Pietro

I, for one, want to thank you. For one time, quite a unique event, here was a poll where I had two different options that I both agreed with. I don't even remember which of the two I chose, as I was so balanced between them. Pietro

leaving aside the differences in the map, and looking at the differences in the methods. They both want the channels to be generally open. And I said generally because it is more complicated, but let's leave this aside. The way in which the channels are open are different. Even antithethical. While the taoist practices tries to make the flow very smooth and even, the yoga system tries to temporaly reduce or stop the flow in some channels, to then open it all at once. Like a water dam that holds the water up, and then lets the water rushing out to clear the bed of the river. SO you have all those practices of pranayama (for example) in yoga where you hold a nostril (which effectively compresses one of the side channels, as it also closes the armpit, btw), and then release it, while closing the other. BTW, according to the meditation teacher I follow not only the yogic system and the taoist system is different, but also the buddhist the chinese medicine, and the kunlun are also different between them. I am just refering what he sais, as I have no experience with KL.

I'll answer the belief part: We don't give a damn about believes. In fact we don't believe in believes. We don't consider the question is there a God to be of ANY importance. If there is, good; if there isn't, good. In both cases you will act ethically and morally because ethics and morality is its own reward. As such we don't also follow external set of rules on what is good or uncool. But you are supposed to research this by yourself in yourself. In this we are somehow similar to buddhist which consider the question is there a god in itself a source of suffering so they just avoid it. Not unsmart! Out of many generations of practicians we have learned that the best way to start a spiritual journey is from the body. SO we make the body healthy, and then we go on. So you will need to find someone who guides you into becoming healthy, and then he will explain you about the dantiens, and all that jazz. But make me a favour, do not confuse the indian system with the chinese system. They do have some weird relationships, but I would not equate dantiens with chakras. Plus, do you know what a chakra is? Because if not it really is of no use to know how a chakra (that you ignore) relates with a dantien (that you ignore too) In any case... Wecome onboard: Everything Furthers Pietro

Yes, would be great to be able to edit your position, so we can keep it up to date! I travel too much, it just does not make sense to write where I am, just where I will be eventually. BTW, quite a Norway community we have. We should start a sub-forum on the Norse gods

Yes, I think that the correct way of looking at the situation, in this little irrelevant corner of TBs, is that I am ok with you, and you are not ok with me. Procurator, growant said that you might have committed a crime. Would you be willing to tell us where do you live, and/or to contact the local authorities? Pietro And, in case anyone wonders, no I am not being ironic.

