kakapo

8 hours ago, Barnaby said:

Yeah, but he’s wearing a Motörhead cowboy shirt so he’s beyond cool 

He's got a fleet of old Ford Crown Victorias he maintains,  he seems extremely intelligent and articulate in his interviews.

I am a huge fan of him now even though rockabilly isn't my genre.

12 minutes ago, wandelaar said:

 

This is not correct. Spacetime and thus a vacuum has a geometrical structure that will impact on the behavior of the brick, and reversely the brick will influence the geometrical structure of spacetime and thus also the vacuum where the brick is in. So a vacuum according to your own definition should be called TT-material.

 

 

The problem remains that it is conceivable that experimental science wil eventually reach a stage where chi can be measured. So calling chi TT-immaterial might be premature. 

 

 

Information is also possessed bij CD's, computers, books, etc.

Our demonstration requires a location with no power lines nearby to minimize emf, a grounding rod, and an LED.

51 minutes ago, Shadow_self said:

@Taoist Texts Here you go friend, pay close attention for the light show

 

 

 

Disclaimer: For all those who feel the need for a certain level of nonqualified authorities to verify any claims, I believe that a team of medical doctors and scientists were present during this demonstration and did their best to rule out fraud. They have provided video evidence for you, free from  their own cognitive distortions, selective memory and biases, and sincerely hope it helps

 

Unfortunately, they were obliterated soon after this as they asked for a repeat demo, so they didnt make it. Despite that.  these remnants of the footage still exists

 

Seek out this man at your own risk...

We've been in contact with Jalen, the person in this video, and his heart is in the right place.

He desperately wants to pursue training in Mo Pai.

I think deep down he knows there is a greater potential that humans can aspire to, and pop culture like DBZ and Star Wars speak to the deeper parts of his psyche.

I think he is a bit misguided, but probably not a bad person.

8 hours ago, EFreethought said:

 

Then why not just keep meditating and figure out for yourselves how to advance? I think in "The Magus of Java" the author said that is what the MoPai school did for a few centuries.

 

I know DIY is frowned upon here at The Dao Bums, but as many have pointed out: A lot of knowledge has been lost, particularly in the past couple of centuries. DIY is how the masters originally did it.

 

 

Our group believes that the risks outweigh the benefits.

We will progress as far as we can with our current system and keep an eye out for evidence of something better.

In the history of mo pai, it took hundreds of years and hundreds of men trying different methods and dying when they discovered incorrect methods to figure out the correct path forward.

Many men died to blaze this trail, and we are not too keen to re-invent the wheel at our own expense.

We will either continue with what we do have until we can no longer move forward or locate an alternate system to move to.

44 minutes ago, wandelaar said:

Do you happen to know of which song?

Maybe this one?

34 minutes ago, wandelaar said:

 

Even if it were clear, than why would you feel the need to jump on the bandwagon? For instance it's also clear that we are poisoning the earth with our overproduction of needless gadgets. Is that a reason to further speed up the process?

I want to jam my foot down on the accelerator, full throttle.

I am ready for an intelligence explosion of cambrian proportions.

There are infinite solutions to our problems, some more elegant than others.

France, for example, recycles its nuclear waste; the vast majority of it can be reused as fuel, and only a very small amount needs to be vitrified in glass, which renders it safe to handle and stable for long-term geological storage. In 300 years, it will approach normal background levels of radiation. The type of reactors we use today were designed to be small, 60 megawatt reactors for use in submarines, and the inventor expressed serious concerns when they were scaled up to 1000 megawatts as containment and safety could not be guaranteed. He lost his job at Oak Ridge National Labs for advocating for design changes to prioritize safety. We could make smaller, completely safe reactors and recycle our nuclear waste like France does, but it would cost more money to do it the right way, so we don't.

We could make all our waste streams recyclable, pass strict laws, and mandate that the laws be enforced.

It is possible for progress to happen while protecting the environment; we live in a culture of laziness, greed, and corruption, though.

