Cameron

I smoked for over 10 years. When I first started it was a high school thing. People were smoking so I started. I really enjoyed it. Then I smoked everywhere. I hadn't smoked for over 5 years. Then started again after my first Kunlun workshop. I didn't sleep for over a month and was going through some crazy stuff. So I figured I better light up I smoked for a few months after that. Actually it wasn't until I moved back to Atlanta and got really sick that I stopped. I hadn't gotten sick at all living in Arizona. The weather here just does really good for me. I could smoke and eat garbage and still feel good since the weather is so great. As soon as I moved back to the East Coast that was gone. I felt so bad, vomitting for a week straight. That when I tried to light up it felt disgusting. I have completely transmformed my life since then. I Haven't touched a cigarette for months. I work out almost every day. The idea of smoking is a real turn off now. But we a have to go through what we have to go through I guess. As stupid as our decisions are sometimes.

I have no opinion on the matter! *sips tea*

Santiago is good peoples

Interesting about the Queen Mother of the West. Oscar Hsu has his take on the practices that involve her. He has alot to say about her. Way to complex for me to get into. But if you see him you can ask him about it. At this point I am inclined to take everything I learned from Max and Jenny and just practice for awhile. I don't really have any interest in the backround or any Immortals involved or anything. It's a letting go practice. Same goals as Zen and Advaita. Just more fun

No, the methods are not from Kunlun. They are Maoshan. Max likes the name Kunlun for other reasons. I agree it could be confusing to other's. But I don't have a problem with the name. It's just a name after all. My understanding is he likes using the name since it is like the Taoist Shamballah and represents the top of the crown and the highest point. The original name for the practice is Yi Gong. So if you prefer to use the original name Sifu Jenny uses that's what it is. Cam

Breathe..smile..be happy. It's OK..whatever it is

Ok now everyone..let's breathe. Back to basic Taoism. You know the reason you got interested in posting in this lovely discussion board in the first place Deep inhalation and you belly expands. Deep exhalation it contracts. Feel the love, energy, fullness in your tan tien. Relax..relax..relax. Ok, now picture for a moment that we are all fine just as we are. There is no problem. There isn't anything to argue about. You and me are equally loved and accepted by the universe. Feel it in your heart. All of the parts of ourselves that aren't loving and caring. Feel those parts. breathe and smile into them. Actually feel what is there. See if you can feel it without the mind interupting with dialogue. If the mind interupts with dialogue breathe and smile into that to. It's all good. Everything is fine. We are all cherished and loved in the Tao. We may stray from our original intention. That's OK. Things happen. There is no judge or executioner here. Every single problem here is self created and is an illusion. Can you feel it? Who is anybody getting angry at words on the computer screen? Let's all breathe, relax, forgive and start anew. We all have something positive to offer. Why not explore the positive we can share instead of the negative? It begins with forgiveness. And letting go of our little self imposed version of reality. Speak your mind. Don't hold back. I am fine with it. It's OK

Same ones(Beijing). But if you can corner him in Texas and get any more info let us know! He mentioned them again in his last post on Kunlun Forum. Regarding everything else. Just let it go. There is nothing to argue about. It's all been said already. Best wishes to everyone

He doesn't talk about them much. From what he told us at the first workshop lecture(you weren't there but at the workshop the next day) they are crazy high level. Ask Max about it next time you see him

Wow. Ok. let's see. I do know more about Kunlun then other's here. OK? I have taken a bunch of workshops and have my experiences. That doesn't mean I consider myself to have any great knowledge about Kunlun. The fact that I know more about it than other's on Taobums who have never done it isn't saying much I am not into personally attacking others anymore. I said what I said about Spectrum and it's off my chest. But I am just not going to "go there" anymore. I sincerely do wish you all the best whatever you practice. It get's rough in here sometimes and feelings sometimes get hurt. It's just the karma of this place for some reason. Kunlun is the Tao? I don't think I said that. I don't think I am that arrogant. It's a powerful practice no doubt as others here have found not just myself. And I don't think me saying I like Kunlun and that the woman who brought Kunlun here from China says you should see her or Max before you practice is me giving advice. It's me repeating advice-from the teacher. If your going to make a problem or issue out of this then I really do throw in the towel. Because I don't buy that you really care about students interested in this practice but just like to fuss and argue. So I won't add any more energy to that. Cam

