stirling

_/\_

People get all excited about the rarity or difficulty of reaching "cessation" (4th Noble Truth), but in fact it happens in short bursts all the time, and is completely familiar to most people once they realize what it is. ...of course these cessations lack the complete realization of what they actually are, and the depth of emptiness it is possible to understand and appreciate.

Mr. Stimpy, SO much gold in these posts... but I would love to see the attributions that go with them. I collect these sorts of things. _/\_

Believe it or not, even a sneeze, or a sudden surprise will do it as well.

There isn't any intrigue. The owner could come here an interact at any time, and did for many years, but chooses to put their energies into other things these days. We are fortunate that they haven't decided to pull the plug on this board. If you have cognitive dissonance about how things are operated, you have myriad other choices. The owner continues to fund this place out of the goodness of their heart. This board costs money, and doesn't make any. As we are all guests here, we should behave respectfully, thankfully and kindly, both to each other, and toward the moderators and owner. Membership here is a privilege, not a right.

It is worth listening to our brilliant friend Doc, here. I might have said some of it, but greatly enjoyed reading all of it. Actually, I think you have made some progress, from an intellectual standpoint. If there is a "self" what IS it. Does it always have the same thoughts... do the senses always see from the same perspective? Do you meet the same "I" every time you sit on the cushion? Are you the same person when you are at work, or with your partner, or with old friends, or are these selves different? Is there really ONE "self" that you can point to? Where there is just stillness of the mind in your sitting, is there a "self" watching, or separate objects in your view? With your eyes open and without thought filling your mind with conceptual objects, is there anything that has existence of its own as separate, or just a panorama of color, shape, and light in your view? Look carefully when the mind is still. The very basis of everything is present when the mind is still. It is a ripe opportunity for seeing things as they truly are. - Don't expect to get this because we are pointing at it, or from reading this on a board, though it COULD happen. It is hard, in my experience, to impart these ideas without at least some face to face Zoom work. Still... just looking at this again and again could crack it. Feel free to message me if you are truly curious about this.

In our discussion elsewhere about how one would prove such ideas - how would you know if any of that was true?

I went for an amazing walk out today the sea today, and listened to this: It was a spell, in the way that all good sutras should be, and brought about a lovely deep stillness. Maybe this spell will work for you too? _/\_

Find out for yourself!

Just for clarity sake - these are all the same "attainment" if you can call it that.

_/\_

Enlightenment is an entirely objective realization. Enlightenment (oneness as you put it) breaks the subject/object way of seeing. It wouldn't be oneness unless it did! Agreed, except that no human will ever CONTROL their thoughts, what is required is to let thoughts settle out by no longer stoking and feeding them into mental dialog. Thoughts and feelings don't ultimately belong to a "self", they arise and pass away in awareness in the same way that anything else - the wind, a bird flying by, an ache - arise and pass. It isn't. Realizing that we ARE that awareness is. How would you know? No human has ever been enlightened. Enlightenment has only woken up to itself. Humans are part of processes, unfoldments, gods, social clubs, and the rest ONLY in the dream of separateness - duality. Enlightenment is the realization that what we ARE is that pure awareness. It rather changes the rules somewhat.

Pretty phenomenal performance yesterday… and I properly pushed it. I think that’s two good days from here. Would love to know ( and think it would be beneficial) what has been manipulated to get us back on track.

I answered this question on the "Transmission" thread:

You aren't LOOKING at the oneness... you are looking at the separateness that arises from it.