Pero

Now that is something I agree with. But why do you then try to convince others eating meat is bad? Also, I`d like to say that becoming vegeterian is not so easy. I mean, you can`t just decide one day to stop eating meat, might mess yourself up. I eat meat, and I also think it`s a bit "heavy" to digest. But I don`t see myself becoming a vegeterian (at least not anytime soon). I eat when I`m hungry, if it`s meat, it`s meat.

True enough, though I do think some things he said had some value. Maybe. But what if all those people have one thought in their mind, like "Michael can`t lift the carrot". Are you certain you would be able to do it? And don`t forget the pshychological effects when people around you expect and maybe even want you to fail. Not very encouraging. Also, I`m not sure how good a comparison is lifting a carrot and levitating? The degree of diffuculty and skill required aren`t quite the same. Though I do think if someone really mastered something he should be able to do most of the time. So, I guess it indeed shouldn`t be any different than lifting a carrot. If there were a room full of believers, people would probably later say it was done under unscientific conditions. I agree. What do you think is the reason that the followers aren`t as good?

Hmmm, helps gray hair?? I might check it out again. I practiced them for a little while years back when my godfather borrowed me a book about them and wrote them down. But I don`t remember well what kind of effects I had from them, I think I felt energized after practice.

I remember someone saying that if someone for example is a master of levitation and can do it at will, if he`s put in a place with a hundred people who think that it isn`t possible at all, even such a person would have problems levitating or wouldn`t be able to at all. I don`t really remember who said it, is it possible it was Osho?

Interesting topic. But I`m interested in something more concrete, like some technique or something. Can you share something Seandenty? And what do you think (or know from your experience) is wrong with the HT techniques? What are these in English: "Long An Zhuan, Yi Zhi Chang and Jing Bu Gang"? I know about Yi Jin Jing (which is muscle/tendon changing) and Shi Shui Jing (bone marrow cleansing if I`m not mistaken), but I don`t remember hearing about the rest (at least not in Chinese).

That`d be nice. But it would have to be planned way ahead (at least for me), and somewhere that isn`t expensive (I˙m just a student). I`m probably going to a place in Venice (I think it`s called Dolo) next weekend to learn (and refresh) a bit about sound practice. Anybody there?

Posted this on HT forum also. I have to do a paper which is part of passing my final sociology exam on this title. So I`d like to ask if anyone knows any good books or internet sites on this topic. Now, the problem is, it has to be related to sociology. Something like beginnings of christianity and gnosticism, expansion of christianity and fall of gnosticism (reasons, circumstances, like one thing I found is that the belief that with birth you bring a new soul into this material world, caused a lot of abortions between gnostics, which was part of their "extinction"), where both of them are today.... How both religions influenced each other, how they coexisted... Christianity isn`t such a problem, but gnosticism is. I found one book, that was talking about gnosticism and it`s social and economic state of its followers. However the book was rare, it wasn`t on amazon, and it cost 300 $ (!) I believe. Any advice would be very appreciated.

