adept

In Buddhism there is a sequence of events and practices which supposedly lead one to awakening.

They are the 4 Noble Truths and the Eightfold Path.

In Zen there is no path, no practice, nothing to awaken to. 

 

"A special transmission outside the scriptures,

Not founded upon words and letters;

By pointing directly to your mind

It lets you see into your true nature and through this attain Buddhahood."

 

I started looking into the zen record, and what are more generally known as koans.

Over 1000 years of documented encounters and instructions.

In these writings are the recorded sayings of the zen masters, written down at the time. 

There are commentaries on these texts by other zen masters, and commentaries on these also.

There are no 'official' answers to these koans as is suggested in Zen (Buddhism).

There is no mysticism in zen. No ' special enlightened state '

It is here, now.

When you 'get it', you will know, without any lingering doubt whatsoever. 

It is sudden, and so simple that you don't understand how you didn't 'get it' earlier.

 

 

Mumonkan, Koan 19

'Ordinary Mind is the way'

 

Joshu asked Nansen, "What is the Way?"

"Ordinary mind is the Way," Nansen replied.

"Shall I try to seek after it?" Joshu asked.

"If you try for it, you will become separated from it," responded Nansen.

 

How can I know the Way unless I try for it?" persisted Joshu.

 

Nansen said, "The Way is not a matter of knowing or not knowing. Knowing is delusion; not knowing is confusion. When you have really reached the true Way beyond doubt, you will find it as vast and boundless as space. How can it be talked about on the level of right and wrong?"

 

With those words, Joshu came to a sudden realization.

 

 

 

Hi Folks.

I'll start by stating that I don't wish to denigrate anyones spiritual practice or tradition. All I'm offering is a viewpoint which differs from what we have been told about Zen. By Zen, I mean the Chinese Ch'an lineage, and not the bastardised version that found its way to Japan, Korea, and later the Western world. I'm only using the word Zen as it is what people are most familiar with.

 

I found this quote online which I think is a good analogy:

"Buddhism and zen both aim for the understanding of "how to not drown".

While Buddhism traditions teach how to build bridges and boats and find detours, zen teaches how to swim.

Buddhism wants to save you by cultivation, Zen teaches that there is nothing to be saved from, because it's all made up by yourself.

Buddhism propagates rules, precepts, vows and dogma, while zen is all about the understanding of your mind and its function."

 

About two decades ago I started to investigate the world of Zen. As we all do, I did some research online and acquired a lot of information.

Now and then though, I kept coming across statements which challenged my views. These statements weren't frequent. Just now and again I'd see them mentioned. They were "Zen is not Buddhism" and "Zen is not meditation". Searching out these topics wasn't fruitful but I kept the quotes in the back of my mind for future reference.

 

A lot of time passed. I'd been interested in other things but something was pulling me back to Zen. 

I wanted to know what Zen is. 

To be continued......

On 26/10/2022 at 4:26 PM, Apech said:

@adept

 

Hi,

 

I have no medical qualifications or spiritual ones either - so whatever I say is just what comes to mind when reading your OP.

 

It is almost as if you have had a physical ailment (the hernia) fixed by physical means - I assume repaired with webbing or the like - but your body has recreated the symptoms of a hernia.  So you still have the painful swelling.  This suggests to me that your problem is on a more subtle level.  I don't know what that problem would be - only you really can find this out - and address it.  Given the location though I would naturally say it has something to do with the LDT.  Something to do with the formation of the LDT and the way that qi is operating there.

 

You say you have done martial arts and also qigong I think so maybe you are sensitive to qi.  You can through meditation examine what is occurring perhaps - or intuit the cause(s)?  Some nice deep shamatha breathing might help perhaps?

 

 

 

Thanks for the reply Apech.

Yes the hernia was fixed with a mesh, in fact quite a lot was used this time as the rupture was bigger than anticipated. This also may be one of the causes for these post-operative complications. In the past I've recovered fine, only for another hernia to emerge years later. It's interesting that you say that I might be sensitive to qi. All throughout my life I've had a sort of a sixth sense regarding people and situations. Maybe I can detect certain intentions and incidents just before they happen ? I may be picking up on qi and the training and practices that I've done could be amplifying those feelings. I think you might be on to something there. 

I'll have a look at deep shamatha breathing, thanks for the recommendation.

On 25/10/2022 at 10:08 PM, Nungali said:

 

I would be changing doctors .

 

It's very rare that I visit doctors. Only because of my hernia problems and that it can only be fixed with surgery. 

Because of the complications post-surgery, my surgeon and family doctor were going to be my first ports of call.

I do know a TCM practitioner who will most likely be more helpful than these licensed drug-pushers.

13 minutes ago, blue eyed snake said:

 

that's an odd choice for pain

and indeed gives horrid side-effects.

 

 

 

I know. It's an antidepressant. Apparently at low doses it works on nerve pain. 

On 21/10/2022 at 12:16 AM, blue eyed snake said:

 

pregabalin is wellknown for its nasty side effects.

 

I would go back to this doc and see what he offers, or go to another one for a second opinion. 

