Seth Ananda

Cool

I Totally agree. How is this different from what I was saying? Also that truth is having an experiential aspect to it in your life, as in habits are changing easier... I see Anatta and E&DO as being in the category of Truth that is always true about all situations. Are there other Truths you would put in this category?

That makes sense to me, but what is your objection Vajra? I was also wondering about a point someone made earlier, if I read it right, about whether Insight was permanent or not. How would it be permanent? wouldn't it just arise moment to moment dependently tied to what ever it was having Insight into? That could seem permanent, but on close inspection could show it as really being an ongoing and connected series of moments? Thoughts anyone? To try to say it better, If the mind stream is made clear, and the mind stream itself is dependently originating, then the clarity of Insight is going to stop any further pollutants from entering the mind stream. In other words, clear mind gives rise to clear mind give rise to clear mind gives rise to clear mind...

Hmm please spell this out further.. If it has no experiential level to it, how can it be cognized, seen, or in any way understood? And if It can be known in some way or other, what effect would that knowing have on you?

Hmm, I am not sure I agree. The Absolute has an experience level to it as well, otherwise it would be completely meaningless and irrelevant. If you clearly see the nature of things, such as empty and dependently originating, do you really believe that your experience wont change? Seeing Anatta means seeing one's nature as selfless. That's what No self means. I can effortlessly see now the truth of no self. That's Absolute, as I understand it. The relative is that i am still a person, who answers to my name...

Aahahaha! I am not Enlightened, not by my standards anyway. when I can tell you how many molecules spun past in the moon last night, then maybe I'll 'allow' you to call me an omniscient Buddha Sure Its an 'enlightening' experience but there is a difference... For me it does also feel like a major step in the right direction. also, as I stated in the how to start a cult thread, I do have some misgivings about RT. Naturally I feel very grateful to them, for helping me gain liberation from the Illusion of some permanent fixed self. I think they have stumbled on a wonderful way to help people 'get it' and that is by applying pressure and not allowing discussion about other topics, so you can't wander away into extraneous details. It's like a thread that can't go off track and maintains the pressure till the subject is cooked. Unfortunately they think that swearing and a torrent of Insults may be a necessary part of the process. Now while I do not have a problem with this personally, I think many do. They state that the goal is to help many many people gain through their process, but unfortunately only a small number of people would step foot in their pages. They ban so many people who I think could have got it, with better Understanding. I Think the pressure is the key Ingredient, not a torrent of abuse and explicit language. Also I do not think their process is original as they claim. There are stories of Buddha enlightening people with a few powerful sentences. I have read many accounts over the years of a teacher helping his students 'get it' in crazy pressurized kinds of ways. One Zen master supposedly cut of his students finger to help 'enlighten' him. Ouch! I worry about the possibility of people just believing in the process with out seeing clearly within their own experience that there is no self. And I worry more so about weak minded, or just young or Impressionable people being bullied into just believing they 'get it' as I think may have happened already. That to me would be a disaster. People not getting it, going out trying to help people get it, and idolizing the abusive strategy's RT uses is a major recipe for disaster. But that said, if you are strong minded, don't feel phased by off language, and are up for the challenge, by all means head on over. Even if they help you get it, then find more skillful means to share the realization, then Its still a good thing.

