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oh that's in master chia's advanced biomechanics of the iron shirt, basically the three levels (training the organs and fascia, training the tendons and joints, training the marrow and sexual essence) are the inner teachings of the martial arts as he learned them from some shaolin monk i don't remember exactly the story that doesn't matter i'm not sure it's ok to make open statements about techniques, but i guess it'll be all right just once, really sorry if i dissapoint but i have to respect the rules that go hand in hand with the teaching... if the chest is not right the energy will get stuck and you'll have problems with the organs inside the chest. if the shoulderblades are not rightly positioned the 'power' will stuck into the spine and you'll get problems with it... it's an issue about making the right connections between the bones and the tendons so that the power can safely travel from one point of the body to the other. also you can store it and then discharge it with specific methods which are really cool. most of the chinese masters do not agree that these are taught openly to westerners and have low esteem of master chia's work, but you know how it is, you have to see what works for you and take it and make it your own thru your own practice... all you need to know are in the Iron Shirt Chi Kung, Tendon Chi Kung and Bone Marrow Nei Kung books and videos. they are not very expensive and can save you years of research.... the pole standing has it's secrets also, it's not just 'tofu qigong', it's really a very direct way to build internal power. although i can understand why most masters won't share that and tell you just stay still and do nothing... if it's not accompanied with true emotional and mental alchemy the results can be catastrophic, that's why master chia always stresses they must be learned and understood together with the whole system.... i hope i helped at least a little

good post. keep in mind that the position of the shoulderblades and the chest are essential, they can either build power or........

Excuses, excuses... (Using metaphysical reasons explain one's actions is not very reasonable) PS: "Just" rearanged sugar molecules? Sugar is anything but inoffesinve... Some of the effects of sugar and cocaine are pretty simmilar. I notice that every culture that encounters the Tao uses it as a metaphysical excuse for aberrant behaviour. Today it's booze and pot, i wonder what will people think of tomorrow??

yes, i heard it goes by that name also (i'm reffering to the 'palm thing' here)

Yes, you MOST SURELY don't need a girlfriend... while you still have your palms

Hi there Craig, I have a proposition to make, that maybe helpful in more than one way... Consider that there are mainly two sides of daoist cultivation, DA DAO (the great tao of enlightenment and immortality) and XIAO DAO (the tao of everyday life and social interaction). Each of these two brances uses different types of prima materia. Xiao Dao uses 'hot' and 'cold' (yang and yin) sexual energy for purposes related to health and longevity. Da Dao uses 'primal' jing (non-polarised sexual essence) for purposes related to higher goals and acheivements. Thusly, the misconception related to 'pop taoism' and 'traditional taoism' quickly dissolves. There are just different paths that go different ways. There's an article in the link in my signature that i wrote related to Da Dao and Xiao Dao. I'd like you to have a look at it and tell me what you think.

You're right, but you're waisting your time We know this fellow for quite a long time.... There's no way we can help him, but I guess you had to give it a shot. Let him be and have his experience... The misinformation that he spreads also keep the ones that are not properly motivated from advancing on the path, which i consider to be quite a service to Dao, paradoxically. It's nice to see that everyone has his role to play in this great scheme of life... It's hard to change even if you want to, harder even if you don't care about it...

The effect of the alcohol is that it breaks down the aura, and facilitates 'spirits' to enter and feed on your internal power. It pulls your shen out, the Qi is scattered and the Jing has alot to suffer from alcohol - the liver, the blood, the sexual essence are all affected. Of course there maybe the case of practicioners that have the Gongfu of getting it out of the system very fast. But that is not very common. Beer is more acidic than coke. Wine, if it's blessed by a person with internal power, can be used as medicine sometime. But as medicine, it shouldn't be abused. Alcohol - did you ever wonder why it's called 'spirits'? There can be many excuses to defend one's habit and vices, but the truth is alcohol is hardly a 'friend' for a dedicate practicioner... I guess it all depends on what one wants in life.

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Challenges?... You mean opportunities...