Thaddeus, I haven`t done much research. There are a few versions. The story I remember is that some Japanese doctor (of something...) Mikao Usui was researching something about how Jesus healed people. So during his research he came upon some buddhist formula for meditation. So he went on a mountain and meditated for 21 days. At the end of his retreat he saw a white ball of light appear and crashed into his third eye and knocked him out. After that he saw millions of rainbow bubbles or something and symbols for reiki. So from that he got knowledge about healing. From this the reiki we know these days came. This happened around the end of the 19th century I think. Reiki is supposed to be older though, supposedly from times of Atlantis and all... Supposedly was also used in buddhism, but it got lost in time. I think that the attunements basically do what reiki people say they do. Open up channels, connect you to the energy better... All of which you can do on your own, but I think they can speed up this proccess. I said there is no god in the usual sense of the word. And that to me is how most people think of god. That is, as some old guy or a higher power or whatever, that looks down on them and feels sorry for them and helps them etc... They give god human attributes, loving, merciful, wrathful etc... That is sort of childish to me. I`m not saying it`s useless as it gives people hope and strength to go on. But a god that has attributes is not a real god IMO. He may be powerful and all, but is to me only a half god. Of course God is not an entitety to me. He can`t have any attributes, is form and formless, base of all things, unknowable. I think we are god as well, what we really are. God that is usually thought of, is to me no more than gods from other cultures, like Vishnu, Siva, Zeus etc... But this is not exactly how I think, as it`s hard for me to express my thoughts right on this, as like I said god is unknowable. I think when you do know him, you are enlightened or whatever. And also, is say he, but that is not right, since there is no gender at the base of things. I can`t remember who said it, but it was sort of like this: "Someone wants to find god? He should be careful. He will find his true self. Someone want to find himself? He should be careful. He will find himself in mortal danger that he will find god." Anyways, all that I`m saying is pretty much irrelevant philosophical BS, since we could talk about it for ages and nothing would come of it, what really matters is your own experience, realization, enlightenment and so on. ......

I think you are generalizing. Tibetan Buddhist have long life practices as well, I don`t know what they consist of yet though. Buddhists care about longevity, but in the sense that if they live a longer life, it will be more possible for them to achieve some realization in their current life.

Hey Harry, can you elaborate a bit? What do you think that is better "out there"? I like it, but haven`t done it for about two weeks now. I prefer my other standing and moving practices, however I had some good results from Spring Forest as well. Did only the level 1 exercises though. Also, I`m not so sure about Chun Yi Lin.

I get that quite a bit too, but it often doesn`t stop me from posting. I think we`d all be mostly quiet if we realized we have no clue. Sometimes I only later realize it`s all shit.

She said in another post that she has an invisble counter on her site and it registered the link or something like that. No magick. Yes, but this is generalizing, not everyone are the same. I think attunements can help you on your way sometimes, but not really neccessary. I use Reiki symbols sometimes and I didn`t get any attunements. Of course I don`t think you can say that you do Reiki if you didn`t get attunements, I mean you can say it, but not really... Now that is a good question... There is no god... At least not in the usualy sense of the word... I just don`t agree about the Earth part, I don`t see why you think that`s wrong... If I may ask, what is your "religion" (don`t know how to put it otherwise)?

I`m interested as well, what kind of nightmares? Funny, that`s what I said as well. Cloud, what misogynistic practices?

Wow, that sucks man. Hard to tell if it`s connected. In any case it obviously isn`t helping you. I`m just about to check it more myself since I have a cold. Though I don`t know how I`ll be able to tell if it has helped me or not, since I do my own practice... Hehe Harry, we posted at the same time. That is absolutely true. Well, I definately feel something from the picture, like energy coming out. Where do you sing up to what you guys were talking about?

I disagree. Of course my disagreement depends on what your definition of a soul is. My own definition is kind of fuzzy, and the truth is, I don`t know what a soul is, I think if I did really know, I would be enlightened. However, my belief sort of, is that it`s the very base of me, or maybe more right to say that it is the real "me". So basically nobody can "mess" with that "base". How could anybody mess with "my" original nature or whatever it`s called. So energy work IMO isn`t "messing" with souls, it`s "messing" with energy, which could however be considered as a manifestation of the soul. On the topic of healing, I have a friend who had gall stones (are they called like that in English?). The doctor told him he would need a surgery. But before doing that, my friend went to a healer, who heals with angels if I remember right. In the end he didn`t need surgery, the stones disappeared. However it was not only the healer who did the work. My friend had to change his diet, way of thinking (although I`m not so sure of that he he) and he was eating some kind of informed pills. So I think going to a healer certainly helps and can speed up the healing process, but you have to do work on your own as well.

In my understanding it`s not that sexuality is the promotion of evil, but reproduction. By creating children you bring more souls into this "evil" material world and hence it is not wanted.

