Seth Ananda

these are personal attacks? Are you sure you are not describing one of the lengthier cut'n'pasters of this forum. But really, speaking from a podium is a personal attack? Having no sense of humor is a personal attack? Are you sure you are not just trying to derail this thread? If so thats pretty lousy for a Mod... But I should add, that I personally, don't really have a sense of humor around bigotry. I have dead friends over this subject. Also i work as a counsellor and see the result of it everyday in my clients.

But Back to my topic. Do Sexist Racist or Homophobic attacks constitute a personal attack? I have presented a solid set of arguments as to why they do, so if they do not, please describe how...

Well you tell me honestly, in the spirit of friendship, if you wrote that thinking about how you feel I act or have acted? If the answer is yes, then it was a rather snide way to off colour and divert this thread.

hmm. this seems to be more like a 'snide' insinuation about me, Cat, than a genuine and honest look at the Issues I present. lol. Sad though, as these Issues are costing peoples lives daily.

I Imagine the mods would have to decide on that Issue if it was becoming personally attacking.

Jesus told his Disciples that he would be back soon, but that hasn't stopped two millennia of Christendom from happening.

Fantastic thread Apech! Outside of these articles, do you recommend any particular books/links/teachers on the subject?

Gaito, I have reported you for trolling. Repeated posts with nothing in them, adding stupid amounts to the number of posts in this thread.

If I affect here, that is part of the real world. despite how it may seem sometimes, this is not some interdimensonal realm of its own....

I disagree. This is a Microcosm of the world. And Social Justice Issues can begin in the smallest of places. Choosing to accept that an attack on Race, Gender or Sexual orientation, constitutes a personal attack to everyone of that nature, and is thus in violation of the rules here, is a small but powerful political step towards a world free of oppression.

Most Gay Rights groups are totally open to help from the Hetero world. And I will give it. I have dozens of Gay friends. My sister is Gay. My Uncle was Gay. A friend I grew up with was Gay, and was murdered. If My Daughter turned out to be Gay I want her to inherit a world that wont hate her.

LOL!! I am a Heterosexual, and I love being one, as Women are Wonderful and desirable beings to me. Yet Seeing others not get the same fair treatment that I do, makes me seethe with outrage. Unlike the other corrupt souls and hate filled minds on this forum, I will not stand by and watch Injustice go unchecked. People here are actively working against the Gay rights movement. They have basically the same mindset as the supporters of the south in the American Civil War. I on the other hand am with the Abolitionist's, many of whom, despite not being black slaves, could not stand by while seeing a fellow human enslaved. If they had all 'talked' {as Gaito would like me to do} about slavery, instead of getting up and fighting, then America would still have Africans in chains, and not nearly enough Bigots in the ground... Talk, makes the Moderate hate groups feel very secure. They can pretend they are being reasonable, while a black man in chains works their fields.

Yes, but the correlation with Hitler and Bigots is Perfect. Hitler Hated a group of people for Who they were. Anti Gay activists hate a group of people for who they are. Sure Hitler went a few steps further. Into Extreme hate. But Moderate hate was the foundation that Extreme hate grew out of. Hitler didn't start at "lets Kill all the Jews!" His moderate Hate festered over time. anti Gay hate groups dont all want to "Kill All Fags!" But plenty do, and when it comes down to it, the Ideology of Moderate Hate groups {and advocates - like WWROA...} is still Hate, and is the foundation for Extreme Hate groups.

