Sloppy Zhang

I have heard B.K. Frantzis talk and write about this as well, that "Peng" should not just be limited to just the "Peng" posture/move, but it is actually a force that is present THROUGHOUT the body and THROUGHOUT the entire form. Even if if you are yielding, you still have that "peng" in your structure. He also writes about sung/song in various places as well, not only with alignments, but in the almost energetic sense that energy/force that sinks down can rise up (and in fact can make the rising force stronger) but energy/force that rises up can not always sink down (and in fact certain rising forces can actually prevent downward flow). So proper training should start with the structure and the relaxation force before you start getting into the way it can "bounce back" up and into the generating/issuing force that can be seen in Tai Chi.

I would start with Bruce Frantzis's "Relaxing Into Your Being" and "The Great Stillness", see how you feel after that.

A perspective on Franz Bardon, which talks on a few points you brought up: http://forums.vsociety.net/index.php/topic,15084.0.html Also an IIH commentary here: http://forums.vsociety.net/index.php/topic,13531.0.html These guys have their own school of Western Hermetics that appears to draw heavily from Bardon's material: http://thedivinescience.org/ They give semi regular classes online.

I mean, for me it comes down to the difference between cultivation paths that emphasize/appreciate catharsis, and those that emphasize more the slow and steady path to exploring, unlocking, and releasing what's there. Some people tend toward catharsis as being necessary to get the stuff "out there." To get stuff moving. In that respect, BDSM, or any intense "trigger" can get the juices flowing, so to speak, and get you to a new and profound state that you can then use as a platform for introspection, meditation, etc. It also gives you a "target," so you can work to getting to that state or being able to work with that state more reliably without that "trigger." Other people, though, can become reliant on that catharsis, and must go to ever increases lengths to keep getting that same rush of catharsis. They become addicts. Or, for other people, too much comes out too quickly. Or they lose their footing, and they spin out of control. Maybe they were already prone to letting things go. Or maybe they don't know what to let go and what shouldn't be let go of just yet. I would take it for what it is (no pun intended!... that's a lie I totally intend it) No more, no less.

So I kind of wanted to get a thread started to focus on the methods taught by B.K. Frantzis. I think his stuff is really great. His seminars can be pricey, and some areas of instruction seem to be spread far and wide, but I think what he has out in book format is excellent. However, most of it is rather uncontroversial (I think he wanted it that way!) so it's easy to gloss over and move on to something more flashy. One of my inspirations was the other day I think I caught some sort of cold from a friend of mine. Today when doing my dissolving practice, I notice my nose was pretty clogged up, and I felt a lot of tension in my face. Earlier I had tried to blow my nose, but not a lot of stuff was coming out, it was mostly just congestion I think. I spent about 20 minutes just dissolving my face, and after I felt a really strong urge to massage certain points on my face, which I did. A couple minutes later mucus started flowing out non-stop. Really nasty stuff. But after that I felt 100x better. Stuff that probably would have taken two or three days to get out (or get over) took me under an hour. Excusing the nasty example, I'm curious if anyone else can share experiences they've had from practice, insights into the system, or something else along those lines? I know there's a few people here that have had experiences with the system Bruce teaches, so it would be great if we could get together and share, as well as give info to anyone looking to investigate (as many people are discouraged by high prices and not knowing exactly what they are getting). For my practice background, the only way I've managed to get a hold of the material is through books, but this summer I'll most likely be in New York, and have more access to teachers, and depending on how my funds look and their schedule, might plan on going to a seminar