Thanks as well As far as I understand, soul and spirit {the way I mean those words} are just as present as mind and body and emotions, But they are all dependently arising processes. To me there is the physical anatomy of the world and our body, and there is also the subtle or spiritual anatomy to the world and our body. This is just what I experience. For me at least, it would be a mistake to Identify with subtle elements just because they are subtle. They seem just as Interdependently arising as the physical body. To me, none of this constitutes the Fixed self fabrication that we make up and that causes so much trouble. The No self teachings do not remove anything but the need to make one [or many] of these aspects into - A core unchanging Identity to be clung to and believed in. - Our spirit changes and grows, so does our soul. The Light of the universe underlying everything is also changing and is also dependently arising with the phenomenal world. I am still a person and still exist, and answer to my name. I just no longer have a belief that there is some part of me that that is the real me. I am free of needing to be anything. This is why I love certain aspects of Buddhist philosophy above all others. Everywhere else I have looked, there is still a tendency to try to be something. Even if it is something as subtle and mysterious as awareness or consciousness, when I decide that that is actually my true Nature, [and it may well be] I create subtle levels of grasping after self. Those traditions might be totally right, and we may really be awareness underneath it all, but In Buddhism I am freed from the need to be anything [in a clingy manner]. That's the Joy of no self. Its totally open, allowing experience as it is, honoring of all its parts and processes, and getting in the way of nothing. Grasping is tension, and leads to suffering. if I have to be awareness, then one day when I feel really stuck in the material realm and all those spacious feelings have lessened, then I will feel bad, and want to get back to that state. It creates state dependency. For me I am done with state dependency. I lived in bliss for a few years and became utterly bliss fixated. I was like a junky. If something bugged me all I had to do was focus on my mantra a little harder, and a massive wave of bliss would wash away any sense of irritation. I was self fixated, state dependent and not particularly available to others. Now I am easily with others. I went to a party tonight a sat with many people in easy, natural and affectionate connection. No trying, no force, I must be Hypnotized. If you can Hypnotize someone into this realization then great. That will do a world of good for them. Trust me, Its amazing. The Hypnotist question is really not particularly useful if you understand Hypnotism. Basically we are all hypnotized all the time. every view we hold is how we have been molded and shaped. So whether i am hypnotized or not is a moot point. I'll answer one question with a question. Is absence of proof for Santa claws proof that he doesn't exist? The self that you are asking about is a fairy tale. A Myth. If you really have a self somewhere, that is always with you and never changes, shouldn't it be really obvious? you mean it has to be really obvious right? so where is it? point at it for me? Find a single thing and say 'here it is! this right here, this is my self!' Like a fairy tale santa, suddenly one day you realize 'Hey this guy is nowhere to be seen, he is just a myth.' Where is the sense of suspicion that maybe this self you have been taught to believe in from every angle of the world around you, that you have never seen one shred of evidence for, is possibly just wool pulled over your eyes...? I think the most Important thing about this subject is not how philosophically correct it is or is not, nor whether one is merely hypnotized, but whether it really has serious potential to help people take a large step towards ending suffering... It has done this for me, and that is why I am sharing my experiences. I have changed beliefs many times over the years, sometimes with great results in my actual life, like when giving up particularly negative beliefs, but nothing has come remotely close to this. If just believing in it could do this, I would say go ahead and believe. Unfortunately belief is not required, and does not help get the realization. It may even get in the way. You have to see it clearly for your self. If this path towards ending suffering is not for you, that is fine. I hope you do well in your respective path, and come back to share your learning's and to help others. But this path works. It's amazing. It does not lead to Nihilism at all. That's my experience of it so far - which is only one month. [free from anxiety, panic and medication] So Awesome! Blessings to all. Seth.

Hilarious! did you read how I said this realization is helping me feel more connected to others? Feel free to call BS though First I should probably explain the language I am using, so we may further understand each other. When I say self, I mean the Idea that we are some actual thing, somewhere inside or encapsulating our general physical Location. I at least [and I imagine most other people as well, but i'll try to speak for myself] used to walk around believing in this 'entity' at the core of my experience. When I said 'I' it came with an inner conviction that it was coming from the real Me. When asked to 'pretend' to look, {nice condescending opening to dialogue there bye the way, thank you very much, I wish I had seen what you wrote before you edited your post } I was looking at this assumption that we all hold, that there is this core to my identity. That's what I found when I looked. when expressing thoughts I would say "I think" and all that that was coming from was an 'I thought' which is really just a thought, no more or less Important than any other thought. My feeling nature had 'I Feelings' which were really just Feelings themselves, no more or less valuable than any other feeling. I thoughts, I feelings, just thoughts and feelings. Where is this mysterious self that we hang so much on, and spend so much time trying to defend? No where. Even Awareness does not constitute a self. There is actually very little we can say about awareness apart from that it experiences stuff. No one has ever experienced awareness it self, and It may not even be one thing. It is possible that the Visual awareness is quite different to say our hearing awareness, and who could tell anyway? We can not separate our awareness from the experience of the senses as they arise in the various moments. To say 'I am awareness' is really just the mind coming in with an Interpretive process to add an 'I thought' to the simple experience of awareness which is already their without needing any thought added. Once I saw clearly through all this, I realized that what I had taken to be my self was really just an Internal narrative, A false story built up on 'I thoughts' and on 'I Feelings' and that all the fighting, stress, defensiveness and anxiety were just that story in action against the world. The story was the only thing to disappear. All my thoughts and feelings are still their, I pay the bills, eat porridge, and relate better than ever with others - usually... As I have stated I can still have strong emotions, act like a dick and so on, but that stuff is far less as it is no longer held together by that false Idea. We are really just processes of the Universe, all arising together, streams of experience and awareness, with no real Underlying nature. We are totally interchangeable, Interdependent with each other and the universe and all in this together. In the general locale or Gamut of our Body/mind/hearts we feel, Love, get hurt, long for happiness and an end to suffering, and when the story of being some solid unchanging or 'Real' thing ends, we come closer to this. That False Idea of being a Self, is the underlying Matrix for Suffering. See that this strange alleged self, is actually Impossible to find anywhere within you, and then realize that it is not only just Impossible to find, but you have never had the tiniest scrap of evidence that it is their or real in your entire existence! It has never been seen, experienced, felt or interacted with in any way, ever. What does that tell you? You should be starting to get very suspicious by this point about it's 'alleged' existence. Great Blessings on your path - what ever it is.