 

 

I actually contacted my doctor, not the surgeon who prescribed me the pregabalin, and he put me on amitriptyline. They were ten times worse than the pregabalin. Absolutely awful. It took me a couple of days to put myself right. I'm not taking these types of medication again.

On 21/10/2022 at 4:09 AM, Lairg said:

Western medicine tends to managing symptoms rather than dealing with causes.   Side effects are added to the problem.

 

TCM is better at dealing with life force issues.

 

Some causes come from outside the human - for example family karma

 

 

 

 

I know an acupuncturist who helped cure me from particularly nasty hay fever a lot of years ago. I may ask him for some advice.

On 21/10/2022 at 3:25 AM, forestofemptiness said:

I live in a decriminalized state, so a lot of people take and swear by medical marijuana for pain, even pain not responsive to conventional medications.  Not sure if that’s an option. I’m sure you’re spending a lot of time researching.

 

For meditation, usually the prescription from a Tibetan Buddhist POV is tonglen, compassion practices (ie Chenrezig) or metta meditation.

 

Mingyur Rinpoche has a meditation on pain, but these really depend on the individual. 
 

 

His brother Tsoknyi Rinpoche has a course Fully Being that I found helpful for different kinds of pain.
 

May be worth checking with a traditional Chinese medicine doctor if you haven’t already—- you never know. 
 

Asking for help from a higher power.

 

May you find relief from suffering and the causes of suffering.

 

 Thank you. This is excellent.

On 20/10/2022 at 10:34 PM, Nungali said:

Many use medical strength marijuana .  

I would also be getting another medical opinion on it ... maybe some   TCM  / herbalist  or specialist  ?  That is ; a professional - NOT a Daobum !

 

 

 

Thanks Nungali.

Funnily enough I was thinking of marijuana as I was posting.

A friend of mine has had an incredible cancer reversal using cannabis oil. He was given six months to live two years ago with an aggressive bowel cancer and put on chemo. The chemo did nothing for him and so he scoured the internet looking for alternatives. He's now cancer free and the doctors are amazed.

Greetings all.

I'm now in my mid-fifties and I consider myself to be very healthy. I rarely get sick. I can't even remember the last time I had a common cold.

From childhood I've always been active. I took up several martial arts in my teens and continued into my thirties when I got interested in the internals. Since then I've had a daily qigong and meditation routine for over two decades, have always eaten well and tend to have a positive outlook on life, despite the state of the world these days. 

The only thing I've had a problem with health wise is recurring abdominal hernias. I've had 4. The last operation earlier this year was far bigger and deeper than my previous ones. My surgeon wanted to repair in such a way so that there was very little chance of another coming back. Recovery took longer because of this, but I noticed something concerning immediately after my procedure. 

I have a protrusion where the wound is situated and a constant soreness which gets very painful at times. An ultrasound scan found nothing there. No fluid, blood, or another hernia. Nothing. Just a painful, but soft and squidgy pot at the bottom of my abdomen. Very unsightly. 

My surgeon said that it looks to be fat and muscle which has binded itself to the scar tissue during the recovery process and that I may have to have plastic surgery to remove the unsightly lump if it doesn't subside in the next 6 months.

The thing that is really bothering me is the pain. My surgeon has diagnosed me with chronic pain which happens in only 3% of patients hernia surgeries. All regular pain medication is not working and so he prescribed me with Pregabalin, which is normally an anti-convulsant medication but when taken in small doses it is a nerve pain medication. However the side-effects are horrendous and I have experienced some of these already only a few days in. Dizziness, suicidal thoughts, pain in the limbs, headaches, brain fog and lack of co-ordination have plagued me for several days. I feel absolutely terrible and have stopped taking them.

I'm looking for alternative means of dealing with this chronic pain, whether that's medication, exercises, energy work, herbal remedies. 

If anyone has any suggestions I'd ver much appreciate it.

Thanks in advance.

29 minutes ago, dwai said:

Mantra practice will not hurt your other interests, if anything, you might be accelerating your spiritual development.  

And really, all it takes is a few minutes of your time every day. Sometimes we might feel a sense of loyalty to one tradition over another,  but really it is a matter of our own choice.

 

These things don't happen to random people out of the blue, there's a reason why you've been given a gift. Whether you act upon it or not is entirely up to you.

 

Thanks dwai. 

I intend to act upon this very fortunate gift I have had the good fortune of receiving.

The words of encouragement and genuine help is the reason I keep coming back to the forums. The Dao Bums is indeed a special place.

23 minutes ago, idiot_stimpy said:

 

Maybe the information contained in that specific mantra is meant to assist you in a certain way.

 

Yes. That's the reason for the thread. I feel like I'm being urged to practice it, even though it's entirely different to me. 

Maybe what I think is right for me, actually isn't, and forces greater than myself know better.

Thanks for the replies. I'm not sure how, or if to, proceed. 

Mantra recitation seems at odds with my current practices and study. I've invested a lot of time, and money, in what I do, which all come from Chinese traditions.

