stirling

I appreciate that, Bob.

I have a friend who was being sued for an honest mistake and was at risk of losing his retirement. The one thing he refused to do was declare bankruptsy because of his cherished values. He eventually realized that there was no other path and "surrendered" to what wanted to happen in reality. It was the best thing that ever happened to him. Realizing that he had no money, the people never sued him, and kept his holdings, as ended up with more money because a good chunk of his debt was forgiven. He became a much more kind, generous, and humble person as a result. A more famous example is the old Chinese "Maybe So" fable: Accepting things as they are without generating a story about whether they are good or bad is a great way to reduce suffering. As you suggest, one days misfortune is the next days good luck.

This is a nice summary, thank you. This is what happens. Practice, and some pointing leads to being able to see what "no-self" and "emptiness" are. Once recognized you have all the tools you need to rest in that spaciousness. It isn't actually that hard. The truth of suffering is undeniable. Anyone who looks at their life will see it. I also REALLY like the tools of attachment and aversion for looking at how we generate Samsara/suffering. Once we see the mechanism we use to generate our suffering, it becomes more and more obvious how we generate it. I agree. I'll go further and say that all manner of beings exist in their way, but even gods (in Buddhism) are not enlightened, and would need to become enlightened to realize their true nature and truly master reality. These beings are not as we imagine them.

Oh, absolutely. Anybody patient enough to develop a meditation practice with access to a realized teacher can have this cleared up experientially within a month, for moments at a time, building faith in the practice. Well... it is, but it is being expressed using the "via negativa". Cessation, or Nirodha is the fourth Noble Truth, the end of suffering. Cessation, which can be temporarily experienced by even a beginner (with some pointing) as I mentioned above, is "self" dropping out. It is pure presence/awareness. Your earlier quote captures this perfectly via Buddhism's "Einstein", Nagarjuna: When you COMPLETELY understand that Samsara is generated by your creation of Karma, Nirvana is the result. No-one to generate karma means that the creation of it ceases, and old karma is seen through and falls away. Beautiful quotes. Not only are all BEINGS are enlightened, the fabric of reality is enlightened, or :

Perhaps, but for most it isn't. It is a story you tell yourself. A belief. I've seen some truly strange things, but I won't argue that they are any kind of objective reality. I disagree with your assessment of this poster. I think they are actually being kind and deferential. Please consider adopting a similar attitude Collegiality is valued here.

I don't honestly think it is the shout, blow, or pebble hitting the jar, a word of scripture, or anything else that is the impetus, but the moment of stillness that happens afterward. In Zen, the reason for keisaku (stick) on the shoulder is to surprise the mind into stillness. The same is true of most "crazy wisdom" stories, like that told to me by Roshi Ian Forsberg about Kobun getting up in the middle of dokusan and jumping out the window. Really, no-one and no-thing can "transmit" enlightenment. It isn't a contact high. It is the stillness of the mind that makes us "accident prone" which is why Soto advocates for the practice of shikantaza, where resting the mind in stillness is really no different from enlightenment itself. Where there is enlightenment there IS no-self to experience it, and no other to bequeath it. It is simply a shift in perspective, away from identification as an "I" and into identification with the field of experience, or "awareness".

The Buddha does not mention reincarnation in the original Pali suttas. There is a reason for that. This moment is the only REAL moment. The past and future only exist as thoughts happening now, and have no absolute reality beyond that. The past arises as a story about who we are in this moment. It doesn't HAVE to limit or color our identification with the Eightfold Path in this moment. Truly, we are reborn every moment we open a door into a fresh room, remember a past suffering, or project a new one into an imagined future. We reincarnate as limited, living beings every time we create a limiting story about the empty awareness we truly are. Our stories about ourselves as victims, champions, firemen, presidents, criminals, or whatever are only that... stories. No-self is the realization that all of our moment by moment reincarnations are just the adoption of a new belief system about the kind of person (with its commensurate limitations) we are. In the moment of the realization of no-self, and further realization of emptiness, we are free of ever believing in limited fictions about the supposed "self". We no longer identify with the collection of phenomena we identify as "self", and realize that what we are is the ENTIRE field of experiential phenomena happening in this moment. What we truly are, in Hindu terms, is the Self, empty of a center and encompassing all experience. This is what we have ALWAYS been, our inheritance and our legacy.

Having some understanding of the absolute, intellectually, is useful, but it is also important to realize that the absolute is ineffable.. it ISN'T any of the stories you tell yourself. One needs to hold the raft lightly, not hold on to it as any kind of ultimate truth.

It is only dismal if you imagine that you are somehow a separate being from the fabric of reality that has agency and is in control. If you realize that what you truly are IS the fabric of reality, it is actually liberation. Magick has this construct in Thelema where one can undertake summoning your Holy Guardian Angel (which is in fact your perfected, enlightened "self") to aid in the realization of unity. That realization isn't different from enlightenment.... IS enlightenment.