Well I waited and waited, but I figured someone would have to do it... B.K. Frantzis' Book "Taoist Sexual Meditation" has been released and is ready to order: http://energyarts.co...meditation-book Mine came just the other day. I gave it a thorough skim and now I'm reading it page by page. As many of you know, I'm a huge fan of B.K. Frantzis. I think his Taoist Water Method tradition is not only super legit, but is a refreshing and new (to the West) view of Taoism, spirituality, and cultivation in the day to day world that is fudamentally removed from some of the more common modalities of Western thought. Some basics of the basics were introduced in his book "The Great Stillness", which not only featured such titilating topics as fingering tofu, but also the basics of moving sexual energy up to the lower dantien through the central channel, or into the lower dantien through the microcosmic orbit (though that book did not go into detail of the MCO, you just kinda had to know it from other sources). Well, I must say, that this book has quite a few techniques. Some of them are pretty basic (fingering tofu) and some of them reach into the "far out" (sex with non corporeal entities and jumping into different dimensions). Sound somewhat different than the usual, boring Frantzis material? It is, but is no less grounded in practical techniques that not only can be applied TODAY, but are rooted in fundamental Taoist thought which can be found in your very own (most likely translated) copy of the Tao Te Ching. And I must reiterate, his position on sexuality within Taoism and spirituality as a whole is quite refreshing, and my guess is that it can really help people find themselves if they go through a crisis between spirituality and sexuality, which includes topics like masturbation, semen retention, partner practices, etc etc, topics which are frequently brought up around here and topics that provide many a member many an unresolved issue. My advice? Buy the book. It's a good size, it's a good price, shipped to me quickly, and it's rather thorough in theory, practice, and for once Frantzis actually gets into some "out there" material (though again, he does so in such a grounded way that none of the "feats" if you can call them that, seem out of reach, just a matter of practice practice practice).

I was around in the Kunlun thread days. There were a lot of well balanced and informative people who posted. I don't know if any of them are active posters, so I don't know if you'll get responses to big names. As far as the practice weakens, I don't think that's as accurate. Rather, when you first start a letting go/releasing practice, you obviously have a lot to release. A lot of releases means a lot of "stuff" going on, so you think you're "doing something." But I think if that tapers off that means you have less and less to release. You hold on to less. The releases you do have are gentler and more balanced. Which I think is a good sign and a sign of progression and development. I'd say, if you feels like your practice isn't "doing anything," then you should keep doing that practice! I'd bet if you did stop that practice for a few years, did something else, or didn't do any practice at all, and came back to it, you'd probably find your practice is "doing something" again.

If we invent a time machine in the future then we've always had a time machine so... We don't need to worry about making a time machine, since we've already done it. in which case, we don't have a time machine, so we will need to develop it. So... should I study to become an engineer, or should I just wait for my engineering marvel to win me the lottery?

I have heard from people who have spent a lot of time practicing and developing themselves according to Bardon's system. They say (and Bardon says this as well) that it is imperative that you get to step 8 before working on the Evocation/Kabbalah books. Why? Because when you are on step 8 you have developed all of the faculties to directly perceive energy yourself, and what you are doing yourself, rather than parroting a formula made by someone else. For that reason, I have heard that Bardon's Evocations/Kabbalah were "incomplete" in the sense that they are missing certain aspects, or have certain aspects reversed. If you have the right faculties cultivated you'll see where the missing piece is or what things need to be reversed. If not, you'll be spinning your wheels. Which is why they say "don't skip steps" in Bardon

I was actually talking about this subject with a group of co-workers. One of them said "oh, it's like the movie crash!" And I thought it was a great observation. For those who haven't seen the film, I highly suggest it: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crash_(2004_film) Basically, several peoples' lives interweave. Actions have reactions, and those can be good/bad/neutral. They just are. One thing leads to another leads to another leads to another. I imagine that one further on the path can see how their actions would affect others, and apparently fully enlightened beings can act without creating karma? Maybe it's just an extension of knowing what everything causes and just moving to avoid any of those entanglements.

