terry

you are an apologist for unwarranted, repulsive and inappropriate hate speech... islamophobes are painting one of the worlds greatest religions black... I refuse to defend islam as it stands on its own, but I can't stand by and participate in dialog involving hate speech without calling it out... the usual thing is to take a lot of awful biblical quotations out of mothballs and point out how violent the ancients were...that doubles the offense... this sort of islamophobia green lights horrible discrimination and people are dying due to this sort of ignorance receiving currency as though it weren't beyond the pale in any legitimate discussion of religion... it got trump elected... it will get us all killed, not just the ones marginalized and dehumanized...like the jews in the last century, they are scapegoats and lightning rods for western self hatred...unlike the jews, there are 1.7 billion muslims and more every day... soon hundreds of millions of poor bangladeshis will try to escape the effects of climate change through migration and hatred will become a tsunami...westerners will encourage india to take a hardline...nuke them... they're not human, not like us; they're muslims... if pakistan or syria were in europe or christian, they would get some assistance...

still thinking about the causes of islamophobia... In freudian,, western psychoanalytic terms it amounts to penis envy...powerless, inadequate, frightened, insecure and needing someone to blame desperately because being oneself is so hard... strawberry fields forever! and keep your cotton picking hands off of my patch... there is a blindness to the righteous karma of reverse colonialism, and the need to replace all these old haoles anyway with vigorous new blood... rumi gives us the image of an effeminate eunuch who owns a beautiful slave girl...he can sell her to buy kohl and rouge and perfumes, in order to pursue his own pleasures, but he cannot use her in the natural way, only pass her on to someone suficiently virile... of course, there's no such thing as being a little bit castrated...

Old argument, goes back at least to zeno. Zeno had an orchard, and caught a thief stealing his apples, and proceeded to beat him.The thief protested that if all things were god's will, then he should not been punished for stealing fruit. Zeno replied, if all things were god's will, the thief shouldn't complain of being beaten for his theft.

one love (bob marley) One love, one heart Let's get together and feel all right Hear the children crying (One love) Hear the children crying (One heart) Sayin', "Give thanks and praise to the Lord and I will feel all right." Sayin', "Let's get together and feel all right." Whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa Let them all pass all their dirty remarks (One love) There is one question I'd really love to ask (One heart) Is there a place for the hopeless sinner Who has hurt all mankind just to save his own? Believe me One love, one heart Let's get together and feel all right As it was in the beginning (One love) So shall it be in the end (One heart) Alright, "Give thanks and praise to the Lord and I will feel all right." "Let's get together and feel all right." One more thing Let's get together to fight this Holy Armageddon (One love) So when the Man comes there will be no, no doom (One song) Have pity on those whose chances grow thinner There ain't no hiding place from the Father of Creation Sayin', "One love, one heart Let's get together and feel all right." I'm pleading to mankind (One love) Oh, Lord (One heart) Whoa. Give thanks and praise to the Lord and I will feel all right. Let's get together and feel all right. Give thanks and praise to the Lord and I will feel all right. Let's get together and feel all right.

