Lucky7Strikes

I have only learned one "technique" in the course, and it's the most generic one imaginable....chanting Aum! The main technique you learn is the Shambhavi Mahamudra which I haven't got to yet and has to be learned in person. Nothing he teaches is particularly new, it's the way he goes about it that's so fresh. It's not contaminated but straight from his own experiences. He says he's had no teachers in this lifetime and no spiritual education. That's why I like it so much, the way he weaves everything together into a coherent whole without a background of spiritual grandeur. I don't have a critique so far. Maybe that his "scientific" explanations are sometimes a bit weak, but I think he does that so people from strong western backgrounds can have a way to relate. But then again, he is better at it than most teachers I have seen.

I'm almost done with the online inner engineering, which is like a beginner's course in the Isha program. As I wrote in the other thread by Serene Blue, it's incredible. It's the most profound thing I've done since Kunlun. He clears up so much garbage for me. I'm going to go see him in October in the states when he will be teaching a course. Aren't you in Australia? He' going to be teaching there soon. I posted a link in another thread as a reply to your post, but wasn't sure if you got it. http://australia.innerengineering.com/ His life story is also extensive, especially his past life stories, his interaction with disembodied beings, the dhyanyalinga. I don't remember ever being so excited about a teacher, including the ones I have read.

I didn't say the brain isn't involved. Just that the will does not belong to it. My body has a will, doesn't it? When someone pinches you and you have a response, you have a reaction. But if you are present in the moment you can see the situation clearly and respond with a conscious will. For instance you can just feel the pinch without a resultant categorization of it as pain as most people would. That's an immediate and not a preconceived process. If our will was preconceived within the brain all the time, we would not have adequate means to respond to immediate changes in our environment which happen frequently. This is just a logical example. In experience, when you no longer identify with thoughts which are mostly localized in the brain, you realize your head activity can be experienced not as you, but within you. I'd say this is one way to argue that consciousness is not generated from the brain. When this steeping outside happens, I am aware of everything as a whole, including my surroundings as if there is no boundary. It's like I stepped out of a moving vehicle and now I see its pathway totally from above without division between sceneries i would've seen had I been inside the car. The less you identify with any-thing, the more expansive the view becomes. I feel very present and at the same time I feel like there is no I existing in the picture. Again, I'm just sharing an experience. But here I also feel very potent. Like I can really act. And when I act in a very clear states of being, it doesn't feel like I am choosing between possible pathways, but rather creating something entirely new from this immediate world I am aware of. There's an obvious correlation between how unconditioned this act is and how present I am within the moment.

I suggest you try to live with an abandoned free will for a period of time and see if your life falls into harmony.

As I wrote above, I believe that's just the brain. In my experience will does not belong to the brain, it can, but usually that is a conditioned reaction in a chain of mind processes from previous thought. Free will is a spontaneous will that arises from being completely present in the moment.

Yes! In the past five to six year I have been studying spirituality I have not come across anyone with as much clarity and relevance as Sadhguru. I am on day seven of the inner engineering program of Isha, and I can vouch that it is one of the most profound teachings I have come across. Everything he says is like a nectar that settles every conflict I have within me. He is incredible.

Actually it does! You become like a blob. A wave in the ocean. Until you get smacked up side the head.

This is only if you believe you are limited to the brain organ. Do you make choices just in your head? Because sometimes I choose to use my brain and other times I don't.

Will is immediate, it's not part of a process, just as presence is not part of a process. I would go as far as to say that presence and free will are inseparable, just as they say emptiness and infinite potential are inseparable in dzogchen. It doesn't belong just to the body and mind. The body and mind just function according to the conditions, more like a machine. But you can alter it. Will is only part of a process when it is a conditioned reaction within the mind and the body. It is certainly not a brain process. I can be outside of by head-mind at will. My brain is within my will and not the other way around. As for your second post, imo, you can't change patterns while admitting that your will is also part of a cause-effect chain. You just develop another pattern at best, which is like changing bad karma to good karma. It's better to just drop karma altogether. Just drop the patterns and live immediately as everything is. Then whatever you do emerges from clarity.

I said "at this point." And no, day to day life just shows day to day life, it doesn't show that consciousness is eternal. Mundane day to day awareness of mind, body, and inner energies should be seen for what it is and nothing more or less. It surely doesn't tell you that consciousness is eternal. Whether or not it can be illuminated or expanded to a greater degree to reveal ourselves is a different question. It's like if you have a binocular you shouldn't conclude from what you see of the stars their reality just by pointing the lens at the sky. But it doesn't mean there isn't a possibility to improve it to a telescope from the principle of the lens construction.