But what to offer? Sometimes people who don't know I'm allergic to peanut butter say "I'm sorry I've been such a dick, here, I bought you an extra large snickers bar." Gee, thanks for the present, I can't eat it. Maybe you shoulda asked around and figured out what I like, or maybe even asked me

Well, it's a broad topic. The definitions of qigong/neigong I'm borrowing from Frantzis because I believe they make a good delineation between subjects. Broadly speaking- qigong is working with qi in the body/mind/emotions. Generally, working towards physical health and wellness. Many martial artists fall into this realm- they might have the qi of a whale and can squish you into the ground with a hand. But are they particularly spiritually developed? Not necessarily. Plenty of topics on this board have gone into energetic attainments vs spiritual attainments. Neigong- this is when you get into "spiritual cultivation." Psychic influences, karma, dissolving ego, Tao/void/Godhead/whatever. This is the kind of stuff that gets you further on the path, and may carry over with you when you reincarnate. In this context, you can have qigong without neigong and neigong without qigong. But in what, in my personal opinion, are full spiritual traditions (which touch on all aspects of life/death, daily or otherwise) there are methods of dealing with the physical body (avoiding injury, healing injury, what positions to sit in, etc) and those run up the spectrum to get into meditation. One can even make this distinction between different types of yoga- there is the yoga that cleanses and exercises the physical body/energy channels, and then there are types of yoga that deal with serious cultivation of the spirit/higher energy centers (kundalini type stuff). Plenty of people are doing yoga these days for the health benefits completely ignorant of the spiritual cultivation side (analogous to qigong without neigong) and plenty of people (maybe even here on TTB's) are sitting in full lotus meditating to achievement without getting into the yoga postures that tone the buttocks (neigong without the qigong analogy). Sorry if my shorthand in the above post offended or mislead you In any case, those are the terms I'm using and the context I'm using them in. Feel free to agree to the definitions or not, it's just surface level stuff. But that will give you the key to see what I'm really saying. Now, with regards to Mistele's articles, in his first article on Bardon's basic training (here: http://williammistele.com/ch1mental.html), he writes: In particular points 1 and 4. It seems like the assumption he is coming from is that zen and qigong/Tai Chi are not self contained, but merely aspects of a whole (a whole that Bardon encompasses) namely, the mental and the energetic power, respectively. Now when I first read this I was already practicing B.K. Frantzis' methods, which contains not only physical development (in terms of energy, alignments) but also a means of smoothing out emotional, mental, psychic, and if you read the outline in his books for trajectory of the practice, full on spiritual/internal alchemy. But then it occurs to me that he probably hasn't met anyone from a full on Daoist tradition that is an equivalent to Bardon's so... that was just me getting all puffed up for no reason It's not about "you said XYZ about my tradition", it's more about "these are the qualities of a full on spiritual tradition and method of magical/spiritual development, you either have them or you don't." And the fact of the matter is, many these days don't. In any case, regarding Bardon's system, I do believe there is internal alchemy involved, and again, he puts it right front and center in the middle of the book. And by the middle of the book, I mean steps 1-3 where you are working with the soul mirrors and elements in the astral body. The whole is to turn your gaze upon yourself (introspection) and assess what is there and what isn't there (become aware of your imbalances) and to begin the process of balancing them out, using the elemental energies as handles. Admittedly it is indirect, but that's the whole idea. You're a beginner. As you get better and better, you become more skilled at parsing out which emotion is which. What is their energy? Throughout the day, you realize when more fire builds in you, when your water becomes weak, when you let air whisk you away, and when earth keeps you so rooted you can't move with the flowt of life. This is nothing more than elemental ways of saying "you need to be aware of how energies arise inside of you, and you need to deal with those energies." Sound like an awareness practice to anyone? Of course, most of this stuff is left implied. Sort of. He mentions in several places throughout the text that your practice builds and you never forget this. And let's not forget other Hermetic principles (understandable if Bardon assumes these are implicitly known, perhaps?) As above so below, the law of analogy? The energies you are working with on the astral body have effects/analogs in the physical and mental realms. So suddenly you have room for your entire practice to move up or down to different "levels" of your being. But of course, how many Bardon teachers are out there to prod you along and check your progress? Not many. So, and this is purely conjecture at my part, I think people do the basic of this and then move on. You know, to the fun stuff. Especially for energetically sensitive people, energy manipulations of step 3 are waaaaaaay more fun. I also think cross training has something to do with this. For instance, Bardon doesn't teach energy/elemental manipulations until steps 2-3. But if you've worked in a qigong/neigong practice, you already know how to feel and manipulate energy, hell, you may already have worked with projecting it into other people (and spaces, etc). If you've worked in other forms of magic (when I was young I got the book "Modern Magick") then you've already been working with elemental energies. Bardon puts that shit together like nobody's business, and now you can see how elemental energies build to things like clairvoyance, clairaudience, remote viewing, astral projection, etc. You know, the fun stuff. But the whole idea is that you don't get TO the fun stuff unless/until you're balanced out. But of course balancing involves awareness. Stillness. Reflection. Radical self honesty. That shit aint fun. So I believe that is the cause for powerful but fucked up people, or at least people who have no "neigong" or alchemy or whatever terms you want to use. It's not because it isn't inherent in Bardon's system. It's because most people practicing Bardon have not refined their practice to that level. And that's not Bardon's fault. And the same can be said for visualization. At first it's an indirect method of getting a "hold" on the energies. keep in mind, Bardon doesn't just use "visual" visualizations. You hold feelings, sounds, tastes, and smells in your mind to give you a "grasp" on energies. Eventually, once you have gotten a hang of the vital force or other elements, move them around directly with intent. Again, implication vs explicit statement. Read between the lines people This is magic/occult/whatever. Get creative.

