Tommy

Sorry, you lost me. All I was doing was turning the Koan into a different question so it can be answered because Old3bob said, which wasn't the real answer but a way to bypass the Koan. Which then I replied with one hand clap is changed to two hand clap and the question is thus abled to be answered. But, of course, it isn't. It is just another iteration of the answers which do not answer the Koan. As someone said before that Koans are more like a lock and key. The teacher is the lock and the student is the key. If the student figures out the key (or Koan) then the lock opens the teacher. Or something to that effect. To me. it seems the Koan is just another crutch for the student to use in order to focus his concentration and be able to maintain the silence. This allows the awareness to depart from this mind. Of course, I do not know if any of this is true. But, I try to make things simple for me to understand.

There seems to be a belief that those who have had an enlightenment experience are blessed and pure. Which I believe is far from the truth. The people who have such experiences do not lose who they were; rather that, they keep their personality and add to their repertoire of understanding of the world. As the saying goes, before enlightenment chop wood and carry water. After enlightenment chop wood and carry water. Nothing changes and everything changes. To put your own ideas on another's experiences?? What does it say about your frame of reference? IDK. I am a simple person with a simple understanding.

Does being tired of the same stock responses make them false? IDK. Does one discard it or delve into it to find the truth? Understood, looking for different layer. But, then wouldn't it then become theory if one hasn't experienced the ultimate truth or enlightenment? Interest in what breaks the loop. opens the heart, allow actual higher consciousness? Wouldn't that require doing the actual work to do that? IDK. I am still on my own journey. I do not want to espouse the same Buddhist responses that you have grown so tired of. So, no real answer here. IDK. Personally, I like hearing the Buddhist responses. It helps to hear that I am not far from the truth. Good night.

Men usually just strive for continuing of the relationship and women look for happiness. When the going gets rough, the men dig in for the long run and women look for a way out. The cost is giving of oneself beyond hopes of being happy. But, just finding happiness in the giving is the key to remain in the relationship. Yes, communication of needs and serving the other. But, one has to find the joy of doing so. Otherwise, it becomes a duty or a chore. Not a blessing. When that doesn't happen, resentment is true. Feet dragging. Again, if the joy in doing or giving or serving is gone then there is no love. Love comes from losing oneself and finding joy in the giving and serving. Opposites attract? Maybe. I haven't found that to be true. What attracts is being on the same page and understanding the needs and wants of the other person. Then having your needs met while serving the other. It is strange that love is a two way street. One going your way and the other going theirs. So, is it opposite? What is love? I still don't know for sure.

Different words for love must mean there are different nuances to love. Love of mom which brings a safe feeling. Love of a good woman which brings feelings of joy. My issue is when one does give and give and give, the feeling one got was one of being happy for doing it. After so much time, does it change and then become something which is more burden than love?? Then more questions, like was it true love if this is how I feel (burden) now? I know I do not wish to be a burden. Guess as life goes on, one learns to accept things as they are?

Okay, so you aren't asking a question. You are just being rhetorical so you want to trigger a positive reaction. What is love? Baby Don't hurt me. Don't hurt me. No more. As a husband, I do what is needed to keep this relationship with my wife and child. I believe it is out of love but I really do not know for certain. Because I do not know if love is suppose to be as a servant to others? To give and give and make others feel fuzzy, safe, secure or bubbly? What is love? Baby Don't hurt me. Don't hurt me. No more. Yeah, cork tree ... gives and gives and gives??? Or is it that people take and take and take? Okay, trust in doing so things will be better? What is love? Baby Don't hurt me. Don't hurt me. No more. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D2h4PhgobI8

I think this is what attracts me to Zen. Pointing exactly to it and not saying what needs to be done. Codifying and a to do list is what traditional teaching is of regular subjects like math and physics. One thing leads logically into the next. Seek stillness? Do it a lot? For nine years straight, sit facing the wall of a cave?? I heard stories where he left his image in the cave wall. Still, I feel like it is when he took the tile and started polishing it into a mirror. Not possible for this me. But, thank you.

