liminal_luke

I´m not sure that going to Buddhist centers and looking for people who´ve achieved the Rainbow Body is the best way of evaluating these traditions. These kind of ultimate markers of enlightened practice can provide inspiration, for sure, and I do believe that it´s a possibility. But many practitioners with less lofty aspirations are gaining great benefit and feel happy with their spiritual lives. Perhaps they´ve noticed an increase in compassion, in patience, an improved ability to navigate the stresses of life from a strong calm center. Maybe they are able to savor small joys with a more refined quality of attention. Some just want to find a temporary respite from an otherwise frazzled life. Achieving these things is far from the ultimate, but it´s no small beans either.

Relationships push people to grow, spiritually and otherwise -- that´s just the nature of the beast. This is true whether the partner you pick is "spiritual" or not. Either way, if you opt for a relationship you´re gonna get pushed into growing. Of course, not being in a relationship is an equally valid path and many people prefer it. Deciding to be in a relationship is like signing up for an advanced placement intensive course, even though you haven´t really completed the prerequisites, because the teacher is hot. Best case scenario, you learn a lot but it´s gonna be a bumpy ride.

I made a recent discovery about myself, and, if you´re like me, it might help. For me, the desire to have sex is often preceded by some sort of semi-conscious twist of conflicting emotions that I don´t understand and would rather not deal with. When I sit down and really get to the bottom of whatever it is that´s niggling at me (say by just writing out whatever is on my mind for an hour), the desire to have sex just isn´t there anymore.

Here´s what I believe. For most people, most of the time, masturbation or sex with a concensual partner whenever you feel like it is best. For some people in limited circumstances, holding off from having sex can be useful. What´s not useful -- for anybody at any time -- is feeling ashamed. I don´t care how many times you cum a day, feeling shame always makes things worse and never better.

Cookie-cutter peers with sly mischievious grin at snickerdoodle.

I don´t know about Zen Buddhism as a whole, but the pithy aphorisms of Zen practitioner/master Paul Reps are very much alive to me. Drinking a cup of green tea, I stopped the war. An instant realization sees endless time. Endless time is as one moment. When one comprehends the endless moment He realizes the person who is seeing it. “Seeing the smile in your eyes, I have forgotten that people die” About art. Draw this line, only as you feel it to be the most worthwhile act of your life. Only a single line is needed to discover who is doing what. The line comes before meaning.

Personally, I tend to think the "dangers" are overstated, but I´ll tell you what I´ve heard. Suppose the goal of system X is to move energy up, and the goal of system Y is to move it down. If you practice both systems at the same time, the best that can happen is that they cancel each other out and you won´t get the results you want. In the worst case, the conflict between the systems might be harmful. If you don´t have the expertise to know whether the practices you do complement each other or work against each other it might be wise to do one at a time. At a minimum, you could separate the two practices a bit: do one in the morning, one at night, or else practice them on alternate days. The potential dangers go up if you´re a super gungho practitioner and don´t stop if things start to feel off.

The following book was recommended on the website of the late sexologist Jack Morin, author of The Erotic Mind, for clients dealing with self-esteem issues. Since this is a problem area for me too, I picked it up and find it useful. http://www.amazon.com/s/ref=nb_sb_ss_c_0_24?url=search-alias%3Dstripbooks&field-keywords=compassion+and+self-hate&sprefix=compassion+and+self-hate%2Caps%2C Compassion and Self-Hate: An Alternative to Despair (by Theodore Rubin)

Some interesting points made in Dan Savage´s sex column (Savage Love) by guest experts on the subject of penis size. "CAP's girlfriend says his penis doesn't penetrate deeply enough," says Dreger. "CAP could try positions that let him get in deeper, or, better yet, he could take the time to figure out where his girlfriend's 'sweet spots' are, because, according to the sexology literature, length matters less than location." That means you need to retool your grind, CAP, not cut up your meat. You also need to stop viewing your dick as somehow fatal to your romantic prospects. "Dr. Schober did a study of guys who had really small penises," Dreger continues, "small enough to be described as 'micropenises.'" And how do men with dicks so small that doctors feel free to toss around an ego-shattering prefix like "micro" do with the ladies? "This study found that they tend to have 'close and long-lasting relationships' with women," Dreger says. And Dr. Schober says: "They often attribute partner sexual satisfaction... to their need to make extra effort, including nonpenetrating techniques." One of the microdicked men in Dr. Schober's study had a wife and a mistress. "So much for the theory that having a small member won't get you a woman," says Dreger.

