affenbrot

NO! Definately not! just feels perfectly right to practice with my Dantian now, no special interest in Blisses and Samadhi States in the moment! (Although i must admit it once happend, that I was sitting there with the Hatha Yoga Pradipika's instruction of how to cut your frenulum linguae, razor blades ready at hand... well in the end I never did. ) If you are so keen to get it done qickly, why don't you just date a dental surgeon, he can do it in half a minute!!! (hehe, speaketh advocatus diabolus) keep us updated!

i found some MRI images of a Yogi performing it. looks quite natural after all: Kechari MRI pictures

No spiritual topic but anyway: I'm just reading Jung Chang: Wild Swans a history of the writer's family through three generations in china - very moving, and a lot of things about china i did not know the least! Also currently lying beside my bed: Stanley Keleman: Emotional anatomy. The structure of experience - classical bioenergy, amazing drawings of the human body (e.g. as a hydraulic system), quite spooky. Arthur E. Powell: The Mental Body and again picking up a book I don't understand at all, but every now and then am reading anyway: Stephen Wolinsky: Walden III - In search of a Utopian Nirvana The ultimate deconstruction of everything (He calls it "post-deconstruction", drawing upon buddhism, advaitavedanta, linguitics, neuroscience, philosophy and quantum physics.) My favourite: his chapter on the bourgoise seeker. Very radical. affenbrot

very interesting thought!! I remember some book (I think it was named "the dark side of the dalai lama" or something) that in depth dealt with the dark arts and magic in tibetan buddhism and the romanticism hindering westerners to see and acknowledge it. For westerners, when they for example deal with traditional tibetan demons in a ritual one may feel a certain respect, connection and power, but mostly in my view this is just folklore. It definately would never be that deeply scaring like it probably is for a native Tibetan, or if this westerner would summon the demons of his own tradition, e.g. the Abramelin rites or the Necronomicon (s.th. that let my toenails curl when even I think about trying - I never would. ..but a tibetan demon well, hey, exotic!) So some eastern tradition compared to Bardon may as well carry a hell of dark things, it's just we are not tuned into perceiving it, like you write in your post. It might in addition be that the idea of the would-be dark things around western magic are to some extent purposefully created by the Church and the bourgoise establishment to scare us away (witches! evil sorcerers!) - and these images are now so deeply imbedded in our psyche that we too well tune into it! greetings, affenbrot (what the f... is the "bourgoise establishment"? I have no idea! - but hope you get what I want to express here:-|

Hello everybody! For me this group feels like a virtual sangha already. I love the openness and sense of exploring and researching matters of spiritual practice. Real ?Sanghas? I so far met and been part of often felt too focused on a very specialised set of tradition and /or more often a teacher. Sometimes it is really amazing how mental, emotional and spiritual vibrations can be transmitted only through this written medium in the internet! I live in Germany, met M.Chia ten years ago, after a period of kriya yoga practice. Since four years I have been with a chinese teacher who mostly does a very abstract "heart to heart" teaching and "transmission without words" which sometimes is quite amazing but still often insults my wish for intellectual understanding and self-responsible practice... A very short intro of myself to start with, I will add something in the future! I am happy to be an official member now, and hopefully will quit always only lurking from behind! ..but you know, english is a foreign language for me and reading is just much more easy than writing (meaning "composing", "looking things up in a dictionary")! greetings affenbrot

Thanks for commenting, very helpful ! affenbrot

mh, sounds true. What I still bother with is the following: if you now let your own state aside for a moment (what am I saying here? ) the possible weirdo energy hanging around in the mental field of a certain tradition - you are inevitebly going to have to deal with it - or not? If I enter magic in the best possible way, relaxed, happy and with the most pure and highest intentions - the astral scum will leave me alone - or am I still are going to encounter it because its just part of the gathered information of its history (or part of me?) ? Can you in the other direction think of a tradition that you enter with the worst shape and still the tradition is so pure and "clean" not much will harm you? But is the bad weird energy not the best thing to work with and the real challenge to deal with it (like in the abramelin rites, and well, alchemy?) On which level does it really exist outside of myself or not? Maybe I am just I little too impressed or afraid of power and so I start projecting my own fears and unresolved issues onto this and start "seeing" things that just are not existant. On the other hand, aplying the dzogchen perpective would pretty soon let me lose all interest in Bardon anyway... affenbrot

hi, i have been reading in my Bardon book a lot lately and came across Misteles side by chance also about last week! Funny. The four classical elements-approach in this tradition attracts me a lot, I feel more at home here than with the 5 phases. What struck me some days ago is that Bardon does a kind of work that seems in parts very similar to the fusion practice: He lets you mediatate on the quality of the elements and stresses a lot to explore and balance your emotions (completly categorized into the four realms of the elements) Having done this he introduces an abstraction of the four into two: magnetic and electric force. He even does manipulate these two into a kind of rudimentary kan and li by forcing them together in the chest area for healing purpose. I think there exist a lot of trials to compare the 5 phases with the four (plus ether) elements, but im not sure if it is possible to make a one to one transfer.... About Bardon: i feel drawn to this a lot, but still: -I cannot Really perceive it- , but an intuition sometimes lets me see a lot of very low dirty, sticky, lower astral energy hanging around in this area. Not in his teaching , but in this field; probably produced by the people who used and abused these magic realms? How do you feel about it? cheers and excuse bad english affenbrot