Yes, any "energy" (or anything else) must arise from the source, and is therefore not separate. Agreed... just a variation in terminology.

Current Events is on "pause". Generations of admins are debating its fate, complicated by the ability to actually get on the board and post something we are all experiencing. I would expect an answer soon.

Definitely humans are constantly coming up with layer after layer of meaning and concept - but they without any real substance. They are interpretations only, not a deeper meaning.

You are saying that the "energy" is Brahman?

I don't buy it either. Ironically the story of "Lords of Karma" and a "Law of Retribution" would simply contribute to more self made suffering. You can stop generating karma. You can work with and dissolve enough of your karma to eventually see that YOU were the creator of it all, and that it only exists because you are constantly telling your story about reality and creating suffering for yourself. What happens if you stop blowing up an untied balloon... it goes flat. Same with your karma. The only person torturing you with your karma is you.

Is this your standard for the verification of the "ascended or enlightened"? What is a "real energy form", in your estimation? What is "real" on its own? The mistake is in believing that "energy" has some reality outside of mind. Do the non-dual paths result in powers? After a fashion, but the realization that can accompany or precede them puts paid to the idea that they were ever "yours" or that you somehow constructed them. If you think you are the master of something there is still understanding to be had. You may think you are in charge, but you aren't DRIVING. That's where an understanding of reality comes in. Crowley, for example, had Thelema for this reason... he was realized. These have some correspondences with the "fetters", delusions that are overcome after insight in Buddhism. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fruits_of_the_noble_path#Outline

Welcome to the board, Jeffrey!

The admins are currently in some discussion about policy on this sort of stuff, and attempting to solicit some historical background on the Current Events forum, and intentions around it. Pausing the thread in question was a first step while we take this apart and wait for some comments from the Elders. I think you bring a lot to the board, Maddie... it would be a shame to have you move on because of this blip in the board history. This IS a moment where change is happening. Things often have to get as bad as they can get before they change.

Hope you find what you are looking for PL. Welcome to the board!

There aren't any "wrong" conditions - reality is what is happening right now. The conditions of this moment can't be different. Wrong conditions exist in your mind. What growth comes from peer pressure or competition? Both are the product of delusion. What would you consider "meaningful" in this context? What would an example of an "achievement" be? Do these achievements belong to an individual? Are there concepts that are real? Do concepts exist in reality? How are communications with galactic emissaries less fantastic than astral projection?

Absolutely - they are definitely not separate.

As far as real transmission outside of scripture, it happens all the time... Sufis, Hindus, Jains, and even Christians and Jews, amongst a multitude of even those with no formal belief system can come to realization.

With deference Mark, I feel like you are seeking something with this continued line of questioning. What IS it? Did you have an experience that you can't reconcile and are trying to understand? Are you trying to construct a theory for something you haven't experienced? Do you feel like there is some "hidden" Buddhism that others have missed out on, best explained on some cludge of Zen and Theravada doctrines? What do you REALLY want to know? I ask this with what I hope you see as great compassion for your continued quest.

Welcome to the board. Your post makes it sound like you might be having a hard time. I sincerely hope you find some acceptable comfort and resolution to you struggle. To answer your questions from MY perspective as Buddhist practitioner: 1 - Your questions don't sound crazy, BUT it wouldn't hurt get input from a counselor and/or psychiatrist. Yes, there are energetic phenomena, which may or may not be relevant to life and spiritual development, if you are open to such things. Not all answers purely exist in the spiritual realm. Your language suggests a pragmatic recognition of your symptoms. Stick with that, vs. adopting the language or limitations of specific scientific or spiritual disciplines. 2 -It doesn't sound like you damaged your body, but you, or a professional, would know better. 3 - What wants to happen generally happens. Don't resist it, but DO check with medical professionals if you feel uncomfortable or feel frightened. 4 - I'll leave suggestions about this to someone else, but my experience is that simply being with things as they are is the wisest course, BUT asking for help where there is mental or physical discomfort is a good idea. 5 - With apologies to my board-mates, I am not sure that there is anyone here that is qualified to help you with this. I'd be happy to be wrong, and you'll have to weigh suggestions with your OWN experience. Stories about energy, intention and what it means are legion, but real solutions might be thin on the ground. Trying to manipulate energy can result in worsening consequences. Be cautious. Be sure to cautious and consider the idea that your "energy" and its implications MIGHT be a story you adopt rather than a reality you inhabit. Feel free to message me with any questions about my responses. I open the floor to further answers...

Here is some deep DEEP dharma about the nature of suffering. Keep it to yourself, it's secret! I am only kidding about the second bit. Recognizing the stories you tell about your "self" and how and why they cause suffering IS actually deep practice.

I honestly didn't know it existed until I became an admin. I told the other admins that a thread was out of control and would probably blow up the board. I'm sure they thought I was hilarious.