I don´t think so. The only real "danger" is from mixing systems at the same time. Nothing wrong, in my opinion, with giving something a go, and then, if you discover it´s not for you, moving on to something else.

I´m mixed on the topic of relationship wish-lists. One friend of mine said he sat down one day and wrote down all the qualities he wanted in a partner, and, lo and behold, that´s exactly what he got. The relationship has been a long-term and mostly-good one, although if he had it to do over again he might have given some of the items on his checklist a bit more thought. For others, relationship wish-lists can be a bit too stifling. Say spiritual is at the top of your list. Ok, good so far, but now what? How are you going to recognize that spiritual person? I consider my mom very spiritual but she has a pronounced distaste for God-talk and wouldn´t go back to her yoga class after the teacher had everyone chant "ommm." Often, the most spiritual people don´t go around in spiritual-looking clothes saying spiritual-sounding things -- and you might well want to avoid a lot of those who do.

Of course you can do what you want, and no you don´t have to answer to anybody. But then again, why not try a system for awhile and see if you like it? Trying a system on for size doesn´t mean you have to make it part and parcel of your identity. You don´t have to sign any contracts or take any oaths. At least not in most cases. It´s kind of like cooking. If you´re an expert cook you know how the different ingredients work together and how to use them. You can make an excellent meal just off the top of your head. But what if you´ve never stepped foot in a kitchen before? You might want to say, "hey, this Barfoot Condesa looks like she knows what she´s doing....why don´t I try a recipe of hers?" If you don´t like it, try something else. Chances are that a tried and true system (spring forest, stillness-movement, sheng zhen....etc) that´s put together by a master, preferably someone that your fellow Bums vouch for, is more likely to be an efficient path to progress than what you cook up for yourself.

Bodhidarma, I get that you´re in a lot of pain around current norms around sex, and what you take to be your poor chances of finding the kind of relationship you want. I hope you get to a better place around these issues soon as this is something that is bothering you a great deal. Please give women the benefit of the doubt. You have some valid points about society in general, but that doesn´t mean there aren´t a lot of women who are not shallow, who are not superficial, who are not just looking for a quick fling with the guy that has the biggest penis. There are plenty of women who would like you, love you, just as you are. I know it. Liminal

Reading about the "shadow self" reminds me of a meditation experience I had many years ago. I´d decided that I was going to meditate for ten minutes each and every day, but for some reason I just couldn´t get myself to sit down and do it. Weird, right? I was berating myself. Ten minutes, I told myself, was such a teensy amount of time to do anything. Well, finally I´d just had it with myself and said I was going to do it right then no matter what. And as soon as my butt hit the cushion I was in tears. Immediately I got it....oh, THIS is why I was putting off my meditation. Turns out there was a bunch of not-so-easy-to-face emotion right under the surface, and I didn´t even know it until I started my practice. Or rather, part of me did know it (which was why I was avoiding meditation) but it wasn´t a part of myself I was consciously aware of. We´re all like this. There´s the part of ourselves that we know easily, and an often much larger part of ourselves that we don´t know, a part lost in shadow. Often we keep parts of ourselves that we don´t like very much repressed in the shadow where it seems we don´t have to deal with it. Shame especially gets locked in the shadow-self closet. But the funny thing about the shadow is how much good stuff there is down there too -- joy gets buried along with the shame, childlike wonder, playful spontaneity. Much of what we talk about when we talk about practice involves engaging with these shadow aspects of who we are. The idea is to know yourself better. To take aspects of self hidden in darkness (where they often end up controlling us from behind the scenes) and bringing them to the light.

Sounds like a wonderful feeling of freedom, that sense that you can do anything with your life.

Are you considering a career as a shephard, mindtooloud?

...

Yes, I was going to mention Steve -- the local expert on these practices for sure. If you´re feeling stuck, dc9, Steve´s the guy to ask.

