dwai

http://www.amazon.com/Being-Different-Rajiv-Malhotra/dp/9350291908 In the past few years I've been a participant (and prior to that an observer) on TTB, I've noticed a marked lack of awareness of the internal conditioning that many (well-meaning and some not so well-meaning) members have developed (as a process of being part of a socio-cultural group(s)). That by itself is not a problem, but the problem arises when these people try and employ their native "lenses" to study something that doesn't fit into that framework. Eg, Westerns studying Buddhism, Taoism, Hinduism. This results in a few things: a) the student learns quickly enough to let go of his/her native tendencies (intellectual, cognitive etc) and re-learns the process in the "language" of that which he/she is studying. the student learns a particular tradition and is deeply conflicted in being able to successfully reconcile that with his/her native perspective. c) the student learns a particular tradition (or more) and can disengage the part of their intellectual process to be able to understand the tradition but as soon as they revert back to their native system they feel conflicted and end up appropriating those portions of the "other" that they have learnt (the parts that are in coherence with their native system) while rejecting those parts that are in conflict (often at the risk of trying to eliminate the very traditions they have studied and creating/rebranding the parts of the system they think are applicable in their native culture). This book is probably the best book in the past 100 years, that has clearly exposed this paradox in terms of Indian (Indic) and Western modes of thought. I would strongly recommend reading the book. While many portions of it might seem outrageous to some of you, I suspect that the process of reading and understanding what's in the book will help each and every one of you a better Daoist, a better Buddhist, a better Vedantin/Hindu (fill in the blanks as you need). I hope you find it as enlightening and refreshingly honest as I did. Best, Dwai

But it is not a matter of attainment or losing. It is a result of the limiting adjunct...or in shankara's terms - upadhi.

OC is simply OC. Without any object. Why complicate things? When thoughts have ceased (or as in the extending gap between thoughts) is OC. When they start again (thoughts ie) it is not OC any longer. Of course objects are apart from Objectless Consciousness. When Objects are a part of OC, it is not OC anymore. That's not to say that they are "separate" (going by Advaita terms), they are projections. That's of course the humble opinion of this dumb advaitin.

I have experienced that it is relatively easy to determine the nature of energy being emanated from others and what/how it affects our own. This is a natural progression to taiji practice imho, where we get sensitized to others' energy. At one point I used to find it difficult to go into a mall because of the overwhelming feeling the chaos of energies evoked. I found out that it was true for my teacher too (during his formative years). In terms of ting jing, I have had the experience of actually having what can be called premonitions about things going to happen and a "gut feeling" of not wanting to do something (a certain way) or to wanting to do something but rationalized against it. Inevitably everytime I went against this "gut feeling" ended up in less than desirable results ( albeit one could rationalize that as well and tell that many things will seem undesirable in retrospect). The feelings I get are very strong and sometimes I cannot "not do" something simply because I was forewarned because no one would accept my reason to not do something (say in a work context). My friend and I often practice this before or after commencing a push hands session. We will stand facing each other and then try to project a thought while the other reads it. Sometimes we are more successful than other times (again one could argue that these are infact in the realm of chance, but that not withstanding, there are times when we can see the thoughts as images being projected). So, ting jing does provide us insight into our environment. The hard part is knowing how to act/not act on the knowledge (sometimes definitive, sometimes intuitive). About yin or yang nature of ting jing, since it is a receptive type of energy (listening), is it not therefore automatically more yin than yang?

Sure. That doesn't change who he was after he became the jk.

How can you know that jiddu krishnamurti was a product of the theosophical society's lunacy? Before he became j k, he was touted as the maitrya buddha/jesus christ rolled into one by the ts. So its no wonder that he was an ani-guru guru. If his way works for some one, so be it...more power to them.

This topic is also bubbling in the yoga community in the west. You cannot remove hindu and india fom either vedanta or yoga. If you do, they lose their soul, figuratively speaking. The amaing thing is hindus have lived and respected other religions and philosophies for 5000 years (at least). And that speaks volumes about what vedanta is about... So how can so-called american vedantins be intolreant of those fom whose homeland vedanta was transmitted?

Stop running. Stand in preparation form (taiji) a lot. Dont think too much...breath and eat grounding food.... Pressure headaches happened to me when i started doing a special kind of yoga. My teacher told me to take it slow and practice simple asanas regularly. As the channels opened up, the pressure headaches stopped... I get heat in my middle dan tien during certain type of meditation...where i'm focussng on the middle dt. If you do qi related stuff, you have to ground....drain the heavy stuff, store light stuff in your ldt.

Tingjing. My teacher was talking about how tingjing can be applied in regular day to day situations. In meetings at work, in the supermarket etc. What are your thoughts on this topic?

3Bob, The Shaiva way is slightly different from Advaita Vedanta (or Kevala Advaita) and it resonates with me more (in that the universe is a result of the ecstacy of Shiva -- who is Satchidananda)...spanda?