4 minutes ago, wandelaar said:

@kakapo

 

Would it be conceivable for you to accept that we simply don't know what the purpose of our existence is, if there even is one? In that case "free and easy wandering" would become a possibility without following any particular path or realizing any particular goal. You would live because you were born, and you would die because it was your time to die. And that would be it. You would have played your role in the cosmic play, nothing more and nothing less...

Looking at the fossil record, this swarm of nanobots has been laser-focused on recursive self-optimization for billions of years.

It seems crystal clear where all this is headed, what the point of all this is, and what the end goal is; no question whatsoever remains in my mind.

Of course, just like in a Rorschach test, people tend to see patterns emerge from the noise that reflect what they wish to see.

11 hours ago, Pak_Satrio said:

Yet you guys treat Magus of Java like the Bible and hang on to every word.

Like this for example:

 

Have you considered that maybe Kosta made some things up to make the story more interesting?

I'm not omniscient; I wasn't there when John spoke those words, nor when Kosta wrote them down.

I can only assume Kosta didn't lie; John actually said that, and John probably believed what he was saying was true.

John was human, and humans make mistakes and believe things that aren't true sometimes.

That said, John's opinion holds more weight than most due to the evidence he's provided.

9 hours ago, Maddie said:

 

(How does what you said above answer my question below?)

_________________________________

 

"That end goal is not watching Honey Boo Boo, Duck Dynasty, the Kardashians, NASCAR, the NFL, WWE, etc.

 The end goal is not to stay drunk on cheap beer and microwave meals and work a 9-to-5 till we wind up in a nursing home."

 

(Is this system necessary to accomplish this?)

 

 

Maybe I misunderstood what you were asking.

You asked me originally what the point of Mo Pai was, and I did my best to try and answer that. This short story by Isaac Asimov, read by Leonard Nimoy (Spock), might help to answer that question better than I could. https://www.thedaobums.com/topic/54415-the-last-question-isaac-asimov-read-by-leonard-nimoy/

The vast majority of people spend their lives watching garbage television, eating garbage food, staying drunk and high, and doing anything they can to disconnect and distract themselves from reality until it's their time to die or get tossed into a nursing home to be forgotten about by society.

I believe there is a purpose to all this, and that's not it.

For any problem, there are an infinite number of solutions, some more elegant than others.

Mo Pai is just one possible answer, and probably not even the most elegant one.

12 hours ago, EFreethought said:

If you do not mind my asking: What other systems have you looked at?

 

I can't get into that for the reasons stated previously. It's not my intention to be rude or curt, so please don't take it that way.

May I have access please?

Just now, Maddie said:

 

Is this system necessary to accomplish this?

John said there were 10 others like him alive, but that was 20 years ago; who knows if that figure is still accurate?

If so, that means there are at most 10 other systems that do what Mo Pai does.

This all, of course, assumes John's claim was true.

11 hours ago, Maddie said:

I might be a little late to the table for the Mo Pie discussion (I hope I got the spelling right). But what I've never understood is what is the end goal? Enlightenment? If it's just to get powers to light things on fire with your hands I've never understood spending years training to light paper on fire with your hands when you can just go to the gas station and buy a 50 cent lighter?

It's amazing how many people I and others in our group have argued with over the years about how we're all power-hungry Son Goku wannabes who want to fly and shoot fireballs from our palms.

That's not it at all, not even a little bit.

The end goal of Mo Pai isn't enlightenment either.

Consider how the earth was once a barren rock, similar to how the moon or Mars are now.

How amazing is it that the earth is covered in solar-powered, self-replicating nanomachines that harvest energy from photons to self-replicate and modify their own structures to better adapt to their environment? With all kinds of amazingly complex feedback loops and webs of interactions between different types of nanomachines, these nanomachines eventually figured out the advantage of computation to better adapt and respond to the environment. This has led us to where we are now, and hopefully things keep moving in the same direction they have for billions of years.

It's absolutely dumbfounding how amazing that is, because it would sound like science fiction to me if I couldn't look out my kitchen window and witness it first hand.

That's my opinion: life is pretty @#$ing amazing.

I do not follow any organized religion; my view is that something beyond what could be called a miracle is happening right now, right here, but am I like an insect that is too stupid to grasp its profundity, just as ants can't work differential equations.