When was the last time you heard me asking Sean to interveene, because someone has been un-nice to me? Should I forward you the PMs I received over the years, that would make the procurator email sound a nice educated answer? (At least he explained why he wasn't answering!) FACT: most human beings are either racist, or misoginist, or sexist, or homophobic, or dislike people from other parts of the worls, other cultures, other religions, or who are just called John. By most I mean more than 90%. In fact I suspect it is higher than 98%. It all boils down to our genetic, and the fact that we are primates, and as monkeys we don't like monkeys of the other tribe. We dislike them. Most monkeys (and I place humans among them) would if unchecked first kill a monkey of another tribe, and then maybe feel guilty. Yes monkeys are able to have emotions similar to human beings. They can have compassion and guilt. Generally after. Forcing everybody to behave does not make everybody not a racist, but makes everybody a liar. Worse, someone who is even lying to himself. I am not saying that everybody hates jews, or nigers -sorry black men- - sorry coloured men-, -sorry african american... even when they have never been to africa, or to america- , or homosexuals. What I am saying is that most of us, dislike someone. And we do so for deep unexplained, often unexplainable reasons. We do this because we feel those persons as different. So what? Get over it! Some time ago I saw a really nice adv. It said: "Some people are queer! Get over it!". It also works the other way: "Some people are racist! Get over it!". We are practitioners, no one can change the whole world, but we can change ourselves. I find this thread shameful. Tao Bums, what has happened to you? Why are we having all those threads, should this or that person be banned? You are acting like an old grumpy lady. You want the whole world to be your way or you get offended. It is ok to offer compassion to a person who has been wronged, but we are not the karmic police. Let the karmic police be the karmic police, and stick to dissolve your karma. Also we need to divide between what happens in PM and what happens in public. I think it is fair to expect people to keep a certain level of decency in a public forum, at least to avoid it to reach a point where actual comunication is no longer possible, but can we really expect Sean to police the PM between two adult individuals? I think Sean should just answer like Twitter did: I am sorry, but we are just a carrier, like a phone network. If you have a problem contact directly the authorities. More than that, you can ignore the PM from Procurator, what else do you want? You want him to be punished because he does not like Jews. Now something about name calling, and name calling black people in particular. I come from Rome, we don't have so much weight on the world niger. We never had slavery. I mean, we never had slavery of only black people, we would just have any other population a slave. I suppose you could call us equanimous. SO when I was 3 (1973) my father explained me that there was people who had a darker skins, and those people where called negri (nigers). When I was 6 I was told that the word niger was very offensive in america and so now everybody in the world had to use the word coloured. I was naturally easygoing so I made no fuss about having to change my vocabolary. Then when I was 12 I was explained that Coloured was now considered even more offensive, and instead I had to use the word black. And finally some years ago I was explained that now the word black was offensive too and we should call black people african american. Even the ones from Italy? Even the ones from Italy. Sorry but I think all this is very silly. It is walking around the problem, and not facing it. I dislike having to change my vocabulary, but I really dislike this culture of whimpering where everybody indulges in feeling wronged because someone called him in the wrong way. But he himself is allowed to use those words and those jokes. Jews can make jokes about jews, but no one else can. Black people can call people nigers, but no one else can. And let's not speak about muslim people because the situation there is even worse. And what is worse is that all this is untrue. Is a fake. A play pretend. Here is where I realised it: When I grew up I use to use the word black. I used the word niger only one time. I was in the military service, and I had a friend who was also doing the military service. He was black. He was also an alpha male, ex boxer, and communist (at least we had something in common). He would get offended all the time. In a fascist culture like the italian militars, it made for an interesting contrast. Especially because being a good boxer he was very respected. AT the end of the year we had a discussion and I told him that only because he was a niger he did not have the right to be offended for every expression people used. Yes I used to word niger. That time he was not offended. Maybe being accused to be offended all the time, and then acting offended was too much, or maybe he felt there was no spitfullness behind my words. What really surprised me was that I never used that word. It was interesting that in the heat of a discussion I forgot all my political correct bullshit education, and just went for the first word I have been taught when I was a kid. And to conclude, you know why I like Bruce? Because he speaks directly with no bullshit. I never heard him paraphrase something, unless he was being ironic. People get offended around him all the time. So what? He likes to be so, and if you want to learn from him you need to accept him. Yes you need to accept someone who is not politically correct. He still has compassion, he just does not pretend. And funny enough when he tries to be more politically correct his teachings arrive less strong. And there is probably a teaching even in this. edited for grammar

BINGO!

It looks like more and more people are hooked up to porn. And I know that how to stop having meaningless sex is a big issue in this community. So I would like to share a book I just found on the internet: The Porn Trap: The Essential Guide to Overcoming Problems Caused by Pornography I have not read it all though. But it is very interesting from the start. It seems that pornography never was a porblem until the internet so much that many doctors would suggest to use it to deepen a relationship. Now some 75% of divorces claim the use of pornography of one of the partner (85% of the time the man) as one of the causes. BTW if anyone has also found a book on how to free yourself from the addiction of downloading books on the internet let me know. I might be in the process of treading one addiction for another. Oh, yes, you might need to register on gigapedia to download the file. I could put directly the link, but since it is copyrighted material it is better not to.

And yet, at the time of Lao Tzu, there were teachings about empiness that predates the arrival of any buddhist teachings in China. An example of those are present in the Nei Yeh as translated by Harold Roth.

While having Li Jiong leaving seems an easy solution, and maybe the best one, as he does not seem to be ready to be in such a company of mature practitioners. It does leave a bit of bitter after taste in the mouth. AT least in mine. I feel, I wish he didn't took the easy way out from an obviously difficult positions, and had instead choose to remain, pay off his karmic debt, and join the community at large. I still would prefer he did so, it makes me feel the energy woud be smoother around the whole topic. I would like to add that many of us had embarassed ourselves in the first contact with this community. A bit like kids wetting themselves on the first day of school. The group energy here is very strong, and although it is a bit easier to handle it with the possibility to re-edit your own entries. There are very few people who did not went through this sort of initiation. I feel he had a lot to share, if not anything else, his single headed trust in the method he is following. I hope he be well wherever he goes, and comes back when really he has the roots and the humility to teach. What was that chinese phrase: the more the grain is full the more it bends it head. or similar.

