liminal_luke

It sounds like revenge sits better with you than it would with me. Perhaps part of your Black Dragon nature? I suppose someone could consider themselves "an instument of the tao" exacting justice like a force of nature. Can something that looks and smells like revenge happen in the natural course of wu-wei action/non-action? Perhaps, though I`d say this is a very high-level calling. Very few people can pull off such a state of consciousness, not to say you`re not one of them. I`d be cautious though. Rather than seeing oneself as a punisher, I`d prefer to focus on just having really super good boundaries. My understanding of boundaries is that it falls under the category of the metal element -- being sharp like a blade, perfectly reflective like a polished mirror. Having firm boundaries has a little bit of the same feeling tone as revenge. There`s the same sense of standing up for yourself, of not letting anybody mess with you, of knowing your worth and refusing to be treated as anything less. It`s a strong dragon-like stance in the world. It`s about self-respect. One more advantage of good boundaries: when you really have them, people instinctively sense it and treat you right. Revenge becomes less necessary because you`re rarely victimized.

I`m more of a hedonist than an ethicist, so I personally prefer to consider revenge in terms of how it feels. Contrary to the impression a person might get watching Hollywood movies, I find that most of the time revenge feels lousy. Well, actually I haven`t really revenged myself so much to know, but I`ve thought about it a lot. I`ve fantasized. My revenge fantasies have a certain dark momentum, but I find that they keep me energetically tethered to a situation I`d rather be free of. For me, revenge fantasies are like doughnuts: they taste good when I`m eating them but give me indigestion. What is revenge like for you? Do you truly enjoy it -- before, during, and after?

I want to join the group but I`m "not the kind of person they are looking for." It`s something of a catch 22, you see. My interest in learning a little bit about Mo Pai, both the nature of the techniques and the likely results of practice, disqualify me. Oh well. I guess I`m doomed to practice some untested and unscientific method like Spring Forest or Stillness-Movement or Flying Phoenix. Thank goodness I still have a few matches around if I need to light a piece of paper on fire or something.

IIlovecoffee, I`ll admit to having a bit of posting fun at your expense, so if your experience on the board truly has been painful I plead guilty. As someone who knows what it`s like to be frustrated, I hope that you can empathize with the frustration of the Bums here who honestly would like to have a reasonable conversation with you and find the way impossibly blocked. You see, you really could talk more about Mo Pai. You won`t but you could. The world would not come crashing down, honest to God. Maybe some people would criticize what you say or not believe it or whatever, but so what. Do you imagine that everyone here agrees with what I have to say? I can tell you for a fact that they don`t. One member considered my views on Islam criminal and said that he thought I should be imprisoned for 25 years. And yet here I am, still a free man, posting away to the delight of some and the chagrin of others, and only slightly the worse for wear.

Oh, if you were really in such pain you`d just leave. Of course the same could be said of myself. I suspect this little dance gives all participants pleasure, and displeasure, in roughly equal measure.

Many have said that the western Mo Pai students have not cultivated any demonstrable superpowers, but that`s just not true. There`s no way I could say only a few phrases -- "we are only interested in objective scientific proof" and "I have nothing further to say to you" -- and keep Bums engaged and entertained for 27 pages.

I`m not one of those liberals who ran away to Mexico to get away from US politics. Actually, I find it astonishingly easy to ignore politics entirely, my numerous Trump Talk posts notwithstanding. No, I`m here for the tacos and the relatively cheap living, and mostly because this is where my boyfriend lives. It`s true that I`m not a very patriotic person. You might have read my post awhile back about how it peeves me when people use the word "great" and "America" in the same sentence. That doesn`t mean, however, that I have nothing good to say about my birthcountry. On the contrary, I really miss living in an apartment with consistently running water. Happy belated 4th!

There are several smiling practices. My understanding is that the secret smile, as taught by KAP (kundalini awakening process) is different from the inner smile of the Healing Tao. If you`d like to read a free ebook on Michael Winns version of the inner smile (and are willing to give your email out to be on his mailing list -- recommended) you can get it here: https://healingtaousa.com/

Before I clicked, I had the wrong idea about this thread: I thought it was about a person, not a bug. I think I`ll say what I was going to say anyways, even if maybe it is a bit out of context. Life isn`t about deserve. If we`re alive, we`re alive -- end of story. There`s nothing we need to do to deserve the right to take up space on this planet. Life is given, not earned. What`s earned is what we make of it.

Meditation, especially when practiced in an extreme way by beginners, can be dangerous. Sometimes I think these warnings get overstated though, and might needlessly scare people off. Along with the perils of meditation, we need to consider the perils of avoiding meditation.

Personal stories may be subjective and unscientific, but I often find them the most persuasive. After people have stayed around here for awhile, we get a sense of their personalities. I pay attention when someone who seems honest and reasonable reports their personal experience. Remember Cameron? He had all sorts of wild and fantastic things to say about Max and Kunlun, and people really listened to him. Many went on to get their own training with Max on the strength of his testimony; I know I did. Not everyone fell in love with Kunlun like he did, but it was an interesting moment in Taobums history. If someone friendly and conversational talked up Mo Pai from a personal experience perspective, we could get a similar groundswell of enthusiasm. And yeah, I know, not gonna happen. But if the goal is to introduce serious practitioners to a system that works, it`s hard to beat personal story.

