stirling

What others? The act of writing it IS compassion.

The spiritual scientist, tests, constructs, actions, entities all only exist in your imagination. This is the absolute reality. https://www.lionsroar.com/what-are-the-two-truths/ Reality is obscured by the belief in a separate self that has agency. Every time we believe our thoughts and conceptual frameworks are real we are deluding ourselves. Oneness is always what everything is. Noticing your misperception is all that is needed. Resting the mind in open awareness meditation is the SAME as enlightenment, but lacking the realization.

"Self" (as opposed to "self") is the same as "no self". Absolute reality is a unity. That unity is the entirety of "Self", and so naturally empty of "self". It is even empty of the conceptual idea of emptiness. All apparent objects (including people) lack any existence of their own (intrinsic existence). All appearances in consciousness ARE the "Self". Do not mistake the "Self" for any kind of thinking, planning, deciding entity. It is merely present, unmanifest, timeless and space-less and what "we" really always have been. "We" have never been something separate from it. The illusion of ourselves as separate beings surrounded by separate objects manifesting our will in the world is a mistaken interpretation of how things are.

I always enjoy the intellectual rigor and detail of your posts, so thank you for this one, Mark. What I am pointing to is the idea that "actualizing the fundamental point" is merely dropping the "doing". The "self" is the doer - the one checking if the in or out breath is happening correctly, possibly scolding you if it isn't, monitoring the right mix of causes and conditions, giving up if life isn't on an even keel, etc. These are all artificial limits on just being. There is no process necessary to just be. Truly being present can happen when driving, doing your taxes, or shooting a gun. Meditation, when we are thinking of Zazen or Dzogchen, is the one thing we do that ISN'T an activity - it is just resting the mind in its own nature. As you say, it is the cessation of doing. The phenomenal world continues, thoughts arise, bombs explode, lovers entwine - the whole pageant continues. Forgetting the self is simply allowing the illusion of being a self to drop out. What takes practice is simply learning how to stop stoking the fire of iterative thoughts that feed the delusion of being a being with separateness.

A belief is what we construct when we don't know. There isn't a belief system that truly describes reality, for this reason. It is always the construct of the thinking mind that divides infinity into parts and decides which ones are important for the new "system". All such systems are therefore obviously incomplete. Reality is just "this" WITHOUT your story about how it has been, or how it might be in the future. This includes all traditions, systems of thought, beliefs, practices, sciences, etc. It is good to avoid identifying or building a new "self" out of your particular practice or belief system, and hold such things lightly. Reality is always perfectly fine just as it is. Reality is not a separate entity (from us or anything else) that accepts or rejects how things are. Reality is never at odds with what is happening, it is our conceptions about how things should be that are at odds with reality. The entity that accepts or rejects reality as it is in this moment is our thinking mind. When the mind is quiet and still, clinging or aversion to how things are drop away. There is just being. This is what "reality" is. This might be the clearest expression of this that I have ever found:

...further, there are actually beings all over the place with the SAME understanding. There are likely at least one or two in a city, or meditation center near you. You can meet and work with them, then decide for yourself what their level of understanding is or isn't, OR (better still) learn and practice WITH them and see for yourself.

Subtle bodies, gods, auras, steps of awakening, lessons, cosmologies - these are all stories we tell ourselves or adopt because they "resonate" with us. Even science is one such story. I can see my blue aura and sometimes those of others if I direct my attention that way - its interesting, but it doesn't tell me anything about the nature of reality. I don't think it is anything to worry about or build a story around. The body is constantly changing, whether it has any subtle aura qualities, or aging related pain qualities, or is strong today, or weak tomorrow. Natural or "supernatural", they are still things that come and go and can be seen sometimes but then not others. The quality of reality that doesn't come and go is its non-duality, which, with practice, can be seen all the time. Awareness is what "we" ultimately are. It doesn't go anywhere, cannot be hurt, and does not depend on conditions for its existence. I'd love to pitch in on a topic like that, and hear your ideas and fears. If something is happening, I'll be curious to see what it is.

Based on my experience he likely awakened, but the insight wasn't stabilized. Meditation becomes very attractive at this point as it is effortless, and deepens insight and seeing. After some period of time "self" drops away, and insight is the default way of seeing and doesn't require any effort. The Tibetans call this "post-meditation". There is still sitting and deepening the seeing of emptiness, but emptiness is the default seeing at that point. I think trying to append what meditative states he might have experienced is perhaps of limited usefulness. I'm not familiar with this specific terminology, but I think this covers what I was saying above, as does: This is the deepening of the emptiness, which doesn't change the core insight, but is something like turning up the volume on the seeing of it. When I read Maharshi it is clear to me that he has the full measure of insight, and that it was, as evidenced by his actions and obvious lack of "self", complete. Just my opinion.

I can see it right now.

Nah. The Kingdom of Heaven is present in this moment always. It is present at parties, at car accidents, during sex, and even when a loved one dies. It's everywhere and permeates all experiences all the time, and belongs to no-one. It is impossibly beautiful and looks JUST LIKE THIS. It isn't "in" anything, it is the fabric or your experiencing MINUS what you think you are looking at. It is the antithesis of history, places, lives, and discovery. It's always right here, waiting for you to drop into it. It has never been anywhere or anytime else.

Ah... within WHAT?