I've started to pick up on this a little bit as well. I don't think I'm developed enough to feel/communicate with spirits per se, but I have started to notice an "energy" behind certain places, certain actions, etc. I've taken up not doing "unnecessary" things. Unnecessary could mean something that whacks out my energy, but also something that whacks out the energy of the area. That said, I'm still in development, so occasionally I do things against my better judgment/feeling, and I wind up feeling reeeeeaaaaaaaal shitty about it later. If I offend a spirit, again, I don't have the ability to perceive/communicate with them, so I wouldn't really know how to make amends. But I do feel really shitty and do the best to clean up my act for next time, because it's kind of a bad experience

I would disagree on this point as well, and I would also ask what your definitions are for qigong and neigong. Steps working with the vital force in the physical body are Bardon's "equivalent" to qigong. Or rather, if you are doing qigong, you are working with vital force (qi) in the body. So that would be where qigong fits in the grand scheme of things. Now Neigong is a little bit different, because neigong gets into internal alchemy and getting into changing the fundamental core of your being. A good qigong system that is part of a long standing spiritual tradition will evolve into neigong. (But I guess it doesn't have to, as long as you understand what it is and what it isn't. Plenty of qigong systems out there are good for physical health, and if that's all you need and all you want, more power to you. But if you want to get into deeper/higher levels of being... Gonna need something that deals with that) Now here's the kicker- Bardon's system IS basically a form of internal alchemy (which also includes aspects of physical health/healing that qigong would supply). So now we come to the conversation of working in multiple lineages. Should you do it? Are two lineages compatible? If you have two fully developed lineages that address the needs of the physical, energetic, spiritual, mental, psychic, emotional, whatever/however many bodies your paradigm uses, then it doesn't much matter- each system is going to have ways of developing in these areas, and how deep they develop them depends on the tradition and the teacher. I would very much suggest William Mistele's writings on Bardon: http://williammistele.com/ In particular, he talks about how a master magician must embody everything masters of other traditions are. He notes two- the first being zen, which focuses pretty much entirely on the mental body, void meditation, occasional focal meditation. He says a master magician should basically be a zen master, because all of the skills on the mental body (as defined by Bardon) are the same. He then says that a master magician should also be a Tai Chi/qigong master, since working with the vital force in the physical body is what Tai Chi/Qigong is about. Now obviously traditions of Tai Chi/Qigong get VERY in depth about the physical body- acupuncture points, meridians, energy channels, openings/closings of the body. Mistele says that Bardon doesn't go into that much depth, because if you get to the point where you are breathing vital energy in through the entire body, you're basically doing it (and I suppose if Divine Providence allows you to discover other methods or if you want to learn from a spirit or a Tai Chi master, more power to you). I don't think Mistele has met/been involved in a legit Neigong tradition (they're rare as hell anyways, let alone in the West) so while I initially disagreed with hem on the point of Tai Chi/qigong being only a "part" that a master magician would know and more, I kind of see where it's coming from if you have the perspective of a Tai Chi/qigong master who's just working with energy in/of the physical body.