To those who responded to my last post, It was addressed to Scott. I met Scott in person. I consider him a friend and was adressing a post he had written in this thread. Now people like Spectrum and Dizzydazzle have issues with stuff I wrote. It's fine. I have issues. We all have issues Here is the thing..I don't care what your opinion is of me or what I have written. I don't know you. That was one of the points I was making to Scott. Even if I love Kunlun how the heck am I supposed to know by the mishmash of words and ideas any of you have written if it would be a good practice for you or not? The advice that has been given here repeatedly is if it interests you check out the book, check out the free lecture. Now someone like Specrum essentially get's upset because Kunlun practitioners don't put up videos of themselves practicing Kunlun which I found deeply offensive at the time since we were told by our teachers not to do this. Then has the arrogance to question our teachers wishes. Teachers who have devoted every day of their lives to practice and I get a little upset realizing I am in a community that is not full of friends and say I won't post anymore. Then after a moment of reflection I realize I do have many friends here. You can't be best friends with everyone. That's how it goes sometimes. But since I do like most people here I changed my mind and will keep posting. So to repeat, "We do Kunlun. We like Kunlun. For proper instruction you owe it to yourself to see teacher "a" or teacher "b" once. If it doesn't feel right to you then don't go".

Best post of the year so far imo

Scott, As I sit here wondering how to respond I think the first thing that comes to my mind is the limitation of the medium we are using. I think if I am going to be honest the real reason it might be "irresponsible" of us to reccommend Kunlun or not to anyone is that we don't really know them. I mean, I know it seems like we do but that's not really true. We are basically reccomending a spiritual practice to strangers. That wasn't the case with the original group of Taobums I sort of "nudged" to do Kunlun. For the most part we all knew each other. If we hadn't already met in person we had been speaking on the phone or on here for years. What I see here on Taobums is that most likely it will grow larger. My feeling is more people will eventually become interested in these things and you may be essentially reccomending a powerful spiritual path to someone who it may or may not be appropriate for. I know it's sort of a wierd thing to be concerned about. Here is my concern:We are mostly a bunch of youngsters..your in your 20's I am in my early 30's. I am going to go out on a limb and say we will probably check out other spiritual paths in our life. We are still learning and growing. Maybe not. Maybe Kunlun will literally be the end of our spiritual seeking and we will just do our Kunlun practice for many years. But I know the personality of most Taobums is to check different stuff out. So..my feeling is it's best for us to have a neutral and unattached view towards all of this. And I am not saying you don't already. But a spiritual path and studying with teachers is a very profound karmic deal I think. It's not really something that should be based on other students opinions. That's why I keep repeating over and over again in my posts now to follow your inner feeling/intuition. Whatever I say is irrelevent if you keep feeling that studying with a certain teacher is not going to be a good path for you. That said, I haven't seen anything posted by anyone doing Kunlun that would be called irresponsible. Actually, in my humble opinion the Kunlun practice has attracted some of the most intelligent and good hearted people on here(I am not counting myself ) I guess what it boils down to is though I feel strongly the Kunlun path and teachers are worth checking out for basically *anyone* I am still mostly in the space of "I don't know". Being in the space of I don't know is cool. I don't think there is anything wrong with it. And if we are going to be honest about all these questions. Is Kunlun good? Should you see Max or Jenny? Are the pictures of Max's hands glowing real? Does Jenny teach other practices besides Yi Gong and do you need it? etc etc The real answer I believe-for any of us-is "I don't know". That said, if your drawn to say something. That's OK to man. peace, Cam

