mouse
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Posts posted by mouse
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thank you. I also decided that I'm going to strictly focus on grounding, and I-chuan. If my Sifu allows me to join his other classes with no extra charge I will definitely do that, either way I think he will at least let me use the extra space during his other classes for standing. I just love how easy it is to push myself in there. It feels really cool to burn up, barely be able to walk, but feel more natural than ever.
Pranaman,
In my lineage we hold out structure at every posture in the form. This allows us to refine the spacing of hands and inches of every body part as well as to lock into memory the correct structure.
Holding each posture allows you to slowly through active relaxation "song" all the way from the top to the bottom, part by part.
Over time, this will train your Yi (intent) and teach you to relax when force is exterted on you and still maintain your structure.
With enough time, your tendons and structure will be so strong that you'll have no issue holding your selected grounding posture for any periods of time. In the beginning you'll feel the shaking and burning etc. Just remember to relax into it. Your muscles should not ache if your posture is correct. Only the tendons burn which you can easily shake off after the drill.
Grandmaster Huang used to say that if you could sleep at night, you're not training hard enough.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse
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Thanks for this Lin... I'm gonna get laughed at, but I would love to do Wushu more than anything. I love to compete, and I love the athleticism that it involves.
But I also value the little bit of meditation that I know...I often wondered what will happen if the two are combined.
Prince,
Wushu is flowery. Nice to look at but lacks substance. Many effective martials arts are very simple to look at but are so direct and efficient that they look "boring".
Many wushu guys have knee reconstruction as well if thats what you're after. The angles they achieve for asthetics are at the expense of their health.
Please reconsider.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse
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Mal,
Great. Cameron has good Taiji. You should be looking for Nick if you're in Townsville. Unless there is a Townsville in NSW I'm not aware of.
Cameron heads up the teaching in Sydney. Nic runs the school in QLD if thats the state you're from.
Either way, both can point you in the right direction.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse
PS: Keeping notes is a very good habit. Saves guess work after and gives you pointers during your own practice.
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Based on my experience training in Wing Chun, Xingyi, Bagua, and Taiji, I believe Wing Chun to be primarily an external art. I think that some Wing Chun teachers have recognized the benefits of internal training and supplemented their training with those methods. The chi sao in the video clip is clearly a blend of chi sao with push hands. Traditional chi sau is much more focused on striking then pushing. We've been seeing a number of Wing Chun players starting to compete in push hands events at our tournaments. They find the cross-over to be valuable in their chi sao and some of them do quite well at push hands, especially restricted step.
The three generally recognized internal arts have one thing in common - they strongly emphasize standing and/or moving meditation as a core focus in their training regimens - Xingyi=santishi, Bagua=circle walking, Taiji=slow meditative form, plus all involve additional standing and sitting meditation. This is not a fundamental core element of traditional Wing Chun training to my knowledge although all styles of martial art utilize meditation, posure, whole body power, etc... We did some neigong exercises and some standing and sitting meditation but it was a small component of the training, relatively speaking.
Xuesheng,
I won't comment on Wing Chun further as I do not train in it.
As for moving meditation in internal arts. It is the point where you transcend the physical, I feel.
For Taiji, we do form as moving meditation to enter samadhi. Once in that state, fighting becomes natural and is in slow motion. Kind of like spiderman. Seeing energy is possible as well.
We do our form once for refining structure, alignment etc and another time for samadhi.
This aspect is lost and/or not understood in many schools.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse
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Thanks Mouse, I did enjoy it. Strange enough I'm learning sarm bo pai tarn now
I think I even recognised the jong he attempted. Although all schools teach the jongs differently and he didn't actually get very far hahaha. (not laughing AT anyone I just enjoyed the video)
Did you have any contacts for Sifu Adam? I've found http://www.heavenmanearth.com so can just use that.
Would a person be able to "take home" much from a one day seminar? I tend to need a LOT of correction in calss and I think I might need a bit of prepatary stance work to get the most out of a seminar.
Still it would be cool to tell my Sifu I got my sat on my arse by a Tai Chi player.
Cheers
Mal,
You can use the email on the website to reach him through his assistant as he has a busy schedule and prefers to live in seclusion to practice.
If you are in QLD, just give Nicholas Karaam a call, he is Sifu Adam's top instructor and the "Tai Chi player" in the video. His mobile number is on the website.