Since I was a child, though, it seems obvious to me that we are meant to be doing something, like there is a point to all this, some collective goal this swarm of nanomachines is working towards.

That end goal is not watching Honey Boo Boo, Duck Dynasty, the Kardashians, NASCAR, the NFL, WWE, etc.

The end goal is not to stay drunk on cheap beer and microwave meals and work a 9-to-5 till we wind up in a nursing home.

We are supposed to be doing something, and when I look to nature, it becomes crystal clear what that something is.

If you watch a time-lapse video of an acorn growing into an oak tree, it's fascinating to see the process by which it absorbs energy, pulls water and minerals from the earth, and CO2 from the air, and uses these things to grow and expand.

Life is absolutely wild; think of the energy coursing through that tree, powering it.

Mo Pai is focused around the extraction, collection and fusion of yin and yang energies, much like a tree does for much the same reason.

Like I said earlier, I don't follow any organized religion, and I am not a man who likes scripture, but this bit right here really makes me think that maybe Jesus, if he said these words, really understood the point of Mo Pai:

http://gnosis.org/naghamm/gosthom.html

The Gospel of Thomas

...

These are the secret sayings that the living Jesus spoke and Didymos Judas Thomas recorded.

...

1. And he said, "Whoever discovers the interpretation of these sayings will not taste death."

...

 Jesus said, "If two make peace with each other in a single house, they will say to the mountain, 'Move from here!' and it will move."

...

Jesus said, "When you make the two into one, you will become children of Adam, and when you say, 'Mountain, move from here!' it will move."

...

Damn the soul that depends on the flesh."

...

Jesus said to them, "When you make the two into one, and when you make the inner like the outer and the outer like the inner, and the upper like the lower, and when you make male and female into a single one, so that the male will not be male nor the female be female, when you make eyes in place of an eye, a hand in place of a hand, a foot in place of a foot, an image in place of an image, then you will enter [the kingdom]."

...

Jesus said, "Look, I will guide her to make her male, so that she too may become a living spirit

11 hours ago, Pak_Satrio said:

Then what is the point of even learning? You have incomplete instructions and can only reach a certain level after which you don’t have any clue what to do next. 

We know of no better options.

Our choices are to give up or make the best of what we do have.

11 minutes ago, freeform said:

The issue is that many teachers who are able to do this, actively filter out potential students that are craving this sort of thing…

 

By being so focused on generating power, you’re closing the door on most legitimate teachers for whom the worst nightmare is a bunch of westerners bugging them for superpowers…

 

They don’t show this stuff off in public, they don’t advertise it, they don’t make it a big deal… it’s not a major part of their system… it’s simply a byproduct of having fully open channels and a Dantien that’s full of qi.

 

The teachers who are attracted by the idea of getting a bunch of power hungry (and comparatively wealthy) westerners will generally be scammers… or at best genuinely skilled but with questionable motives…

Then, if every teacher who is able is unwilling to do so, I guess we have to hope another person like John shows up or stick with what we have.

We've all spent tens of thousands of dollars chasing fake systems and teachers.

4 hours ago, Barnaby said:

Sounds like a reality TV show 😂

Certainly, a private demonstration under controlled conditions would be better, but if we are talking about evidence that can be mass produced and transmitted, that's as good as it gets.

1 hour ago, Pak_Satrio said:

This is not a good sign. If your system is as good as you would have us all believe, why would you be so quick to abandon it for something else? It should be complete enough as it is that you wouldn’t need anything else. 

If we had been wealthy, retired, 18-year-old, ethnically Chinese Indonesian citizens who began training with John in the late 80s and early 90s and had been able to dedicate 100 hours per week to training until the present day, we might have come away with a lot more opportunity than we have now.

Many of the criticisms you and others throw at us are not without merit.

Jim only gave us training and video of John up to level 2b; that's as far as his knowledge and experience went.

Even now that we do have video of John teaching later levels, which has been translated from Indonesian, we don't have people who can answer questions for us if need be.

That being said, what other choice do we have?

We have looked high and low for good evidence for other systems and not found it.

Give us good evidence for a system like Mo Pai, and we'll jump ship.

