Seth Ananda

What? Its an absolutely massive genetically diverse group where one can easily find every body type and elemental disposition. 16.3 million people in this one alone, and they are doing more than fine as vegetarian, they are actually amongst the longest lived and healthiest category in the world... Well this is rather funny, as I did not criticize the Dalai Lama, as I don't think badly of meat eaters {being one myself} [and I think the Dalai is Awesome!] But just because his physician says one thing doesn't mean that a dozen others won't say other things! Or is this another example of physicians being OMNISCIENT? But i am seriously beginning to question your ability to hold a rational debate? You know you jump onto the 'hurt' wagon very quickly in these kinds of discussions. All because someone disagrees with you? And no, they are thought/beliefs... You try to prove it by saying "the Dalai's physician said so!" That is not proof, and leaves us with nothing but beliefs Ohh documented studies?!? That really showed me! Have you ever heard of a study being wrong? Or being done well but on a flawed basis? Or only being part right? How do you know that the vegetarians in question had good {or the right} vegetarian diets for them? Its all a matter of enough protein /carb/mineral/vitamin... Thats science. What one gets from meat one can get from vegetables with a bit of experimenting. Assumptions again? Not a vegetarian! lol, 16.3 million people doing just fine in just one of those groups. There are many many vegetarians who do not have adequate vegetarian diets, that is true. Just not true. No one Needs to eat meat as it is impossible to starve to death on a vegetarian diet. But It may take quite a bit of experimenting to find the Veggie diet that works best for you... {and doesn't lead to anemia} Have fun Even though we don't always see eye to eye on things, i love your work!

I think the point is about Killing full stop. Killing leads to hell realms. Whether it is to eat or not is besides the point... Mind you they don't see eating meat as bad, just the act of killing itself is a highly negative karmic action.

I don't know, as I don't know the sutras very well. But I have heard this exact teaching from many Tibetan Lamas... Hence they themselves never Kill, ever. But they don't mind having others do it....

Well I admit that. But I don't need to be. The science is solid. A vegetarian meal can provide just as much of the life sustaining nutrition as a meat one. Protein, fiber, minerals, vitamins, carbs... Its all easily there. Funnily I am not arguing for Vegetarianism. I am simply arguing against the relatively stupid idea that many people can not live with out meat... Once again, massive genetically diverse communities do just fine without meat. All we have here is Yamu's 'thoughts' vs the actual reality, of many communities filled with actual people, one alone of which has 16.3 million members, who are life long Vegetarians and do just fine. I am making no point other than this. So if you wish to argue, argue something about my actual point.

Lol, my 16.3 million healthy people was not a back up argument? and your counter is simply an appeal to authority, that being yours? Have you ever heard of of someone with 'clinical experience' being mistaken? Or even spot on most of the time, but occasionally in error? Or are you an All Knowing Infallible physician? Are you referring to me in the Gungho category? This is my first post! And I did answer: Massive solely vegetarian communities living very long healthy lives! Are you upset because my answer KO'd your fairly weak arguments in one hit? Is that why you resorted to claiming that "I talk but say nothing"? How is putting up facts about the worlds massive {and body type diverse} vegetarian communities saying nothing??? Where did I make this a spiritual Issue? Why did you post this to me? I already know the Dalai Lama eats meat, and I also know he feels guilty about it, as he said so to my friend. My friend was over in Nepal {i think} helping them set up permaculture at the Dali Lamas request. The Dalai Lama was very Interested in the science side of permaculture and so wanted to be informed about every step of the system. My friend saw that they ate a lot of meat, so he said "we can add goats here, and harvest them as we get too many". This horrified the Dali Lama, who said "We don't kill the animals we eat! It breaks the Bodhisattva vow" My friend said "well Who kills them?" Dalai said "People from other religions!" My friend said "doesnt that break the bodhisattva vow? Doesn't getting someone else to kill for you condemn them to a hell rebirth?" The Dalai Lama flew into a rage, and started shouting things like "what do you know you stupid westerner! How dare you judge our culture, its thousands of years old!..." Then he started shaking his fists around and threatening to punch out my friend! [too much red meat anyone?] At this time my friends friend, picked up his camera and took a picture of the Dalai in a rage, which immediately calmed the Dali down... Later he apologized and said he feels guilty about the meat Issue, as so many Tibetan Buddhists, including him, continue to gorge on meat even when they no longer need too because they live out side of Tibet... My friend had that pic as his screen saver for years. Seth.