Maybe we should ask for a self suspend button. Each of us can press it and define the number of days. Also if this means not being able to read as well as to write. A bit like the "take a break" button on google mail (you have to have the google lab installed to see it). Maybe if we pool some resources we could get someone to write the patch to add it. Just think what an inprovement in anybody's life

Hi, thanks for answering me. Sounds like you you feel the need to be acknowledged. And you felt threatened by him. Am I correct? Pietro

Well, part of the problem we have right now, is that we have a global economy, but not a global governance. The good side of it, is that we can enjoy websites like thepiratebay which if not, would not be possible. In any case the final decision is inside Li Jiong heart. He will decide to do what he wants. There is no global human law that can force him to give back the money. But I am pretty sure that he will if he feels that that is the right thing to do. Why? Because he said so.

Hello Li Jiong. I only know your course by the description rookie does of your course, there is a more mundane description of the external part of the technique, and then a more advanced, and internal side. Rookie was aware of the external side, but not on the internal one. On the other side, as you have explained not everybody can benefit from your course. Now the interesting side is that he was able immediatly to discern that he was not going to be satisfied with the course himself. Also I would suggest you against closing a pay pal account. Because they are quite versatile things, and might be useful. You have said that you would be willing to give him back the money if he admits that he could not use your course. I need t say that my heart rebels against this request, because it feels as very humiliating. Please do not ask someone to humiliate himself, to release your bond with him. Let him go. It will free you, too. I also feel it is in rookie right to express his disappointment, not just in losing his money, but in not being able to reach what he was expecting to reach. I don't think you should be angry with him because of that. And this will stop people who would in any case not reach anything from your course, from getting involved. Now look at all this in this way. Rookie could not use the external part of the course, for he already knew it. He also could not have any use of the internal part of the course (as for example craig could). He felt so, immediatly and since your method can only help some people, do you want to punish him further for that. Ultimately the decision is inside your heart. You know if you should give him back the money or not. But he was able to discern immediatly that he was not going to be helped by your course. Why not helping him some other way? Well, if you read it all, thank you Pietro

Hmm, I did start a taoist wiki, many lifetime ago. it was called taotewiki. Ask around and the old skool here will still remember it. But then I discontinued it since I was the only one to write in it. Or better, after one year when it came the time to pay for the next round, and once I realised I was the only one to use it, I pulled the plug. Part of the problem, I think, was that each school in taoism sees the world quite differently. So instead than quarelling on everything, we just preferred to work our differences here. Now I am more hopeful that each school of taoism would start their own wiki. Here, my idea was also that we should have, after every thread, when we have reached a consensus, wrote it down on the wiki. As well as having a FAQ page. But, you see, people over here are not interested in building something here. I say this with no offence meant, it's just not in the interest here. I collaborate with another website: metagovernment.org. We are trying to build a software to let communities govern themselves in a better way. By a mixture of wiki, slashdot karma, and maths based tag cloud measure. A very geeky project. Fits us. Both online and offline community (although the software only work for online communities). Well, when we started a wiki there, it flew. We were only few people, but we all started to collaborate. One line me, one you, and soon we have some good material out there. But over there we all wanted to build something. There was excitment. There was the promise of doing something that could really have an effect. It all boils down to the question, why are we all here. If you take away the people who are here to sell, those that are here to buy, and those that are here to rant, or to meet their mates, and generally to gossip about this or that master, there is very little left. But please, start one. Start a wiki, I'll play along, and at least we'll be in two. Pietro

Good clarification. I think our friend could not change his modus operandi because it was part of the color. Somehow the more insulting he was, the more ludicrous his posts were. But of course then he changed his name and came back as Cat, and so all is well. Except sometimes the mask still falls off. Sorry, permission denied, you cannot leave! but, nice try.

Wonderful! I laughed so hard (seeing the pic) I must have woken up the neighbors. Maybe we should post the pic to appear every time he is trying to hard. That would be enough of a punishment!

