Partez

I'll keep an open mind up to the point where a child can spot someone is a fraud. If you take an issue with that, it's on you. Once someone is shown to be an obvious fraud, I say get the pitch forks out. Trash is putting it nicely describing them, and you should be pissed if you wasted your time and money on them.

Honestly, who uses what is irrelevant because anyone connected to blatant con artists in any way are going to be either frauds, or well meaning people suckered in and perpetuating the BS. Hearing about them electrocuting themselves just made the connection all the more blatant, but the moment I saw them do a coin vanish and the pyro stunt, as well as a lot of other parlor tricks, I mean, all I'll say is if you still have any trust in this organization then sooner or later your money will be gone anyway, so you might as well give it to them. Anybody who isn't completely deluded can look at the evidence and decide for themselves.

I had some good faith right up to the point I saw the grand master of this thing dropping an ignition pallet to demonstrate "pyrokinesis" and doing a shitty coin vanish. These guys are frauds and trash, so how about some good faith towards me for saving some people lots of their time and money. (and a donation to my sex cult perhaps?)

This i don't understand at all. What known law of physics? I know of doctors in thailand who use a machine to charge themselves up, then emit the electricity into people as we do with faqi. The store the energy in their gut and use intention, breath and muscle activation to push the energy out. When they are empty they go back to the machine to charge themselves back up again. Our bodies function on electricity, your nerves, your muscles, almost every single cell in your body functions because of electrical potential. Just as that doctor in asia who charges himself up and holds onto the electrons in his gut. Can our neigong breathing which activates the production of energy and releases tons of electrons not do the same. Where we are simply syphoning of a small percentage of this energy and storing in the gut???? We do not produce the electricity from nothing, we use what is stored in out gut (lower dantian) and emit it. You guys keep talking about the laws of physics because it was mentioned in the ring of fire documentary yet it's a completely false statement. As a living creature, we constantly produce electrical potential in our bodies, every cell, every second. Is it that unthinkable that with the correct training you can harness some of these electrons/photons/energy and store them, not needing an external device for the energy. This is what I do every day if i am using qi, I do meditation with specific breathing and then relocate that heat/energy into my gut which is stored and can be used later. So here Rudi is already being full of s*it imo. It's obvious what he learned stems from this system, and the head teachers for this "system" is from Thailand. So it's already admitted that the system does in fact use machines to electrocute themselves as part of the training, but Rudi is pleading ignorance of it. Why? I think so as not to associate the demonstration he made with the use of a machine, as it's becoming pretty clear by now that this is what's happening. So you have the initial fraud confusing Westerners into giving him their money with magic tricks. Then you have what I think are well meaning, but deluded people like this guy: https://www.youtube.com/@NeiQiGongJiaoshiAndrea/videos Who bought into the system, and is being honest about his experiences, but isn't pretending that he has magical powers. And then you have guys like Rudi, who decided, hey, I spent all this money on this thing, so I'll just adopt some magic tricks too and defraud others like the initial guy did. That's my opinionated summary. What do you think?

Omg, is this the master here doing a coin vanish??? FFS.

Also what Rudi teaches is basically this: So if you want to learn from the original Western guy you can learn from here: https://www.neiqigongfu.com/ Also I found a guy on YT who outright says that in the advanced stages they use a machine to electrocute themselves: At least he seems honest about it.

Let me know if you hear of anyone in Australia doing this. Otherwise will need to wait to go overseas and check out the guy you recommended to me. PS: Just to clarify, there maybe two distinct phenomena going on. One is of transfering the "Qi" to another person, which may or may not have being achieved by a machine. If it wasn't achieved by a machine, but may have been "suggestion", I don't take much issue with it, because as far as I'm concerned, the phenomena is still real. Even though how people try to explain it, be it Qi or the power of the holy spirit, may not be accurate, they are still achieving something, and they may believe the reasoning behind it. What I'm really concerned with in Rudi's demonstration is when he shows manipulating physical objects with the energy. When it comes to that, there is no middle ground. It cannot be suggestion, because you can't suggest to pieces of paper to move around, so either 1. He is a God amongst men who's achieved something beyond what some monks who have devoted their whole life in following could not do at a relatively young age, and we should all bow down to him as he is about to revolutionize our understanding of humanity as we know it. Or. 2. He is a piece of s*it fraud, one of many to come before and after him, that only needs to be shunned and ridiculed because he strapped some device to himself and tried to fool people for profit and ego. (and maybe a sex cult, or is that just what I want to do?) So my main questions and what I want to see tested is what he demonstrates at the start of this video:

And also invite a credible skeptic to do it, maybe one already know for exposing frauds, not just some random X magician dude.

Yep! Once I get the thing I'll play around with it and see what it can do. I'll post some videos up.

If he comes out with a device that's completely invisible from the outside and can produce this effect, I'd trust him anyway, because he would make more money selling this thing to magicians than scamming some bums.

Stripping down would pretty much be required I'd say to show you don't have a device. Again, you are showing something miraculous so the onus of proof is on you, dismissing it away how you did just now is something a fraud would do. Just put some speedos on like millions of people do every day at the pool, it's not a big deal, unless you are trying to hide something. What would be so hard about this? There are plenty of YouTubers out there chomping at the bits to find someone to expose live on camera, and would literally just involve checking you for devices. If you aren't willing to do this in your underwear, it's a non started tho, because that is exactly what would be required to show you don't have a device on your body, as well as checking where you will be standing.

Humans generating electricity they can expel through their fingertips would be deemed acceptable to be tested for sure. I think you are over thinking things. They already tested things like water dowsing, which I think is way more probable than creating electricity.

I personally would be very impressed if he can recreate what he shows at the start of the clip, moving pieces of paper around, and not use a device of some sort to do so. I'm pretty sure the skeptics do rule out humans generating electricity as a thing, beyond rubbing carpet on socks. Australian skeptics offer $100 000, which isn't that much in down-under cash I suppose, but probably worth a trip down for anyone certain in their skills.

Jesus was an energy healing, levitating, transmuting ascetic that wondered the desert while fasting and spoke to the devil, then proceeded to command demons and necromantically raise people from the dead... Nothing occult about that.

Will the skeptic's Qi, un-mellow his vibe so he isn't able to do what he claims? Can someone please explain why it's such a battle to just get a bit of objective proof on seemingly outlandish claims before buying into them 100%?

Why not ask him why he hasn't done it? He obviously wants money to some extent since he is charging an exorbitant amount to learn what he learnt. And he was willing to demonstrate his ability and perform and practice it on groups of people in the videos that he showed: What's the issue then of allowing some skeptics to come along and offer vast amounts of money for you to do what you claim to be able to do all the time, and hold seminars to teach other people how to do.

I just have. If he is following this thread, as I'm sure he is, he can address and reply to the things I'm saying.

I'm speculating about it working at all If it was well established that people could shoot electricity out of their hands, then yes, it would be prudent to ask them how they think it's done. As it stands, we have monks and meditators, and Qi Gong practitioners of all sorts, practicing similar things, that are twice or more Rudi's age who don't claim to have these abilities, even while claiming to have some others like healing with Qi. So again, sorry to sound harsh, but until we have some solid evidence, I think it's more important to establish first if something is "real" or a trick. And the only question I have for Rudi is where he is based, and if he is willing to do a demonstration with certain parameters in place.

I personally don't see humans being able to produce electricity as a distraction at all. Just think of the revolution it would produce, it would literally save lives, so dismissing it as just a "distraction" is asinine imo. Fact is, Rudi has shown a phenomena that goes beyond the reality that we currently know, so he is either revolutionary, or a fraud. If he is a fraud, why would you want to give money to someone like that? Even if they may have taught you something you never heard, that they probably regurgitated from a more deserving teacher that you'll never discover because you're wasting your money and time.