Hehe Thanks, always go further but stop seeking hey? Sailor bob Lives near bye, I have seen him before and am planning to again. Fortunately the No self teaching does not leave a self or a not self to cling to. its not based on an Idea, Its just based on the fact that you can not see or experience any form of 'self' anywhere, or ever, in any way what so ever. In other words it clears the mind of a false Idea. That leaves an expansive spacious sensation which fluctuates in Intensity, but who is there to cling to that? Always going further occurs naturally, as it is natural for me to read and practice, simply because doing so was always a passion for me. I will thoroughly enjoy going as far as I can, but its no longer from a sense of striving... Nargajuna is helping Immensely. I was seeing No self clearly in 'me' but he is helping me see it clearly in the phenomenal world. That being said there is that duality of words. Me and World. Its not really like that any more either... I am also getting a lot out of Greg Goode, Rupert Spira, and Dzogchen and Mahamudra readings. Blessings to all these great teachers... I do feel though that one has to be careful lumping all the variety of Nondual experiences together into 'one indescribable' event. There are different levels of non dual experience with differing levels of subtlety. Over the next year or so I will do a massive study of Nondual teachings and states. I wish to utterly clarify my communication abilities, to be of the greatest benifit to others that I can be. Jed McKenna is on the list... Thanks everyone for all the best wishes P.S. AdiShakti, my name is Seth Ananda

Why do you continue to nearly have good posts, then fall short of the mark? Analyzing the 'Church of progress' and any inherent assumptions it has made is a good thing, especially in our world which is quickly drying up its resources. But then you chuck out a bunch of absolutist statements like the above. You often claim to be just challenging scientific fundamentalism, but you come off sounding like you are probably [really underneath it all] a lurking religious Fundamentalist. Why don't you come clean about what you are, what you practice, what religious Inclinations you have or not? At least when I have asked, or the others that I have seen who asked, you never give an honest direct answer. It makes people uneasy and gets in the way of you having better dialogues with others. People do not trust you because of your shifty dodging of these questions. I myself tend to think he's a Jehovas witness, no a Falun head, no just a Christian Fundie, no he talks about cultivation... and these thoughts and Impressions continue to circle around. Then I Think no he may not be any of these, but is just someone who enjoys thinking about scientific possibilities that have not been thought of, or are ignored by main stream science. So which is it? What are you? Where do you stand religious or spiritual wise? who are we talking too? When you pump ID, what is your motivation for that?

