Fireblood

The me dies. However slowly you go there. You'll still know everything you knew before and you can still build yourself back up if you want to, or a new self. But the me that starts out is not the me that is there at the end. Be careful what you ask for, it might not be what you expected.

Well done. You summarised the key to the whole thing: why? If you understand the why to everything then you'll get there, maybe even in a few days. The key is not understanding everything but that there is no understanding and that things (in your mind) just are and may not have a real reason to be like that, although working things out also works. The dumb thing is that the Matrix movie explains it: 'It is not the spoon that bends, it is you'. That won't mean you'll bend spoons but it means that you make your meaning and when you realise that about each thing then it all eventually dawns on you. But reality remains as it is because it is 'you that bends' not the spoon. There are other ways that get you there, of course. (This probably all sounds a bit arrogant but I've given up caring about things like that.)

I didn't know the Buddist perspective. I am just going by experience. The emotions are still available but can be left unused (best word I can think of). You still have to work to eat unless you become reliant on the state or begging or charity. And depending on how much money you have that can still be suffering for some.

Totally agree with this part: "In fact enlightenment will not remove you from suffering or grant you freedom from your emotions, rather it allows you to view the world as it actually is and in so doing, grants you freedom from the restraints that ego places on you." The cliche that ends '...After enlightenment, chop wood and carry water', and nobody understands this until they've really been there. Also lots of people who don't choose to go through enlightenment will definitely lead better lives than some that have gone through enlightenment. Enlightenment doesn't always mean a better life (although I love my life and appreciate the little things now). Experiencing the result can't be explained in words, because the other person cannot know what you experienced by your words.

Thanks fiveelementtao. I'll try this too and see how it works out. I need to settle with what I've already tried thats working. What I'll do is give it some time and then try this and compare it. Fireblood.

Thanks for taking the effort to post your advice Ya Mu, I appreciate each response and consider it too.

O.K thanks all and to Shaktimama. I got it, it's icy cool. I need to narrow it down though. In order I tried: Testicular breathing. Five gates breathing. And reversing the orbit. And all three at once, which seems to accelerate it. The strange thing is I can mainly feel it in vessels to the right and left of the spine. Regards, Fireblood.

Enlightenment (as it is called by some) is both. The approach people take is either weighted to the mental or the physical. Or there may be a balanced way too. I do not claim to know all the ways. Just to have experienced the result. If you think that non-duality means no body then you haven't got it yet. It's just that simple. Unless you're talking about perception only.

'Enlightenment' is biological so it spans culture. Nothing to do with religions, although some try to claim it. Why does meditation work? People try and keep their mind empty during it. What happens is that thoughts arise and the mind deals with them consciously or subconsciously one by one. Hence the beginner has a hard time (usually). Over time the thoughts decrease because each issue is resolved. This method takes a long time for most people, simply because it's a slow way to deal with all the issues. Once the pristine state is recovered then full mental capacity is available, hence clear thinking, creativity etc. Most people who start the process give up because they don't think they are getting any results. This is usually because people deal with easy issues in their life. When the dark stuff comes out, people don't like facing this so they stops. Some people call this phase dealing with the shadow self - which is basically all the bad crap that's happened in your life. Anyhow, I thought I'd share that as I've learnt a lot from these forums. Basically you don't need any gurus to do this using a psychological method. As for the inner alchemy, then that's not required for enlightenment but probably can lead to it. My take on all the inner alchemy stuff is that its all about the Kundalini. That's why most people go around in circles jumping from practice to practice. In addition they are stuck within an attachment or personality but are not even aware of it. But that's just my opinion and I know many will differ with it, but that's o.k, it just means we know different things. I'm willing to share this freely if anyone is interested.