What is love and why do you have to give and give and give? Also, what does it have to do with the reality of a cork tree? Please explain what you are asking or trying to state. I am a simple person and need help to understand. Thank you.

So change the question? What is the sound of two hand clap? Easy.

I believe that Chan started when Bodhidharma went to China to spread Buddhism. The monks at the temples were all expecting lectures and speeches. And, I think Bodhidharma was more of a demonstration type of teacher. There are stories of him sitting in a cave for nine years. What does it teach us? IDK. Guess I still got a long way to go??

Sorry, my mistake. When I read the word Who, it brings to mind the beginning of a question. Yeah, haven't gotten that far. I am stuck trying to understand with this mind that I lose what is in front of me. I barely have quiet. The mind still wants to race and cover all things. The stillness eludes me. So, the question , What is MU? stains the quiet. It persists and remains a focus. At times, I can not let it go. If I do then I lose myself in thoughts trying to find an answer. I am guessing that I do not have enough concentration to go beyond just listening to my breath. I do thank you for your words of encouragement.

I think the question of, "Who is mindful?" is much like the Koan, "What is MU?" the answer is there just out of reach. Try as much as I might, I can never reach it. Another Koan popped up while I was sitting. It was the question, "Does a dog have Buddha nature?". So, sitting there, it came to me that my awareness is not unique and must be the same as everyone or everything. But, to say yes then how would a dog find Buddha nature as it seems only humans have that ability. To say no then it is to deny that awareness or Buddha nature does exist in a dog. Again I am stuck. So, yeah, otherwise I won't penetrate duality. Haven't yet.

Thank you for your thoughts about this. So when teachers talk about self observation, don't teachers talk about mindfulness? What is mindfulness? Google defines it as, ... "Mindfulness is a practice of being fully present and connected to oneself, without getting caught up in automatic thoughts and reactions. Paying attention to the present moment Observing thoughts and feelings as they arise Accepting them without reacting or judging Cultivating a non-judgmental attitude Focusing on the breath or other sensory experiences Returning to the present moment when distractions occur In essence, mindfulness is a practice of being fully present and connected to oneself, without getting caught up in automatic thoughts and reactions. " So, I would say that being mindful is self observation with the added focus of not identifying with the thoughts or emotions that may arise thru out the day. Self observation is fine but if one loses oneself in the moment then where is the benefit of self observation? So, teachers are needed along the way as well as a sangha.

Life has its ups and downs. Sometimes there is life, love, laughter and much pleasure. Other times there is pain. Suffering comes from being attached or clinging to life without pain. Or for wanting something and not getting it. Pain is inevitable. Suffering is not. Does not having attachment or clinging present a life without love or caring or compassion? No. Buddhism is much ado about love and compassion. Wisdom comes from seeing the ultimate truth, Buddha nature. I have tried to be a good person but have not always succeeded. Tried to be compassionate but not always a person who expresses compassion in his actions. Am I a bad person? I hope not. But, I try to live a good life. Do I avoid suffering? Yes, If I can then I will try. I do not believe I am any different than anyone else. Do I not appreciate the other stuff life has? Sure, I appreciate the situations and beauty life has to offer. Who wouldn't? Do we focus upon suffering? No, it is just something we seek along the journey. It may bring us to seek the Dharma. And for that, I am grateful. Yeah, many questions and only answer is to practice and experience the truth about life.

Yes, all true. And as you have given to me, advice, before speaking to see if the words are in the light of compassion, kindness and helpful. So, it doesn't matter what I think of their stories or reality. It does matter that I remain attentive and compassionate and do no harm. I understand that there is conventional truth and ultimate truth. And the critical eye you are pointing to. Since my experiences are of conventional truth, it is difficult to know what the wise choice of action is. So, I try to remain open and understanding when dealing with others. I do get caught up in my own reality, thoughts. Not always doing the right thing. But, I am trying to learn and grow. Thanks for the help.