It only muddies the water of your beliefs. In the end to you or me at this point neither the idea that there are streams of flowing consciousness or one eternal consciousness mean nothing but theories, because we don't have the means to prove sufficiently to ourselves their reality. Theses ideas mean just as much as believing in a spaghetti monster or a man with a beard who made each one of us. Have any such theory only appeases our past upbringings or identification with a religion/belief system. That's what the mind does most of the time anyway: make imaginary alliances and problems only to struggle to justify itself and finally appease a self-made burden. To have a strict idea of the world, as you might believe there is an eternal consciousness, is a great hindrance to direct seeing of reality.

Hm? Bob, I care what you think. That's why I'm engaged in a conversation with you... I wanted to simply know your knowledge and experience behind that statement: Osho was demonic. So is what I wrote above as an assessment of your statement right? I assumed you had an in depth knowledge of him, or possibly met him in person, especially since you mentioned eyes. Osho was known for his stare. Demonic is a powerful word to use when describing someone. So I wanted to know why you used it in this context. That's all.

That sounds a bit limiting. Once you figure out the mind, you will be satisfied? Deconstruction of your entire karmic conditioning and the ability to reconstruct one's actions. Like how they say bodhisattvas can choose where to be born, or some able to construct their entire bodies for a certain purpose.

So basically you think Osho is demonic because the negative effects he had on people around him.

No need to be condescending. Did you mean maybe you meant that somehow your view of Osho's eyes made you think he was demonic. That his eyes reveal some demon potential in him (and all of us as well)? In that case, I'd like to ask if this is a particular ability you have, as in how you know a demonic eye vs. a non-demonic one and what you mean when someone is demonic.

Cool! Yes, I also believe that it is possible. Can you share their accounts? And was one of them a Kunlun practitioner?

Is Thusness omniscient? If not how can he conclude about reality. I always thought Thusness was just sharing his experiences and what he has seen, not making a claim about the nature of everything. At least I've never seen a post of his saying that the world is like that or like this. It's always centered around experience. No? Can you share what Thusness has shared about other planes and realms and the Buddhas? I don't see why you can't share them. Also if he sees the deconstruction of things, can he also reconstruct from what he sees? From my perspective, anatta is the deepening of the direct experience of presence. As long as you don't conceptualize presence, it naturally obliterates the sense of individual self or objective selves. Also isnt being in presence contemplation? Or do you contemplate by thinking? So imo non-conceptual presence is probably all there is to the path. Everything goes from there. You can conceptualize all you want for a million years. But it won't get you anywhere. You conceptualize so that you no longer conceptualize. Realization doesn't happen in the head does it?

Uh, or maybe his understanding deepened. People can you know, learn more stuff.

I think one thing you should really clarify is that it is your thoughts, reactions and attempts to analyze experiences of presence that objectifies presence experiences and basically gets you stuck there. This includes Self and no-self and dependent origination or whatever. They are all limitations to what may be revealed in one's experience. I'm not saying they are true or untrue. But the mind saying anything in those lines is bound to be a limitation. You will probably disagree because you worship Thusness's experiences like it's a religion, a fact set in stone, but Thusness is only sharing what has been seen by him so far and there only seem to be these "stages" because they were when the mind decided, "hey this is it, this is how it is." I doubt he believes what he knows now is an ultimate truth or the structure of reality or whatever. Has he experienced beyond the body and the mind? I'm not talking about concentration states, but literally beyond the physical realm. These so called "realizations" are revealed to the mind with the deepening of direct awareness experiences and not the other way around. Like how you can see the process of attachment and karmic functioning happening in your head when presence becomes clearer. So to say Self, no-self, impermanence are "realizations" is a problem because when one's vision ultimately deepens is when these realizations are loosened and everything is again seen directly. So the base must be presence. One cannot say to have experienced what thusness calls anatta without presence. The mental understanding of anatta may get you to direct presence, but it is not the same. That's why discussions like this are almost always detrimental because it is with the head-mind we are trying to conceptualize reality. It feeds the mind's tendencies to finalize, an almost opposite reaction to what you are really looking for.

Sorry, I guess I exaggerated a bit what you wrote. So Osho's eyes revealed potential demons in people? I'm really interested if that's the case. Can you share an experience or a source where you got this from?

So have you experienced oneness with all animate beings? And seen the "Source" you will be returning to? Like, are you able to shift you vibrational level to a degree outside yourself to include others to know that we are One dreamer?

Can you elaborate on quantum consciousness or "akashic" records? Do you have experience with them?

you mean osho's eyes turned people into demons?

Haha! Thanks. What were the sanyassins like? Did they all scream really loud every day too? I actually wanted to see if anyone on thetaobums met with him. I personally like Osho and find his teachings valuable. It really doesn't bother me that he was drug dependent. Or left a bunch of weird egotistical followers. He meant to provoke. On another note, are you around melbourne? If you are, I highly recommend attending this: http://australia.innerengineering.com/ (also, wouldn't mind a feedback. )

Have you experienced this? Did you experience my consciousness as "One" with my own?