fiveelementtao

I suppose that if I were to take a non-judgemental view of that verse, I don't think it is referring to current political unrest. This is nothing new. It has been happening like this for thousands of years. These guys who are protesting now, may be successful, maybe they won't. If they are successful, they will put "their" guys into power who are just as likely to oppress and minimize another religious or political group. So, I don't see this as the meek rising up to change the world for the better. They are probably fighting for access to jobs and money. Most likely if they had the means to provide for themselves, they wouldn't care about who was in gov't.

If I put my personal prejudice against organized Christianity aside, I take that Bible verse to mean that, in the end... Only those who are comfortable within themselves and can achieve a state of harmony and balance in whatever circumstance they are in will inherit the Tao, The Earth, Heaven, Nirvana etc... I don't think that if this is really something that Jesus said, that he was referring to violent, political upheaval.

just my opinion...

This practice was given to me in meditation when I was asking for relief from similar symptoms. It is a very cooling and balancing practice for me. Hope it is helpful..

A shamanic perspective is very helpful for me when dealing with critical inner voices. One technique I use is to enter a meditative state and then imagine myself in a very healing place. For me, it is in the mountains near a stream. Then I call my guides for protection. Then I set up a chair in the middle of a circle surrounded by my guides and helpers and then I invite my critical voice or problem or resistance or whatever I am trying to work through and then I put my critical voice on the hot seat and ask it. "What do you want to tell me?" "Why are you really here?" etc... Usually I find that the voice or the resistance is actually trying to protect me. Then I will ask what it is trying to protect me from and then I can get a good idea of what scenario initially started the dynamic. Then I find out that the thing that is working so hard to keep me blocked can be convinced to work in a different way to help change things. So, this is a way that I use to be pro-acctive in changing my internal subconscious beliefs. My experience is that these internal voices cannot be shut up. If I resist them, they will defeat me every time. But if I address them and seek to help them understand that whatever old instructions I have given them in the past is no longer working and I give them a better alternative, then they usually come around and then work to help change things for the better. But, just like people, they need to be talked to appreciated and included in the process...

hope that helps...

Yes. Your want is valid. There is not invalid feelings or desires. It is just a matter of whether our actions are constructive or destructive. So, It's not an either-or proposition. Part of taking responsibility is seeking help. asking for help is one way to learn how to take constructive actions on our feelings.

There are many in the world who complain about not getting any help. But usually they just don't like the help they are given because it means they will have to change their viewpoint and take uncomfortable, frightening or even painful action to resolve the problem. And after a while, when they have burned all their bridges and refused every offer of help and there is no one left to help them, then they complain that no one cares and no one will help.

What you are suggesting seems to be very different. It sounds as though you are not just looking to complain about your situation but actually looking for a way to take action to resolve it.

So, find someone you can trust and respect and ask for help. The Universe will also rush to help you if you take action that sends the message that you are serious and willing to do the work necessary. Asking for help is the first action that sends that message..

I must admit I often fall prey to abusing myself, but it is something I'm conscious of and am working to correct.

 

I do want help, but I question whether that want is valid instead of just a result of unwillingness to face and take responsibility for my situation. In many ways I feel I already know what's wrong, and this continual search for "help" is just stalling for time or searching for a "magic bullet" to make it quick and painless, or maybe laziness and a desire to have someone "fix it for me."

woops! double post...

I'm just not sure that any word in the Bible or any other tome is absolutely to be taken at face value - who knows what the original intent of the speaker was?

True. It is hard to know if that was ever said or if it was recorded correctly, but...

The language is pretty clear... The original text you are quoting was originally written in Greek and the word translated into the English "Meek" was the Greek word "Praus" which also means, "mild, humble" So, unless there is some very deep ironic use of the word that I am missing, whoever wrote down this passage as it is recorded seems to be saying that the humble, and non-violent shall inherit the Earth.

Now, whether or not this is actually something that a man named Jesus said 2,000 years ago or is the invention of someone else later on... That is another issue altogether.

But, I believe that this quote does echo a familiar Taoist idea that humility will eventually triumph over grasping and greed. Too bad most modern Christians haven't seemed to understand their own scripture....

Does it seem like we're watching TV coverage of the meek inheriting the earth?