My concern with moving forward is not for the Individual, but for every Gay person in the world. Some friends, some members of my family, and the unknown multi millions. People who have been bashed, murdered, and who have one of the highest suicide rates in the world. People who are socially maligned every day and at every turn. People who would never choose to to be what they are in the face of society's onslaught of hatred against them. My concern is for them. One can spend a decade debating with one Bigot, and they may not change their minds. That decade would be far better spent, making the world safer for Gay people. As we already did {and are still doing} with racism. Society started Banning Racists from their various public speaking platforms. Public shaming tactics, cancelled accounts and various boycotts forced people in power to make public apologies for racist statements, and started to make it safe to be not white. Generations down the track, It is much better to be not white. Not white kids can grow up feeling good about themselves now. Thats far more Important to me than 1 stupid bigot feeling he has the right to spew his vile hatred on others - personally attacking what they are! This is a Major social Justice Issue. The next front is for Gay people to get the same rights as anyone else. The Homophobia of WWROA, Gaito, ET thoughts and others, will die as they die. In silence. And the oppressed people of the world will breath a sigh of relief. Large change like this happens over generations. With the eventual death of the Bigots and their Hatred.

I hope I would get banned as well, but say it was someone else who was serious, and not trolling?

How by the way is Homophobia not personally Insulting to all Gay people everywhere? The same way that Racism is personally Insulting to anyone of the targeted Race.

If Hitler posted some 'science' on the Jews, from Mein Kamph here and I pressed the 'like' button would it be safe to say that I have racist tendencies? Yes. Especially if I followed him around 'liking' every one of the posts that he quoted from Mein Kamph in. That would make me pretty much one of his Racist supporters. Now while we are on the subject of Hitlers Mein Kamph, how would the Mods feel If I start cut'n'pasting quotes from it about the innately corrupt nature of the Jews? Would i get banned? I wan't to know, because I have this thread in mind....

Zero Tolerance should totally include Sexism, and any form of hate or bullying over something someone has no control over, like race/sex/sexual orientation. I have reported a number of offensive sexist postings over the years.

Do you feel that suspension or banning are justified for Racism? if so, I sincerely Invite you to investigate why you feel there is a difference between hating a person for their race, compared to hating them for the sexual orientation they have had since birth.

there was no 'reason' or logic involved in the posts. It was nothing but a deliberate attempt to defame a minority for being different. for instance, logic would insist on looking up the source of the posts. {right wing anti gay activists} Or in the case of the 'homosexuals' WWROA quoted, one would consider that there must be many types of personalities each with their own views, within the Gay community, and not one of them in any way defines the whole Gay community itself. Instead, unreasonably and illogically, WWROA presented it as being indicative of Gay culture as a whole. He also presented it as if being Gay was actually a choice that 'education' could correct. He and his friends stand guilty of Personally attacking every Gay person in the world, by attacking who they actually are. There must be repercussions. This is exactly the same kind of Bigotry as Race Bigotry and can not be allowed to slide. Hating and attacking someone for who they are.

So is attacking a persons race considered not attacking them directly? I posit that it is, as it is attacking what they are on a physical level! If you agree with this logic then you must also concede that any Homophobic remarks/threads/links are also in direct violation of the forum rules, due to the fact they are directly and personally attacking every gay person on the planet. Like race, being Gay is usually not a choice. It is what they are. Roll up your sleeves and start banning the Homophobes.

How is this about majority rule? If anything it serves as a dark mirror to the blackness within the minds of several bigotry infested posters.

Its good to reflect and speak on the negative elements of belief systems, religions and cultural idiosyncrasy's. This is not always bigotry, and may in fact be common sense, or highly Important to our planetary survival. These things can be negative, and highly destructive to our world. Like Race though, being Gay {usually} is not a choice and can not be helped. This puts it in a different box. One can not fairly critique someone for something that can not be helped in any way, and doing so constitutes bigotry of exactly the same calibre as a KKK member hating a man because of his colour. Most of you here, unknowingly or not, are just as bigoted as a member of the KKK. In damning someone for being Gay, or painting a negative stereotype of Gays, you are telling them that they are inherently negative on some level - which they have no control over. It is not a belief system for them, it is not a religion or a cultural thing, it is who they are. As Nature made them. And the fact that 'spiritual' people here, wish to support and contribute to a hideous scale of cultural hatred and bigotry is quite disturbing.

I am amazed that turtle shell wrote this... Vortex, gaito and timelessness 'liked' it. Gaito, that is me pointing out your Homophobia by the way.

Vortex and turtle shell 'liked' this post.