Sir Darius the Clairvoyent

One heartbreaking one: One for the mesoamericans: Archaeologists have uncovered a 4,000-year-old network of earthen canals in present-day Belize, shedding light on the early inhabitants of the Yucatán Peninsula who preceded the ancient Maya civilization. https://www-vg-no.translate.goog/nyheter/i/B0zno9/arkeologer-har-oppdaget-4000-aar-gamle-fiskekanaler-i-mellom-amerika?_x_tr_sl=no&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=no&_x_tr_pto=wapp And one closer to home: “Bronze Age and Viking Age societies in the Nordic countries were very similar,” Kristiansen says. The most striking resemblance was that both were maritime societies. https://www.sciencenorway.no/archaeology-bronze-age-ships/was-there-a-viking-age-in-norway-2000-years-before-the-vikings/1698522

I find it interesting. Don’t know about you guys, but would a thread sharing finds be of interest? Disturbing find in Bronze Age britain https://www-vg-no.translate.goog/nyheter/i/93G62E/grotesk-funn-fra-bronsealderen-i-britisk-massegrav?_x_tr_sl=no&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=no&_x_tr_pto=wapp this was published today. I doesn’t provide a lot of information, but I wonder if it’s related to the arrival of the bell beakers, based on the timing. A few others: https://www-forskning-no.translate.goog/arkeologi-dna/nye-analyser-viser-at-ismannen-otzi-holdt-pa-a-bli-skallet-og-hadde-morkere-hud-enn-forskerne-trodde/2243804?_x_tr_sl=no&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=no&_x_tr_pto=wapp New info on Ötzi the iceman Bronze Age Scandinavian society linked to secret society: https://www.rockartscandinavia.com/images/articles/a20chacon.pdf Remarkable New Evidence for Human Activity in North America 130,000 Years Ago https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/new-evidence-human-activity-north-america-130000-years-ago-180963046/

Yes, Ill edit it now : )

In this spesific case, it is about an alternative form of "punishment" to prison, where people get help getting their economy in order, learn skills, develop a network etc. Problem is, it is hard nut to crack, to attract people with capital without being able to offer them an return on investment.

rainiest city in Europe my friend. Thanks to the people of the southern hemisphere for keeping us somewhat sane during three months without sunlight:

(This will not be completely PC, but I’ll back up the more sensitive issues with references) The standard narrative Humans left Africa around 80-60k years ago. Nothing much happened until agriculture developed 9-6k years ago, culminating with the first civilization: Sumer. Agriculture then, suppousedly developed independently in the America’s, Indus Valley and China as well (and a few possible other candidates. Humans didn’t move around much, but tech and culture spread primarily through trade. People willingly adopted agriculture as it was somehow superior to a hunter gatherer lifestyle, and then then the ball just kept rolling: and here we are, peak civ and high art: (A little bit of a straw man, but in essence, I believe there is some truth to it). Reconsidering the past of our spieces During the 1800s, Homo sapiens were belived to be around 10.000-20.000 years old. During the middle of the 20th century, this got pushed back to ca. 50.000 years, due to the discovery of cro magnons and Neanderthals. At this point, humans were belived to have evolved primarily or exclusively in Europe. From between the 60s-80s, this got pushed back to 130.000 - 200.000 years ago, based on some archeological and genetic evidence, and this time we our ancestral home got put to east africa, Ethiopia in particular. Finds such as Jerbel Irhound, pushed this even further back, this time 300.000 years in Marocco. Humans suppousedly left Africa about 60.000 years ago. Scholars such as David Reich, no believe that there has been multiple migrations both out and in of Africa. One piece of evidence supporting this, is that Homo sapiens Ydna replaced the Neanderthal one, at least 100.000 years ago (1). Further more, we know that humans lived all over eurasia for at least a million years. In addition to this, we keep discovering new spieces: denisovians, homo florencis, naledi and so on (2). There have also been fascinating evidence suggesting humans might have lived in the America’s as far back as 120.000 years ago (3). Allthough consensus remains that human evolution mostly took part in Africa, this has become way more nuanced over the last few years, and Eurasia has increasingly been seen as a major player in human evolution. Instead of looking at human evolution as a tree, we should view it more of a weave. The most obvious proof of this is the fact that all non Africans carry 2-4% Neanderthal dna. According to Reich, the number of Neanderthal ancestors might be as high as 10-20% (note: percentage of ancestors ≠ amount of dna). We also know that some populations carry dna from speicies so far unknown (ghost populations). «According to a study published in 2020, there are indications that 2% to 19% (or about ≃6.6 and ≃7.0%) of the DNA of four West African populations may have come from an unknown archaic hominin which split from the ancestor of Sapiens (Modern Humans) and Neanderthals between 360 kya to 1.02 mya.» (4) The cognitive revolution, if it indeed is real, didn’t take place until 40.000 years ago. Population replacements - tech, culture and language traveled primarily with people, not trough trade I’ll stick to Europe as it’s what I am most familiar with, but believe me, there is plenty of material. 400.000-40.000 yo neanderthals 45.000-40.000 yo anatomical modern humans 40.000-26.000 yo aurognacians 30.000 - 20.000 yo gravettians 20.000 yo - 10.000 yo western hunter gatherers 10.000-5.000 anatolion farmers 5.000 yo - indo europeans Allthough all Europeans are a mix of the three latter, to various degree, the change was far from peaceful (5). Long distance, human travel Here are a few, confirmed ones, prior Columbus: - polynesia to South America - the silk road - Vikings in the America’s - closely related individuals has been found as far apart as Hungary and Mongolia during the Bronze Age (was unable to find the study, ref Reich). - the aboriginal Australians, 50k years ago - relatively modern explores (such has Heyerdahl) has shown that cross ocean travel was fairly straight foward with relative primitive tech The younger dryas Was an apologolypatic event; I quote from wiki: This coincides with to extremely interesting events: goebekli Tepe and Plato’s date for Atlantis. Goebleki tepe was deliberately buried. Before this, there has been found zero, recognized evidence of civilization. So… is it time to reconsider the standard narrative? Facts, legend and narrative My argument goes along the lines of this: weather it is based on fact or not, humans put them into a narrative regardless. Let’s take the foundation stories of Norway, the US and Israel. They all probally contain some degree of truth, and a lot of exaggeration. But does it really matter whether Harald Fairhair got rejected by a woman who didn’t want to marry a petty king, so he decided to not cut his hair until he united all of Norway? To me it doesn’t. Further more, I believe myth and stories contain a lot of truth in a deeper sense. (1) https://www.science.org/content/article/how-neanderthals-lost-their-y-chromosome (2) https://www.theguardian.com/science/2023/nov/18/where-did-other-human-species-go-vanished-ancestors-homo-sapiens-neanderthals-denisovans (3) https://www.sciencenews.org/article/first-settlers-reached-americas-130000-years-ago-study-claims (4) https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC7015685/ (5) https://sciencenews.dk/en/100-ancient-skeletons-reveal-dramatic-turnover-of-denmarks-population https://www.independent.co.uk/news/science/archaeology/stonehenge-neolithic-britain-history-ancestors-plague-archaeology-beaker-people-a8222341.html https://www.newscientist.com/article/2180923-every-man-in-spain-was-wiped-out-4500-years-ago-by-hostile-invaders/

Sure we can, anything on your mind? A few topics that fascinates me, proto indo euro, comparative and pagan influences on Christianity. But these are huge and though questions. We should prob make another thread tho, so make one about whatever you’d like to discuss and I’ll see if I got something to contribute.

My friend, I welcome you to try a year in Norway and you’ll know for sure that it does ahhaha.

I mean, all old stories which we have lost the cultural connection to sound weirds.

Probally. We say mannen PÅ (on) the moon tho. I believe there is a unique Germanic version of this as well, due to the phrase being so common in these languages (as well as how well it flows), all though I am aware it exists elsewhere as well.

1. åkerspenna, Norway, approx 500 ad 2. Sutton hop helmet, England 3 finnestorp buckle, ca 500 sweden 4. first artifact with the word Odin engraved on it, Denmark 5. somewhere in England 6. beserker, Sweden All these are asscociated with Odin due to the ravens, the beserker theme and and one eyed ness on the helmet, Odin sacrificing his eye and again, the beserker/wild hunt theme. Also, Odin is also accosiated with spears. Odin is also known as the hanged god, or god of the hanged, and likewise hanged from a tree: Odin's Quest after the Runes (havamal) Consider the facial similarities. Where are you based? The danish show gåten om Odin (the enigma of Odin) is available at both DR as well as NRK, and id assume SVT as well. Its pretty good.