Except that they aren't being very meek at all. Are you mistaking the word meek for poor?

According to the American Heritage Dictionary the definition of Meek is:

1. Showing patience and humility; gentle.

2. Easily imposed on; submissive.

Which begs the question: From a spiritual perspective, When is it a good idea to use violence to achieve one's objectives?

Dude, please listen to yourself...

Especially since I am very intellect-focused and thus pay great attention to the words spoken, even if that might make me overlook emotional messages in them sometimes. I already told you that I said one thing to the therapist and he heard something different, and that I have a lot of experience with that phenomenon, understanding to some extent where it comes from. When you want to oppose someone and don't get the right ammo from him, you have to exchange it with your own.

so, every verbal communication is a battle? How can you expect to relate to anyone else under those conditions? Everyone has now become your enemy...

And due to the nature of the root of that behavior, using a voice recorder and playing back as proof won't help either, because then the person will simply brush it off, try to focus on another point, without acknowledging having warped someone's statements.

That kind of behavior is fueled by emotion, so it tends to clash with intellect-based communication. As I said, I have a lot of experience with that, and one of the most extreme examples was when I talked with someone at a meeting, and someone else who is very emotion-focused told me that he didn't notice anything having being said, just perceived speaking, and was very confused and said he had never experienced that before. Quite alarming, but that observing person put the blame on me, like I forgot to include something in my chat, like I wasn't normal.

I think the chat was either simply too intellectual for him or he didn't pay attention at all and didn't want to admit it.

Even in later talks with him, when I tried to point out possible fears having been involved in a talk between us, he assumed with complete certainty that I was referring to fears of mine, not his, and agreed to himself that of course there were great fears involved in what I said. When I explained that I meant in him, 'NO NO NO OF COURSE NOT. I'm totally serene and at ease.'

Perhaps if you focused on your feelings rather than your intellect, you would be able to connect with people instead of frightening them away.

Hardy, your answers are in your own statements. I will only comment one of your statements

but that observing person put the blame on me,

Based on what I read from you they did not "blame" you. They were sharing their experience of you. Based on what you have written here and this incident it seems that when someone shares their experience of you and you don't like it, you feel blamed.

Seriously, dude, if you can open your ears for one second, I highly recommend you investigate this with a therapist and learn how to hear other peoples' experience of you and use it grow. Otherwise, I completely agree with you, if this dynamic doesn't change, you are totally screwed and alone for the rest of your life. Only you can change this, but you will need to find some help, and follow direction. I think that group therapy would also be good for you, because then you can hear other peoples' experience of you. Good luck to you...

One teacher once told me that if two or more people tell you the same thing, it means the Universe is trying to tell you something and you should listen...

OK. I am out of this thread for real this time...

who says Im not?

 

Still wouldn't seem to stop me from wanting to commit suicide for the murderous men they all seem to prefer over good natured men.

Are you?

You should have heard my former psychotherapist talking. He, too, didn't try to find a path towards a helpful solution (from A to B, so to speak), but seemed to think that if he blames me for being where I am on my path, this would accomplish anything. But in essence what he was saying was: 'In my view you are wrong as you are, and you have to get right.'.

You're right, I would have liked to have heard that exchange between you and your therapist. I bet I would have heard him say something different than you did.

It sounds like he was trying to help bring your attention to your participation in your situation. It is unfortunate that you interpreted that to mean he was blaming or judging you. This is a problem for patients in this scenario. Well, now I understand why you want to help Heaven Chi stay victimized. Because he reminds you of yourself, maybe???

So, perhaps I am wrong and you both really are victims. Even if that is true than you have nothing to lose by trying to change your viewpoint. In Heaven Chi's case, he is being attacked by black magic. If he chose to try and change his viewpoint from helpless victim to someone who has possibly attracted this to himself, and he was wrong nothing would change. But if I am right, then by attemopting to change his viewpoint, he might get better.

The difference between my approach and yours, Hardy, is that I have done what I suggest and my reasons come from my personal experience. Yours comes from hypoer intellectualizing your state in order to justify to yourslef that you are "not to blame." If you can get over that idea and take responsibility without projecting your hyper critical parents that live in your head, you might make some headway into changing your life.

