statusquovadis

Hi, may I have a PPD please? Thank you

Thank you for your reply. I may not necessarily agree with your view (about taking sensations as practice marker/ map), but thank you for replying in good faith. I understand now that you're concerned about newcomers being misled.

I haven't been around here much, mind stating factually and briefly what caused this kind of doubt? In this thread I only saw someone mentioning it was the manner, reminding them of a school teacher or something. Then there were remarks about cults. But looking at the content (not the delivery, which I'm taking the benefit of doubt and attribute to cultural and language difference) of what's been shared here it still seems fairly legit to me.

Sorry, don't understand the reference. Is this OP, awaken? Edit: after watching the video, a more humorous take would be: If that's really awaken (who's probably 50-60 years old) that would be the greatest advertisement ever for her meditation methods! 😄

Been practicing extensively across the sea, predominantly Buddhist meditation stuff. I'm curious about the Taoism side. Good question about what motivates me. No longer seeking for myself, but perhaps understanding of different types of meditation can help others. From a non-dogmatic, pragmatic perspective it is also interesting to see what works, what doesn't, and why.

Might do that, when the time is right. I'm kind of a collector of meditation techniques, and thanks to this topic started reading Wu Zhen Pian (Pregadio's translation). Why, are you not confident? Only confident of your own teaching, or your teacher's?

And to the detractors, while this is a fairly free-speech forum, I do think you guys should reflect on your motivations of doing so. OP here is offering knowledge that's been collected over decades of her life, for free. If you don't think it is worth it, or can't see the value of it, move on.

Hi @awaken thanks for writing/translating these. Will come back to this as reference if and when i go back to serious meditation practice and as a bonus I would probably learn Chinese in the process. Just a couple of questions if you don't mind: 1. Is what you're based on The Secret of the Golden Flower? Or from multiple sources plus your own experience. 2. What does it mean when it is said "hide the LDT (lower dantian) from shen from the ming men direction"? 3. If there has been occasional strong heat in the ming men area should I be worried? Have read variously that it is related to trauma release, yet another source mentions it is yin deficiency (especially with cold hands and feet), etc. Thanks if you would consider answering the above. Otherwise not to worry I'm in a good condition with stable life and lifelihood.

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Hi guys, I've been reading and digesting stuff for about a month now, and thought this may be good time to ask the question on where to go from here. It's either this or casting yarrow stalks A bit of background, which may be relevant, else just skip to the next paragraph. I did a fair bit of external and internal martial arts from early teens to early twenties, with no specific emphasis on qi. In fact my mind back then was rejecting it for various reasons, despite some evidence of something beyond what is strictly physical. In the early 20s, I activated the microcosmic orbit through a description in Dr Glenn Morris book. Still didn't know what I was doing, asked my taichi teacher but he couldn't (or wouldn't) tell me more, other than that being an indication of spiritual powers. I left it alone, started working and forgot all about it. A few years later I did KAP1 online, and that made me more comfortable with the idea of working safely with spiritual powers. But it was the beginning of many years of struggle with depression and working through "stuff", so again I left it behind. Several years later, I had a serious accident and that brought about some change. It sounds clichèd, all that stuff about searching inside and finding meaning, borne out of the realization that youth and this body I took for granted wouldn't last forever. I started meditating and going to silent retreats. I'm now in a comfortable place for about two years, with a sense of effortlessness of life unfolding on its own accord. I still practice meditation, but in that tradition it is widely believed that eventually one would need to be a monastic in order to work towards full enlightenment, which I feel is not my path in this life. Or rather, taking the path of least resistance, this is not where my life is going. At this juncture Daoism seems to lay out a path of integration as a non-religious lay practitioner. I'm interested in the philosophical aspects of it, reading DDJ and got Dan Reid and Pregadio lined up, but another part is still curious about energy works, just wanting to see where this leads to. Looking at the bigger picture, it seems like I worked on jing (thus affecting ming) up to mid-twenties. Then started working on xing in late thirties, through intensive meditation practice. Now I'm returning to work on ming, to fix physical issues that came by aging, accidents, and the strain of sedentary life. Self diagnosis, could be totally off: the three fields are fairly balanced presently. MCO and side branches of the thrusting meridians are open, as well as some meridians down the limbs and back. Some imbalances between the left and right, attributed to old injuries, and between the yin and yang vessels (yin vessels need some work). Thrusting vessel and baihui opening only partial, though fortunately not causing any serious issues. The question is, what does one do from here? I have read some books, but feel it can only get so far. Some options would be: - Join a big name teacher's retreat (e.g. Wang Li Ping, Damo Mitchell, Mantak Chia, etc.), but this would probably be a one-off without any follow up, and requires coordinating leave from work. - Join one of the teaching institutions in China, thinking of the Five Immortals temple, or Wudang Daoist Kungfu Academy, they are open year round, easier to schedule and the teachers seem more accessible. Will need to learn some Mandarin. - Find a local teacher. I have a couple of names of teachers with a lineage but the class is very much health qigong. How does one get through the door, should I wait until we know each other better, or get a private lesson? Will it be necessary to become a formal disciple? Any answers, comments or suggestions much appreciated 🙏😺

