delusion. There is a book "Verbal Judo" that might also be helpful. There is no room in Buddhism for "putting someone in their place" as is commonly meant, as Jadespear suggested. That is certainly not the only way to deal with an asshole. If you choose to go that route, you will reap what you sow, and experience more inner turmoil. Likely outer turmoil too. I would not recommend that. There is no end to that cycle of verbal violence, and that is certainly NOT in accordance with ANY school of buddhism.

That's a very good point, thank you for the reminder. Do you know if there is some equivalent for ethical conduct in Taoism? I know in yoga they have yamas and niyamas, which include friendliness and compassion. I read the Tao Te Ching has the 3 treasures: compassion, frugality, and modesty. But, I'm wondering if there is any more information on Taoist conduct. Do Taoist practices have an equivalent to stream entry, where defilements are eliminated? Reading some of the past posts mocking other people, belittling them, it seems directly at odds with ethics from any of those three schools. Hence my comments in a past thread, where people who were bullying others might not have cultivated and gotten as far as they should given how much they claim to have practiced.

https://roguetaoist.wordpress.com/2016/01/25/hypercompression-my-meditation-method/

You would be incorrect, for the second time, about me. I spent probably 10-20hrs reading on his methods from various sources, particularly this forum. Short of emailing teachers of other systems, and asking them what they thought of BKF's system, I did all I could reasonably do. I literally brought up posts that were 10-15 yrs old, how can you then claim I am not willing to do due diligence? My post was literally the results of due diligence! I don't think I am expected to travel to Sante Fe and conducted my own interviews. If you would share these sources, I would certainly read them. I have provided at least some basis for my claims, while you have not. You would be disagreeing with joeblast, pietro, and Ya Mu. From what they have written, they did more than their due diligence as it is. Earl Grey, your posts used to be more compassionate and friendly. I've read a lot of topics by you as well, and benefited from your words. Either way, you are incorrect about me, again.

For any future readers, I wanted to counterpoint the above views by saying Bruce Frantzis's methods have been well respected by many members here in the past. In fact, the past member's views were the reason I purchased "Opening the Energy Gates of Your Body" as my first qigong book. As an example, I just finished rereading joeblast's and pietro's breathing thread, who immensely benefited from BKF techniques. Likewise, Ya Mu, or Michael Lomax of Stillness-Movement, also spoke about him as a peer, jokingly dividing the territories and saying "[Bruce has already claimed the West of the United States]." Further, articles have been written, and I've read here on the forum, about how BKF would enter these tai chi tournaments in China as a foreigner, and win! Unheard of in his time. As a last example, one of his past students has wrote about healing her bipolar disorder through BKF dissolving method and (and some tai chi). Anecdotally, I have heard BKF seems cold. However, I have personal experience with his online methods, and he has never bullied or talked down to anyone there nor in his materials. In fact, in his energy gates book, when he is describing a qigong he thinks has been very harmful, he refused to mention the name out of respect for their lineage. He just described how his process works, why it is correct, and how it differs from that lineage. He was certainly not regarded as a charlatan in the past, nor is he regarded as one in the present.

I think that depends on the branch. I studied Rinzai under Meido Moore for a brief period. And the first years of all practice was susokan, or breath counting. He says that only after experiencing some type of stability, and even glimpses of kensho, do people graduate into koans. There are also practices he goes into in "Hidden Zen." Some of the monks there did chanting practices as well. He never actually mentioned vipassana practice as part of the curriculum, nor in Omori Sogen's books either. We also practiced with our eyes open, and had a particular focus on maintaining peripheral vision throughout the day, not only during practice.

I agree with you, mostly, lol. I also do not think simple HRV training can lead to samadhi. In my experience, Kriyabans (and indian yogi's in general) tend to use the word "meditation" very loosely. However, if his videos and methods include more than HRV training, which it looks like they do since he has one on pratyahara, japa, and stillness, then it possibly could lead to samadhi. The kriya yogi's of his lineage seem to always like involving science as much as they could, specifically to appeal to westerners. Incidentally, when I attended Sadhguru's 3-day Inner Engineering Kriya Course, the last technique they taught us for a couple hours, after 20+hrs of practice, lectures, etc., was a special type of meditation they called "fun meditation." It consisted of going outside and playing frisbee and volleyball XD