In any case my friends, as usual, I have beaten this horse to death so I shall take my leave of this thread...

blessings...

also, being loving compassionate and sensitive, etc. "evolutionary wise" only developed out of a need to make pair bonds to help raise one's own children and make sure they survive and grow up in one piece.

Interesting Non, how you have an argument for everything people say except for the suggestion for you to get some professional therapy... What is your argument against all those on this forum who have suggested you see a counselor about your views of women and sex issues?

you're forgetting something: cognition. some people can't even conceive of thinking beyond their egoic location, and they lack the trust that there is anything there, so they only walk on ground that they can see, even if that ground is astro-turf of their own making. it really is beyond the scope of some people's conception scheme, and therefore, the devil they know is constantly chosen over the devil they don't know.

 

it takes time, courage, and lots of challenges to transcend one's paradigm of understanding. some folks refuse to do it, but most don't even know how or what it even means,

I completely agree with everything you have said, yet we live in a Universe that is constantly pushing us to evolve beyond our current understanding. So, while it definitely seems as though we are unable to move beyond our current understanding, the Universe will not tolerate us choosing to avoid learning new ways of being and thinking. My belief is that none of us have been given more than we are capable of handling. Sometimes we are given enough to push us to our limits and we must choose to grow beyond our current state. Those who do not, create more challenges for themselves. We sometimes forget that Earth is is a big school...

discussion forums are difficult to have active interaction with people in these situations. In person, I am able to convey compassion and tolerance while still confronting denial. forum threads and emails are different, so my tactic in these subjects is not so much for those in denial, they are in defense mode and they are on auto-pilot when it comes to protecting their denial, so I really am not speaking to them but to others who read these threads who may need a little nudge.

If you think you have been in the SAME situation that he is in, and think you know the solution to that situation, then why are you unsuccessful at helping him?

Well, he has already made up his mind that he doesn't want my help. So, I'm not able to help him. But, I am doing what people do on discussion forums and butting my head in and volunteering my opinion for fun. Now, if he had actually approached me for help, one of the first things I would require before actually helping him would be to require that he be willing to follow suggestions even if he didn't like them or was uncomfortable with them. If he were unwilling to do so, then I would not attempt any help.

But, having said that, Hardy, since you are asking me my opinion, I will tell you that not I nor any other human being is able to fix his problem for him. If that is what you mean by help then I am incapable of any such help whatsoever. All I can do is tell him what I did in his situation.

IME, If he had considered my observations with an open mind, even if he didn't understand them and proceeded to open his mind and investigate them as real possibilities, then he would be helping HIMSELF. Which is what I have been suggesting to him this whole time.

But as you have already read from him. He says he doesn't understand the concepts I have shared with him and he refuses to even investigate them because he says they are ridiculous to him. So, even if I wanted to help him I couldn't because he is totally unwilling to even consider them.

As I have said before, I believe this is because, on an unconscious level, he doesn't want to grow beyond his current level of understanding because it is too frightening to him as hundun said,

the devil they know is constantly chosen over the devil they don't know.

So, instead he is choosing to remain a victim and anyone who suggests that he change his mindset is threatening his state of being so he takes it personally and rejects it out of hand without even giving it a try...

But don't fool yourself, these women want murdering men and violence. It's what makes them hot.

Nonsense! Only emotionally damaged women want violent men. Loving, healthy women want compassionate, sensitive men. One can still be strong and masculine and still be loving, compassionate and sensitive. THAT is what makes women hot.

You need some serious therapy, my friend, but I bet I am not the first person to tell you that, so I am probably wasting my breath..

@5et

Well, are you trying to understand why he knows the problem but can't fix it? Or are you calling it ridiculous?

I know why he can't fix it. When he is given a proven method to fix his problem, he refuses it before even trying it. That is called "contempt prior to investigation."

I know that he has sought advice from others on this forum who have shared with him similar remedies as I have and he has rejected it.

So, it is ridiculous for someone who admittedly does not have the knowledge and the power to fix their problem to reject other viewpoints without any investigation.

This indicates a very clear unconscious desire on their part to prolong their misery instead of taking steps to remedy it. And the reason for this is simple: It is far more painful and frightening to take full responsibility for one's own life than it is to simply adopt a victim mentality, and in fact, to continue to energetically attract chaos to oneself...