All the people in my group love Taobums. There`s almost always one of us logged on throughout the day, though he/she might be doing other online work or (gasp!) watching Netflix and not really paying attention. We never have trouble with the moderators who are almost universally loved. Yeah Taobums! (Like members of some other groups, we sometimes see people here following foolish methods and believing foolish things. It`s so hard to resist pointing out the error of their ways! We bite our tongues and pull our hair with longing to set them on the right path. But most of the time -- not always! -- we stay silent. Through long experience we`ve learned that people usually have their own way of doing things and our "help" would just get in the way. Ok, Luke...breathe....ah, that`s better.)

I`ll have to trust you on that Spotless. I didn`t understand a word.

TheLerner is doing his darndest to have a "serious discussion on this topic," but let`s say you`re right. It`s impossible. No reason to even try. This place is full of people hostile to the practice. Ok, so my question: If we`re so bad, why are you talking to us? Your goal here isn`t to discuss Mo Pai...so what do you hope to accomplish? Have you been successful?

Idquest, I`m not opposed to Mo Pai, not at all. Actually, I know almost nothing about it -- certainly not enough to have an opinion for or against. Nor do I mind people keeping their practices to themselves. While I love personal stories, there are some I won`t tell, some I`d advise against other people telling. Sacred experiences deserve to be treated as such. I would ask, however, that those who prefer not to share don`t tell me what I`m missing. If you want to be quiet, be quiet.

Nine here.

What`s incredible about this thread is how little it has to do with Mo Pai. There`s no discussion of technique, personal experience, learning opportunities. It`s not that there`s no interest in Mo Pai; many Bums have requested information and Thelerner has even offered to open up a tightly moderated thread about the subject in his PPF. But still, it`s a no go. The people who ostensibly come here to share something about Mo Pai, clear up misconceptions and so forth, don`t have the slightest intentions of sharing squat. So, if this thread (now at 16 pages) isn`t about Mo Pai, what is it about? It`s an in depth examination of a few Bums personalities who claim to practice Mo Pai. Most of what`s said is negative but they don`t seem to mind so much. To a certain kind of person, all this attention is emotional food. Maybe they take it in energetically and use it as an alchemical substance to light fires?

The idea of a tightly controlled thread to discuss Mo Pai techniques without hostility or partisanship sounds fantastic, but those who practice aren`t interested in sharing. I wish they would! Despite all the protests to the contrary, what they really want is what they get: lots of conflict where they get to play victim. I`m convinced they actually sort of enjoy the whole banning process. Maybe it gives them spiritual cred in their group?

My mom, renowned in our family for her pie, swears by Betty Crocker. I`ve asked her to teach me how and she`s tried, but there`s a knack to rolling out the dough and crimping the edges I`ll never get. Crisps are just as tasty and easier for the pastry-challenged. It would be interesting (if a tad foolhardy) to speculate about what kind of pie various Bums would bring to a pot luck.

So many people screaming about how their peach cobbler is so (objectively) good, and nobody will tell me how it tastes. Nor what`s in it or where to buy. Don`t spit in my apple crisp, OK? It might not light your fire, but it`s warm and flaky and it comes with vanilla Hagen Daz -- and that`s good enough for me.

This is powerful. Both the experience, and your way of expressing the experience. Thank you.

Most things worth doing involve some discomfort and unease, and my experience is that spiritual work is no exception. The point of the work is to change (or perhaps to realize that change is not necessary which amounts, imo, to the same thing). And being human, we have resistance to change. If the work is effective it will bump me up against that resistance in a way that is uncomfortable, at times excruciating. There`s an art to pacing, I think. Not backing off so far that the work doesn`t happen, not being so gung-ho that it happens in a way I`m unable to integrate. Of course, the flip-side is that it also feels very good. Spiritual work brings me closer to myself, and there`s a lot of satisfaction and bliss in that. Just lately I`ve been doing some work that opens up my breathing. In the process I meet the resistance and tension that had me clamping down in the first place -- no fun. But as things proceed I feel more free, more open, more expanded.

They weren`t kidding when they said the purpose of Mo Pai was not to generate virtue.

There are those who love to get dirty and fix things. They drink coffee at dawn, beer after work. And those who stay clean, just appreciate things. At breakfast they have milk and juice at night. There are those who do both, they drink tea. Gary Snydrer

Thought I`d post a link about a practice (and concept) I love: Shinrin-yoku, Japanese for "forest bathing." It`s the practice of being in a forest as a therapeutic activity. Of course many Bums spend time in the forest because that`s where they live, not because they want to, say, improve their immune systems. Good for them. Personally, I prefer to live my everyday life in an urban environment with frequent forays into nature. I might start a regular Shinrin-yoku practice. http://www.shinrin-yoku.org/