You know, the futhark fell out of use around a millennia ago, mind helping me out?

There is a lot of BS on YT, but also a lot of good. Here, I thought we could share some gold. Speaking for myself, it is my fav form of media. I’ll start with this one:

I do. hallucinations.

The man on the moon is an interesting one. Anyone done any research?

@Sir Darius the Clairvoyent (or rather, Viggo Johansen) @stirling @Nungali @Cobie So first of all, I shouldve been more clear. The foreword was as mentioned for meditations by Aurelius. But the context of that particular qoutation, was, can something written by the most powerfull man, 2000 years ago, be relevant to us today? Therefore the question of what it means to be human. @stirling I agree with you @Nungali Yes, it was also intented towards materilaism/mentalism. Or wheter the physical is a construct of mental, or visa versa. I feel quite convinced that the mental is primary. Reason being, we know that the mental can create appearantly physical phenoma, while we have no clue how a bunch of no concious cells can turn into a conciouss being. Id like to open a third alternative tho. What if the world is neither physical nor mental, but that the physical and mental is fundementally the same substance?

I’ll check the book, but I’d like to know, what do you think this «whatever it is» is?

You know what… reminds me of basically every fairytale im familiar with.

Haha yes, and it all took place in the no lands of America. «IM NOT GAY» «Early account of Aboriginals observing a ship coming up the coast , exploring the 'new land ' . ' We saw clouds at at sea, moving along (sails ) under them was an upturned shell, like an island , it had some trees on it (masts ) then a water insect came out of it and walked across the water ( a long boat with oars ) it came up onto the beach and men got out of it ! '» This could throw a lot of light on many stories of old, I am sure. No particular comes to mind, but I’ll remember this «Second, Harpur finds in all of this a profound insight into the nature of reality, and what it is to be human» Is love to know «Second, Harpur finds in all of this a profound insight into the nature of reality, and what it is to be human.» I feel disturbed enough as it is. Im ready for being told that that dwarf I made love to in a lake was a prehistoric creature. « With Jung, Harpur argues that these are phenomena of the psyche, but that psyche is of the world, not just of us as individuals.» Familiar with sheldrake and morphic ressonance? https://www.sheldrake.org/research/morphic-resonance/introduction

How would you feel about implenting "recent posts"? Something like this:

It does. Did not know about it.

This is a big one. From your article: Cultural Christians are those who received Christian values or appreciate Christian culture. It also states that you don’t need to either believe nor disbelieve in order to be one. My take is, there is no such thing. First off: not even Christianity is purely Christian, but absorbed damn much from previous and contemporary cultures. Why is paradise a land of milk and honey for a lactose intolerant people, for instance? Curious, don’t you think. I think ideas like all being eqeul in the eyes of god and love your enemy, are both powerful, radical and fairly unique. Turn the other cheek is certainly a radical departure from Jewish scripture, which says an eye for an eye (which again can be traced back to Hammurabiat least). Maybe it can even be traced back to Adam and Eve. If you punch me, I punch you back. Sounds quite human, actually. I read an interesting segment about how some of these universal Christian values might come from stoicism as well. I’ll post it when I get home, if your interested. But then you might as well ask, where does stoicism come from? And we could go way more controversial and discuss slave morality. Further more, Christian beliefs varried way more at its start, then it does today. Which is the opposite of what you’d expect, really. Marcion was a sentral figure in early Christianity. He believed that the Jewish/ot God was not only not the same as that of the Christian. He believed OT god was the literal devil. And no, that was not a fringe belief. It’s not even THAT fringe today. Then we ofc have the canonization of the Bible. God only knows on what basis they determined what text came from the heavens and which came from the horned one. I think I am open to the idea that parts of it is divinely inspired, in some sense. But the editing, composing and canonization of it is with out a doubt in part… manipulation. Another example. Muslims for instance, value Christ enourmusly, but don’t believe in all the things Christian’s do about him. So could they be considered a another version of Christianity, in a sense?When Christianity was sold to the Scandinavians, they where sold a completely different story than that of the modern bible. Jesus was presented a some sort of warrior king. Heaven resembled that of Valhalla. Hell was a land of ice and snow, just like the Norse hel, and the literal opposite of the christen hell. As everywhere else Christianity is, it is also a mix of the original culture and the blicial faith. It’s not like Christins immediately became all holy and abandoned their old ways and stopped drinking. Not at all. Nowhere was this the case. Yet I am pretty sure they considered them self Christian, and probably also the «correct» type of christian. this is the jellingstone, and is a central part of the danish national narrative. It is even on their passport. With time it became known as Jesus at Jellingstone, but in all likely hood, it is actually Odin.. The thirty year wars is the bloodiest we in European history. It was fought between Protestants and the chatholics. That’s what I’ve been thought however, but very well might have been other interests at play as well. But think about that. The pilgrims were considered extremist by the standards of medival England. My Christianity is not the same as that of my grandmother, nor of the Mormons. Allthough we are all influenced by Christ…. I don’t think cultural Christianity is thing.