Pure objectless consciousness is alive. Nothing, as in nihilistic emptiness is not. But there are those who say "emptiness" and pure objectless consciousness are non-different

I would recommend reading the nasadiya sukta for more insight..

pure objectless consciousness is one without any objects...if there is no object, where does the question of omniscience come from?

Actually Shankara very clearly says that Brahman and Atman are non-different. So Brahman doesn't appear as Atman, instead when one realizes Atman, he/she also realizes Brahman.

brahman doesnt appear as atman. Brahman and atman are non-different. There is a difference, imho. The changing world is in the realm of duality. So change is necessary. Brahman is nondual, so no change is necessary... We keep trying to extrapolate the "source" of phenomena (like you are doing), but it is not necessary. Just like the waves of the ocean rise from and collapse into the ocean, similarly all phenomena rise out of and fall back into brahman. Why? Who knows... World does change, but the world is in the realm of relative reality. Do you know all your thoughts? Or are only aware of some of your thoughts? You too are conscious, aren't you? Masters have to deal with the limiting adjunct of their physical existence...so they are bound by the same rules...ending ignorance doesnt mean knowledge in the mundane sense. It means ending the ignrance about one's true nature.

When we start, we aren't aware of either atman or brahman. We then become aware of the individual ego...and after living through the ordeal of the individual ego, some of us, maybe, figure out there's more to things that meets the eye. So, we start searching. And then we come face to face (sometimes) with silence. That silence shows us atman/brahman. And why both atman as well as brahman? Because we start with our "self" and then come to atman (which is actually brahman). The problem is that we have to reconcile the opposites to come to the one. Like a tai chi master pointed out in his blog recently -- The two poles of yin and yang are united by consciousness. That is the state of unity. So, when we learn to become so clever and internalize the syntax, we have to resort to atman and brahman. If we were just ever present, we would not need it. Let me ask you this -- does the ocean need to be aware of the waves? The waves are just it's nature. Does a realized master need to be omniscient when he/she rests in non-duality?

Fa jing is preceded by condensing...when my teacher does it, i can feel the energy condense but his muscles dont tense... For intermediate level peope its not easy to condense and release...so i get it when these guys in the vid do what they were doing. They will only get better with time. But those who think they know Fa jing but develop muscle tone instead, end up carrying tension in their bodies and will inevitably present a surface for their opponent or training partners to push against... O well...looks like you are digging a nice big hole you can crawl into...

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=bus%20driver%20fa%20jin&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CDQQtwIwAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.youtube.com%2Fwatch%3Fv%3DiVa2FitK5QI&ei=ke9MUN2gJJOY8gSC7YGoBg&usg=AFQjCNEjjIV1qmwv5GgUbHc1l5df5v_v_g Intermediate level fa jing...

are you serious? you mean hsingyi, bagua players dont have fa jin? Fa jin is inherent to all internal martial arts!

Thanks boy I am not new here...I was having trouble logging in so I ended creating a new id...

My limited knowlege on this topic seems to indicate that peng is one of eight energies that can be applied via fa jin. So peng is a jin, so is an, lu, ji etc (i forget the chinese names but im referring to wardoff, roll back, press,push, plit, roll pull, etc). Wardoff is a floating and uprooting type of energy. Roll back is like creating a blackhole into which incoming enegy sinks. Press is an explosive and focussed energy, like a sudden discharge of bellow or a spark from a capacitor...push is like a snow plow...split is like a knife cutting through and separating one into two, roll pull is like a whirlpool going off into a distance. The other many jins referred to are combinations of these and the frequency and wavelengths modulated...eg short power, long power, cold power, etc. http://www.willamette.edu/~jlaronge/seven.html Check out descriptions of the diffrent stages...

Nice lucky, The yoga sutras contain a practical roadmap to use. Not too much, not too little...effortless...simple. Its not just western thought, it is the human condition in and of itself that misguides....(or perhaps western thought has become such a defacto that we mostly dont know any other way).... My teacher says we ascribe a heavy price on knowledge and the mind and that takes its toll by reducing wisdom innate in us all...the wisdom to knw when to use the outer trappings and when to let go. I look far and wide for that which i dont know But i find oneday that i lost my self Of all the books of knowledge in my mind's endless aisle The one about my self is not on even one shelf When i let go off these books can i turn back to me And then will i learn that i was already free

It is called "Ama" in ayurveda. Amma means mother Yes phlegm is considered a toxic by product and swallowing it instead of spitting it out will tend to have it deposit in the digestive system, dampening your digestive fire, resulting in increased chances of things like allergies etc. also if you are generating lot of colorless phlegm, chances are that you are allergic to something. It is not unusual to see mucous in the stools etc as well in such conditions.

Imho, taiji is an excellent daoist meditation. One can stay in preparation form and become one with dao. We end up lerning all the various forms because we (unknown to us) want to be able to meet the dao in any position, any situation etc(ergo preparation form) My teacher emphasizes meditation over martial training in taiji...though we do learn fa jin, etc. karma is non issue if we stick true to taiji....ie being wu wei. Wu wei is the state of nishkama karma so no karmic points are earnt.