xabir2005

Currently no, that would be the more tantric side of Buddhism and I haven't practiced any of it. Though I am interested in Dzogchen so might pick up related practices in the future.

In a dream, is there a real tiger being reflected?

Not even a 'something' - just reflections, shimmering appearances, much like a dream but very vivid.

I had glimpses of experiences like you since a couple of years back, and seeing this, Thusness told me to start practicing self-inquiry... it didn't take long, (but it can certainly be faster for some - some got it even instantly), about 1 year 10 months since I started self-inquiring... to Self-Realization. You may want to try self-inquiry as it is a direct path to self-realization which I, Thusness, and many others can attest. The method is being described in my e-book: http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2010/12/my-e-booke-journal.html , but also taught by many other teachers like Sri Ramana Maharshi, Ch'an Master Hsu Yun, etc etc. And no, I don't feel distinct chakras or dan tiens, and furthermore I don't manipulate or deal with chakras or kundalini and the likes in order to induce experiences of cosmic consciousness or lead to self-realization. I consider that as a valid, but gradual path... whereas self-inquiry is a direct path to self-realization.

As I suspected, what you realized is exactly the same as the I AM that I talk about (but you said it is not I AM but more like 'I am not', at which point I wasn't sure what you were implying). You are saying the same thing but just don't use the same term as me. The I AM I talk about is not a conceptual, mind-body identification or ego. After almost 2 years of inquiring, "Before birth, Who am I?" the answer came: Before birth, I AM. (not as a conceptual answer though as there was absolutely no thoughts at that point) The I AM is utterly still, but it is not dead stillness, as it is obviously aware/awake as a sheer presence, and is all-pervading. It is prior to conceptual thoughts, and in fact appears upstream to all thoughts and perceptions (Before birth, I AM). This is not mere stillness state as in a calming of thoughts, but the absolute stillness of Presence. Now as the old Masters say, cherish and trust your experience, but refine your views. That realization and experience of I AM is undeniable - it cannot be denied, or rejected. It is something so clear and vivid, intimate and undeniable, and at that point of realization I said, everything can be denied except I AM. When I realized this, I started a topic called 'Certainty of Being' in my forum, and that is how my e-journal started. The view however needs to be refined. As Shurangama Sutra describes, (33) Further, in his practice of samadhi, such a good person's mind is firm, unmoving, and proper and can no longer be disturbed by demons. He can thoroughly investigate the origin of all categories of beings and contemplate the source of the subtle, fleeting, and constant fluctuation. But if he begins to speculate about self and others, he could fall into error with theories of partial impermanence and partial permanence based on four distorted views. First, as this person contemplates the wonderfully bright mind pervading the ten directions, he concludes that this state of profound stillness is the ultimate spiritual self. Then he speculates, "My spiritual self, which is settled, bright, and unmoving, pervades the ten directions. All living beings are within my mind, and there they are born and die by themselves. Therefore, my mind is permanent, while those who undergo birth and death there are truly impermanent." ...... Because of these speculations of impermanence and permanence, he will fall into externalism and become confused about the Bodhi nature. This is the third externalist teaching, in which one postulates partial permanence. And this is why the further insights into non-dual (see http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2007/05/some-writings-on-non-duality-by-ken.html ) and anatta are important.

I voted for Others because wisdom to me is a unity of bliss, luminosity and emptiness.

Mahayana is actually a form of Buddhism, so...

good. When you see self, seeing, awareness, as a mere convention or label collating the transient but self-luminous aggregation (which is the meaning of 'seeing is the seen'), then there are just aggregated direct experiences, moment by moment experiences of thoughts, sensations and sounds and so on, but never a solid or inherent self, experiencer or seer. This effectively is breaking the mirror because a reflector behind reflections is not required - all along just the aggregation of mere reflections that arise according to various conditions.