Hi dc9, I´m have that book as well, and took an online workshop about the sound healing practice. If doing everything seems overwhelming, I´d suggest just focusing on one part at a time. You could just work for awhile, for instance, with "ah" and let everything else go. No hurry.

It´s great to have big expanses of time to devote to nothing but practice. Oh, to be a monk! But even monks have kitchen duty. So here´s what you might do. Instead of feeling irked because your domestic life is clashing with your practice, find ways of integrating practice into that normal life. If you have to do the dishes, do so mindfully. Feel the warm suds on your forearms, be aware of the movement of your arm sd you place plates in the drying rack. In other words: be in the present moment. This works better if your practice centers on awareness and mindfulness, but even martial artists and alchemists can benefit from a little focused attention. If you look for them, opportunities for practice are everywhere. Not everything has to be sitting on your zafu for an uninterrupted hour. Practice "standing" while waiting in line at the post office. Practice "inner smile" while stopped in traffic. Normal domestic life is where our practice gets tested. It´s when we find out if our efforts during periods of formal practice are leading to more harmonious relationships with others, an ability to navigate through the challenges of work and love with greater ease. Practice is homework to get us ready for the pop quiz of domestic life.

The difference between reacting and responding? Oh, about ten seconds. Here´s my take. Reacting is what we do automatically, almost without thinking. Someone calls me a name; I call them a name back. When I´m stressed I´m reactive. There´s no space to consider alternate possibilities, no willingness to sit with discomfort or ambiguity. Responding, on the other hand, happens when we´re able to note our reactions without immediately putting them out into the world. We can consider: is escalating this conflict by fighting fire with fire what would really be best now? After due consider (like I say -- ten seconds) we can take a responsive action.

Now that you bring it up, maybe I misspoke saying teens and people in their 20s are at their sexual peak. The first sexual experiences we have are unlikely to be our best, however memorable. We haven´t yet learned to feel comfortable talking about what pleases us, to feel comfortable asking what pleases our partner. People in their twenties generally don´t have the interpersonal awareness that great sex requires. They´ve got hormones though, so there´s that. It may seem like all younger people want is meaningless sex, but I don´t think that´s so. Many younger people (and plenty of older ones too) lack the emotional maturity to cultivate great relationships, but almost all of us want emotional intimacy. We might be scared of it. We might push it away. It might get glossed over in the rush for quick sexual (non) fullfillment. But we want it, almost all of us.

I agree with TheLerner that it´s fine to decide to be celibate for now, to concentrate on yourself. Who knows...maybe a period of celibacy is exactly what you need to get yourself to the point where the next relationship you get it will be a good one? And I´m certainly not recommending being in a relationship where you´re not happy in any way just for the sake of the relationship. I read a quote somewhere that it takes a very fine relationship to beat being single. Amen to that. After a long and unhappy marriage with my father, my mom found the first long-term fulfilling relationship of her life when she was in her fifties. She thought it was odd, finding "the one" so late in life, but I think it´s that way for many folks. Sometimes we need to go through lots of life to get to the point of being mature enough to attract and keep the partner that truly makes us happy for the long haul. As a society we glamorize youth. People may be at their sexual peak in their teens or early twentites, but they are not at their relationship peak. For many of us, the relationship peak comes much later -- so give it time. (Which is not to say you can´t marry your high school sweet heart and live happily ever after, cause that happens too.)

I find myself, somewhat surprisingly, in total agreement with Karl here. Nothing wrong with choosing celibacy and the single life. (Not that it´s impossible to be celibate and in an nourishing emotionally close relationship at the same time.) But...I don´t think anybody should choose celibacy out of frustration with their experiences thus-far with dating. Relationships have a lot to recommend them, and people can learn and grow as much through their relationship(s) as with celibacy. Maybe even more so. Yes, lots of people cheat -- of both genders. All relationships have their share of heartbreak, and often cheating or being cheated on is part of that. I don´t wish that particular heartbreak on anyone, but it´s part of the human condition and part of the grist-for-the-mill of life experience that helps us grow. To avoid relationships because of the possibility of getting hurt, through cheating or otherwise, is to miss out on an important aspect of life, imo.

Kiddy pool or no, the New Comer Corner seems to be getting good use. Congratulations to those involved in it´s setup. I have, however, noticed a shark or two trolling the shallow waters.