Both Awesome movies.... And Great Idea Taomeow

Good points all. But, when he said the mad God thing, I do not think he means that literally, the way many crazy cult leaders believe it - Adi Da, Li Hong Zhi... that said, you still make good points, and I myself have always wondered about the possibilities for the place to go Evil Cult. It remains to be seen. There was a guy here in the RT thread who claimed he was bullied into accepting No self as a belief, with all kinds of negative consequences [dizziness, distortion...] and it seems pretty clear to me that he was not done, even though they may have Blued him when he started to parrot them... That concerns me and always did. The possibility that people who are not strong in their personalities yet [maybe just young], could just get bullied into accepting with out really seeing, would be a disaster. I am very strong in my personality, so cannot be bullied into something. These are all things I worried about reading various thread... It is possible he may have discovered a system that really works, and will continue to work, that rely's on the controversial technique of goading, haranguing and Insulting the student into Liberation from Self. Getting called a cowardly dick headed fuck face who is to chicken shit scared to just look to see if there is a Self, anywhere... tends to make people sweat, and feel a very Heightened sense of them selves - which is potentially very good for Inquiry. It is much like many Zen stories where the Zen master uses any dirty tactic to Liberate his student. I myself grew up in a Cult. ours was no 3 on the Australian dangerous Cults list, and since i left I have studied Cults in great depth. At points I even deliberately joined them to gain more insight into cult dynamics. Unfortunately what I see there could send it the way of Falun, if they are not careful. Ciaren has mentioned that No self does not end suffering. An Asshole who realises No self will probably still be an Asshole. But he has said it does end the Matrix that suffering depends on, - the belief in being someone... It certainly reduces suffering [iME] but time will tell. I still think RT [at least for the moment] is an Invaluable resource for the strong minded...

lol, nothing of the kind goes on. He is not a messiah, he has no deeper Insight into No self that anyone else there and is in general far more fucked up [baggage wise] than most of the other people. And as I already stated in the RT thread, if you want to argue or debate or make friends, then RT is not the place for you - join a philosophy club, and theorise for the rest of your life... RT's one and only purpose is to help people realise No self. You go there and you look. That's it. Worked for me...

http://www.ruthlesstruth.com/arena/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=1122

Hmm Ruthless Truth was good for me. I get that they may be seen that way, but it was not my experience with them. Mind you I understood right from the start exactly what they offer, how they help you achieve it and thus I understood how to use my time there. I did not waste any time theorising. I did not try to debate them, or convert them to my super philosophy! I told them what I was experiencing in relation to any Ideas/thoughts/feelings of self that I was having. They then asked me further questions about it which I answered. Finally I gained the realisation of no self. The Ideas were old to me but the environment they have there, where they put pressure on you to really look, as if your life depended on it, that is what helped me get it. I am planning to write a piece on the experience of No self, but want to watch it for longer. All I can say is it is awesome and utterly simple at the same time, and has nothing to do with belief. All the content [mind/attachments/emotions/baggage/blah blah] is still there, but before hand, There was a central set of Ideas [the Idea of being someone] holding all those little stories together. I am still free to fly off the handle in a threesome thread, or act like a tool when triggered, but at the same time the intensity is greatly reduced, as well as many desires and attachments. To tell you the truth I am still getting used to it. Parts of myself [my stories or history] are just surfacing and unwinding by them selves. I am amazed at how many Issues are just resolving themselves, without me doing anything at all... I do not see Cirian as a cult leader, in the negative sense, although there will always be sycophantic behaviour around anyone who stands up and does something like him. I am not one of those people, and I do not believe what he is doing is as original as he thinks. Nor do I think they have to be as rude as they often are. In some of the threads I have thought 'you may be liberated but your still a dick head' They have only been running for a year and hopefully they will get better and better at dealing with the different views they encounter. Time will tell whether it degenerates or gets good and massive. Either way I find it hard to imagine it will go down quietly At the same time, they are helping large numbers of people gain an amazing Insight. One that could very well be a Major turning point in a persons spiritual life. Blessings.