Just remembered a daoist story... It seems in ancient times daoists were very interested in human anatomy and biology. As they could study extensively plants and animals, compile huge books with classifications and typologies, they could not do the same with the human body. The only oportunity then was to perform autopsy. The problem was that it was considered a form of desecration. There were a number of cases of daoists that were killed because they risked their life, going into cemetaries and unberry the dead, so they can perform autopsy on them, to learn how the human body works on the inside. The gift of inner vision was not bestowed to every practicioner, but the knowledge on anatomy seemed to be vital to them. Other cases were that when the Emperor had some favours do offer to some daoists, they would ask the bodies of the people that were sentenced to death, to open them... sometimes they would perform vivisection... Nowadays, all this information regarding anatomy, physiology, biology and such, is free and available to any of us. To daoists, the body is the foundation of the practices, and a great gift of heaven, which they try to understand and use as support for the alchemy practices that they have developed. Maybe is just me, but aside these ideas, it seems a bit silly to say that you're not interested how are you made, and what are you made of. It's your own body for god's sake, you have to know how it works, in order not to ruin it. Especially practicioners, that do things to their brains and bodies, they have to know how and what buttons to push. If they do something wrong, they do it at their own expense. Which reminds me, the medical and pharmaceutical industry thrives exactly on: ILLITERACY in biology and our own anatomy....

Before we skip up to the Real World, We still have to deal with This One... Knowing implies taking responsability, That's why everybody runs away from it...

Sean, Would you consider a female moderator - due to the obvious fact that ttb is a sausage plaza I vote for a W-o-m-a-n !

Ah How well does this thread paints a picture of the average ttbum - that remains to be seen. I want to add that there were two instances that made my mind regarding what to vote: - I took a glance at the complexity of the training and knowledge that a daoist disciple has to go through. - My experience with practicioners that take things 'on intuition only' showed me why they discard learning: they are Very self-centered. Simple, eh? Not to me. I keep watching them over the years, to see if there's a progress of any kind in their life: The ones that don't wake up to the bitter truth that alchemy requires hard work, dedication and being at peace with the idea that things may not come out as they planned, well, they just keep on doing what they are doing: nothing spiritual, only some kind of exotic culture.

Interesting... sounds like an excuse to me

I don't know anything specifically... just trying to ask kathyli for some insights. Fun = practice

interesting and quite balanced

anyone ever heard of karsai nei tsang?

Ah To me, the 'catch' of this thread and poll was a discussion around two-three items: - illiteracy = do people perceive that the lack of knowledge in the fields of biology/anatomy is quite a deficiency to any ordinary person, but to practicioners all the most... - hazardous = why would it be hazardous? that's a pretty confusing term, heh? - irrelevant = of course some will be challenged by the title and vote for this option... as daoism works on connecting everything, all the most the body and mind, i'd like to hear how they think it: does it have a rational argumentation, or is it a feeling of 'what do i/you care?'

so, i heard it was alot of fun...

my opinion is that: a daoist per se needs to respect alot more laws than your average joe. especially because they are not man-made, but the expression of tao and nature...

.

...yes, but if it's the real thing... POW!

oh good, i was beginning to worry i think i have some idea about how hard is to give others a glimpse of the difficulty of the training, when it gets real. well, what can i say, maybe it's better that way... L1

I got carried away trying to make a point i didn't have to make. Based on experience and education i think that: - sending sick Qi into the Earth will not solve the problem, because you need meditation experience to be able to work with the Earth's cauldron in order to transform that negative energy. Your Qi, whether good or bad, will still come back to you, because it's a part of you, and it wears your 'signature'. So you can sink whatever amount or quality of Qi into the Earth, without transformation/alchemy practice, it won't make much difference, the sickness will return eventually. - once you can do it with outside help (of the Earth) the next phase is when you can do it in your Inner Earth, inside yourself, without having to project it outside. Sorry about the misunderstanding, it usually happens when we separate an idea from it's context, and forget about the large aplications and implications. About stopping the world, I have a comment to make, as a former CC practicioner: it seems that the technique means more than just sitting silently and receptive. It's a spiritual event that can happen on occasions in a seeker's life, when all circumstances and timing and internal power is just about right. It usually comes after good years of correct hard working... What it does is that it breaks down the barriers of perception in one instant. It's a consistent shift of the assemblage point, connected with some event known as 'the descent of the spirit'. It's really a long way, and hard work until you get there. It's just my view, based on what i experienced, and learned, and witnessed. L1