That's right. So Rudi has demonstrated what he claims as influence over the physical, which cannot be produced by hypnosis, and I say the burden of proof is on him, certainly before I throw my money at one of his seminars. That might sound harsh, but there are way too many frauds in this field not to be skeptical. That said, if what he does turns out to be legitimate, I'd happily throw my money at him. Instead of asking for a 1000 pound one on one consultation, can I recommend for him to do the James Randi challenge tho? I believe it still stands, even though James passed away. Obviously money is important to Rudi on some level, otherwise he would be teaching for a much lower price, or for free, so why not kill two birds with one stone? Prove once and for all that electric chi is a thing, revolutionizing the world as we know it, and become super wealthy. Why waste time shilling a system on a dao bum forum is all I am saying. On a side note, I did fork out the money for a static electricity device, so if I don't electrocute myself, look forward to me filming some demonstrations for reference. Either that, or starting my own sex cult based around my new electric Qi skills. At the moment, it's a toss up.

That's right, and magnetism is largely dismissed by hypnotist, ironically in the same way as hypnosis is dismissed by the larger community, for being too "cooky" Looks like he's from Jakarta based on his site: http://www.dodiemagis.net/ I do the same "thing" he does. Hypnosis, magnetism, "energy" healing. Whatever label you want to place on it, I personally believe the mechanics behind it are the same. I use it for healing also in my practice, and it's great for psychosomatic symptoms like fibromyalgia. Well that's it. It's impossible to draw the line in a way, and that's why I love hypnosis because it skirts the line of what's possible. When a hypnotist "glues" a person's hands together, is it because there is a sticky "Qi" that they are activating? Are they just imagining it? Does imagination control "Qi"? Then what is "Qi" really? Who knows.

Thanks for that. And I would recommend checking out Dodie Magis if you're in Indonesia. He does a similar thing to what I know how to do, but is next level with it: I can vouch that the phenomena he creates is absolutely real, in that it's not done with any kind of stooges, and from what I could tell, he was able to make everyone experience the phenomena. The issue is if you want to train with him, is I didn't get the sense he was teaching exactly what he does, and kinda just gave you a bit of fluff while showing you how good he is. That said, he is very good imo.

Agreed 100%. I'm skeptical, but open minded. Without skepticism you end up wasting money and time that you could have seeking out something genuine, or enrolling in a karate class. With a closed mind, you might miss something truly magical, to whatever extent it's possible in this world. I lucid dream and astral project, and while I'm skeptical about the experience being me actually leaving my body or just my imagination, if I was too closed minded about it, then I never would have trained myself to do it, and would be missing out on an experience that is real, even if the reasons behind it might not be what some people claim it to be. And if you're still feeling desperate to throw your disposable income at somebody, I can give you my paypal account, and say a prayer for you in my Qi Gong practice or something. It might work.

John Chang was the only person that seemed to have gotten examined in this way: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eJm9A2iXiFA But then you watch other clips of him and it strongly points to a trick, so in the end we are left in the same place, speculating. I recommend people do experience it first hand, and also check him for any devices that are able to generate static electricity like this one here can do: What he dose at the start of the video here looks identical to what a static electricity device will accomplish: I don't own one, so I don't know the ins and outs of how it works, but if this is fake, it would most likely be something like that.

Not at all. Almost 100% of people can experience hypnosis phenomena, it's just that 10 - 20% are exceptionally good at going into the hypnotic state. You might have experienced stepping onto an escalator that has broken down, and for a moment you feel that it's moving? That in essence is what hypnosis feels like, and what happened is that your mind was imagining the escalator moving in anticipation to take the next step, and doing it over and over again made you conditioned to it. If you are adamant that you won't be hypnotised, you probably won't be. At least not by anyone who TELLS you openly that they are about to hypnotise you. PS: If anybody is in Sydney, Australia, I'm happy to meet up and explore just how powerful our minds are when it comes to screwing with our reality. You just need to have an open mind, above average IQ, a good focus and good imagination.