dwai

Good for you Qi can feel like many things. Electric, magnetic, hold, cold etc etc. They are all different ways in which the mind interprets Qi. It feels different internally vs externally. Internally, there is always however a feeling of flow/movement. Also, when we get to a certain point in our cultivation, the Qi starts filling up the inside, like air or other fluid filling a balloon. At which point, externally, it feels like a field (i.e., the filling up internally generates a field externally). Like when you experience static electricity, or a magnetic field. It has a surface tension, like pushing against a balloon. That surface tension can be used to do various things such as transmit martial power, healing, etc etc. Okay, that makes sense. For the most part, I don't subscribe to "our civilization" being entirely mine. Mine is a world of Hindu, Daoist and Buddhist civilization, informed by those frameworks -- only happen to be a resident of the Western world I don't quite see it that way. What we consider "mind" is essentially a conditioned layer of the one awareness. Like waves on an ocean. So when we consider ourselves to be the waves, there are 'differences' (some waves are big, some are small, some are powerful, some are weak) -- but when we consider ourselves to be water, there is no difference. By emptying ourselves of our conditioning, we are going back to being just water.

The greatest fallacy of the type of skepticism being displayed is that they (skeptics) think that everything has to be objective in nature. However, by that very token, they fail to recognize that for every object, there has to be a subject. In esoteric systems such as neigong, tantra etc, the subject is of paramount importance. A blind subject cannot see. But to a subject with vision, the world is truly a spectacular smorgasbord of colors and light.

That is me...just seemed pointless to write something on this forum when i've written it down already on my website... It is easy to dismiss these things as "disassociation disorder", very convenient to do so. However, when you truly open up to existence beyond the limitations of our mind (not even getting to the physical body yet), the possibilities that seemed totally ludicrous previously, present themselves. There is an old saying that is apropos here -- "First learn to empty your cup" (then Truth will move in there).

Here is an account of my ‘Qi’ (and other) experiences. http://www.medhajournal.com/sometimes-we-need-the-spiritual-milestones-and-the-signposts/

Well said! I've dealt with many skeptics over the years. Typically the people who can't feel energy/qi are folks who are very stubborn by nature (something about their causal body being very constricted). There are many such worthies, who spend 20-30 years doing Taijiquan and don't accept the idea of Qi, and so on. I can't possibly articulate this better than Mark Rasmus does in this video --

Don't mean to be provocative, but maybe you've not met the right people or just didn't learn the right methods of cultivation. Philosophical Daoism is not merely empty philosophy. If you want to live Daoism, you have to learn to become "empty" first. Emptiness is not an intellectual concept - it literally is everyone's core nature, yet is covered by layers of concepts and percepts. In order to become empty, one has to let go, layer upon layer of 'things' (thoughts, ideas, emotions, feelings, etc etc). When the core is finally exposed, all doubts about "energetics, qi and so on being considered nonsense" will be put to rest.

Entirely IMHO, so caveat emptor... I think what you're posting about has to do with the mind, which is in essence the reflected light of awareness rather than awareness itself. It is the mind that has a conscious and a subconscious. Awareness is always just awareness. The mind is like the moonlight, which is reflected sunlight. It can illuminate somethings (we call this aspect the conscious mind), and not illuminate others (we call this the subconscious mind). The so called autonomous functions are basically result of aspects of our life-forces. In the yogic tradition, there are five aspects to what is loosely categorized as "prāńa". These are called the pançavāyū, or five-winds. Each of these has a role to play in the functioning of the bio-mechanical vehicle we call our physical body. https://www.himalayaninstitute.org/amrit-blog/yoga-wisdom-worldview/balancing-energies-5-prana-vayus/ The article above sheds some light on the function of the five vayus or winds. These operate as they are meant to, quite naturally, without any active participation by the mind, though when they are out of balance, the effects are known in the mind. Also, a Yogi who has mastered the prāńa, can control these five functions with active volition -- such as stopping the heart from beating for minutes at a time, etc etc. The problem you articulated is a result of the modern model of the human being, considered to be a swirling mass of matter which happens to generate consciousness. The reality is actually the other way around -- Awareness/consciousness is what we are, and the matter is just an appearance within our field of access. Here's a nice visual of the model I am referring to -- Nice blog too (haven't read it in detail, but seems to be talking about the same topic) -- http://unurthed.com/2010/06/ So, answering your original question -- We have to transcend the mind entirely. That which knows both the conscious mind and the sub-conscious mind, as well as knows when the mind is blank (deep sleep) is what is important. It is the most important. Without it, there is nothing.

