Tommy

I have to wonder ... say the experiment of the double slit where a single light source travels past a double slit. The initial result is that there are light and dark patterns which form on the back screen. It is a pattern of wave interference. When the source was changed to an electron gun, where electron particle was sent past the double slit, the experimenter expected to see two bright bands. Instead, the pattern for light waves appeared. Somehow the single electrons form a wave pattern on the back screen. Then when the experimenter watched the electrons go past the double slit, a pattern of two bright band appeared. So, it seemed that the simple observation of the electrons changed the results. This makes me think question, does sitting quietly in meditation, observing, change something fundamental in consciousness? Can the act of observation make the universe behave in a different manner? Sorry, for the side track. My mind tends to lead me off to neverland. Note: The emptiness or don't know mind, when observed, does it change anything?

Does it matter? Guessing that with my abilities and knowledge that not much would change. So for me it wouldn't matter. However, what would knowledge of the atom matter? Well, atomic energy, a big bomb, ?? Guessing again that maybe true knowledge of the essence or soul might allow for other things to happen which may not be evident at the moment?? I remember a movies where the premise was that the whole world found out that reincarnation was absolutely true. The consequences of that was there was a jump in the number of suicides. If people didn't like their life then they would turn it in and go for a new one. I know it sounds silly. The consequences of knowledge and experience does matter?? Doesn't it? Note: Thank you for your kind words.

And how many compared to those who have no past memories or continuity from the past? One in a million? Two in a million? Or let us say 2 or 3 in a hundred thousand. What percentage are you talking about? Only those exceptions? If they really are for real? Also, can't one be a prodigy and not have the talent come from a previous life? Note: The Buddha or the awakened one could not prevent his own death. All things born will die. So, awakening is suppose to end the cycle of birth, death and rebirth? If one gets a chance to live again then why would anyone want to stop from being born again? Life isn't all suffering. Is it? Well at least for some of us, life can be very nice for a little while.

Long ago, when I first came to daobums, you made a response post which really annoyed me. And I have seen where others have had the same reaction. I have come to the conclusion that it doesn't matter what others say. It only matter how one reacts to others. I can only control myself. So, after having said this, I thank you for your reply. To say that my spirit is the essence of me?? I don't see it. As I have been knocked out, know there is nothing of me that exist outside of my body. Drink alcohol and my mind becomes affected. There is nothing I sense or feel or grok that is outside of this body. And so, what essence would there be? It is like people tell me there is a God. Sure. Okay, then how do I know this? How do I find my God? No visions or acts to show God. Some people who have had near death experiences say there is a God and so on and so forth. Personally, I don't see it. Maybe someday if I ever experience Kensho. Or have a near death experience. Lets see, Ram Dass who took LSD and other drugs to experience something "else". That isn't a path I wish to take. I mean it might give one the experience of something other than this realm. But, how is it real when it only seems like an illusion created by the drug? Sorry, I take seriously the idea of trusting the Buddha's word that one should see for oneself. So, for me, death doesn't allow entrance to heaven or hell. It is the end of this life. What Karma has in store for me? LOL. Does it really matter when there is no continuity of mind or memory?

I personally do not know how the spirit would penetrate all existence since I have found no such thing in myself. Some have mentioned that they can travel thru the astral planes. Guessing that might have something to do with the spirit. For me, I do not have such experiences. And so, I do not see, feel, or grok that there is such a thing as spirit. This not to say there isn't a spirit. Just that for me, it doesn't exist. I live and breathe. Wake up in the morning, cook myself a meal, boil water for coffee. What life is, it is in front of me. When I read the saying before enlightenment, chop wood carry water. after enlightenment, chop wood carry water, the question arises what changed?.

I thank you for your reply and trying to help me understand. Still, I remain confused with all this as my mind doesn't see these complexities. Saying that breath or the act of breathing is in part spiritual, leaves me wondering if actions turn into portions of ourselves. The actions of the mind to sense conditions brings an uprising of emotions. So, the act of breathing brings a spirit or spiritual sense? My head spins with all these thoughts and ideas. So, let me just say thank you for your efforts to let me understand. And let's just say that I don't get it and probably never will. When Quantum mechanics says that anything can come from from the nothingness of space, I can understand that. But, when one states that breath or watching breath is a spiritual act, my mind freezes. One can say that one is on a spiritual path. However, it seems to me that it is only the real path to follow. All others returns to the beginning. When one says that two quantum objects can share the same information at the same time even though they may be light years apart thru quantum entanglement, okay, I get that but don't understand how since it is faster than the speed of light. So, yeah, I read your words and as I read they make sense. But, how it relates to me, there is a chasm. Still I thank you for trying.