What kind of a reply is that? ... I`ve heard of the course in miracles, but know nothing about it. I think I glanced through a book about it in a bookstore and just didn`t find it interesting to me.

We`ll just disagree on the value. I don`t see why it would seem logical to research this. I have interest in Vajrayana, but I don`t have much of an interest to research this. I don`t think you wrote anything offensive. At least I didn`t see it. The way of investagating is for me to experience it, not just listening to what other people claim. Buddha said something like don`t believe anything you are told, try everything out for yourself. Of course, in this case though, if it is true what they are saying, I would be brainwashed or something and would find it hard to get out. So it could be a bad approach. Wayfarer, I don`t see why you would have to re-evaluate your expirience with the DL... Off to lunch now...

A very good point. I`m not sure how it effects the Gnostic material since I don`t know how exactly they view his resurrection. However it would obviously weaken the foundations of Christianity, even crush it maybe. But it wouldn`t bother me either way. Well, yeah, since when did weapons inspire anything at all?

Buddhism (Tibetan as well) basically consists of sutra, tantra and dzogchen. Paths of renounciation, transformation and realization. What DL is teaching mostly IMO, is sutra. Moral codes, ethics and such. All paths are connected in a way, however they differ very much as well. While in sutrayana one must obey certain rules, codes of conduct etc., these same things may appear to be violated by tantra and dzogchen. I forgot where I was going with this, as I am in a hurry... Will post more later. And yes, I didn`t read the whole thing as I don`t think it would give any benefit or that it`s neccessary. Reading the first part and the annex is quite enough for me to see that there is an agenda of some sorts, and I don`t feel that what is written is written from any "higher" understanding... Also Cloud, don`t forget, we`re not all crusaders like you.

I agree with that. Except: The scripture doesn`t matter as much as its interpretation. It can be "perfect", the interpretation of it can be flawed IMO. If it is even possible though, that something can be flawed....

I think what he means is this: the "healer" doesn`t really heal anyone, he enables the person to heal themselves. Will check out that site later, when I have more time. The woman looks nice at first glance though.

After some thought, I thought it would be good if talked about what you think with the term "microcosmic orbit". To me, that is just the conception and governing joined. So you can do MO through either fire or water path (well, and also the wind path). Anything else is no longer microcosmic orbit to me. It`s just an orbit then. The difference then would be in how you trasnport the energy, breath, focus on points, touch etc. The path should be the same. I think similarly of the MaO. Just semantics, maybe.

I agree with Mandrake. Nazis have also crossed my mind. As this looks like propaganda they would use, only against the Jews... I`m pretty sure these were some Christian writers with an agenda against Buddhism. Comparing Islam with Buddhism..... They also show misunderstanding of Buddhist teachings, which even I can see, even though I don`t have any extensive knowledge of it. Perhaps it would be better to say twisting of the teachings, they find and show things and interpret them in a way that suits them. It`s almost like if you sent some taoist or whatever guy to look into Christian religion. What would he find? Drinking the blood of Christ and eating his body. Very civilized indeed he would think.... And what`s up with this: "In Tibetan Buddhism we have an archaic, magic-based religious system, which has remained to a large extent untouched by the fundamentals of the Western Enlightenment." Helloooo. Last time I checked Tibet wasn`t in the west. Imposing views maybe? Also, they obviously have something against magic... I`m sure some of the things they are saying could be right. After all, it`s an organized religion, and when was everything all right in organised religions? Never, I think. However most of it I believe is BS. Just Christian propaganda. Jelauosy I imagine. As well as lack of faith ha ha ha.

I agree, although I don`t know what dross is (I get the meaning though). However be careful, if the teachers or the history is corrupt or something, that doesn`t mean that the teachings are corrupt or useless as well. Like the Christ "myth" as you call it. Even if it is a myth, you can learn many things from the teachings that attribute their origin to Christ. To me they hold no less value if Christ was indeed an agressive politcal figure.