Sloppy Zhang

And when someone ELSE is the target, do you protect them or run away? When a friend or loved one is targeted, do you just run away and leave them to their fate/karma?

They've already responded to threats (or insinuations) of the death of Julian Assange by putting together an "insurance" package, which his lawyer has described as a "thermonuclear device" for the information era, containing a bunch of files that has information wikileaks has not released, primarily because it contains information which could get some people (like spies) killed. A super encrypted version of the file has been released and passed around, and in the event of Julian Assange's untimely death, the password will be released and the files will be out there and available. At least that's what they say. Is it a bluff? Maybe. There are a lot of documents they have but have not released, so I'm sure there's something.

Avoidance is great. But what do you do when the fight comes to you? What happens when you are targeted BECAUSE you do not fight?

Many people out there who love and are powerless.

This is mostly how I have viewed them as well. It's easy to say, "I would never use powers for personal gain" if you never actually have them. The REAL test is if you DO have powers which you could use for personal gain, the kind of powers where you could do something and no one would ever even suspect it was you. Would you use them? Or stick to your morals? Would you find that it is entirely different than how you thought?

For anyone who doesn't know, ROTC Makyea- I'm not in a very good position to be giving advice, because I'm rather all over the place these days myself, but this is what I would recommend based on what I'm doing now- I would say first to find out what it is you find yourself thinking about all day. When you imagine your future self, it doesn't matter in what wild capacities you think of it as, what do you see yourself doing? Then, meditate, but focus on your body, focus on you right NOW. What do you feel your present being wants to do/the directions it is going? I have found that many times, what I want to do is more a projection of what others expect me to do, what I should do to fit into a certain role, or what I think I should be doing/how I should be doing it, but when I center on my body, and myself in the present, sometimes those things fall away, then again, sometimes they don't. I usually go with the things that I 1) find myself doing/thinking about all the time, and 2) don't fall away as soon as I start a little meditation. But who knows how that will work out for me in the future I have no guarantee this will work to a satisfying end (whatever that may be), so take this advice with caution.

Nice points.

Interesting points. So do you think Robert Bruce has done it?

So how do you know Robert Bruce has done it?

I feel sad that you can't take it seriously, as Raduga adds some interesting insights on projection in a way that is devoid of some overlying structure- he just describes what happens and what to do when stuff happens. Sounds cool. Mind sharing some of these?

Breaking news! Man advertises product using sex appeal! He obviously is a fraud!!! Seriously, maybe you should give his material a serious read, there's some good stuff. And as Seth has been pointing out, Robert Bruce's method is far reaching and broad, but to someone who just wants to get out of body, is rather cumbersome. Even if you just want to get the bare bones of how to get out, you've got to read dozens and dozens of pages. Not to mention there's a lot about developing the energy body. Which is great if you want an all encompassing method.... But some people just want to get out of body. Raduga's methods are pretty straight forward and take advantage of natural phases of sleep/wake that can be used by anyone pretty much immediately after they learn them- he also gives lots of alternatives and a strategy for how to manage changing scenarios depending on the type of person you are. It's devoid of the larger system that Robert Bruce's material is, which can be good or bad. If you want a system that will help you grow and develop, maybe you should work with Robert Bruce's material, develop your energy body some, and things like that. If you just want to get out of body.... maybe Raduga's is better. (I've never actually seen any of the videos, I just read the material was a pretty lol-worthy video, though).

Perhaps you should take a look at this thread. It seems that even the notion of losing chi through orgasm varies, and there are people all over who have orgasms that actually boost their energy. So maybe rather than getting into some view of "oh, orgasms/losing chi is bad" maybe you should think of "it's something spontaneous that has been happening since I was a kid, maybe I should ride the wave and enjoy the moment." And again, like scotty said, you lose a TON of chi worrying out whether you are losing chi, far much more than you would if you were just doing the activity without mentally attaching to it.

The legal case in Sweden is just this back and forth deal, but I've been reading various people around the net saying that Assange/his lawyers might be giving this a lot of their attention, because the more things get mucked up with this case, the more trouble the U.S. would have to go through to get their hands on him (though Sweden on sex assault/rape vs. U.S. on espionage... who gets the prisoner?). In any case, the legal dilemma facing Assange would be interesting, especially if he was tried for espionage. The Espionage Act is pretty broad. Nevertheless, there are still some general guidelines which cover it- Espionage Act For example, in the section for "Gathering, Transmitting, or losing defense information", there is this bit: Many sections of the Act include little phrases like this. It would be up to the U.S. to actually prove not only that he got the documents (which everyone pretty much knows), but that his intent was deliberately to cause harm to people. So far as I know, it is shaping up pretty close to the aforementioned Pentagon Papers case. From what I know, a lot of the same issues that they brought up back then are being brought up now. And the Pentagon Papers were covered under the first Amendment. Not to mention the fact that, from the perspective of the Supreme Court, the government did not succeed in proving their case that the Pentagon Papers were causing enough harm for them to be censored. And I haven't really seen anybody citing examples for the harm that wikileaks has caused. A lot of "hypotheticals", like "what if someone gets hurt because of the info?" and "what if other countries stop working with us?" and things like that. Nothing solid (at least nothing that would sway me if I were in court). So just from what I know, seems to be following the same kind of road.... In fact, here's what a senator said from the 1971 case (the senator supported the release of the pentagon papers): Sound familiar to anyone??? However, there's been a lot of misdirection/misrepresentation of the whole situation in the media these days. I don't know how the Pentagon Papers were covered in the media in their day, so I can't speak to that.