To Yamu's 'facts': Anyone/everyone can be a healthy Vegetarian. This has been shown over and over again. There are numbers of mixed nationality communities around the world with many generations of life long vegetarians, of every blood type, and constitution that there is. Seventh Day Adventists are a perfect example. They only have about 16.3 million members but within those numbers, somewhere you can find people with every elemental disposition, body type, blood type... They boast among the healthiest and longest lived people on earth. All one needs to be healthy is the adequate balance your body requires of proteins, carbs, vitamins, minerals, and... A vegetarian diet can deliver any combo required for a human. Simply put, people who think they 'Need' meat are simply addicted to meat and the quick fix of nutrients it can deliver. I have met people who 'feel' the cant live without cigarettes, heroine, caffeine... But seriously, they can...

This is one seriously courageous post my friend! Good for you I applaud anyone willing to face the nastier side of their personalities, and who has the guts to sit in the uncomfortable places rather than turn and run. Whoever the teacher is, it sounds like they have a good student, and those are as rare as good teachers. Respek! Seth.

Hi Everyone A while back, someone posted an Interview with a Korean Taoist Hermit, who lived mainly on Pine Needles ground into a sticky paste and with some water added {If I remember rightly} for many years... As Pine forests are so abundant on the planet this could be very useful Info for anyone planning a Hermit retreat... So does anyone have any further Info on living on Pine Needles, or any other awesome tips for someone who is hermiting? Thank you. Seth.

Whats the best way to prepare it, or do you just gobble it down Raw?

I am not sure that talking about the brain as limited entirely to the head is correct... The brain is an interface with the whole body. Sure, the left brain and its logic are what people would describe as 'in your head' but the right brain governs feelings, which Include the Heart... Also I am not trying to reduce mystical reality to brain function either. That massive experience of Love and the Numinous that some call 'God' for want of a better word, of course has to be processed by the brain/body for it to register in our brain/body... The Ancients had the old formula, As above/so below, as below/so above. Higher function/experience will always trigger physiological responses, and as we learn to be able to trigger those same responses ourselves, it will give us access to the Higher functions/experiences. This in no way 'reduces' mystical experience to Right brain activity. How could it? mystical experience leads out side the body and its [current known] capacities for Information gathering. You get to Know [gnow for Vmarco] things that you couldn't possible have access to by any Normal route...

Yes but he obviously meant this in a good context!

A Pig can Love rolling around in Mud, and a Philosopher can Love rolling around in Shavism! The key point both statements hang on here is Love. Perhaps you should try rolling around in a sense of humor?

Umm, that didn't sound like an Insult to me, am I missing something?

Hi Vajra, good to hear from you! Which pencak silat though? About 5 come up

Thanks Mind if I bombard you with questions? Could you tell me more about Isochronic tones and photic stimulation? Do the tones require headphones or will they work over speakers? I am guessing that Photic stimulation is some kind of flashing eye cover device? Do they work individualy or do they only work together? And do you find that they increase lucid dreaming while using them or within a certain time frame of having used them? Also do specific brain entrainment states trigger Lucid dreaming more than other states? I have no real experience with the electronic stuff. When I was 17 I had a master charles delta tape that I used while meditating for a while, and 20 years later all I have done since is chuck on a holosync cd very ocassionally... What has worked very well for you? Thanks again. Seth.

Hehe, If you like him, you may also like Ramsey Dukes, he is my favorite author in the Chaos current, although less practical and more philosophical, but very very funny. SSOTBME and Blast are just great... I still really like the chaos current and most of its authors...

Micheal Raduga's stuff is my favorite. It has a really good system within it to isolate if a practice is working or not for you Individually, so you can tailor the method that works best for your individual nature... It is very scientific, in how it has Isolated the stages required, and chucked out all unnecessary additions to these as 'technique clutter' and found dozens of ways for people of different dispositions {visual/kinesthetic/...} to achieve each of the three stages: 1.) Relax deeply. 2.) Enter the Vibration state. 3.) Exit technique. Astral dynamics has stuff that is extraneous to this procedure, and while with people of a certain disposition, it works really well, there are others who it doesn't work at all for. i know one guy who used Robert Bruces book, with great discipline for years, and experienced nothing at all. when he finally read raduga's material he had his first obe in 3 days, and has been doing so regularly since... Happy Travels!