I do not myself think we are alone. I have had my own strange experiences with an Extra Terrestrial, but physical as it was, there is always a part of me that chucks out the possibility that I could have generated it myself some how. I Have seen Hypnoticly Induced subjects 'Halucinate' and interact with 'physical' visions. That said my partner of old saw my Alien friend, and I did not see the hypnosis subjects 'friend'. There is always the possibility of mass hallucination, but that seems a bit off to me. I find it even weirder when Skeptics write off something many people see as 'mass hallucination' considering the telepathic implications such a phenomena would have, for every one to be hallucinating the same thing at the same time... Then again, I used to put a lot of energy into Kali devotion, as I just love her as a Goddess. When I took up extensive fasting and doing puja's she would appear in my room and dance for me. I would be riveted with ecstasy, every drop of blood falling from her tongue would nearly destroy me. But then one day as I felt her coming on, I felt a subtle kind of wrenching from my balls and deep abdomen and it felt as if her Image [she seemed real] was somehow chucked out from within me... It was not quite the same after that, as I felt I was witnessing a part of my self. Please note, I am not claiming to be the divine mother of course... I am just chucking out uncertainties, to alleviate being overly attached to ones view of the experiences we may have. But I think it would be very strange, and almost Incredible if we were actually alone. I just don't think the universe/Life would waste all that space.

Hehe, he has an alternate trilogy called 'An Illuminatus Trilogy' set back round the founding of America, which I actually think is a better read than His and Shea's Illuminatus trilogy - which I loved by the way as well... A lot of people over looked that work because the title is so similar, I think they think its the same book. The first in its series is called 'the widows son' then 'the earth will shake' and then 'Natures God'. The main character is named Sigismundo, and it spans his journey from Sicily through the secret society's, his blood brother Caglistro, and his landing in the new world... But he is not the only character, they are all exceptional... Mind you the books get weirder and weirder, and the hilarious foot notes get longer and longer and progressively stranger, and the last book is probably half foot notes... lol Read up if you are a RAW fan

I love RAW. read em all, several times. My favourite was Schrodingers cat, Prometheus rising and his 'An Illuminatus Trilogy' which is not the Illuminatus trilogy and was not co written with Bob shea.

I am part way through all of these except Goode's book which I am reading again Natural Perfection, by Keith Dowman. Standing as Awareness - Greg Goode The transparency of things - Rupert Spira The precious treasury of the basic space of phenomona - Longchenpa You are the eyes of the world - Longchenpa The passion of the western mind - Richard Tarnas The sun of wisdom - Khenpo Tsultrim Gyamtso Depth over time - Swami Khecaranatha The lost secret of Death - Peter Novac and Loy's - Non Duality, which should have arrived by now... lol And two of Eugine Gendlins books which I have to read for school - Focusing & Let your body Interpret your dreams. I really want to read more on ecology and the mind, developmental studies, and brain plasticity... I really need new book shelves. mine are collapsing under the weight....

Hi Badogue, I am glad things are Improving for you That technique is called the 'Shallow thrust' in Taoism, and yes it is good to minimise excitement for the man. Your not drawing out so fat that the sensitive head of the penis gets to close to the tighter entrance of the vagina. There are some other things that may help. One is a good woman who can guide you into her while she helps you process any feelings of tension/anxiety/nervousness that can often cause a man to come to early... A lot of men hold deep beliefs around, making love with a woman, getting what they want from a woman, feeling like they 'have' to perform like some sexual super hero, and especially an almost chronic fear of not pleasing the Woman. [that often relates to our fear of disappointing our own mothers. lol] For some men, Its just a performance issue, [though the fear of disappointing mum still may be relevant ] and once they perform adequately, say through a technique like yours, that fear dissipates and soon they are having sex like a star, so well done. Seth.

If you suddenly experience non-duality, what will the difference be between you and your girlfriend, or anything else for that matter? Anyway, the 5th is full of Dakini's [in my fantasy anyway... lol]

There is a Chikung form that Involves growling and dog like noises, but I can't remember what it is called, or who does it. I think I heard about it first here at TTB's.

Anyone not a student of these Tenaga 'Masters' can punch any one of them in their useless faces. Put any master anywhere who claims to be able to use his chi 'only' to flip someone away, or to deflect his attacker, with zero contact... put them next to any real martial artist who is trained to fight, Including me, and watch them/me punch the noses right off their tenaga faces... lol Now all nonsense aside, Full respect goes to their energy cultivation system, but over and over again these lame ass demo's have been shown to only work on that masters students, or on students who really believe in that masters abilities... Some one show the golden bamboo school to this noob.