Don't know how you ever came up with this? Meaning how did you discover this truth?? And what way is there for me to verify this? Is this like enlightenment? Just something to aspire to but never really achieving?? Sorry for the so many questions.

The heart where emotions are felt? So, you say that spirit is anchored in the heart? Is the spirit an emotion? Or is it part and parcel of the the heart and its emotions? My emotions are driven by my mind's understanding of the situation to provide a base for my emotions to be felt. To say that spirit is anchored in the heart, means to me, that it is just part of that which ??? .... arises from where into the mind and thus takes it form from the thoughts. Yeah, now more confused than ever. Yeah, all that makes me think of the guy who is holding onto a rope which is anchored on a roof edge. The guy is holding onto the other end of the rope. All the while standing on the rope and walking out into the middle of nowhere. Up in the air by holding onto the rope? Yea, fancy words and lots of dancing around to produce a wonderful show. All of which still makes no sense to me. I guess I am lost and always will be.

Well, you seem to know what spirituality means. What is the spirit and how do I find it in myself?

In my life, I have found that I have a mind and emotions. These things exhibit their properties thru my body. I feel them to be real. I have not found a soul. So when one says something about spiritual this or that, I really do not understand as I have not found there is a soul in my body. In movies, the souls are mostly ghosts of a person who might have existed. They exist in our realm thru their trauma and inability to move on. Where they are suppose to go, I have no idea. I was taught, as a child, to believe in God and have prayed many times usually when I needed help. There has been no action or vision to lead me to believe there is a God. Many have said it is a matter of faith. Where as, the Buddhism says to not just take their word but to actually find out for myself. So, even though I have never experienced enlightenment, I trust there must be such a thing. What it is or how it is , ... well, that is beyond me. Buddhism becomes strange when it declares that this world is an illusion. When I strike my fist against a rock, my hand hurts with pain that makes me feel the truth of this world. It is real. Suffering is real. The more I just sit, I realize that there must be something else or more to this life than just suffering. What is the truth of our nature? Don't know. So when it comes to Buddhism, I listen and hear the words or the wise. My mind goes "Yes, but". And then I sit and My mind goes "Don't know". Is it really one versus the other? Seems to me to be all part of the mix.

Don't know

And this affects the sitting how? When the point of just sitting is .. to not follow thoughts or chase thoughts, how does it relate? When just sitting is .. to allow one to not identify with thoughts and to be present? What is your next thought going to be?

I am not that sophisticated to understand the difference between "Yes- but-mind" and "Don't-know-mind". So correct me if I am wrong. The whole thing seems to be about the attitude in which one approaches the sitting?? Or is there something else I am missing?

Thank you Mark for the helpful hints. Sometimes, I do not understand all that was written in the post. But, I come back to it a few times and it helps. Thank again. Hope the dance is an enjoyable one.

Yes, I have seen this creeping vines and the never ending narration of my life. Also, how the posture affects the mind. This only makes me know that trying to go forward without a teacher is not going to go well. Twenty to thirty years of practice and still stuck with the creeping vines. So, I positively understand this. Being 66 years old, I think I might have another twenty or so years left to life. And it still won't be enough time. But, I keep trying. When there is such a block that I can not even sit for a minute, I rest and day dream and then I try again. Sometimes, I try to focus my mind and cut off the creeping vines with a mantra I learned long ago. Gate, Gate, Paragate, ParasamGate, Bodhi Svaha. That will get my mind to focus. Then later, back to paying attention to my present with silence. Sometimes, I feel the weakness in my bones and I can not sit. Other times, the peace I feel with the mind quiet, it lets me sit for an hour without realizing the time passing by, I don't expect change and I don't really want a benefit from just sitting. I just want to feel the quiet and be present. I don't think I could be called a watcher, just sitting, cause there is no sense of time or change. Trying to grasp these moments of quiet make them vanish as quickly as thoughts enter and the mind chases these thoughts. But, got to focus the mind. Then hopefully, will one day drop this mind.