Perspectives on Time Neil Oliver begins his book Wisdom of the Ancients by reflecting on the uncertainties of our modern world. He contrasts apocalyptic warnings of catastrophe with evidence of progress: fewer people in poverty, better living conditions, increased life expectancy, and groundbreaking advancements in medicine and technology. Yet, even with these achievements, peace of mind remains elusive. In search of wisdom, Oliver turns to the past, exploring how our ancestors perceived and navigated their world. Similarly, the question of how time is understood—whether as a linear progression or as a recurring cycle—has shaped the worldviews of different cultures throughout history. Lets explore The Greek View: Hesiod’s Ages of Man Hesiod’s Works and Days presents one of the most detailed accounts of time as a sequence of ages, each with distinct characteristics and a gradual decline from an ideal past. Hesiod describes five ages: The Golden Age: Ruled by Cronos, this was a time of perfect harmony and abundance. Humans lived without toil, suffering, or conflict. The earth provided its fruits freely, and death came gently, like sleep. After their deaths, the spirits of the Golden Age became guardians of humanity. The Silver Age: This generation was less noble, characterized by immaturity and foolishness. Humans lived as children for a hundred years and showed no reverence for the gods. Zeus, angered by their impiety, ended their time. The Bronze Age: A race of warriors arose, obsessed with violence and destruction. They were hard-hearted, used bronze for tools and weapons, and left no lasting legacy, as their lives ended in self-destruction. The Heroic Age: A deviation from the pattern of decline, this age produced noble demigods who fought in legendary wars like Troy. After death, they were granted a special place in the Islands of the Blessed. The Iron Age: Hesiod’s own era, marked by toil, strife, and moral decay. In this time, envy, dishonor, and injustice prevail, and Hesiod laments the loss of virtue and harmony. This linear progression, from an idealized beginning to a degraded present, mirrors a sense of nostalgia and pessimism about humanity's trajectory. Hesiod’s narrative ends with a sense of inevitability: decline is unavoidable, and Zeus will eventually destroy even this race of men. The Norse and Indian Cycles of Time While the Greek conception of time in Hesiod's Works and Days is linear, the Norse and Indian traditions embrace a cyclical view of time, with the universe moving through repeating phases of creation, destruction, and renewal. The Norse Perspective: In Norse mythology, time begins with the creation of the world from Ymir’s body, but this harmony is temporary. Over time, chaos grows as Loki and his monstrous offspring bring strife to the gods and humanity. The world reaches its breaking point at Ragnarok, the apocalyptic battle where gods and mortals perish. However, Ragnarok is not the end. After the destruction, a new world emerges from the sea, green and fertile, and survivors live in peace. The cycle begins anew, symbolizing endless renewal. The Indian Yugas: Indian cosmology divides time into four yugas, or ages, which form a repeating cycle: Satya Yuga (Golden Age): A time of perfect virtue, harmony, and abundance. Treta Yuga (Silver Age): Moral and spiritual decline begins, and humanity must work to sustain itself. Dvapara Yuga (Bronze Age): Conflict, greed, and suffering grow. Kali Yuga (Iron Age): The current age, characterized by chaos, immorality, and decay. At the end of Kali Yuga, the universe is destroyed and then recreated, beginning a new cycle with Satya Yuga. This cyclical understanding of time reflects a belief in eternal renewal and the inevitability of change, contrasting sharply with Hesiod’s finality.' Shared Patterns Across Traditions While the specifics differ, the Greek, Norse, and Indian traditions share remarkable similarities in how they describe the epochs of time: The Ideal Beginning: All three traditions start with a Golden Age: a time of peace, abundance, and harmony. In Hesiod's Works and Days, this is the era under Cronos, where humans lived like gods. In Norse mythology, it is the initial creation, where the gods live in peace and craft beautiful things from gold. In Indian tradition, it is the Satya Yuga, a time of perfect dharma (virtue). Gradual Decline: Each tradition describes a process of degeneration. The Greeks move from the Golden to the Iron Age, marked by increasing toil and moral decay. Similarly, the Norse narrative shows harmony breaking down as chaos and conflict culminate in Ragnarok. In Indian cosmology, the yugas progress from Satya (virtue) to Kali (chaos). Violence and Strife in the Middle Ages: The Bronze Age in Hesiod’s account, the later yugas in Indian tradition, and the Norse struggles against the jotnar all highlight a period dominated by violence, conflict, and a focus on martial prowess. These ages are transitional, setting the stage for ultimate destruction or renewal. The Apocalyptic End: The Iron Age in Hesiod’s account aligns with the chaotic Kali Yuga and the Norse Ragnarok, all depicting a final collapse marked by greed, strife, and a loss of morality. Possibility of Renewal: While the Greek tradition ends on a pessimistic note, both Norse and Indian cosmologies emphasize cyclical renewal. After Ragnarok, the Norse world is reborn, and after Kali Yuga, the Indian cosmos begins anew with Satya Yuga. Here’s the continuation with the remaining sections translated into English: Liberalism, Marxism, and Nationalism The past two centuries have been marked by three major ideologies that have shaped societal development: liberalism, Marxism, and nationalism. While all three emerged from the challenges of modernity, they can be understood as reactions to one another—each attempting to address society's issues but from radically different perspectives. Liberalism arose during the Enlightenment with a focus on individual freedom, rights, and property. Inspired by thinkers like John Locke and Adam Smith, it became the foundation of modern democracy and capitalism. Through market economies