Yes, I would agree. Very well expressed... but unfortunately false. Not unfotunately for you, unfortunately for us all! Life would be easier if you were right. I do agree that But pornography does not work only on humans but also on monkeys. Male monkeys are willing to give up their bananas to look at pictures of the butt of female monkeys. The fact is that the idea that the problem lies in society has been an idea, a theory, that has been with us for a long time. And it really has gone full swing in the 60s and 70s. What happened them? That we started take psychological tests on kids more seriously I assume. That seeing baby girls tuck their train under the blankets, saying "It's alright little train, have a good night", and baby boys using Barbie dolls to shoot like a gun, really went home. That the fact that if you ask to a kid to complete the phrase :"I play with...", male kids say: "I play with [this toy, that toy]" while female kids say: "Iplay with [this other kid, that other kid]" also went home. But what really happened was that we started a) measuring the way hormones are released inside the human body. understanding how hormones influence the development, and your expression c) measuring how all this happened in animals. d) And finally, very recently, study how this is different between men and women. I would address you to three books. The Alchemy of Love and Lust from Theresa L. Crenshaw The Female Brain from Louann Brizendine and The Red Queen: Sex and the Evolution of Human Nature by Matt Ridley. for a start. (Both the female brain and The red queen effect are available from gigapedia, where there is actually quite a library on the biological root of gender differences) All three are divulgative science, easy to read by anyone, but written by scientists in their respective area, and with a bibliographic reference for each claim. At least one of those books, was written by a woman who started being fully convinced that gender differences were a social construct. Then she had a boy... Those are the books that I read, but while looking for the title of the first one, just today, I realised the immense body of literaure that in the meantime has sprouted out. Just look into the "Customers Who Bought This Item Also Bought" section on Amazon. And among some trash you will find some authenthic gems of scientific studies on the topic. Among the ones from which I would start is: Why Gender Matters: What Parents and Teachers Need to Know about the Emerging Science of Sex Differences by Leonard Sax. May I suggest that at least you read the Amazon presentation of those books. Respect to the three books I cited, The famale brain will explain you how the brain is really different between a boy and a girl. And the difference starts in the womb. Some hormones get released at certain times of gestation. If this happens correctly then at puberty other hormones get released too, and all goes well. The boy is a boy, the girl is a girl, and they attract each other. But sometimes things don't go smoothly. For example, with twins of different genders you can have a problem, because the hormones released by one fetus get absorbed by the other fetus. Making their gender difference less strong. So the first will give you an idea of the importance of hormones and biology in the sexual relationship environment. The second will clarify how women are really different creatures. And the third? The third is there to show how humans and animals are REALLY similar. Take another common myth. The myth of poligamy and monogamy (and btw, I am in full support of poligamy). The myth is that human beings are corrupted by society. And because of this they cheat on each other. If not they would be monogamous (according to most women and most christians) poligamous (according to most men). Except that: a) animals cheat too. In humans, the amount of cheating does not depend on the social status nor the culture a person is in. Wherever they have measure the number of people who were not born of their legal father they always found about the same number. (Something REALLY high, I think even 1 in 5!). The data is in the red queen effect. So animals do it too. It does not depend on society. It depends on biology. Ok, so much for the theory that it is all a social constructed problem. But why is it so? And here I can only suggest my own personal opinion, which is not endorsed by any research grant of any kind. It happens so because from nature point of view this is the best way to have kids on the next generations. You see a society full of zen males, who balance their sexuality perfectly, is not going to be good from the point of view of nature. In general they will not produce enough ofspring and they will not be controlled by females enough. And why is it important that male are controlled sexually by females? Not because they are superior, but because they are needed to keep the kids safe. So, I agree: But nature, not society is the culprit. And it takes hard work to get free of it. ANd even if you do get free this will still not be a problem from nature's pov. The effort will be so much that only few can do it. And the others? Have a family, have kids, beg for sex. Or worse. I think for the first time I can see the concept of original sin, and being baptised by fire. Not the symbol of it, but the actual thing. We were born imperfect because it was needed so. If you want to be free you need to work. Hard. I say this not as a Christian. But as someone who was born and raised in a Christian culture, and thus is pretty familiar with its concepts.

I loved your post on delusions. But, permit me to say, it is not alcohol or porn the delusion, but something else. Of which alcohol and porn are the results. FOr example in the images you showed above what would that be? attachment toward the woman in the image? the illusion that she belong to us, or that we have the right/possibility to have her? Or that she is willing to have us? In short what is the message that we are subliminaly getting that is different from the real state of reality? That message is the delusion. The alcohol or masturbation is oureself acting on that illusion of grandeur. Could you please clarify what you mean here by 'this' in the phrase 'this bad karma'. For example I remember a practitioner who would disagree with me being so pure and vegetarian (at the time!) because, he said, it would make everybody else feel bad. Is the bad karma the fact of causing other people to look up or down on you?

Hey, cool clothes! I think you have a point over the cost. But regardless of the cost there can be tons of reasons why a person might want to change their outer appearence. After all don't buddhist monks shave their head to represent that they renounce to desires? Would this action be patented by them, or are we allowed too to have an external act that represents an internal change?