If any of you have watched Battlestar Galactica, the primary antagonists in that show are the human-cybernetic hybrids called Cylons. There were 12 models and of these 8 were cloned to build up the humanoid cylon population. Over the years I’ve noticed that there exist certain archetypical human characteristics too. Certain basic “patterns” keep repeating themselves again and again, across the so-called ethnic and racial boundaries. A certain “base” pattern is recognizable at a subconscious level (usually), and that’s why when, sometimes, you meet a definitive stranger, you get the feeling you’ve known them somehow. There is just enough similarity in the way this stranger looks and behaves that your mind does a sort of “mapping” with a person you know from before. I wonder why? Any theories about this?

@blackturtlesnake Mark Rasmus is one of my favorite “online” teachers of internal arts. Never met the guy but follow his videos on YouTube. He is very good, and at a high level. I don’t follow his hermetics framework, but I think at that level all these frameworks start to look the same once we get beyond the labels and language.

I'm very boring and find almost everyone else's stories fascinating, and often wonder why my life isn't as amazing/colorful/eventful as everyone else.

The fast changing style is called "vinyasa" or "flow" yoga. It is physically challenging to practice and will definitely give you a good workout. However, it doesn't do much in terms of the real yoga itself.

Being

Lo and behold! Swami Sarvapriyananda's folks released this video this very morning --

The problem with language is that it is always symbolic/representative. Phenomenology implies subject-object duality. Nonduality is not in the realm of experience — at least not the phenomenological kind (i.e., Paroksha Jnana). It is aparoksha. If you read the article I linked to, he makes the distinction between Kutastha chaitanya and chidābhāsa. The pure objectless consciousness whose light is reflected in the mind. Knowing of the phenomenological kind is only in the mind. And the mind is not Brahman per se. Brahman/Atman is the knower of the mind. There always is and remains an awareness that continues through all three states. But it is not a memory — Depending on whether the identification is with the body-mind or as Awareness itself. That is still in the realm of subject-object duality. Brahman is always Brahman, who is the knower of the reflection and the reflected consciousness (aka mind).

There are prescriptive techniques one can follow in order to prepare for real Vedanta practice. If one's mind is scattered, practice Raja yoga. If their mind is polluted, practice selfless service via karma yoga and dedicated name remembrance (called nāmasmarana) of their deity of choice -- bhakti yoga. Then when the mind has been cleansed, made focused like a laser, then one can start vedānta in earnest. Actually Brahman is not experiencing anything. But that's a good concept to hold on to until there is no need to hold on to it. Only a jñāni can know another jñāni. Others can see if their mind becomes transparent and still in the presence of the teacher. If it does happen, then they're in good hands.

A very interesting promise is made by Advaita Vedanta -- This might seem very silly to most people, but this promise is very profound and has great depth to it. What does "attain what you already have" mean? It means you are already Brahman/Atman. There is really nothing to attain per se. The attainment is merely a dropping of the veil that seemed to hide your true nature. After the veil drops, you realize you were already and always that which you realized What does "give up what is not yours anyway" mean? It means the world of objective reality, where you are a doer of actions and owner/possessor of things becomes apparent as just an appearance. So you give up the idea of being a doer and possessor, because you never were a separate actor or owner of "things". They were just appearances that rose and dissipated in you, the reality.

I think the OP points to a basic question and a methodological as well as theoretical difference that exists between two main schools of spiritual practices. That of effort vs "no-effort". In all genuine spiritual traditions, there comes a time when the practitioner will have reached a stage where they start letting go of effort. This implies of course that they had to go through a process of "effort" to get to the point of "no effort". The fact of the matter is that what we're looking for, if it comes to the chimeral quest for "enlightenment", no effort is necessary, because it (that which we're looking for) is quite simply, our quintessential nature. However, there IS effort needed to become ready to realize that very fact. The reason effort is needed is because very simply, our minds are scattered and polluted by the distractions and garbage of the world that we consume on a regular basis. So the effort that is required is in cleaning up the mind, which is ultimately the tool that will enable us to realize the very simple fact about our true nature, that is "hidden in plain sight", so to speak. What makes this harder is that so much has been written and said about it in different traditions. There are so many theories and so many approaches to attain that which is unattainable (because it is already our true nature), that dilettantes (essentially most of the beginners who start upon this most admirable quest) end up getting quite confused. In fact, it is not just limited to dilettantes, but also seasoned practitioners who are confused right up till the point that the realization dawns upon them. Then it becomes clear that the conceptualizations they had been holding in their minds as "knowledge" was at best a weak facsimile of "reality". So in my observed opinion, I would say that the "direct path" (similar to Shen based traditions) and the "indirect path" (Jing-qi-shen based traditions) are both correct, but have to be put in their correct context. There are those who are born with exceptional clarity and are relatively unsullied by the world due to pristinely good karma from previous lives. The fact is that for most others, effort is required, along with the path of physical and energetic housekeeping and cleansing before the consciousness based approach becomes available. It is not good or bad, better or worse or even desirable or undesirable to use effort where required. It simply is a fact. So if you are one of those who don't "Get" the direct path, be honest with yourself and go back to the basics -- DO apply effort, because you need to. When the "Direct path" will become accessible to you, it will automatically happen. That's how the spiritual ways work.

