Daniel

I'm having a very hard time answering your question without speaking in hebrew. I'm sorry. Yes I agree, but I'm missing the connection the relevance to this subject matter.

Yes. Thank you for pointing that out. We have a name for it, but, ... this is going to sound weird ... I can't say it's name. I'm ( forgive me ) duty bound to secrecy on this. Yes. What I'm talking about is 'Craving+Ignorance' at a very high level. And *Not* in the good way. There's a name for it in Hebrew, but I can't say it or type it out. OH! How about this? It's Craving+Ignorance of the worst sort, without a single drop of averice at all. None. The other two are full. And the third is a bottomless pit. That's "It".

but now, I kinda need this:

Ok. Thank you for pointing this out. gnowledge... ok. It will take a little time and practice, but I think this sounds really nice. Thank you for saying it. ty. It took a while to find y'all. I'm glad I did.

Then there's this...

How about a little SantaCruz Ska flavor?

unless... gain' *is* loss fresh water drips without cost when sipping from moss

You win.

Hello manitou, It's a pleasure to meet you. *Daniel bows deeply to manitou in honor of 39 years* ( it was 27 in 2008, that means it's 39 years now )

You are always welcome, open door policy. Since I know you're having troubles, I'll check back here regularly over the next few days in case something comes up that you want to talk about. Speedy recovery, and Best Wishes to you and yours,

me too... on all counts... Anyone who suffers from insomnia, you have my deepest sympathies; if you ever want to chat about it let me know.

Hi Scholar, It's a pleasure to meet you, my name is Daniel. I come from the Jewish tradition of healers taught by the Ba'al Shem Tov. It's important you know that, because it is not a cultivation path, and my knowledge and understanding of energetics comes from that school, not a Daoist school. But, That doesn't mean that I can't help. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- @Scholar This advice from @freeform is, imho, the most important advice in the thread so far. The advice given was: "Unfortunately in these arts ‘feeling stuff’ is not necessarily a good sign " Please focus on this, and really let it sink in ( no pun intended ) ( see below ). It's very simple, simpler than you think. Read @RobB's advice. In all cultivation paths and occult practices that I have learned. Grounding oneself is the first thing to learn. Or else... well.... a person leaves themselves exposed to Qi Deviation. Look it up it's on wikipedia. It has a fancy name in Chinese i think... but it basically means... "cultivation gone wrong". That's what it sounds like to me. What you're describing in this thread .... that sounds like Qi Deviation to me, especially if you do not know how to ground yourself. Yup. Something you expected to be relaxing is not relaxing at all, it's the opposite.... QI Deviation. There are a lot of ways to ground oneself.... here's what I do, because, what they heck? I'm in the shower anyway... but I digress. ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- My prescription for you if you choose to take it is simple. 1) Cease all cultivation until this is resolved 2) Take a hot shower when you feel the burning sensation, then slowly, very slowly turn the water from hot to cold. *** It's important to go very slowly from hot to cold *** *** Be sure to get your whole head immersed in the water periodically *** *** then slowly step back out from under the water in the shower so the water hits your belly *** *** repeat the steps above: go slowly from hot to cold *** *** take a tiny step back again, and do the same thing with your feet: slowly from hot to cold *** 3) dry off, make some herbal ( non-caffeinated ) tea and eat something small, like a cookie or biscuit, not fruit, not veggie, not meat *** don't forget to finish the tea completely as well as the little grain based snack *** Please keep us posted, OK?