If you're in Melbourne you can give Andy a call. Number also on website.
With the seminars we try to have as many instructors around as possible and also try to keep the groups small so that everyone gets proper attention.
There are lots of "take home" things regardless of your style. Best to bring a notepad to write down or you'll forget. Also, ask as many questions as you want if time permits. There are no secrets in training, only effort and technique.
As for having your arse being sat on, don't worry about it. We're practitioners not fighters. You can see that the person was just being rebounded and not hurt. Ego might be hurt but only if you are not there to learn.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse
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The clip of the Chisau wasn't internal. It was still using pushing force, still using muscle. Real internal Chisau is when there is proper redirection of force by small cuts and shifts with the hips and alignments with the joints and spine. When hit the energy is enormous, and the technique used doesn't seem like much. It will be fast because in fighting everything is fast, but utilizing muscular pushing and swinging techniques without the body properly aligned behind it is not internal cultivation. That video had none.
Lin,
It does not look like your typical chi sau as they cultivate yielding, neutralising into their structure from their Taiji background this is not prevalent in the traditional Wing Chun where they prefer to use refined axial rotation more.
The reason for the difference in training is that they are Buddhist and carry their martial art as part of their practice as well. Dissapating the force, rather than striking to harm the opponent. All part of relinquishing and letting go.
It is definately internal and you can see that they feed the opponents energy into the spring to issue.
I am talking outside my scope now as I do not practice wing chun so I shall stop.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse
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That seems to be the usually response
Although I object to "BS presented" I agree it isn't really that important I just want to understand why he is so disliked by so many people. But I suspect its something you need to feel rather than talk about.But it's all good, enjoy your practice too and thanks for the cool 2nd video I liked that one a lot more.
Mal,
As said before I won't go into it further. If you wish more explaination we can PM.
If you're in Australia, you may want to meet with Sifu Adam or his instructors if you have the chance as they are having a seminar soon.
As you're trained in tong long, you may enjoy this bit. (1:42) The opponent is sarm bo pai tarn level in tong long and was told to attack at full speed and power with anything he wanted.
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="
name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>Enjoy your practice.
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Is wing chun a discipline that would compliment my taiji/yiquan and does it have the same subtle body affects?
Pranaman,
Depends who you learn it from. Wing Chun is an internal art just like Taiji if you have proper instruction. Structure, alignment, body movement, energetics, touching center are all same principles.
Here is a clip on chi sau done with true internal methods. It does not look like your normal slash and bash very impressive looking chi sau but this due to the opponents "feeling" the energetic center of each other. Issue is relaxed and only done when touching center through sensitivity. Never guess work or letting out random combos hoping one will hit.
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GhSQZiacjo&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param'>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GhSQZiacjo&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1GhSQZiacjo&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
I personally do not train in Wing Chun but internal arts all run on the same principles.
Again, build your foundation before running off looking to other systems.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse
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I won't go too much into the theories as I've expounded too many times already. I'll just let Sifu Adam Mizner explain in his own words. (0:38)
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="
name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>It really isn't a push... The grounding causes the opponent's center to rise energetically basically making him float. There is a very fine point where you issue. The bigger your issue or the more you express it physically the more pronounced it is. Issuing on a person whos enegetic root is severed is like throwing a ball. It is effortless.
The opponent was bouncing back in that video because the issue was through the center (both energetic and physical). The frame/structure cannot be yielded or collapsed as the center was lost hence the pop off the ground.
Usually those with good rooting will pop off the ground if being issued upon. Those with poor structure will just collapse at wherever the weak link is. Where the energy "kinks".
I won't talk about Erle anymore as well as it isn't important. If people cannot see past the BS presented then they may choose to use him as reference. Not much point trying to explain because it will just be a merry go round.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse
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Are you saying erle is dealing with Wai Jin?
My teacher has spoke of your energy going through the ground, as opposed to creating resistance with yourself (in reference to punching).
Also, I believe that what Sifu Fong is doing is slightly different than the fa jin he also teaches, but all because his muscles will twitch during what looks like a time of rest, and every last muscle to the toes is reorganized between the movements which iare sometimes fa jin.
Pranaman,
Fa1 means to express or in this case, issue.