Namdrol on how to overcome samsara: In order to be free from clinging, first there must be clinging from which to be free. In order for clinging to occur, the thought "this exists" or "this does not exist" must arise concerning some apparent phenomena. In order to be free from clinging, the thought, "this is empty" must arise. There is no such a thing as "without clinging in the first place" because sentient beings, in the first place, appropriate aggregates based on clinging to aggregates they apprehend as existent. In order to be free from clinging to these addictive aggregates (all conditioned appearances, both mental and physical) apprehended as existent, one must learn to see these as aggregates of empty of identity and whatever pertains to an identity. When one has seen that the aggregates are empty of a identity and whatever pertains to an identity, at that point, and at that point alone, will one be "without clinging". Without seeing the absence of identity of apparent phenomena, there is no way in which one can be free from clinging. In other words, without eradicating the afflictions (moha, rāga, dveśa) that drive the cycle of samsara, one will never eliminate the instantiation of affliction called "clinging". Without seeing the emptiness of phenomena i.e. their absence of identity, one will never eradicate the afflictions.

or not even two, not even one. Scenery sees, the one hand claps. Seeing is the seen, no seer. In hearing just the heard, no hearer. Maybe take some time to contemplate on bahiya sutta. It is what got me to the breakthrough - http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2010/10/my-commentary-on-bahiya-sutta.html?m=0

To discover it no deductions is required... But an experiential realization

The old monk says the way is like an all reflecting mirror awareness where phenomena are revealed exactly as it is in it. Xuan sha is however trying to point the experience of breaking the mirror, which would be the realization of anatta. This is as thusness said, no mirror reflecting, manifestation alone is. Xue feng and xuan sha are at different stages.

but do you also know this directly? not bad. This is non dual case two: http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2009/01/three-levels-of-understanding-of-non.html To understand case three you need to realize anatta. your statement is not bad, but it is still thusness stage 4 and not 5 of http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2007/03/thusnesss-six-stages-of-experience.html . Therefore your answer still cannot pass this koan: Xue Feng said, “To comprehend this matter, it is similar to the ancient mirror – Hu comes, Hu appears; Han comes, Han appears.” Xuan Sha heard this and said, “Suddenly the mirror is broken, then how?” “Hu and Han both disappear.” Xuan Sha said, “Old monk’s heels have not touched ground yet.” Jian says instead, “Hu and Han are ready-made.”

I see you are from Thailand. Does that mean you are Theravadin?

I see, thanks for sharing your experiences. I am glad you are seeing a lessening of those afflictions. Do you say that those nondual experiences you had are still experiences and not permanent realizations?

Nothing that I said is understood intellectually. http://awakeningtoreality.blogspot.com/2010/12/my-e-booke-journal.html

I have experienced states of stillness where conceptual thought ceaes, where mind and body and sense of self are forgotten, but those are states. Stillness is just a state. And states are temporary. Insights can arise in a state of stillness but not necessarily. But for insight to arise, contemplative investigation is required. True insight is applicable in movement and stillness.