Nowhere to go, nothing to do.. Curiosity still there though, sometimes. I don't know if that will be enough to get anything serious going.

Just a quick update. Still alive. Past two years have been exciting, as many people's lives have been. Not possible to go to China for the next while. Quite happy where I am. My meditation practice in the system I'm in has pretty much gone as far as it can, anything else would be just for fun. I have also been looking into shamanism and some inner works synergistic with it. It's kinda funny seeing the post I made two years ago. Nonetheless, the generosity of everyone here, with your advice and suggestions, the humor and stories shared, offers of energy, etc. is much appreciated. As for Taoism. Still waiting for a chance encounter or something, but in the meantime going to look into material that's available publicly. Probably going to set up an altar of Taishang Laojun and get it activated. We'll see.

I'm reading Wang Li Ping's Opening the Dragon Gate. References to minor deaths (and of course great deaths too) pique my interest. I'm guessing the Great Death is the one that occurred after the 28 days fast, when he was officially dead for three days and his teachers made a wooden plaque for him, though I could be mistaken. But there is no other mention of it in the book. Is minor death similar to what is known as cessation (nirodha, nibbana) in Theravada Buddhism? Relevant quotes of the book: Thanks in advance!

Agree that not *all* teachers of meditation know what they are doing, years of experience notwithstanding. But if you've been following current trends with what is called pragmatic dharma, you'll understand what i'm talking about. Yes, there are higher levels still. It's an asymptote.

This is an interesting take. As mentioned in OP, my path meanders from the physical (jing) to the mental (meditation, shen). Qi is something in between, which both sides touch on at some point. Very different approaches, and I bet those folks teaching meditation for beginners would like to have a word with you! 😄 I'd recommend John Yates' The Mind Illuminated to anyone interested in meditation but not quite sure how to go about it. Work up to stage 8-9 and tell me if it doesn't improve your practice at all.

Haha, no just been buried under work stuff. And not knowing how the site notifications work. Practice happens as it happens... interesting times we are in. Take care and wishing you well!

Thanks for the replies aka spam. Sorry i've been busy with RL stuff, didn't realize no email notification from thread replies. Thanks again! With the virus and whatnots any plans delayed indefinitely but no issue practice can happen any place and time. Take care and be well, friend.

You read my mind 😄

I see. What's your school, if you don't mind? Thanks for answering the noob questions, btw.