Of course, I knew you would say this. When moses went out into the desert and opened his heart, he saw god in a burning bush. To the materialist, there was no god, just a cresoste fire. Moses made up the whole thing to retrospectively justify his acts. I can't even mention jesus whose acts are nonsensical and whose personality is a joke. Muhammed pointedly never claimed to do any miracles or be personally divine, exactly the contrary (quran 18:110): Say [O Prophet]: "I am but a mortal man like all of you. It has been revealed unto me that your God is the One and Only God. Hence, whoever looks forward [with hope and awe] to meeting his Sustainer [on Judgment Day], let him do righteous deeds, and let him not ascribe unto anyone or anything a share in the worship due to his Sustainer!" It is god who justified mohammed. The inner meaning, the ta'wil, is that there is no muhammed, no terry, no bindi, just god. We are "alone with the alone." (corbin) There is no god but god. The jihad, the holy war, is against one's own nafs, one's own soul or ego or personality or putative liver of life. The fundamental delusion is that there is a world out there and a person in here. The inner meaning of the quran - that is, of god's word - reveals that there is no world out there and no person in here. Your god is one god. Omar khayyam: Alike for those who for To-day prepare, And those that after some To-morrow stare, A Muezzin from the Tower of Darkness cries "Fools! your Reward is neither Here nor There.” Again, I am giving you credit here for being a rational being with a heart and mind that may be reached by truth. Of course, that is giving you way too much credit, so let us try to understand whence comes your racist, xenophobic hatred for all that is good in the world, ie islam. Submission to god. The tendency, honestly, is to oppose hatred with hatred. What a bad person you are to deny god and disrespect god's lovers and friends. But... Coming from a medical background, we tend to set aside the moral dimension of evil and treat it as an illness. And you, friend bindi, are not the only person suffering from this illness. People who feel stuck in a life they hate and are unwilling to take personal responsibility for lifting themselves higher turn to jealousy, envy and hatred to compensate for their inadequacy. Because of this, the average westerner facing a failing and spiritually deadening and unrewarding culture of capitalist growth in a rapidly warming, overpopulated world which won't tolerate it, turns to simple minded hate of change and nostalgia for 'returning to normal' or repeating an idyllic nonexistent past. These modern westerners have a totally bankrupt religion and when they look within they see only a chilling emptiness of artificial intelligence and mechanical existence. Unwilling to admit that what is socially acceptable in their culture is utterly unsustainable and bad for them and the planet, unwilling to accept the necessity for change stemming from an imploding way of living, they cast about for someone to vent their negative emotions on in a way that will be accepted by those they slavishly imitate and submit to, their influencers. They are easy prey for people who will stoke any hatred to achieve power. Seeing friends and neighbors succumb to hatred they gleefully give in to base instincts, and deny that anyone has any true religion. They may even become footsoldiers in the culture wars, helping to stoke hatred until one day they find themselves hacking off their neighbors arms and legs with machetes by the millions. You islamophobes are jealous and envious of people who don't have to hate themselves for being devils. Poor, non-white, religious, subsistence farmers are your real muslims. Your average pious wealthy muslim feels a solidarity with these basic peasant human muslims that you cannot even imagine. The average muslim meets a westerner and wants to talk about religion and is astonished to find that the average so-called christian knows little of their own scriptures and rarely prays. Muslims have a rich deep spiritual life that westerners hate because it exposes their own hypocrisy and pretenses and inner poverty. The west is destroying the planet in their greed, and the people who want to deny that find islamophobia a handy diversion and route to power. The global war on islam was entirely a power grab by the neocons, an ongoing coup that has destroyed democracy in america and indeed the world and is bringing us tyrants all over the globe. A dylan says, In ceremonies of the horseman, Even the pawn must hold a grudge. So, my friend, try thinking for yourself and not being such a tool. And that's not even talking about inner meanings, even the outer meanings are wrong and you should change. Recognize racism, bigotry and hatred and stop supporting them. For your own sake if not ours. terry

When my rich businessman son went on the haj a few years ago, the last little desert jumper into mecca had him sitting next to a woman who had never seen a seat belt before. They did not have a common language, and showing her with his belt didn't work, so he finally buckled it for her. And they smiled.

Now I see how, on a forum dedicated to mysticism, there is no sufi section. Even though sufis are the most numerous, influential and commonly known mystics in world history as well as currently. Who would have expected such xenophobia and racism from those interested in enlightenment and mystic love? I'm reminded of my college days at oregon straight in corn valley. Most of those country boys had never seen a black or a muslim and literally did not know how to act or what to say. They would just stare and my friends would feel as though in a goldfish bowl or zoo cage. Get to playing poker and drinking beer and we're all buddies in no time. If you guys sat down in any normal situation with any ordinary muslim your judgmental attitudes would melt away like summer frost. If you worked in the trenches for awhile with people of different color or caste you would soon recognize your common humanity. Without this sense of true brotherhood, which is in essence to recognize the common fatherhood of god, you know nothing of mysticism and resemble the hindoos feeling the elephant.

No sufi who actually becomes a mystic leaves islam. This should be obvious. Sufis are not hated by muslims. Hatred and anger are not condoned by islam. (sigh)

"host organism" I kind of like it. Beats being a consumer.

It does not seem far-fetched at all in america, where abortion is criminalized by flaming fundamentalist catholic supreme court judges even for ten year old incest rape victims. Of course they are total hypocrites, see football moron herschel walker's well funded senate campaign in georgia. America's supreme court allows churches to ignore public health restrictions and will legitimize homophobia soon in the name of religion, rolling back more rights. It is illegal for children in florida public schools to say the word gay or speak of gay parents siblings or relatives. Books are being banned for telling the historical truth and I would not be surprised to see books literally burned. Including qurans, no doubt, if they can find any.

No, nunchuks, it is the anti-islqmic hate speech that has no place in any public forum and is especially reprehensible here. I agree it is a major turn off to new members.