As I said before to overcome ANY victimization on ANY level, whether that be personal, spiritual, emotional, health etc... one must be prepared to spend some time facing some very painful unresolved personal issues. Any external remedies such as exorcisms, mudras, mantras, meditations, blessings, ceremonies etc. are only tools that must be accompanied by ruthless self-assessment. And usually this needs to be done with the help of a professional. Those who refuse to get help usually do so, because they do not want to be confronted with their participation in the negative situation they have allowed themselves to be trapped in...

The other is trying to put oneself in the position of the help-seeker

Good point hardy. I have been in his situation. That is how I know how to fix his. You are right it is pointless to offer help to someone when one has no personal experience with the same problem. That is how I know when someone is in denial and is refusing to face the real issue...

Thanks for the questions Hardy....

I don't understand such theories. Things are simple.

You have the karma that's the cause and then there is your insane enemy who acts from the outside. No theory of me deciding I'm not victim and suddenly problems ceasing. That's ridiculous.

And yet you are the one who is suffering and cannot fix the problem. So, how is it that you know what the problem is and yet you cannot fix it?

Which is more ridiculous?

Perhaps if you tried to understand such theories, your reality would change.

What is sad is when seekers adopt an attitude of "I want what I want and I want it NOW!"

When one has this attitude, they cannot see the limitless infinity of wisdom right under their nose.

But when a seeker is grateful for what they DO have, then the Universe responds and gives them more than they could have imagined.

There are so many powerful practices right here already made available to us. But, many times people do not appreciate them.

But, I can tell you from experience that by being grateful for what you have, this opens the way for the Universe to reveal NEW teachings that no one has heard of before. But it starts with using what you have and being grateful for it.

What parent enjoys giving more to a spoiled, demanding child?

Heaven Chi. Calm down. Look at how defensive you are... Read my post again. If you can absorb it without taking it personally, you can change your situation...

I have been fighting black magic and demon possession for over 30 years. I know what I am talking about. In my 30 years of helping people fight black magic and demons, there has never been one person who wasn't the cause for their own situation. Not one.

There are more than just two types of attack. Demons, black magic, personal delusion... Ultimately it all stems from within you. When you can accept this, you will defeat it.

we all have unresolved emotional issues. You are no exception. Those who claim to have no unresolved issues, usually have the most...

You have a choice. As long as you believe you are a victim, you will be...

There is also the superconscious. Another terminology would be Superconscious = Higher Self, Conscious=Waking Self, Subconscious=lower self.

I would agree that the Subconscious runs the show. The conscious mind makes decisions, The subconscious carries all the psychological patterns that determine the choices we make.

If one is disconnected from their higher selves, the subconscious drives us from unresolved psychological issues (past karma). If however, we are connected to our higher selves, then our subconscious can be reprogrammed to create more harmonious patterns which will then affect our conscious choices.

In taoism we have Heaven, Earth and Man, (Superconscious, Subconscious, Conscious) Which are connected to the three dan tiens. 3rd eye (Heaven/superconscious), Navel (Earth/Subconscious) and Man (Heart/conscious)

In Teutonic Shamanism, we have the same but they are called Odin (Shamanic Inspiration), Villi (Willpower) and Ve (Sacred Space).

Nothing can harm you spiritually without your conscious or unconscious cooperation. If you are being attacked, it is because you (knowingly or unknowingly) have attracted it to you. Moving will not solve the real core issue. Because wherever you go, you will go with you.

Spiritual attacks are merely external manifestations of your internal state.

IME, spiritual and psychological counseling will stop any spiritual attacks once you are able to face your own unresolved emotional issues and accept that you create your external reality. This is simple but not easy. It means you will have to face alot of pain and fear within.

Besides, based on what I read, you have no proof that anyone is doing black magic on you. You don't know what is causing the attacks...

But I agree with what was said earlier. You are not a victim.

I'm seriously considering 100 days of celibacy.

I suggest that if you choose to do it that you do it with the immediate supervision of a qualified teacher who has successfully done it and can help you through it. Do not try it with a book.