This is what is totally perplexing about it. Sanskrit mantras weren't even on my radar. 

A lot of years ago when I was searching for a path, I was briefly interested, but found myself more suited to Daoist practices.

 

8 hours ago, dwai said:

Do you remember the mantra?

 

Did you know that Mantra before (heard it anywhere)? Or is it something that came at you completely out of the left field?

 

Hi dwai. Yes I remember the mantra vividly, every syllable. I would prefer not to disclose it, even in a PM. 

I've heard it before, many years ago and also seen it in written form, but mantra is not a practice which I have as part of my cultivation routine, which is what has me so intrigued. Also the clarity of the whole experience. Like a dream but not a dream. Very difficult to put into words.

After writing the OP, I did some searching online. Some were of the understanding that it is a very auspicious sign that should be pursued. 

Greetings all. I would like some advice and insight on something which happened to me last night/this morning.

I was dreaming that I was repeatedly reciting a Sanskrit mantra. There were no visuals accompanying the sounds, only the mantra, entering my mind, and then me reciting it. As I started to wake from the dream, I was actually reciting the mantra out loud and kept repeating it. When I was fully awake I felt incredible. 

Is there a reason for this ? 

Am I being subconsciously prompted to follow a certain path ?

A sign from God ?

It's still so fresh in my mind which is also unusual as dreams tend to dissipate as time passes.

Over the last few days I've been pondering and meditating on the 'investigation of things' from the Daxue.

What struck me was the sheer depth of such a short statement. As I suggested earlier, the investigation of things is the starting point for cultivating illustrious virtue. Without this investigation, self-cultivation is not possible as we read further down on the passage posted by ZYD : ''From the Son of Heaven down to the mass of the people, all must consider the cultivation of the person the root of everything besides."

Investigating of things, then behaving appropriately after acquiring knowledge through this investigation, is self-cultivation. 

From my so far limited understanding, this process is repeated constantly, refining the self and eventually becoming a person of illustrious virtue.

I believe I may have found myself a worthwhile life-path of study, practice and meditation.

Thanks to everybody involved in contributing to this thread.

 

Osho was about as materialistic as any 'guru figure' ever. Have you even read about his lifestyle ?

23 minutes ago, Zhongyongdaoist said:

Reading Tu Weiming's Humanity and self-cultivation: Essays in Confucian thought was how I first learned the true depth and meaning of the Confucian tradition, and I recommend it as an excellent introduction.

 

ZYD

 

Thank you. 

What I find very appealing about cultivating the Confucian Dao, is the emphasis on behaviour, conduct, morality and humaneness. Traits that seem to be sadly lacking in the general populace these days. 

4 minutes ago, SirPalomides said:

Yes, though there are varying views on what this entails, those of Zhu Xi and Wang Yangming being the most famous.

 

Thank you. 

This thread has so much good information and is fascinating.

I am particularly interested in this statement from the Daxue as posted above :

Such extension of knowledge lay in the investigation of things.

 

This 'investigation of things' seems to be the starting point for cultivating illustrious virtue.

Is 'the investigation of things' a deep contemplative/meditative focus on life, society, people, nature, the way the stars move at night etc ?  

 

The Buddhist Way Of Action

- Christmas Humphreys

 

Crooked Cucumber. The Life and Zen Teaching of Shunryu Suzuki

- David Chadwick

 

Opening The Dragon Gate. The Making Of A Modern Taoist Wizard

- Thomas Cleary

 

Letters of the Nun Eshinni. Images Of Pure Land Buddhism In Medieval Japan

- James C. Dobbins

 

The Way to Buddhahood. Instructions from a Modern Chinese Master

- Venerable Yin-Shun

 

Bankei Zen

- Peter Haskel

 

The Unborn. The Life and Teachings of Zen Master Bankei

- Norman Waddell

 

Bhagavad Gita As It Is

- Prabhupada

 

The Thunder Wizard Path. Modern Teutonic Shamanism

- Michael William Denny

 

The Qur'an

- M.A.S. Abdel Haleem

 

Interpretations of the Meanings of The Noble Qur'an In the English Language

- Dr. M. Taqi-ud-Din Al Hilali & Dr. M. Mushin Khan

 

Healing Light of the Tao. Foundational Practices to Awaken Chi Energy

- Mantak Chia

 

Hsieh Liang Tso and the Analects of Confucius

- Thomas W. Selover

 

Tao Te Ching on The Art Of Harmony. The New Illustrated Edition

- Chad Hansen

 

The Tao of Yiquan. Warriors of Stillness Volume 2

- Jan Diepersloot

 

PM for details. UK postage only.

That's comforting to know CT. Sometimes I feel VERY alone, even in the midst of family and friends.

I'm finding that compassion is a very difficult quality for me to develop personally. The use of the mani mantra in both formal meditation, and throughout my day has helped a great deal. I feel that part of me is softening somewhat. I know there's a long way to go, but with the right intent and daily practice, I can change myself.

Very nice post CT, and all the best for the new year.

http://thetaobums.com/topic/14756-365-tao/