By working from the bottom you mean strengthening jing, LDT work, and letting qi rise on its own? I can see how it can be much safer. As someone with no formal training, I observe accidental qi deviation is quite common with meditators, even when they are not practicing it on purpose. Wouldn't MCO be useful to help ground the rampant energy? I know theoretically it can be grounded automatically through the vessels that run to the heels, but won't an open network of meridians help? Still laughing about the Akuma thing, it made my day 😂

This is why I find Daoist internal arts scary. At the end of the day, how does one know who to trust? There is still some amount of self discernment and intuition needed. Fortunately I'm not following this person's teaching, just a site that popped up when I searched yuan shen. I saw the term elsewhere a few days ago but was too lazy to try to find it again 😂

Lol, yes, shiny toys indeed! 🤩 I have seen some discussions on MCO around here. I'm not much qualified to comment, but my own personal experience is this: the first description I had of MCO was from Glenn Morris book, Path Notes of an American Ninja Master or maybe the sequel. It was just a short innocuous paragraph, this was in the early 2000s, and there was hardly any information. That stuff really worked, I was sensing warm pressure along the prescribed path, and when it rounded the top of the head I started seeing golden lights and having parasympathetic activation (salivation, tearing). Also since then and for many years after I started experiencing rocking movements from the waist as I meditated. As mentioned in the first post, i couldn't find any guidance and just chalked it down to "interesting stuff that happened" and left it. Skip forward to the present day, not as dramatic for sure (got other ways to make things shiny, lol). After the events 2 months ago, the MCO path often lights up on its own, especially the conception channel. My theory is that twenty years ago it wasn't fully opened, the yang governing channel opening more than the yin conception channel, producing some imbalance that actually kinda helped with meditation but also made the system prone to side effects. Just theorizing. https://www.tinyatdragon.com/blogs/spiritual/yuan-shen-yuen-sun-taoism-knowledge-101 I'm not sure if it is yuan shen, yuan qi or yang qi/ shen. What would you call it? Edit: From Damo Mitchell's White Moon book: "Yuan Shen is the undifferentiated light of illumination that exists before the five spirits of Hun, Shen, Yi, Zhi or Po refract into being. This is the true spirit of pure consciousness, the aspect of our nature that Buddhists may refer to as our innate ‘Buddha nature’." I feel this is a close description to the thing I was referring to. Given I don't know for sure, I should have just described it. It is a non-dual field of awareness that extends beyond the physical body, encompass everything perceived, internal and external, with everything appearing to have equal density and inner light, and made of the same 'stuff' out of this undifferentiated mass.

I'm reading that, also got a couple of his other books! Great stuff. Would love to train with his school but there isn't any where I live. Will try to join a retreat some time in the next few years.

Yeah, it is not uncommon among people who meditate a lot and can be more pronounced during retreats, due to the high mileage (like meditating 10-12 hours a day). Visions and emotional upheaval are not uncommon. I think as long as the meditator is aware that these symptoms come from meditation, don't attach to them and don't act out of them. Some meditation techniques are more prone to this issue. I'm curious though if qualitatively there is a difference between qi deviation and side effects of meditation. I'm not too sure yet. So as mentioned I had a few side effects from meditation over the years, the most pronounced were during retreats, though I had some at home. They are known entities under the meditation paradigm and I was relatively unfazed. But the one that I was pretty sure was qi-related was around 2 months ago, when I started experimenting with a few neigong and qigong techniques in the span of a few days, including MCO, wind path (reverse orbit), qi deployment in martial arts practice, plus a couple of other things... lol. Plus it coincided with a new moon and jing depletion through blood loss. Next morning I woke up as if almost all spiritual powers (yuan shen) were gone, could barely sense my own qi movement, couldn't concentrate or string a sentence together, and needed to sleep a lot for a few days. After a couple of weeks things gradually returned to balance, and only a bit later and through some digging around I figured out how it could be explained through understanding jing, qi and shen and the rest of it. Must be basic stuff for resident bums here, but it was quite mindblowing for me.

@Earl Grey thank you for your replies and the kind offer. I started with another person already, so will have to take a rain check on it. The qi sickness links are super interesting, will need hours of reading later, but I believe I have had multiple minor forms of it, thankfully transient. I thought they were just a normal occurrence of the learning process (especially if self taught... lol!). Talk about self-fulfiling prophecy.