Apologies for a long winded post. I waned to enquire whether any of you have thoughts on combining strength training with internal arts? Let me explain what I mean by that. The style of taijiquan I practice emphasizes letting go of muscular strength (li) and rather use jin - I know different people/schools have different ideas about what jin is. In our system it is considered to be the power generated by accelerating Qi into the bone marrow and the lower Dantien. So we store power by condensing Qi into the born marrow - my Sifu says it is like burning gas to generate horse power. Eventually it is generated by directing incoming force into the LDT, which results in power/force rippling out like how a stone is dropped into a pool generates ripples. This ripple effect is capable of returning incoming force, and therefore ends up looking mysterious and woo woo. My experience is, that it took me a long time to get it to a point where it works, to drop my tendency to use physical strength (almost 20 yrs of daily practice now). There is a sense of freedom and relaxation, along with the sense of unbroken sheath of cotton or silk/satin under the skin. I think many of you know what I’m referring to. Whenever I try to add physical conditioning to this, I feel suffocated; like the muscles develop in strength and begin to strangle the other type of ability generated in the body. So I stopped physical training several years ago. I revisit from time to time but give up after a few weeks because of what I described. As I’m growing older, I’m putting on more weight, as the metabolism is slowing down. I don’t think I can lose weight without adding some physical conditioning. What do the members on this group do? How do you balance your internal cultivation with physical conditioning?

The way I understand it is - It is the “I am” knowing that arises before the mind activates. It is the borrowed/reflected light of pure consciousness which appears as the root of the mind. How do one know one has eyes? Seeing is sufficient and adequate for that. To elaborate a bit more. It is clear that the pure subject cannot become an object. This chidābhāsa is known as sense “i am”, and hence is not pure awareness, but only reflected. Just like the jñāni can see brahmarupam in and through samsāra via asti, Bhāti and Priyam (Isness, Luminous and Beloved) attributes of all objects, similarly with “I am”. Here is a more detailed discussion on the topic — https://www.advaita-vision.org/seven-stages-of-chidabhasa/

Drawing, learning a musical instrument or even a martial art would be a good avenue. Maybe take up Taijiquan or some other internal martial art if you have the opportunity to learn. I can relate to this. Even in my own home, I see this playing out over and over again. The problem isn't with you or me. It has to do with people generally being unwilling to listen to advice that is contrary to their existing beliefs. Unless you are presented as someone who is reputed to be a "wise person", people generally tend to discount what you have to say. Heck, most people aren't even really interested in hearing what someone else has to say most of times. They usually want confirmation of their own ideas and beliefs. That's good. You don't have to be the direct source so long as your advice is helpful to people. The best work often happens anonymously. I would recommend the jnana yoga way for you, based on what you've outlined in your previous posts. Supplement that with Hatha Yoga or Taijiquan or some similar internal focused art.

I'm sensing some energy build up in the throat area and some tightness in above the left clavicle. I've noticed that this type of congestion could be due to not sufficiently expressing oneself creatively, or even not expressing oneself to a sufficient extent. Does that resonate with you?

I have a set from Temple style. First is standing in Wuji and simply releasing down. Second is raised hands stance (both sides). Third is Taiji stance (tree hugging). then I do some standing in ward off with focus on different things (up-down vs front-back). Also we have sets called the prayer hands set which I circle through. Usually I circle through the postures 10-15 mins each.

The problem is approaching history from a western perspective, not with Chinese history per se. Indian History is much like chinese history. In the indian context, we don't have what one might call "History" as in the western sense of taking chronological records of past events. In the Indian context, and I think it is similarly the case with the Chinese context, there are narratives of royal lineages along with major events that occured. Since the concept of time is cyclical in the eastern traditions, the sense of time was very different for the Chinese or Indian ancients. For instance, I'll give you what is considered *itihaasa* (loosely translated to history in english) in the Indian context are the epics such as Ramayana and Mahabharata. These were records of events where historicity was considered improbable because of the antiquity they pointed to. Internal references of chronology therein are based on astronomical/astrological data which point to Rama being born as early as ~ 14000-12000 BCE, Mahabharata's occurrence ~ 5000-3100 BCE. So they got relegated to "legend" and "Mythology" by western academics who tried to interpret the naiveté of the "unscientific" indians with a western lens. Similar is the situation with Chinese history as well. Add to the mix the tendency of Indian and Chinese history of infusing lessons (moral, spiritual etc) in their narrative, and the method in which the accounts were transmitted (orally, generation to generation) - that cements the tendency of reject their validity from a historic perspective (in the western/western-educated eyes).

I wasn’t expecting anything. But I like what you wrote Nice. I like this BKF method. If you agree I can scan you and see if I can pick up anything in terms of chakras etc.