Zhongyongdaoist beat me to it He wrote a good post a while ago that I was able to find by searching: http://thetaobums.com/topic/28403-asterian-astrology/?p=433544 Well, since you asked, to a person like myself with decades of study and experience with astrology "East and West", unless your have unwittingly misrepresented him, he sounds ignorant and pretentious. Ignorant because he didn't know that Western astrology has had subdivisions of the signs since the Hellenistic period and all he did was "reinvent the wheel". Call then decans, decanates, faces or whatever, such a ten degree subdivision of each sign has been in use for a long time in the West. It is usually thought to be an adaptation of the Egyptian calendar system. As for Western signs being off by 23 degrees, this is a difference that arises between what is usually called the Tropical and the Sidereal Zodiacs. Western Astrology is based on the Tropical Zodiac which is defined by the relation between the Earth's equator and the ecliptic. The ecliptic is defined by the tilt of the Earth's axis and is what determines the season. The ecliptic is the Sun's apparent path during the year. Spring begins in the Northern Hemisphere when the sun passes over the Earth's equator going from the Southern Hemisphere to the Northern one. This exact day is called the Vernal Equinox because the day and night are of equal duration, and is the beginning of the sign of Aries in the Western or Tropical Zodiac. Thus the Western Zodiac is based on fundamental relations of space and time which determine the seasons and also the cycle of eclipses, which, by the way, is why the ecliptic is called the ecliptic. Whenever the sun and moon are both "on the ecliptic", new or full moons are eclipses. Seems like a long time ago someone noticed that the bright star Spica was setting at sunrise around the VernalEquinox. So the setting of the Spica became a marker of the beginning of Spring. That pesky precession of theEquinoxes changed all that though and now the setting of Spica no longer corresponds to the Vernal Equinox. Oh well, things change I guess. However, the opposite point to Spica is the beginning of the ancient Indian Mansion's of the Moon and thus the Indian Sidereal Zodiac. So the question is, what is more important, that Spica happened to be setting on the Vernal Equinox for a couple of Centuries two thousand or so years ago or a basic pattern derived from the relation between the Sun and the Earth that determines the seasons? As a curious aside, I will note that Spica is important to the Chinese Lunar Mansions also, but it seems to be quit independent of Indian usages. By the way there is a common misconception that Western Astrologers were ignorant of the precession of theEquinoxes and the Sidereal Zodiac. Far from it, both were known from Hellenistic times. The precession of theEquinoxes was termed the motion of the eighth Sphere and is mentioned in the Middle Ages in Sacrobosco's De Sphaera, the standard astronomical text from the Thirteenth to the Seventeenth Centuries. Agrippa mentions the motion of the Eighth Sphere in both his Vanity of Arts and Sciences and in his Occult Philosophy, where he mentions the difference between the two Zodiacs and says that for purposes of working with the Arabic Lunar Mansions in magic it is preferable to use the Sidereal Zodiac. Somewhere between the Seventeenth and Nineteenth Centuries, the Precession and the Sidereal Zodiac where lost to Western astrologers, but in terms of astrological practice it wasn't much of a loss. The Sidereal Zodiac was reintroduced to Western Astrology by Cyril Fagan in the mid Twentieth Century and has enjoyed a certain vogue among people who think it is more "scientific", of course a modern astronomer is going to consider either zodiac laughable and the notion that any astrology could be "scientific", ridiculous. As a final note, I will mention that the oldest surviving work in Sanskrit dealing with astrology is called theYavanajataka and is an account of Western Hellenistic Astrology, yavana being Sanskrit for the Greeks, and is the practical basis for all subsequent Indian astrology. The only native aspect that survives is the Nakshatra's or Mansions of the Moon. which probably explains why the Indians astrologers continued to uses the Sidereal Zodiac long after astronomy had left them behind. I have tried to condense the above as much as possible, there is much more that could be said, but I don't have time now to enter into any extended discussion of these matters. I hope that you and others find the above interesting and useful.