and rational institutions, society was envisioned as progressing linearly toward greater liberty and prosperity. However, the massive social inequalities of industrialization revealed liberalism’s limitations. The working class was marginalized, and many felt alienated in a system that rewarded the privileged. This created room for a powerful critique of liberalism, led by Karl Marx. Marxism was developed as a direct reaction to the ideals of liberalism. Marx argued that the "free" market economy and individual liberty were illusions because capitalism reduced workers to commodities in a system that served the wealthy. Where liberalism celebrated individual rights, Marxism claimed these masked class oppression. For Marx, history was a process driven by class struggle. The goal was a radical transformation of society—a classless community where the means of production were collectively owned. Marxism rejected liberalism’s belief in gradual progress and called for revolution as the path to liberation. At the same time, Marx’s vision of international class struggle stood in contrast to a third emerging ideology: nationalism. Nationalism, which developed alongside liberalism and Marxism, offered a different response to the challenges of modernity. While liberalism emphasized the individual and Marxism focused on international solidarity, nationalism placed the nation at the center—a community built on shared language, culture, and history. Nationalism was a reaction against liberalism’s global market and Marxism’s universalism. It provided a collective identity in a time when many experienced fragmentation and rootlessness. Through struggles for national independence and cultural revival, nationalism became a powerful political force but also a source of conflict. A Life Governed by the Clock The introduction of mechanical clocks, Greenwich Mean Time (GMT), and the practice of punctuality marked a dramatic shift from traditional understandings of time. In older societies, time was tied to the rhythms of nature—sunrise, noon, and sunset dictated work and rest. For farmers in Norway, expressions like "sun in the eyes" and "sun behind the mountain" served as practical markers of the day’s progress. Similarly, medieval churches used the ringing of bells to signal prayer times, still aligned with daylight cycles. In the 14th century, mechanical clocks began to break this connection by introducing a uniform division of time. Church bells regulated daily life in cities, and in monasteries, time was strictly measured by scheduled chimes. This abstract, mechanical understanding of time became a cornerstone of the Industrial Revolution, where factories required workers to adhere to precise schedules. Flexible work rhythms adapted to weather or seasons were replaced by rigid timetables. For many workers, alarm clocks—or in England, the curious profession of “knocker-uppers,” who tapped on windows to wake people—became symbols of a new and stricter time regime. The need for coordination across distances culminated in the standardization of time. In the 19th century, GMT was established partly to ensure railways and trade operated seamlessly. Time, previously localized and tied to the sun’s position, was now globalized. Yet this standardization met resistance in many rural communities, where the abstract, uniform time system clashed with natural cycles. This transition from an organic understanding of time to a mechanical one brought both opportunities and challenges. Mechanical clocks and GMT enabled global coordination and industrial advances, but they also replaced humanity’s natural rhythms with a uniform, strict time regime. Time, once adapted to life’s cycles, became a tool for control and efficiency—a change that continues to shape our modern relationship with the clock. The State of Nature The concept of the state of nature explores how humans related to one another before the establishment of societies, laws, and other constructs. For Thomas Hobbes, this state was marked by constant war, with human nature described as fundamentally brutal and selfish. In Leviathan, he famously characterized life in the state of nature as "solitary, poor, nasty, brutish, and short." To escape this chaotic condition, Hobbes argued that it was necessary to enter into a social contract and establish a strongly hierarchical and centralized societal structure. In contrast, Jean-Jacques Rousseau believed that humans were naturally good, with an inherent ability to cooperate, living in harmony with each other and nature. This was a state marked by freedom and innocence, inspiring his slogan "back to nature!" Whether we align with Rousseau, Hobbes, or something in between, I believe our view of human nature—whether we are inherently "good" or "bad"—shapes how we think society should be organized. David Graeber and David Wengrow’s The Dawn of Everything challenges these traditional dichotomies. They argue that early human societies were not confined to a single form of social organization. Instead, they experimented with various forms of governance, hierarchy, and social arrangements long before the advent of agriculture or the state. This diversity undermines the idea of a single "state of nature" from which modern societies evolved. The authors suggest that early humans had the creativity and freedom to choose how they organized their communities—an overlooked capacity in conventional narratives of human history. In essence, they show that early humans were as diverse and complex as "us civilized folks" today. Final Reflections What am I trying to convey? It’s difficult to say. Maybe nothing. Maybe just that there are no definitive answers to how we should live. But I want to preserve and honour the histories, cultures, mysteries and people who have shaped us. And maybe looking to the past can be just as valuable as the future. This is an immense and complex topic, so my thoughts may feel scattered, and the language might not always flow perfectly. Instead of endlessly refining this, I’ll leave you with some art and quotations: ________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________________