I appreciate your sincerity. I don't choose any stories. I remember the story of the acolyte who created a web of intrigue and drama where there wasn't one, amongst many.. Was it necessary? I could tell you it was, but it would be yet another story. -None of that is happening now, and now is always reality as it is.- I remember the search, the excitement, the drama of far away places, and strange ritual. The DaVinci Code is a well-worn path. It's absolutely attractive! That's the point! If it is what you are driven to do, do it.. but KNOW there is a way out that embraces the simplicity that (maybe?) whispers to you in quiet moments. I appreciate you not lying to me. I offer you the same reciprocity.

It get this intimately... I do. This is a precisely described map for getting lost, in my experience. The belief in a chooser, volition in choosing, conditioning, trust... this is why the genius of resting in stillness is so clear, clean and definitive. Resting the mind and just being present drops the anxiety and uncertainty of whatever story you feel you have chosen. It's a clean, clear drink of water on a hot day. Why not experiment with just dropping the idea of a direction, or what the heart wants in this moment. What if there is just this moment, as it is, and the past and future, all thoughts of things you messed up, or hopes for the future are only thoughts you are having in this now, not real past residences, or future destinations. There is always a moment where nothing is wrong - things just are - and that moment is always NOW.

At this point a beyond that is any-place or any-time else is obviously just getting lost, which isn't to say I didn't enjoy hanging out at Gloucester Place with the Theosophists, or in Crowborough with the Rosicrucians in the 90's, or piecing together my own cosmological tomes of theories that "resonated" with me. I can see auras, spectral monks, and dead people. It doesn't lead anywhere. The questions lead to more questions and don't tell you anything about the nature of reality. None of this is at all complicated. The complication, the mysteries, the standing stones, the prophesies etc. are fun, but really just entangled paths in a forest that lead nowhere. As Manitou says, sagely, it is really just about stopping. Being still. Looking at what is here right now, in this moment. This is my personal experience.

This is not a commonly held belief. Perhaps you could explain this more fully?

Not brain, but "mind". Emotions and thoughts alike arise and pass. It's nothing to get in a kerfuffle about, I promise. Beyond? Where would that be?

I think this idea that the brain is where "mind" comes from is only a correlation. B. Allan Wallace puts this quite eloquently: https://tricycle.org/trikedaily/six-questions-b-alan-wallace/ In my opinion "Mind" is inseparable from the fabric of reality. What "this" all is IS Mind. Mind isn't a local phenomena, it is a holographic phenomena, existing everywhere/every-time.

With realization, being, oneness and non-judgement are the proof that the labyrinth is an illusion. This is awakening. The "puzzle" with its corresponding illusory complexity dissolves when insight arises.

Seems like a moment of non-doership. I sometimes have this feeling too. If it happens again see if you can notice that the body is taking care of itself and its motion in the same moment.

By whom? I think that is just a story we tell ourselves. Definitely. I think this is more accurate story of our senses. Ultimately there is just sensation. The story about whether they are pleasant or unpleasant, or what have you, is ours. Ultimately, at the base level, there are just phenomena arising in awareness. There is much more to see without the layer of thinking mind in between pure sensation. It's possible, but I'm not sure how we would know. What matters is what our state of being is now, of course. This is often the kind of "spiritual' experience that precedes awaking. I haven't but I appreciate your thoughtful posting style. I think that science itself is a mysticism, rather than a route to uncovering any explicit reality. As I have probably stated elsewhere, it is limited by the way it is constructed: It creates models from selected variables to create repeatable experiments, and is therefore unable to encompass reality which has infinite variables. No model can be constructed that encompasses the entirety of everything and its holographic interactions. This doesn't mean I don't think it is useful or interesting. Interesting... but can we "decode" that, or even see that encoding? There is only ever "Nagasena" as it exists in this moment, and as it is defined as separate from its environment. The definition, like all intellectual aspersions of separateness is entirely conceptual in nature. https://www.lionsroar.com/the-fullness-of-emptiness/ Aren't these insights something that come and go? You have them, then they pass? Is there something that is an insight that doesn't depend on a "self" to see it? Michael it is. Thank you for your post.

Haven't managed to get a moment to listen in full, but there is no doubt in my mind that he knows precisely what he is talking about. The new jargon is intriguing. There is very certainly a tangible simplicity and clarity to his teaching that generally only comes about in one way. Anyone who meets that chap would be fortunate indeed.

Reminds me of:

I didn't dig through my history, so I'll take your word for it. I misspoke. Will you forgive me? For which I am sorry. I admit I have not spent much time investigating your path or its list of attainments. In terms of the nature of reality, no.

I'm not sure why this discussion has to be contentious. I didn't say that I knew what your next milepost is, I only know that you have suggested that a non-dual understanding is in your path at some point. Am I wrong about that? The "illusions and falsehoods", (or "delusions and obscurations" as I would call them) are always in the way... until they aren't. The idea of shortcuts is just another delusion, IMHO.

I would say that absolute reality is just what is happening now, without any obscurations about time/space or self/other. It sounds like you are saying that there IS some fear there to me. I would characterize your fear as a fear in duality of the nondual. You are afraid that there is some non-dual "achievement" to identify with, and also something beyond that you might miss out on. My experience is that both of these are ultimately impossible. My advice is simple: Nonduality is in front of you. The way forward is through, if there IS a through... right? So, your next milepost is having non-dual understanding. I am giving you advice that I feel would help you to do that. Then we can all discuss it and you can make your mind up about how things are for yourself. I agree that ego IS a slippery customer. I would personally say that this is what is causing the fear. Ego is always afraid that there is a mistake to be made, a shortcut to be missed, or something better to have or experience. It is also afraid of being subsumed or not really existing. Any of these are also possible avenues in and are thus worthy of investigation if the goal (even if you imagine it is just a milestone) is awakening.