Banks are a business that provides a service to us. People tend to forget this. They think, "my money will be safe in a bank." That's what I was taught as a kid. Want to save your money? Put it in a bank. But banks are a business. My family was fairly conservative and from a poor background, so we didn't get taught growing up about all of the ways you can use "finance" to grow your money. All of the things you can "invest" in. We just learn spend less than you make, spend wisely, always read the fine print, always get a second opinion, don't feel pressured to do anything, never make a decision in the heat of the moment, sleep on it for a few days. When I started to get into college and starting to spend money on my own, I didn't really get sold on a lot of extra bank features. I knew what I wanted and I just went with simple stuff. A lot of my other friends got sold the dream by their bank rep. In any case, as I learned more about business and banks, and how banks actually make their money, I took a fresh look at what banks were doing. Banks are a business, and they are looking out for THEIR interests, not yours. They are providing a service- they give you a place to store your money and access your money when you need to use it. That is what you are getting from them very simply. Everything else they do is an extension of the fact they are a business looking to make a profit. They will charge you fees for this or fees for that. They may offer to do various services to your money- make it grow faster- as long as you agree to certain terms- not being able to access it for a certain amount of time. You may be able to get different cards with different rates, different rules, different requirements, this or that. Always look at what it's giving you, but always ask yourself: what is this for profit business getting in return? Representatives at the bank are paid because they make the bank profitable. That is their job. Remember this. As with all companies, not all will play nice. Some "sales reps" may be more "strongly encouraged" than the sales reps at another bank to "close more business" (get you to sign on the dotted line). One rep might say that you need such-and-such service, but a rep down the street at another bank will tell you that you don't need the service, but instead need another. Your friend's banker uncle might tell you that you need neither, and may tell you to do something else. Or he may agree with a previous rep. The goal isn't to find someone who isn't working an angle. Because in the real world, EVERYONE has an angle (even your local Buddha- his angle is to get you to enlightenment!) The goal is to find someone working an angle that dovetails with the angle you are working (at the very least, security for your money, at the very greatest, profit for your money). Treat banks like a business.

Well let's get un-romantic and realistic, otherwise you're just going to unplug yourself from one Matrix to plug yourself in to another one. What are you studying now? Are you in school in a business program? Pre-business program? High school about to go into college? In the workforce working a shitty job? What are you doing NOW? Have you ever been to the tropics/island/beach and lived off of the fruit? Or are you just imagining how nice it would be? What happens if you get sick? Will you have access to treatment (as in, will you be in a region/country that has good medical practitioners) and will you be able to pay for it (money or insurance?)? Let's say you meet someone and have kids and start raising a family. How would you provide for them and educate them? Your hippy dippy dream might be good for you, but what about for other people? Please consider that your actions can affect others and force them into scenarios that might limit their ability to make choices down the line in their own life. My suggestion? Money is not evil. Money is a tool. You can either make money work for you can work for the money. What is it going to be? You can either run the business, or have the business run you. The law can either be on your side, or you can be on the other side of the law. The secret comes to education. If you are uneducated about money, business, government, the law, technology, etc, those things will control your life and you will not be able to choose your own destiny. Educate yourself, master these areas (or at least gain some proficiency) and make them work for you. Someone made another thread about business/sales and about how it encourages you to lower your morals. YOU determine how far you are willing to go in your own business. Don't want to be a vulture? Don't. But if you are forced to work a job for other people, you have no choice. If they say "be a vulture or you're fired," then you can either be a vulture or get fired. And if you are locked into your life because of financial/educational/business/life decisions (or lack of decisions) that keep you locked to your job, you must do what your boss says, you must lie, you must compromise yourselves, and this is how people get screwed over by their jobs. When you create independently of others, you can do whatever the hell you want. Here are your steps: 1) Get educated. If you're in school, finish. Network like crazy when you are a student. Doors are open to students that are not for non-students (internships, interviews, benefit of the doubts, lack of employment history, etc). Use that to get a job, and from there, still network like crazy. Hang out with professionals who do what you want to do, express interest, always be learning. They will see you are an interesting and intelligent person, and want to work with you and will want their friends to work with you. People will introduce you to opportunities you didn't even know existed, because you are trying to be SMART. 2) Don't be afraid of money. 3) Use your success to take vacations on the beach and not have to worry about where the next meal/paycheck/doctor's appointment is going to come from. Hey man, that nomadic lifestyles sound uber romantic and fun. But it's pretty stressful as well I've had my share of nomadic experiences and met a few nomadic folks. You always think "yeah, I'll live in nature, it will be awesome." But as soon as you notice an empty space on the floor of their living room that looks like it can fit you, someone always utters the question "hey would it be okay if I stayed here tonight?" or some such other question I don't want to be a moocher and honestly I don't want people moochin off me. But maybe that's just how I was raised by a conservative family that believed in self reliance and not asking favors of people. I get that we should all be one and share the wealth and all that good stuff... but, you know... I don't know, maybe I'm just a jerk. I like having my own place, my own money, and yes, if I want to take a vacation to the tropics, I like being able to do that without having to be a beach bum for life.