Hehe, I have been to 5 Rainbow gatherings here in Australia, but none of the International ones, nor unfortunately a world gathering, which is the largest of the species, with only one called a year. Here is my Report. I Love Rainbow, its my favourite kind of festival. No money involved whatsoever. everyone works [who wants to] to make the festival happen. The funny thing is because of the communal nature of the event, You [meaning me, who is generally lazy] find your self wanting to work, to help it all happen. I often found myself doing 12 hour days, quite happily. I think because I was working with others for something that felt good. I have had some extremely heart opening moments there, and it began the healing of that part of me that thinks people are shit. To see beautiful people together, supporting each other and working together, in a feeling of love, for the good of everyone there... Moved me to tears a number of times. its a great social experiment, and when you go back to your normal life, It will cause some interesting reflections. It has some strong cliques. there are your travellers who are usually all round good value. I have made so many good friends over the years there. the Fleathers [feather and leather crew] are their usual pain in the ass, not quite sure if they can trust a person who doesn't have dreads, and want to be an American Indian who smokes lots of pot and talks about 2012. They are usually just very insecure people and not that bad. Still even there there are some Gems among them. then there is the Hippy/spiritual crew. Most of them do yoga, study advaita or some eastern philosophy, and love listening to deva premal, shimshai, Tina amalia... Chanting bliss heads. Only a small percentage of them do drugs, most are extremely 'pure' vegan types. There are usually a few INCREDIBLY anal types in here, but some of the loveliest people i have ever met are in here. Devotional souls with Big hearts dedicated to simple service. Then there is your 'Action types' who are more uncomfortable sitting still. survivalists, anarchists, activists... They do get a lot done. They are who I go to when I need some sparring. There is always a handfull of obsessive martial artist types in there... You can usually recognise their camps by the series of 'massive' masterfully suspended tarps, tree scaling equipment, and cammo not rainbow colours. Then the Families. They Often camp together to minimise party noise too close to kids trying to sleep. they would be from any group that ended up with child, and thus started clanning with like minded parents. There is usually a smaller group of 'philosopher' types, who are usually sitting around debating whatever... then there are the more normal alternative types, that just love rainbow, or just do not feel the need to join exclusively, one particular clique. All that said, these are obviously general category's, and there are many people who blur or transcend all these subjective boundaries. I would go to any Rainbow, any time anywhere if I had the resources. The toilets are a ditch dug in the ground that you straddle and squat over, then partially fill in. Little walls get put up for privacy. Rainbow is always always next to running water, so the swimming is wonderful. We try to do them with permission from the locals, who usually come down for a gander. many end up staying after seeing their first naked hippy girl. and the tribe looks after them well, educates them when they get Inappropriate, as sometimes happens when a hard core redneck stumbles across a bunch of stunning faries naked in the bushes. There are so many Golden moments at a Rainbow. But plenty of shit ones too. The talking circle, while fun at first, now drives me nuts. I refuse to stay longer than half an hour these days. Having to hear crap poetry from 400+ hippies while they hold the talking Feather or stick, is extremely testing. I forget the exact format, but if you want the full experience, go to the seed camp. It starts sometimes up to two months before the gathering, and that is all the preparation set up. I love this. It may mean you get near 3 months camping with good people. Nothing I like more... At seed camp its digging shit pits, making the kitchen, with running warer if possible. Making food storage, making sure washing happens down stream from swimming holes, collecting the donation money and getting the masses of food that will be needed, setting up first aid spaces, organizing where parking will happen, making sure emergency vehicles will be able to get in and out, clearing bramble from camping areas, setting up the various communal covered Tarps, tipi's and yurts, liaising with local council and police. { the cops so far have loved us, and at one came in each night for that 'strange drink' called chai lol } Anyway. I think thats it. The absence of alcohol makes it a very un-aggressive event, so that is a good thing. Stoned people are boring, but not problematic. Drunk people can be quite a different kettle of fish. Nearly every ugly moment I can think of, where we had to physically restrain someone and call the cops was when that person was drunk. so no alcohol. [its a dick head substance anyway, government allowed, to keep workers enslaved. No one would work most of their life in a shit job, if they could not go home and have a drink afterwards. anyway I digress] Great community of people, plenty of politics [like any group]. And also this is all about the Australian gatherings I have been too. I hear they are much larger overseas but with a similar vibe.

I cant believe no one found that Funny! lol