Nei jin means internal jin, wai means external jin. In martial art circles, many external styles will employ wai jin, which is good. It is a refined use of muscular and struture to issue force. Even boxers exploy wai jin. The pushing off the ground, turning of hips etc for the jab or hook etc is a refined method of punching. It is efficient.
However, many get caught up in the physical state and over time never get around to learning internal or (nei jin). And over time they never progress pass that level and start teaching based on that model.
I won't go further into Erle's techniques and his background as I feel it will be a waste of time . All I have to say is that be discerning with whats out there on the internet. Erle for one is not a "teacher" who you should pay any mind to.
As I have mentioned before for your teacher, Pranaman. His writings are good and although I have never met him, he has a sound technical basis from what he presents. You should refer all queries you have to him as he has walked the path before. Never be afraid to ask questions of your teacher. If he is genuine, he will answer you honestly and ernestlyto guide you in the right direction.
Watching how your teacher conducts himself is a lesson in itself. You can learn a lot from there. Good luck.
Enjoy your practice.
PS: Try not to mix too many practices for a start. Is easy to get excited in the beginning but you must have a solid foundation to begin with. At 19, you've got a huge headstart on many who pursue internal arts.
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Fa jing example. (static audio so turn the volume down a bit)
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="
name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>Since I'm using Erle's video I should clarify my absolute to some Yangs styles have explosive movements too
Taiji practitioners should be able to discern wai4-jin4 from nei4-jin4. Wai Jin has its place and application but is not considered Taiji. It is a striking art and is used for fighting.
Neijin is something quite different where you're dealing with energetics. Any force or strike landing on the body is relaxed down and grounded into the earth through proper structure and alignment. If the level of practitioner is high, you can empty out further energy into emptiness as grounding can only neutralise so much.
Being focused on wai-jin, is to be considered a lesser path. Just like iron robe done by tensing. There is only so much you can do with lower techniques.
The nature of lower paths is that they are also easier to achieve yet can only take you so far.
Enjoy your practice.
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I practice zhang zhuan as in the link I posted. Now Im looking into some kenneth cohen stuff(downloaded the course). Also I might buy some other stuff I got introduced in, but now im broke.
salaam123,
You may choose to practice whatever method you wish. If you believe his method for standing posture is correct, good luck with your practice.
In my opinion, it is fundamentally wrong from the start regardless of whether you think he is a nice guy or not.
It is your path.
mouse
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Hua Dao,
Thanks for your response.
I must have misunderstood the context of "grasping".
I was concerned that salaam123 might take the advice at face value and end up "lifting" the arch and also "grasping" the ground leading to a bad foundation in his Taiji practice hence the response to your post as he/she is already on the wrong direction with using the heels for rooting.
I even had a partner test my structure using both methods before I made the post as I thought it was so ridiculous!
Enjoy your practice
mouse
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I don't know exactly what you're trying to achieve but fwiw when standing one should really grasp the ground with all 10 toes, enough so that the arch of the feet slightly lifts off the ground but the 2 balls and heel remain firmly down. This activates K1, which is the counter point to Laogong PC8, which when observing nature people naturally cup their palms and point PC8 towards a camp fire to draw in heat through the point.
If you spent any significant amount of time walking around barefoot you would still naturally grasp the ground with the toes and keep the strength in the arch, unfortunately wearing shoes eliminates the need to protect the toes and causes the arch to weaken. Re-training the tendons in the feet to grasp takes about 1 to 2 weeks of near continuous practice while walking etc. to become natural again. Your feet will be rooted and won't slide around or splay out or in afterward. There is a feeling of pulling up on the outside and sinking down through the center of the legs.
Hua Dao,
Any tension in body (even feet) creates a kink in energy. Once energy reaches the point, it collects there. "Cupping" the ground with your foot instantly severs your energetic root to the earth, raises your center and makes you easy to issue upon as you are not grounded.
Feet should be relaxed. The type of rootedness acheived by relaxation is a spreading of the soles of the feet on the ground. If the arch does not touch the ground it is fine and is due to the natural structure of foot. To "cup" and have the arch lift off the ground is not correct.
This are the principles taught in my lineage so I hope you don't mind me voicing it out. From push hands it is very obvious once you have "cupped feet" it will be used against you. It is like a huge neon sign asking to be issued upon as the energetic break is very obvious to feel.