Get a girlfriend, and get into the position pictured above.

Get a girlfriend.

Couple ways to go about doing it, and a few angles to consider. One is physical tension. If you are tensed (especially in the genitals or in your body) you're going to ejaculate faster (it is muscle contractions that are responsible for ejaculation). If those muscles are perpetually contracted, or if they contract suddenly and unexpectedly, you're going to ejaculate. So, during sex (or during masturbation practice) take note of where there is tension in your body and release it. The method I like best is the method outlined in B.K. Frantzis' Opening The Energy Gates of Your Body, which teaches you how to identify and release tension. But really any method you like will work. In masturbation practice, you're typically going until the "point of no return," which is the point that, if you keep going, you're going to ejaculate. When you get to that point, you ease off, and you relax any tension. Then you pick up the pace, and when you get to the point of no return, you ease off and relax tension. When you are having sex, you follow the same process of easing off when you get to the point of no return. This doesn't have to be sudden, but you can "cover up" your "backing off" process by emphasizing your kissing, rubbing, etc, and then resume once you've "cooled down" a bit. Speaking of "cooling down" a bit, that's a nice segue into the "Dragon Breaths" taught by B.K. Frantzis. If I recall correctly, two kinds of dragon breaths are taught in his "Taoist Sexual Meditation" book, a heating breath and a cooling breath. When you are "too hot," you ejaculate. So you can use the cooling breath to cool the area of the genitals during sex. I haven't had too much chance to experiment/practice this method, but I have had some positive experiences with regards to cooling my body during solo practice (even in non-sexual practice ya pervs ) As an aside these heating/cooling breaths aren't purely sex related. they can be used to heat/cool the body in any situation depending on what ails ya (I'm not an expert on Chinese medicine, so I'll leave the topic of what issue are called by hot/cool/damp/whatever to others) Other things to play with are where is your awareness during sex? Sometimes during intercourse I like to place my awareness in my feet (to drop the energy maybe?) I'm not a master of my awareness, so it sometimes doesn't always happen, or, depending on the position, I wind up feeling my partner's feet more than my own and the extra contact stimulates me more Playing with the point of no return and relaxing/backing off is something I've been working on for the longest, so I've got the most experience. It's pretty handy, and can keep you going for a while. I've also heard that this is the way to get orgasm without ejaculation. If you train yourself to relax into the pleasure, rather than tensing up, the muscles that trigger ejaculation don't get engaged, and you orgasm without ejaculation. I have had a few non-ejaculatory orgasms, but isn't something that I can do reliably. It's mostly in the moment. As with most of my practices, I get lazy even with the fun ones. I haven't tried any of the PC muscle clenching/tensing to stave off ejaculation. So I can't speak to that. I'm more a fan of the relaxation methods, so I lean toward that. I have also only recently started working on the MCO, so not sure how effective that is during sex to circulate/divert energy away from the genitals. As an aside, I've never had too much of a problem with premature ejaculation, aside from the standard male scenario of "men generally get off in less time than women, so I want to last longer for my girlfriend." That said, sex with your hand or other masturbatory devices is a lot different than sex with another person, so even if you practice a lot on your own (always good) your practice is going to start over (to some extent) when you start practicing with another person. Now let's not even start talking about feeling and playing with your partner's energy