In the past, I've attempted Mantak Chia methods of sublimating sexual energy while masturbating, however, I've found them difficult to figure out, as I've always walked too closely to the edge of orgasm and 5 times out of 10 end up spilling my seed.

Stay away from Chia's sublimation techniques! They are not real alchemy and they are dangerous. They are layman techniques that chia picked up from somewhere. What he mistakenly teaches as sexual kung fu is in reality outdated methods of birth control and have nothing to do with real taoist alchemy. Ask the medical qigong practioners on this forum about the horrendous physical problems that people have done to themselves by practicing this retention nonsense. you can also search this forum for many who have posted how these practices from books have caused them very serious problems resulting in impotence and much much worse.

Besides that and more importantly, masturbation retention techniques are completely useless. Once you have stimulated the sexual fluids, they cannot be used for alchemy. That hot, stimulated sexual fluid needs to be released or it will sit inside your body and rot. It will also heat you up with too much yang. In any case, once you have stimulated that fluid it is no longer truly jing and will not help you. you need to let it go.

I guess my question is this:

 

Is my current practice alone enough to successfully sublimate the excess energy (assuming that my practice is of good quality)?

IMO and IME, yes.

I am active and have a high sex drive. I find it difficult to go 10 days without release.

If you have a high sex drive, then be natural and release when you need to. Another very helpful path is to seek out a relationship partner who nurtures your taoist practices and with whom you can share your sexual energy with. I have done the celibacy route and I am now married and my energy is stronger now than when I was celibate...

seek balance in your life and relationships, keep a strong practice and IMO, there is no need to try and force celibacy on yourself. But whatever you do, don;t try and do it from a book and stay away from Chia's sexual kung fu!

going good i pmed him.

Congratulations! Hundun sounds like a great teacher.

since you now have a teacher, this will be my last bit of advice to you...

Be aware that not many teachers will offer their teaching to someone like he did to you. Usually, it is the other way around. Teachers wait until the student has approached them and asked to prove their sincerity and dedication. So, I want to encourage you to appreciate what has been offered to you and take advantage of it. Do not take it for granted. You can show appreciation by not running around asking other people these kinds of basic questions. I would suggest running these kinds of questions by your new teacher first before coming onto this forum and asking everyone else. Based on what I have seen of you, I think that what you need most to is to focus on one path with one teacher. This forum is a great place for networking and connecting with other fellow taoist enthusiasts, but it is not very good for real in depth learning for many beginners. Maybe after a few years of consistent practice with hundun you will be able to ask these kinds of questions on a forum and be able to discern a good answer from a bad one.

my last .02 for you...

Good luck to you...

Mewtwo,

how is your search for a teacher going? I saw that someone volunteered to help teach you. Did you take him up on his offer?

Thank you all. Don't worry I have a teacher and he has given me a guided meditation CD recorded by himself.

He told me however best is to memorize it but I prefer the guided CD.

 

Are guided mediations less effective than otherwise?

 

About anapanasati, yes I know I used to practice it in the past but I don't like it. I prefer my current style of meditation and I'm not changing it. But thank you for your good will to help me.

If you have a teacher, you should be asking him these questions not random people on an internet forum. If you were my student, I would not want you asking strangers about instructions I had given you...

Ok so um some of you have said you could teach me. Well i am willing to take that advise. So where do we begin?

 

 

 

Thanks

Hi Mewtwo,

I think instead of starting a thread saying "OK, teach me" I would recommend that you decide on one particular path or discipline from those who have elected to teach you. Then message that person and begin from there. Otherwise, you will get a million different responses on this thread from people trying to teach you a million different things and you will get nowhere. IME, it works better if you seek out one particular style and/or teacher and approach them rather than standing on the street corner and saying, "OK.. teach me"

If you are not sure which way to go and you do not know of any teachers in your area, then probably a better way to use this thread is to ask people to refer you to teachers and schools that teach online. Then you can investigate the different teachings and pick the one that resonates with you best.. I do not recommend trying to learn from a forum thread.

Good luck...

In my experience, purification is much more important than trying to raise energy or gain powers. The ego does not become enlightened. If you awaken kundalini without purification, all the unconscious crap will come out and it won't be pleasant. Better clean your house first and explore the attic before bringing in the light that reveals everything, lol

Well said!