calmness is one of the requisites for insight, but not the only condition. That is why shamatha alone doesn't lead to realisation. My insights and realizations are not derived from intellectual understandings or inference. I had such understandings for years, until it is directly realized in experience, which is a whole different thing. I can talk about anatta many years back, but realizing it is a whole different thing, for example. Now I no longer have a sense of an inner observer, everything reveals itself self-felt as self-luminosity, without the view and sense of an observer and observed dichotomy, or an agent behind the processes. In seeing just the seen, in hearing just the heard, so everything is experienced intimately at 0 distance. So it is in fact the most experiential thing in the world - can't get any more experiential or direct. My insights are not constructed, but discovered in a very experiential way through contemplative investigation, all of which are detailed out in my ebook. Why don't you actually go and download and read my journal entries - the first one marked on 10th feb 10 being my first realization into the I AM... And on and on, journal entries about my discoveries and experiences, none which are derived intellectually. Afterall its a journal about my experience (experiential insights), not a notebook for some philosophical thoughts. One of the interesting thing this insight reveals is that the way we view ourself, in terms of subject-object dichotomy, in terms of inherent self and world, is what is being learnt and constructed. It isn't real. It is just a view, a worldview, a belief we cling tightly due to lack of investigation, like a hypnotic and magical spell that affects the way we view and cling to ourselves and things. And it is this magical spell that prevents us from seeing and directly experiencing what awareness actually is. When this spell is lifted, we see the world in a much more wondrous and liberating way. There are many levels of veils - the veil of conceptual thoughts when lifted reveals the self-luminous presence as pure thoughtless beingness (aka I AM), the veil of seperate self when removed reveals nondual luminosity, and so on... Age doesn't matter - there are people who got enlightened at 7 (a few such cases are recorded in scriptures), doesn't make sense to say it can't happen at my age. Ramana maharshi had an awakening at 16, this dude got it at 20: http://the-wanderling.com/cyber-sangha.html , zen master seung sahn got it at 21: http://www.buddhimudra.com/wisdom/zen/51-the-story-of-zen-master-seung-sahn Last check, thuscomeone, lucky7strikes are 20, simple jack is 22. All of them had direct experiential realizations. Thusness had his first awakening at 17. My initial awakening was on 09 feb 10 when I was 19, after almost two years of engaging in the contemplative investigation of self-inquiry (ala ramana maharshi style) Now to be honest, thusness never guided me in my self inquiry (my approach is different - I would at least give more detailed pointers, advice or instructions to those interested in self inquiring, as what was shown in my ebook, base on my past experience with self inquiry). Thusness (who himself had his initial awakening through selfinquiry) was adamant it can't be guided - but he assured me that there is actually no "wrong way" to self inquire as long as I am actually honest and seriously self inquiring (and not doing something else like intellectualizing) and rejecting whatever experiences and answers I had until the direct realization occurred. Other than that he never guided me. So I believe, as ramana maharshi, eckhart tolle etc have shown, self inquiry can lead to self realization without being guided. But if I had not had the strong incalcation of right view from the beginning, I would have been satisfied and not investigated further. It is right view that spurred me further to deeper realizations rather quickly - and that is why right view is important and often right guidance. Not that right view alone is all it takes, as a direct experiential form of contemplation is necessary for realization to occur. Simple jack didn't have a teacher, but at least because he had been exposed to many good buddhist teachings, I believe it had helped. Thusness didn't have a personal teacher too. But he said he was indebted to buddha as without the buddha's teachings on fundamental things like anatta and dependent origination, he too would not have gone so far and would have been stuck at the earlier phases of insight.

what happens when mirror breaks and there's no mirror?

actually skandhas are basic buddhism.

All schools teach 1 and 2. As for 3, theravada buddhism mentions only dhammakaya. All mahayana and vajrayana schools teach three bodies.

actually, simple jack clearly has some pretty deep insights/realization and imo might be close to fully penetrating the seven stages, and among others who clearly realize nondual: thuscomeone, lucky7strikes, etc, there might be more. Not that I'm saying they are fully enlightened buddhas or whatever, but in terms of nondual realization they are clearly there.

Indeed. Stillness can just be stagnant and a person can practice stillness all his life but not realize anything. For there to be realization one has to engage some form of contemplative investigation or insight practice.

actually I prefer to call stage four the insight into non duality, being the nonduality of subject and object, while stage five is more about the emptiness of self, and stage six is the dependent origination and emptiness of objects From stage four onwards, nondual experience becomes your predominant mode of perception and gets effortless especially after stage five. But the bond of inherency (seeing an inherent self, awareness or objects) does not go just by an insight into nondual. The bond of duality and the bond of inherency are therefore distinct, tho the former can be said to be a subset of the latter. hardly. As I said some months back: "after the initial realisation, while i cannot at this point claim complete enlightenment (of which there are many subtle levels where layers of emotional and knowledge obscurations are progressively removed), i can report a gradual transformation such that situations that once called for fear, nervousness, irritation, anger, etc now only manifest as some bodily sensations that self liberates upon inception. for example if a loud explosion is heard there can be a surge of adrenaline just for a moment but no psychological fear surfaces." I'm curious as to what your insights or experiences have been.