I was unsure about posting this but I guess I could always disappear again. The starting point (when born) is no-mind, just pure perception. Over the years we gather mental garbage, primarily due to emotional events, both good and bad. These events form 'masks' or personalities or on a lower level they create attachments. When we wipe a sufficient amount of them away then mind is no longer required as enough mental space is freed and deals with the rest of the issues. Finally we operate again from a child like state i.e no cause-effect thinking, just pure perception and being in the now. Of course there are different ways to get there: Body: All the energy work (i.e yoga, chi kung systems etc. Chemically the attachments based on the emotion are dissolved over time. Mentally: Any psychological methods that dissipate the underlying emotions that create attachment. The problem is when people get there and they don't know how to get back, then they need to stay on top of a mountain as they generally become non-functional in society (at least temporarily). Once enlightened you can always fall back to how you were and become unenlightened. Most people who go through this tend to leave their jobs as they can't deal with them immediately after the experience. You can always go back to functioning in the world but you have to pay your dues and constantly stay vigilant for the loss of the pristine state (unless you don't care about it). As for the oneness then it is simply mental association in the current context you can perceive and are in right now. You can learn to switch this on and off. Mindfulness can be switched on and off at will. As can Empty Mind = pure perception without cause-effect thinking and only switching on mind to deal with other people and then returning to no-mind. How do I know this? Because I've done it. Kind Regards. Fireblood. (Why am I here on these forums? Because I used the psychological method. I'm looking to raise the Kundalini and attempt to gain the physical benefits). (If you have questions then I'm willing to answer as best as I can. But I don't' have time for debates). (Who has done this already?:Probably Eckhart Tolle, Ken Wilber, Glenn Morris in this time that I can know of, I'm sure there are others, I just don't know about them).

@Ya Mu That's right, I did not state that he's my teacher. You inferred it from what I wrote. In addition I have a different definition of teacher. My definition could be wrong but I've given up debating every little thing in forums. You're probably right. Thanks for your input Ya Mu. @All I'm still open to ideas. Please feel free to add your experiences so that I and others can learn from them.

Thanks again to everyone who responded with useful ideas. This is a cool forum. The energy levels are fine and I can dissipate the excess quite easily now. I do not however want to dissipate the energy. I have run cool energy before and I know there's a way to do it. Most methods I've come across for cooling the energy seem to help cool the physical body but not the energy itself. I guess I'll have to 'keep playing'. Personally I've found that self-discovery yields the best results as long as a person is careful, keeps notes and can reproduce their results. I tried to learn tummo from a few people but they didn't know what they were on about and their techniques produced as much heat as a lump of wood. After that I read everything I could find and then watched all the videos I could find online. Finally I experimented after reading Garma's translation of Naropa (Philipine edition), the technique was hidden in the transmission about vases etc. I didn't work it out until I experimented myself. Tummo is the basic start for other work IMHO. Minimalistically speaking, what really caused the effect? What can we strip away from all the fluff people added? That's how doc morris used to create models for what he used. BTW nowhere have I stated that Mantak Chia is my teacher. Years ago I used to be in email contact with Dr Glenn Morris who was different because he was open with his knowledge but I haven't seen anyone like that around for a while. I'm not a 'guru' person. And thanks for all the replies because I learnt something from all of them. ---------- @Trunk The breaths do cool the inside of the body and dissipate physical heat. They also helped to make the energy more insubstantial. I'll use the rolled tongue breath for a while and see what happens if and when it does. I'm quite gullible sometimes so if that technique was a joke, I still tried it. I couldn't bring myself to put my gonads on ice but I have been dousing with ice cold water, which has helped in the same way as the breathing. Regards, Fireblood

Thanks guys. I'll practice those techniques and see where they lead to. Gonads in ice water. Yikes! It's cold here in the UK, the wind feels almost Arctic. After posting yesterday I used buckets of cold water for cold water dousing, straight out the tap, and that cooled my whole system down. Feeling better today. Trunk, I had another look at your AT website and the info about emphasis on the lower centres, especially the core, gave me some ideas. I'm going to spend some time on the core for a while. And then maybe look more into variations of the lesser kan/li before I do anything else.

Hi all, it's good to be back on these forums with all the cool discussions. I've done so much since I've been away. And I'll be sharing some of what I came across on my personal practice discussion. It would be good to have other opinions about it. (But I haven't posted about that there, yet). I was wondering if anyone could point me in a right direction. I've been doing chi kung mainly based on Mantak Chia's system and I'm running very hot energy at the moment. It feels very dense/substantial and it is very hot. I know there is a way to keep the energy levels and cool them down at the same time but I don't know how to do that, yet. So in short does anyone know how to cool off the energy? (I don't want it to enter my skull until it is a lot cooler). Anyone doing the work with the KAP folk had this issue? Workarounds? I've run cold energy by accident once before so I know what it feels like, I just can't get it back. If anyone knows how to run cool/cold energy and can show me how to replicate it then PM me and I'm willing to exchange an equally powerful technique for 'stopping the world' (originally based on yaqui concepts). kind regards, Fireblood.