That was more of a commentary on society's marketing campaign against drugs that I grew up with in the 90's (DARE program, "dope is for dopes", etc) than an actual reflection of my own opinions toward drug use (I support recreational drug use). Put quotes around "too smart" in my first post to reflect. I'll continue responding to the post, because I think it's fun for discussion Not necessarily, you are merely basing your decision on certain evidence. But direct personal experience is also not the only type of evidence, and not the only way to intelligently use evidence ("being smart"). My father might have been an alcoholic, so I could be incredibly averse to drinking, even though drinking in moderate amounts might not be problematic (and may even be healthy). It doesn't mean I'm "less smart." In fact, I'm arguably "more smart" because I have multiple situations that provide evidence to support my position. Same arguments can be used for weed, ecstacy, heroin, etc. Maybe I was scared (interesting that you picked that one word out of a "million other reasons"). What if someone took advantage of me in a less than physically aware/vigilant state, and I woke up in a bathtub full of ice minus one kidney? I would have been out a kidney, but at least I would not have been "scared". It least I would have been "less ignorant", and only then would have had a legitimate reason to be anti drug "I did drugs once and lost a kidney to black market organ dealers." But wait, someone would have come back and said "just because that didn't work for you once doesn't mean you have the right to make an overarching argument against it." So hey, there's no winning there You may be using the same argument I may have used, but just moved the goal posts. I could say I did heroin once and it was awesome, and you're just being scared/ignorant in how you're not using heroin. That statement is a bit ignorant as well. You can be incredibly educated about the physical/neurological/psychological effects of a drug based on huge volumes of research (personal or peer reviewed) and determine that is not a state you want to put yourself in. You don't need to put yourself into a situation to know about it (unless we want to get into a philosophical argument about what knowledge is, and whether first hand experience is required for "true" "knowledge" (I put them in their own separate quotes for a reason)). I think some of the verbiage in your posts hints at why. It's not just the English language, but culture. Not just culture, but American culture. Not just American culture, but American anti-drug culture present in schools during the time in which I grew up, and subsequent knowledge/experiences I gained through life (both drug and non-drug related). TTB discussions have never offended me, and I don't mean to start now

Same way Pretty boring square kind of guy Early 20's. Me and my friends were always more of the "let's hang out and talk about life" kind of guys. We'd talk about philosophy and religion and the nature of existence. Get some dinner, see a movie, hang out and talk, just chillin. No drugs though. "Too smart" for that. Then we'd play some video games or something like that. Only really go out to bars/clubs if it's with a group of other people I know. I'll drink to get a buzz but never to get stupid or black out or anything like that. I get that other people like to do it as a form of social bonding/releasing inhibitions, etc, but for me it's not necessary for either. I prefer more personal experiences for social bonding, and with regards to inhibitions, I either break them myself, or have a good reason for why I'm not going to cross a certain line. I know plenty of people who decided to let go of their inhibitions, and had great experiences that will affect them for the rest of their lives. And I know plenty of people who decided to let go of their inhibitions, and had terrible experiences that will affect them for the rest of their lives. Call me risk averse, but if there's a way to examine my thoughts/inhibitions and expand them without also taking away my faculty of thinking critically, I'm going to take that one, sorry.

I would also like to recommend the "Taoist Sexual Meditation" book. Very impressive spread of material, and it places sexual meditation/qigong within the overarching context of Taoist meditation and cultivation in a healthy and balanced way. I highly recommend it in general, and I highly recommend it to people who are struggling to fit their sexuality into their cultivation.

Things might also change as your practice continues/develops. As you resolve and balance the energies within yourself, circumstances that might have "set you off" in the past no longer trigger the same behaviors/responses

Huge fan of William Mistele, I've seen that meditation in one of his videos. Fun stuff.