Enjoy your practice,
mouse
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salaam123,
you should work at grounding throught k1 points. the reason you feel nothing may be because of improper structure in legs.
outside line of feet must point in one of the eight directions. knees aligned to feet. Then physically sink through relaxation and you should feel acheilles tendon stretching. Now relax that as well and feel the connection to K1 points.
You should feel your whole foot spread out evenly with center being k1.
To continue to "feel" through your heels because it is easier is wrong and will lead to lousy rooting. (none at all) Then you may start compensating by going lower or leaning forward and bracing during push hands.
Taiji must be taught through a competent teacher. If you have one, then send your queries to him/her and you'll have drills or exercises to let you feel the proper alignment/rooting. Don't go down the wrong path and have to spend time correcting the errors you've perfected.
Hope this helps.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse
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LMAO better yet you can believe that a person can wave his hands and the students go flying backwards and start to disappear and become light and walk through walls?!
Push hands is an exercise for understanding forces that is all!
Some may choose to believe based on their experience and views. As the level of a practitioner gets better and better, you start dealing with "shen" issues where you can use your shen to pull the opponent's astral body out of their body. Follows the same principles as normal push hands cept you connect on a purely energetic basis. No hands issue are possible as well. (Ling Kong Jin)
Perhaps this seminar video from Sifu Adam Mizner (Heaven Man Earth) will clarify some concepts to those not familiar with them. (0:39)
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="
name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>Another method to understand the importance of sinking in Taiji is as such. Imagine a basin of water. Drop a stone in it and the sinking of the stone causes the water surrounding it to rise. Certain schools such as Imperial Yang Style have a similar concept where they use small droplets of chi to disrupt your root. They call it "As rain falls, the grass will grow."
Hope this gives you guys some insight into the finer points of Taiji. Enjoy your practice.
mouse
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gosh, I've seen so much of that, I am not sure it is real.
Is she sending qi into his body in such large doses that his muscles are forced into contraction and he acts retarded? -How else to explain his apparant loss in motor control?
If she is shooting so much qi into his system, why doesn't he convulse more like an epileptic?
how do they prevent causing damage to his system? Surely, if she's pumping so much qi into him to make him dance like a puppet, that can't have a very good effect on his own system.
I am not sure I believe what I am asked to see.
can you explain what is happening?
findley,
So much is happening in the video to explain but I'll try to give you a rundown. It'll make more sense if you're a taiji practitioner as feeling is the only way to experience it.
It is not shooting qi into his system... It can be done but the results do not look like that. Most times if condensing chi into someone else will cause person to collapse.
This is done by sinking your own energy into the ground, receiving the opponent's energy this floating his/her energetic and physical center, setting it into your rear foot (base) then through active relaxation from joint to joint allowing the kenetic energy to travel down to the ground and bouncing back up into the opponent's center.
Thats the best I can do with my explaination. There are many things happening on the physical level and energetic level to go through here but ask what you need clarification on and I'll try to explain based on my lineage studies.
Best example would be to see 0:19 where you can see very clearly the yield, neutralise and issue.
mouse
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Hi all,
Thought you'd enjoy this clip of some good push hands from a female stylist.
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="
name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>She's very good and at 0:19 you can see that her yield, neutralise and issue all happens at the same time. The push comes and she intercepts, yielding the force onto her structure, rebounding the opponents energy from her base. The issue is instant.
Says on clip that she's a Chen and Wu stylist. I only see the Wu in her style though.
Hope you guys enjoy. She's a joy to watch.
mouse
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mYTHmAKER,
Thats a long time! Good to hear a success story. I eat very well on vegetarian diet, lots of beans, sprouts, fruits, veg, grains, rice, nuts. (all certified organic)
I may have gotten the quantities and ratios wrong as I've never really sat down to plan the meals methodically.
One glaring example of my health being off was when a group of friends and my girlfriend and I walked a long way quickly to a dinner appointment. When everyone reached the spot, they took their scarves, jackets etc off and were sweating. My girlfriend and I both were cold and had to request for hot water to be served.
The advice given by my teacher helped to bring the heat back so things balanced out. In the end I gave it up as I moved back with family and so had meals prepared. We're big on communal living.
Anyway, I'm based out of Australia not England but thank you for your info. Was interesting.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse
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Relax let go of tensions and you won't be cold
and
you can be a vegetarian.