Reminds me of trump talking about mexican immigrants as rapists and murderetrs, "Some, I suppose, are good people." Mighty white of ya, trump.

Waste of time quoting the quran to me. The text is fifteen humdred years old. Muhammed was a desert raider who murdered, stole and raped for a living. Similar to a modern capitalist. One time as related in the quran muhammed was fighting a battle with men of inferior religion. On the point of defeat, he asked a respite to pray, and his proud foe granted it. Muhammed bent down, picked up a handful of dirt, and threw it in the eyes of his enemy, renewed the battle, and prevailed. Afterward he felt bad about it, and god told him, "Ye did not throw when ye threw." God took the responsibility on himself, and absolved muhammed. So He recited in the quran 8:17 And you did not kill them, but it was Allah who killed them. And you threw not, [O Muhammad], when you threw, but it was Allah who threw that He might test the believers with a good test. Indeed, Allah is Hearing and Knowing. This text is often repeated by sufis because it epitomizes the inner meaning of the quran, the batin as opposed to the zahir which is the exoteric meaning. As in xtianity, there are fanatical evil people who take the literal meaning of the law (sharia) and insist on it being the only meaning. Such people are a minority but being evil they hunger for power; it is proverbial that the devil loves to quote scripture. Muhammed made it clear that the quran should be read on deeper levels. The hadith says there are seven meanings for each verse, but the saints say there are infinite meanings and that the believer should understand each verse anew every time it is read. You, bindi, have been tested and have failed. You love the fruit and hate the tree, or love the tree and hate the fruit. You are a warrior for hate and division. I could explain the esoteric meaning of every verse but you would understand me exactly as much as a spoon understands the taste of soup. I'm giving you credit here for having the potential to hear the truth and cop to it. Perhaps you are a saul on your way to mecca and becoming an islamic paul. Try reading the lovng and spiritual verses and cleansing your heart. It is not you throwing stones at god, the compassionate, the merciful, but god herself. I meditate twice a day and nearly always recite this surah: 113. Surah Al-Falaq (The Daybreak) In the name of God, the Gracious, the Merciful. 1. Say, “I take refuge with the Lord of Daybreak. 2. From the evil of what He created. 3. And from the evil of the darkness as it gathers. 4. And from the evil of those who practice sorcery. 5. And from the evil of an envious when he envies.”

the opening words of the Poemandres, the first text of the Corpus Hermeticum: Upon a time while my mind was meditating on the things that are, my thought was raised to a great height, while the physical senses of my body were held back—just as are the senses of men who are heavy with sleep after a large meal, or from fatigue of body. I thought I heard a Being more than vast—in size beyond all bounds—called out my name and say: "What wouldst thou hear and see, and what hast thou in mind to learn and know?" And I said: "Who art thou?" He answered: "I am Shepherd of Men, Mind of all-Masterhood; I know what thou desirest and I am with thee everywhere." And I replied: "I long to learn the things that are, and comprehend their nature, and know God. This (I said) is what I desire to hear." He answered me: "Hold in thy mind all thou wouldst know, and I will teach thee." And with these words His aspect changed; and straightway, in the twinkling of an eye, all things were opened to me. And I saw a limitless Vision: all things turned into Light—sweet, joyous Light. And I became transported as I gazed.... (Poemandres, v.1-4)

The Emerald Tablet of Hermes Trismegistus – (Mystery of the Ether & Gnosis of All) trans sir isaac newton 1. Tis true without error, certain & most true. 2. That which is below is like that which is above & that which is above is like that which is below to do the miracles of one only thing. 3. And as all things have been & arose from one by the mediation of one: so all things have their birth from this one thing by adaptation. 4. The Sun is its father, the moon its mother, the wind hath carried it in its belly, the earth is its nurse. 5. The father of all perfection in the whole world is here. 6. Its force or power is entire if it be converted into earth. 7. Separate thou the earth from the fire, the subtle from the gross sweetly with great industry. 8. It ascends from the earth to the heaven & again it descends to the earth & receives the force of things superior & inferior. 9. By this means you shall have the glory of the whole world 10. & thereby all obscurity shall fly from you. 11. Its force is above all force. For it vanquishes every subtle thing & penetrates every solid thing. 12. So was the world created. 13. From this are & do come admirable adaptations whereof the means (or process) is here in this. Hence I am called Hermes Trismegist, having the three parts of the philosophy of the whole world. 14. That which I have said of the operation of the Sun is accomplished & ended.