Thats fine Daniel. I dont need an ignore list. I just have a quick laugh and move on. Curious thing, your oppsession with the ignore function and telling people who you ignore. Even telling th e people you suppousedly ignore that you ignore them, multiple times! Want to hear a funny little story? Ibn Fadlan was an learned muslim fellow. Once he encountered the norse somewhere along the volga river. Shortly after, their leader died, and a grand funeral lasting for mounth took place. 21. The next of kin to the deceased man now drew near, and taking a piece of wood, lit it and walked backwards toward the ship. He held the stick in one hand while the other shielded his buttocks, as he was naked. He held the stick until the wood which was piled under the ship took fire. Then the others came up with staves and firewood, each one carrying a stick already lit at the upper end, and all threw them on to the [funeral] pyre. The pile was soon aflame, then the ship, and finally the tent, the man, the girl, and everything else on the ship. A terrible storm began to blow up, and thus intensified the flames, and gave wings to the blaze. Whats going on here, you might think. Understably so, because it does seem a little bizarre. Anyway, lets explore. You have two ears, two nostrils, one mouth and one butt. (well, you have two mounths, no ears and multpiple butts, but thats beide the point). These are all hole, in a sense. They were under the belief that unwanted spirits (or lunatics) might enter their body trough these holes, when they left their body. By walking backwards, you cover all of them except one, the butt. So what does the man do? He shields it with his hand