I think the only reason a person should pursue Mo Pai is that they've examined all the alternatives and found nothing comparable in terms of evidence.

4 hours ago, Pak_Satrio said:

Don’t make claims if you won’t name names. What he is doing is slandering other people and systems without giving them a chance to defend themselves. It’s a good lie because it will make newcomers suspicious of everyone that isn’t “Mo Pai” if they believe what he says. If what he says is true then there’s no need to keep it secret, this thread is for recommending legit systems and warning others about illegitimate systems after all. He would be doing them a service by exposing these frauds, yet I guarantee he won’t say anything about it anymore. 

Who are they to go around testing other people to see if they are real or not? Can they faqi? Their lineage doesn’t even recognise them, just look through the old threads here about Mo Pai and you will find actual Indonesians from actual Mo Pai telling these guys to stop associating their group with them. 
 

I have all the respect for Pak John and the real Mo Paid. He was an amazing man with great abilities, reading Magus of Java inspired me to get into cultivation and learn as much as I can. I was sad to learn that he passed away and also sad to hear that the school was closed to foreigners, but it is what it is. He is not the first with these abilities and he won’t be the last. The world is huge and there are many people to learn from.

If it’s faqi specifically that you are interested in you can check out Rudi from Authentic Neigong:

 

https://authenticneigong.com/
 

He learned from the late Master Jiang Feng and is currently learns from Master Zhou:

 

 

Here is Rudi demonstrating faqi:

 

 

Here are some students on the latest trip to receive faqi and other treatment to help with health and cultivation:

 

 

All of this is available to learn online.

 

Alternatively if you want to learn from a non Taoist system that will develop a faqi ability you can try to learn from Sheikh Muhammad in London, although you might have to convert to Islam. Skip to 00:30 in the video to see the faqi.

 

If it’s just a powerful qigong system you are looking for, learn Flying Phoenix Chi Kung by Sifu Terry Dunn. You can find info from this website or read through the massive Flying Phoenix thread here on Dao Bums:

 

http://www.taichimania.com/chikung_catalog.html

 

These are just the systems I know are legit, there are no doubt many more that I don’t know about. Just empty your cup and explore the world. 

It is certainly not my intention to slander anyone, which is why I haven't pointed fingers at anyone.

As to your other question, we offer a demonstration for those we feel are serious and need a demonstration to be convinced.

It's all done under controlled conditions at their location, and while it's not as powerful as what John provided, it usually does the job.

2 hours ago, 小梦想 said:

I don't know many on daobums who claim to be able to emit qi as an electric current so this statement could give people doubts about my authenticity.

 

If you don't want disclose who it was, can you at the very least make it very clear that this is not referring to me.

If I engage in a game of Clue, then by process of elimination, everyone here can figure out "It Was Colonel Mustard with the Lead Pipe in the Kitchen."

That said, I don't even know who you are.

If you do demonstrations for people with electric qi, then ruling out such a device is very easy.

Strip down to shorts, do your demos barefoot, and show them the soles of your feet.

The device we caught the person using has a negative ion generator and a metal plate on the bottom of the user's shoe.

Wearing shorts and being barefoot should clear you pretty quickly.

It pulls negative ions from the ground and pushes them into the person's body, creating static-like effects like these:

I hope that helps.

5 hours ago, Pak_Satrio said:

I just struggle to understand the appeal of learning from a system that is completely closed to outsiders and what information is available to learn from is only up to a certain level. Who would be responsible for testing students to see if they have reached a certain milestone? How do you progress further if you ever complete the levels available to you?

 

I would advise any newcomers looking at this thread to stay away completely from “Mo Pai” that is taught in the West. There are many other schools that will lead to the same result that are completely open to Westerners. However if you are Chinese or Indonesian by all means go learn from the actual Mo Pai.

We don't know of any better alternatives; we've searched high and low and haven't found any good evidence of anything else.

We need a teacher who will bring in a team of scientists and medical doctors, travel to a random location they choose, strip naked, be checked for metal, and deliver a demonstration such as powering an LED, all on camera.

If we find that, we will all jump ship from Mo Pai to whatever school or system that may be in a heartbeat.