Thought provoking stuff, there!

Interesting stuff ninpo, thanks!

Where did you get this from?

Anybody mind asking Alfred E what he means by "survivability", how one would go about developing this skill, and otherwise a bit more elaboration? He's ignored me and I don't think he can see my posts (I wouldn't know, I've never put someone on an ignore list )

Yup, pretty much. How would you (star to, at least) go about doing this?

Yeah, wikileaks and the media frenzy has been the focus of several of my classes on the same, or similar subjects. Interesting (and sad) to see different mechanisms in action.

Maybe. I dunno how I feel about karma. It does make sense, and in some situations I'm likely to agree with it. But in others it just doesn't sit right with me though. Oh well I fully believe that they do. And see this is the thing about me personally that doesn't always come across well.... I'm a junior in college right now. I have to do a lot of things academic. Paper writing, research, etc for both the humanities and the sciences. Now in such an environment, you see a lot of differences between personal and professional opinion. For instance, there are plenty of religious/spiritual scientists out there, but they make a distinction between what they believe to be true and what they can scientifically prove. I am pretty similar. I personally believe that humans are capable of doing awesome things. I believe there are people who HAVE actually done amazing things. I believe there are people PRESENTLY who can DO amazing things. That is my personal opinion and my personal belief. Now, if I were going to write a research paper for a science class, would I have any support? Well..... it would be scarce, at best. There have been some interesting studies with tummo (see the thread). There have been some interesting studies with psi (Dean Radin is pretty vocal on that front). You can (quite successfully) make arguments that the scientific/public community is just not open to accepting these things even if they do see them, which is why there is not a lot of good research, and the good research that is out there doesn't get funding. And that's all well and good.... but at the end of the day we are left with sparse amounts of research. On top of that, there is the prevailing attitude in the spiritual community that, "I do not have to do any work. If you want to know, you must come to me. You don't believe me? Too bad, I can do X,Y, and Z, and I'm not gonna show you just because you ask, if you want to know, do it yourself!" And, you know, that's fine. It's their prerogative to say/believe whatever they want. It's just that, from an investigative view, that is not a very promising sign. It doesn't mean they are lying. It's just not promising. And if everyone gave everyone the benefit of the doubt and tried things without proof, we'd all spend a lot of time and money figuring out who is a fraud and who is not, when a great way to expedite the process is "the burden of proof lies on the people making the claim". This way people don't have to spend significant amounts of time with potentially fraudulent systems and get nothing out of it (some claim you have to do a system for months or years before results, and if that person is a fraud, that's months/years down the drain for someone!) So, yeah, personally, I'm a "believer". But nobody gets anywhere if we just pat each other on the back every time someone makes a wonderful claim about (as we understand the term now) superhuman feats. So on occasion I prefer to take up the "professional" approach, and investigate and ask questions. And some people don't like that, and I'm sorry. Trust me, even I feel like a dick saying, "why don't you prove it?" but, you know, as I said before- I would want people ask me tough questions and investigate me if I made claims, ESPECIALLY because there are lots of people looking for genuine methods. As a person who is dedicated to this path, and as someone who has been duped before, I know it's hard to find something real and good. And asking questions and being critical is a great way to weed out frauds, and help find a genuine person/practice. And hopefully there are people who are helped by such critical inquiries.

What part of that film would you describe as "guardian of the gates"? ******SPOILER ALERT****** His subconscious memories of his wife that kept on getting in the way? The subconscious defenses of other people? The abyss that they could fall into if they were killed?

Interesting stuff. Reminds me of http://www.thedivinescience.org/. A couple of the teachers are frequent posters on http://forums.vsociety.net/ (Prophecy and Veos), teaching a mix of Yoga and Franz Bardon's material. Bardon's material (Initiation Into Hermetics) is also said to be connected to the White Brotherhood/Lodge (a bit can be found in the book Frabato the Magician). Though I did come across this article on Dr. Doreal. A bit old and seems to be incomplete (or maybe it's just that short?)

I have enjoyed this conversation as well Well that's very good to hear! I do agree with you that every news resource is going to have a slant. Many things are not reported even in large, mainstream outlets, though, and even if you are bombarded with stuff everywhere else, you still might be ignorant about lots of things. But when I say "ignorant", I don't mean it as harshly as the word itself comes across- it's just a statement about what one does not know. Even "well informed" people who routinely cruise the news sites (ABC, NBC, CBS, CNN, CNBC and things like that), would still be ignorant of a lot of things! It's hard to know what you don't know! I agree that physical force should be avoided, because it has a nasty way of mucking things up for everyone involved. However, we do live in a physical world, and I like to keep physical concerns in mind. I don't know about that, but I do appreciate the kind thought I wouldn't say softening up. Fighting really does take up a lot of resources, and causes a lot of wounds (physical and mental and spiritual). It's just hard to tell that if you haven't gone through it yourself, and most people go through fighting in their younger days, so by their older days, they realize it's best to avoid that. Thanks for yours as well!

Yeah, I've seen some communities that don't like the way he markets stuff, but to be honest I haven't really looked into many of his products or considered buying his products, so I can't speak to that. But what he does have up on youtube contains some pretty solid advice, IMHO.