Lol, thats not exactly starting small. To understand carefully I am going to have to ask you lots of questions to make sure we are on the same page with the words we use... Stop using misdirection tactics. I have not made a 'swarm of allegations'. I have responded to your posts point by point with relevant questions and pointed out the layers of flawed thinking and dishonesty where necessary. Anyway back to a more Interesting discussion. So far we are on the same page here. What methods do you use that you have found to be particularly effective for transcending the 6 consciousness's? I am a fan of viewing everything as dream like appearance including the 6th... Although in some ways for me, it has a little more cognizance involved in it, especially at first, compared to resting naturally which is one of my favorite practices. When I am really In Natural presence, then the world appears as a fresh, empty, magical display with no Interpretation going on whatsoever, and an amazing sense of wonder and joy accompanies it... In that space I don't have to sit there thinking "the world is empty dreamlike appearance" Also could you speak to how you see Gnoledge as overlapping, effecting or informing the events/life in the sensory world? At least for the Gnower...? Groan! This is going to be hard... So many cultures have teachings around the soul/spirits division after death into two or more fragments. Could you describe exactly what you mean when you say Psyche, Soul, Spirit... Also when you talk about Thymos, what else is Implied other than the amazing gland itself Sure, but what reasons? Could you give me your personal experience of Heart Mind? It may make it easier for me to be sure about what you are referring too. Some people use this term in slightly different ways... That makes sense, but would you describe it further? And could you describe the magick perfections? How do you go about with this for instance? lol, you are sounding dangerously close to the Theistic mystics, so could you unpack what you mean by following Spirit? How does spirit 'direct' in order that you may 'follow'? This is not at all meant as a trick question or a trap, I really would like to hear how you explain this. I have some theories but I want to hear yours first Sure. The Heart is often considered the true deep center of the mind in old cultures, with conceptual thought being distortion or ripples on the surface of the water... Tell me more if you please. what 'is' this higher self? What is it like when you experience it? When is it present for you and when not, or what do you find clouds it for you? How have you learned to be certain in distinguishing its 'voice' from the others? What practices have helped you uncover it? Seth.

And then this: Really? Then why is nearly every point I made in my 2nd last post a question, a seeking for evidence and a demonstration of my unwillingness to Just Believe??? [this post was meant to be part of the previous one but was too long] Someone seeking Honesty and Truth questions deeply, which is something you ask of others but are unwilling to do for yourself... Lol which beliefs? Not even sure are you? You just wanted to chuck in another Insult without having to back up your statement... Thats about as wrong as you can get. You advocate Dropping Beliefs in favor of another set - Yours/short path/tilopa's. I advocate dropping them entirely. No Vmarcoism, No Sethism, just deep questioning of presumption, biases and bigotries and coming to a place of being comfortable believing nothing nor being particularly anti anything either... [now you are getting closer to knowing what I actually stand for] In my experience when one realizes that Beliefs are just that, 6th sense disturbances, mental irrelevant fluctuations, the mind becomes quieter, and something beyond, the Gnowing place {to use your spelling} is again or more easily accessible, and for me that is where the Magick starts. I have done many astonishing things from this place. You on the other hand seem to out to wholesale sell and convert people to Vmarcoism! More: :lol: Wrong!!! I have no Theistic Beliefs, but I also have no no Theistic Beliefs. I am actually free from the theistic concern. Really, I insist that? News to me! hmm, this: VS this from previously: I guess one can see how I might have interpreted you writing a certain way Anyway I am getting bored with you. If you would like to engage directly, inquiring step by step, not rushing out posts, not hiding behind cut and paste quotes, then I am happy to examine anything you have a problem with in my posts and comment in turn. Or if you are over it as well and feel up for it, lets talk about Knowing, or Gnowing if you prefer and how that pertains to Magick... Seth.