Nice to meet you Lao Xiong, I'm new here too, but have been on another similar forum for years. Many blessings and best wishes on all your endeavors. Sincerely,

lair of the dragon : nothing ventured nothing lost unless... gain' *is* loss

OK, ok, no one spank me too hard for this one.... but how about the Qur'an 2:2-3.... not the entire verse... just a snippet. It has to be, hands down, my favorite quote ever. And because it's buried in the Qur'an makes it just that much sweeter. Cause I'm not a Muslim. ( delicious irony ) Here's the verses from the Sahih International version. The quote I'm speaking about is bold and underlined. This is the Book about which there is no doubt, a guidance for those conscious of Allah. Who believe in the unseen, establish prayer, and spend out of what We have provided for them. As I said, I'm not a Muslim, but I really like this idea. For those who don't know, in Islam, Allah is the ultimate reality. That means "those conscious of Allah" actually means "Those who are conscious of the ultimate reality" .That's why I like these two verses in the Quran, and it's one of my favorite quotes of all time. Those verses are talking about *us*. Students of the Dao, isn't it? Those who are conscious of the ultimate reality. Further, what does it say about us, the Students of the Dao? We believe the unseen. I don't know about you, but, that sums it up for me quite well in a nice tight package. What does it mean to be a Student of the Dao? We believe the unseen. The dao that can be spoken or seen is not the Eternal Dao. That's why it's my favorite quote. Cause I'm a Jewish Student of the Dao who believes in the unseen per the Qur'an. It's freak'n ironic as hell, and makes for fun at dinner parties and such.

It's a pleasure to meet you stimpy, my name is Daniel. edit to add... not THE Daniel, just Daniel.

exactly. I don't know. From what i can tell this is one of the final gates on one of the paths to enlightenment: Releasing the attachments to Desire. Desire can be good ( healthy ) or bad ( unhealthy ), of course. Just like anything. The desire you describe above,^^ is, I'm sorry to report, imho, not a healthy desire. An example of a healthy version of Desire is: wanting to help others towards their own freedom ( teaching ). Or perhaps another example would be the attachment to the completion of a bridge that is being built, and the individual wants to complete the project, knowing how many people will be helped by it. That sort of attachment is healthy. Perhaps since you referenced Buddhism, I'll use that framework to answer your question... ( assuming I understand it ). What you're describing is the difference between a Buddah and a Bodhisattva? Isn't it? I'm not Buddhist. So forgive me if I'm speaking out of turn. The Buddah has no attachments at all, none. They are obliterated and annihilated. The Bodhisattva, on the other hand, retains the healthy attachment to the Desire to Teach, to Help, and to Make. But has no other attachments at all. It is as if Desire is all that's left. Healthy desire to help make and do, not unhealthy desire to exploit and dominate. Hopefully that makes sense? ... So, yes there are healthy versions of desire, to help to make and to do virtuous deeds. But, the desire for freedom, is not on my list of healthy attachments as far as I have seen. I can give examples, but it would insulting to any "Believers in Christ" who may be reading this thread. And I do not want to disparage their scripture. Does that help? Too wordy? Sincerely,

Choice. Choosing to accept bondage is a version of freedom. Keeping perspective is the key.

Please excuse the ignorant question: Are there neidan practices which focus on UDT cultivation? Is UDT cultivation dangerous?

This is something I think y'all are going to Love. It's the Wooten brothers. Victor, some of you will remember as the bass player from the Flecktones. The other brother, you may recognize is Roy Wilfred( reggie ), affectionately know as "Future Man". Here, he is playing a standard guitar. However, he also plays an instrument of his own design called a "Drumitar or Zendrum". But this video is before all of that. This is an example of the Wootens in their early years. But regardless of what these folks do, no matter where they go, and no matter whether it is new or old... The whole trio is amaze-balls. What makes this video special is that you get to see Victor battle Roy. It's pre-Drumitar, so this is an old video in the grand scheme of their musical portfolio. Like I said, these are the early years of their career. Doesn't matter though. What results is nothing short of magic. they are priceless

Hope y'all don't mind something soul full... For George and his family and friends.

OMG.... That is a missing link to many many of my questions. Thank you so very kindly for saying this. Sincerely,

Forgive me, this may be ignorant: niwan? does it include physical movements/postures in its practice?

If I recall, a description of the UDT can be found in a discussion of the 9 palaces in The Routledge Encyclopedia of Taoism compiled by Fabrizio Pregadio. I have it in my collection, and I am happy to provide the relevant entry/entries here if there is interest. Disclaimer: my memory is still bungled and botched from this weekend. So I may be miss-remembering all of this.