How many of us walk - walked around in the winter shoulders hunched up tense against the cold.
One day we let our shoulders go and we are no longer cold.
I am warmer and have better circulation as a vegetarian than I did when I ate dead bodies.
Relax let go
mYTHmAKER,
May I ask how long you e been vegetarian?
I felt like you for about 4-5 months into it. Head was clearer, body was light and heath was tip top. After 6 months onwards combined with fasting etc my body was pretty weak. Mentally I was bright and energetically was good. Only the physical was suffering. I dropped from 72KG to 64KG no matter how much I ate or trained.
Spleen was particularly weak and was belching heaps. Like majorly long loud ones.
Perhaps my constitution was not as good as yours. Do let us know your experience. Cheers.
mouse
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That is a very good point. When I was vegetarian I was easily cold and had cold hands and feet too. Funny why it didn't register.
Basically, I was over yin from the following:
Vegetarianism
Meditation
No hard martial art
Retention
Chanting
Studying scripture
etc
To overcome the over yin activities my teacher suggested the following:
1) Holding taiji posture to failure (constantly releasing tension into ground through active relaxation and proper structure, really heats up the body)
2) waking up early and pulling yang energy from sun into body. (only ascending Yang is good. After 11am onwards can be considered descending yang... Not suitable to absorb and caused me to have vomitting and over yang excess.. hard to describe but just try and you will see)
3) Push hands practice
JJW,
I train in the HME system but am not in QLD. Although I've met with Nic a few times and he is a great instructor. A sign of a good teacher is to watch his students. If they can do the things the teacher does, and surpass him, it means the teachings are transmitted full and complete. Many masters have students who get nowhere (despite decades of training) because of ego. Avoid that path.
A good teacher in Taiji also constantly "gives" his center to the student initially to allow him to issue so that he can refine his technique. Then slowly make it progressively harder so that he can learn to search for the center thus building sensitivity. Some masters like to throw students all the time so that they can remain the "master".
Expect to put in hard work but trust that you'll get results and have no questions left unanswered. With a good teacher your efforts yield results.
This is a video of Glenn teaching if I'm not wrong. I have heard that he is a nice person but I have never met him. So instruction-wise I cannot comment. In the video you see them training in "single shoulder push" which is the first set push hands you learn under the Huang system.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1s8fogrbb8I&NR=1
Good luck with your search and enjoy your practice. Do keep up posted on your decision and progress!
mouse
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jjw,
Out your way you may want to give Nicholas Karaam a call. He is an instructor under Heaven Man Earth system. Genuine Taiji. Also part of the Huang Lineage.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0OahN6SnD5o <<Taiji Push hands
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3E3UEpHsWvo <<Qi gong/iron robe/taiji boxing etc
His number is 55763065 or mobile on 0415 640 989.
Fees are very affordable for classes. To get good very quick, privates are the way to go. Depends on your training needs. Classes are great for partner work to build sensitivity through set push hands, then up to free push at higher levels. Iron robe + chigung stuff are taught in seminars but may be transmitted once you are ready.
First level starts with Earth element chigung for rooting, and manifesting sinking and rising.
Good luck on your path, enjoy your practice.
PS: If you are clairvoyant, enjoy watching the celestial sentries protecting the compound.
Choa Kok Sui
in General Discussion
Posted
There are many ways to stand but all the priciples must be there in order for proper rooting.
Watch the front of the video where they are doing ma bu stance. If your structure is correct, you should feel the energy bounce when you strike your thighs due to the spring of the tendons and joints.
<object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="
For taiji form, for most postures there is 1 method we use to measure the correct stance based on your body. Stand in zhan zhuang at shoulder width. Take a string and measure out a straight line between the kidney points. Then use the same distance to draw a SQUARE.
When transitioning, your feet placement will be right on any two of the four corners of the square. Again, some postures do not follow this like in repulse monkey and snake creeps down. But most are using this "square".
For other postures we have other measuring techniques but best to refer to your own teacher as he may have reasons for his own teaching methods.
For me, it works as it is the best structure for rooting. We constantly test our structure by having a partner "feed" energy into our base. If structure is wrong, both of you will know instantly. Is good practice for both as you are spreading your awarness out into your partner feeling for weaknesses in his/her frame.
Enjoy your practice.
mouse