Lol, worst reply ever! Why don't you go through my statements piece be piece and analyze and respond to them? Instead you hide behind words while accusing me of Diatribe, when I am the one who is actually addressing you point for point! Again you dishonestly say I do this or that, while providing no actual evidence. For instance, when you said: Lies Lies lies! Such Philosophical Cowardice! Where did I argue this? You think you can just make up Lies, all the while pretending to be Honest? You sir are a Liar. This is not an insult, as right here you are directly caught lying and slandering against me to win an argument! Despicable! I seriously thought more of you. If there was any truth to your statement you would be able to give an example like this: providing actual evidence from my written material... providing more evidence, not emotional reactive lying drivel and with further actual evidence that my truth is within time, and that that is indeed how I hold my sense reality together... Unfortunately It seems like you dont have an actual Inquiring or Honest bone in your body. You are busy telling people what my truth is, yet you never even asked what my truth is? Your dishonesty is of epic proportions! How can you state my truth is like... when you have no Idea at all what my truth actually is? How can you Lie to yourself and others so blatantly? Are you simply in love with your opinions? You give them freely on subjects you know nothing about. All because I challenge the BS in your writings? Did you realize that in every Inference you have made as to what I believe or stand for, you have never even been close to right? How does that make you feel? How does it feel to know that when you tell others what someone is Implying or saying, that you are actually blatantly Lying to both them and yourself? I myself simply question, and point out errors, as the history of this thread shows. This itself reveals the sick and territorial belief machine that is running under your hood. You would rather slander than have an uncomfortable debate, how sad.

one thing that stands out to me in our debates, is that i actually point out to you where you are wrong or clouded by beliefs, using your own words as an example. You on the other hand, make grandiose statements about how I couldn't Gnow a thing if I tried, and How I am Imprisoned by the 6 senses, and hate Truth! What gets funny is that you have not asked me any deeply Inquiring questions with your Totally Honest mind, to ascertain whether I am utterly free of Gnowing. So again your observation is based on pure belief/nothing observable, and is just an emotional response based on me pointing out the False in you. In fact, some of your replys read like an appeal to others, based on belief in an attempt to get others on side. That is very dishonest. You are accusing me of ... yet giving no credible examples. Thats the Kind of thing I would expect from a Christian Preacher, wait! They are Belief Monkeys and so are You! Because I am making no assumptions, and am just showing you your own delusions, you are getting Angry. You are showing yourself to be the kind of person who murdered Socrates. Lol he would have had a field day with you. He would read one sentence of yours, and see belief this, belief that... You keep saying that this is also true about me, but you have not showed how. My response here is Inquiring into your posts and finding no gold, but plenty of Belief yet you say I have no Interest in Inquiry? So I am pointing that out. Your appeals are based on nothing... on the contrary. you said: a Mahasiddha practices magick by manipulating the space–time holographic reality; as distinguished from magic or slight-of-hand practiced by theist illusionists. Nothing Inaccurate? You are an Intelligent guy, be honest for once. Here you denigrate the Practices and Characters of thousands of Magickians, who work within theistic systems, as being fraudulent tricksters. Magick is Magick mate. Buddhists, Tantrics, and Theistic traditions all practice energy practices, build the Will, and find ways of seeing the phenomenal world as Illusory... Every tradition has its miracle workers/healers/sages despite what you believe. In fact, if you read descriptions of the Wondrous works through history, the Mahasiddha's in no way come out on top as having more/better abilities. In fact they come across as pretty equal to the others. Multiple stories of being 2 or more places at once, levitating, healing, manifesting, raising the dead... Heheh Beliefs again? How do you know these things I ask you? By the way I am a great fan of the Mahasiddhas, but you are not one. Mind too clouded with Beliefs. How do you know: 1. What a mahasiddha is? 2. that your theorys cause my six senses pain? Do you 'Gnow' this, or did you just make it up? Sounds like more of your beliefs to me, not your innate 'Gnowing'! And I am not a child Vmarco, and understand that you were not there. Why denigrate children to try to denigrate me? What I am pointing out is that you 'Believe' this story 'religiously' or without question. You have posted it numbers of times and even written about it in your book, as if it is absolute truth, and as if you understand how to do it, and can teach others how to do it. As you seem to think yourself equal to tilopa, please provide Youtube link and show me such a feat Wait, The fish story is true and can be proved by Gnowing? So you are really saying Just believe me! Hey I have heard this kind of thing before, Hmm where was it, oh I remember, in Church! "Skeptics attack the historical foundations of our religion, but Jesus can only be Gnown through the Heart" "We gnow he is real!" Now why would you say this? Considering your great passion for this subject, I am willing to allow that you have probably had great moments of Gnowing. Thats not what I am debating about your posts. What I am debating is all the other stuff you pile on top of it. So why do you feel a need to reduce me to a single frequency, just because you don't like the tone of my typing? Again, this statement is a belief driven statement about me, and in no way is accurate to the reality of the Seth. Are you only comfortable/safe when someone who disagrees with you is TOTALLY wrong and Ignorant? If so that is very sad, dishonest and utterly cowardly. Therefore Its True!!! [belief alert!] Hmm I must be hitting a nerve? My posts are not diatribe, they are Inquiry. I do not wish to negate your posts. There is that black and white thing again, whats with that? I only wish to negate the False in your posts. Outside of your dogmatism and the various unexamined belief structures you hold, there is some good stuff in your posts that I enjoy. Really? How do you Gnow this? What is it based on? hehe: Beliefs again! Very defensive ones I might add I have spent the last 2 decades seeking and finding ways to refine my ability to 'Gnow' and I use Gnowing on a day to day basis - Gnowing free from constructs, conditioning, learning, time and thought. So far The only dishonesty seen in this thread is yours. As I have shown. I have not just said Vmarco is full of Beliefs, I have step by step shown it. You on the other hand have done just the opposite. You 'say' seth is this, seth does that, and show none of it. Even worse you purposely ignore the Important parts of a post to quible over some minor Issue, like whether Tilopa was a Buddhist or not, completely disregarding the points made... Here is another great example of you saying a lot yet showing nothing: It is a nonsense statement. Because I rejected some of your BS {belief system} in no way demonstrates that I am Imprisoned within the 6 senses. All It demonstrates is how Insecure you are about your beliefs. Otherwise you would not need to wholesale demonize and reduce an opposing perspective with such a cheap tactic. You hate Christians so Ill keep using them as I do think you are very Christian underneath it all. They felt that they were the only ones that were right, so they demonised everyone else {like you} and killed them. She is a Witch, Burn Her! All based on Beliefs. Imagine if they had taken the path of dialogue and debate to Investigate flaws and errors in their own or in others perspectives. {like me} Have some Honesty, be willing to consider that there may be flaws in things you say, as i am about myself. Seth.

Fragile? more like fluid, as I do not 'Believe' any theory or idea in my head with any certainty, hence I am chuckling once again at your posts, not feeling threatened.... What I do find annoying though is your black and white world view, and your fossilised belief structures, which you confuse for wisdom!

Wow, thankyou for such an articulate reply! Fortunately I don't need to be acquainted with the Gnowing you are talking about, or I might struggle with such a badly written description. Less fortunate is the fact that you don't seem to be able to tell the difference between your Gnowing and the rest of the stuff in your head! {your prolific unexamined Beliefs}

Blah blah blah, more Vmarco rubbish! lol, how do you gnow this? did you meet them? You have nothing but belief to go on surrounding their alledged capasities... Hehe, more unexamined belief from Vmarco! So Buddhists are the only people capable of magick! How convenient! And anyone not practicing is thus only an illusionist doing slight of hand? Again, How do you Gnow this? Well you don't! Again this is you just parroting your beliefs from your conditioned and unenlightened mind, which due being full of beliefs you are incapable of questioning, means you gnow nothing! Beliefs beliefs beliefs! Vmarco is full of unexamined beliefs!!!! I think it is fairly safe to say that you Vmarco did not meet every theistic mage to see for yourself if they were just doing sleight of hand. It is also fairly safe to say that you never practiced magick from a theistic tradition, or you would 'gnow' there is no sleight of hand involved. The Irony is not lost, that you use a Theistic mages spelling of the word Magick to seperate it from the common meaning of the word magic being for sleight of hand and illusion... lol, like you gnow that tilopa did such and such? Why dont you turn these Ideas against yourself and examine whats in your head before pointing the finger at others? Why do you 'believe' tilopa put meat back on a fish skeleton and made it swim through the air? Because you are a Be[lie]f Monkey, just like the worst Christians! Sure, but not all Theists fit this category. Imagine someone says "there is a God, its like such and such..." A belief monkey will say "ok I believe!" but a Philosopher says "ok that may be true, but I wish to see for myself" and then sets out to experience it for themselves. This was my path. I practiced the ways the Mystics describe, till I experienced it for my self. Sure I believed for a while 'This is God', because the deep experiences in mysticism are very convincing, both Internally and Externally, but In some way the more one experiences the more questions grow. Belief becomes irrelevant, as a lot of what happens, could be interpreted in many many ways. The mind becomes flexible and less black and white. God/Not God all becomes meaningless concepts in the mystery and the unexplainable phenomona. The experiences of a Living, Conscious, Intelligent and Interactive universe are real, but our interpretation of them may be not! Your black and white world view is a great contributor to the worlds lack of honesty. But don't worry about Magick in the world, Its alive and well. The Fraternities and Lodges are steadily improving the science that is Magick... Real Magick real results! Seth!