Dizzydazzle and Scotty bring up interesting points. Funny trying to say something serious to someone named Dizzydazzle The reality is Scotty, myself and all the other people who do this practice really aren't qualified to answer these questions. Like I have gotten PM's asking about the Kunlun posture. It's really not my place to teach people Kunlun or Yi Gong. The best we can do is share our experience with teachers here. Until one of us actually becomes a teacher and decides to post here regularly(not likely)we can only offer our experience and what little we know. Scotty did sort of nail it in my opinion. The Kunlun teachers don't post here. More then likely they never will post here. So what most of these conversations on Taobums amount to is people asking very serious questions to beginner students. Could you imagine walking into a traditional Taoist temple and going up to some novice asking "What is the Tao? What is Enlightenment? I don't feel like I am sure I want to study with your Master here can you tell me about the practices you have been taught? It's absurd. So to all the people who have spent weeks or months asking questions and wondering about this. I promise you. You will NOT get any info on Taobums about Kunlun that would be as good as seeing Max or Jenny in person. We can go on and on in circles but the bottom like of all of this amounts to "We do Kunlun. We like Kunlun. For proper instruction you owe it to yourself to see teacher "a" or teacher "b" once. If it doesn't feel right to you then don't go". Anything beyond this is irresponsible of both the person asking the question and the one answering. I'll put myself in this camp. I answered because I felt drawn to at the time but when a student says repeatedly "I do Kunlun. I like Kunlun. For proper instruction you owe it to yourself to see teacher "a" or teacher "b" once. If it doesn't feel right to you then don't go". And other's repeatedly answer with "but..but..but". Your really not listening. And it might be a case where you should forget about Kunlun and do something else. Cam

Yi=mind intent Gong=path, way, practice One of her favorite books is "I am That". Ok, that's it!

Ahhhhhhhh...the questions go and on and and on I don't want to play any games with you Taobums. I will tell you exactly what I have been told regarding this system. After this that's it. Out of respect for Chris, Max, Sifu Jenny and all he wonderful people I have met from this practice. It's not my place. But since I was one of the first here to practice this here is what I know: The "Kunun" practice is from Maoshan Pai. This was told to me first by Chris at the last workshop in NJ. Then I asked Sifu Jenny directly about this at her seiminar. Where is this practice from? Sifu Jenny looked me in the eyes and said the practice is from Maoshan. She also told us the name for the practice is Yi Gong. Sifu Jenny is traditional. She is also a Taoist and Buddhist Scholar. She is extremely careful and meticulous when researching anything. My take is she took this practice as a great gift from her teacher and didn't really have an intention to spread it to the world. She likes small groups. So she probably intended to pass it on here or there. She says the level 1 of Yi Gong is all you need. And she is still exploring the level 1 practice. There is another practice that goes with Yi Gong. But it sounded like none us are near the level to learn it yet. Jenny mentioned Kan was ready but he flew back to Japan before she could see him. She teaches in a very one on one way. So if your interested in studying with her stop all the gossip and talk on Taobums and make the effort to either make one of her workshops or set something up with her. My impression of her is she is open to hellping people but she isn't interested in organizing seminars. I have already mentioned to my East Coast Kunlun friends that seeing Jenny would more than likely be a great benefit if they want to get something going in the future. Sifu Jenny said the goal if Yi Gong practice is non duality. Essentially the same goal in Zen, Advaita and other spiritual paths. Sifu Max is another universe Max told me at the first free talk I met him about his "aunties". I mean it was one of the very first things he told us. Maax has studied with many people. Two of the main ones have been mentioned on Taobums before including Jenny. The other main one is Max's Maoshan Sifu in Hawaii. Max learned the Red Phoenix practice from this teacher. Through his liefetime of studying Maoshan Pai practices like Red Phoenix Max then learned Yi Gong from Jenny. Max combined Yi Gong and Red Phoenix and he said this combination was a good fit. He also says he studied with his "aunties" in Beijing or are high level Maoshan Master's. They told him combining the practices lead to the attainment of Golden Dragon Body. Which Max says is the highest attainment a human being can achive. Max went into some detail on GDB at the last NJ workshop. My take without having had the experience myself is it's like a great opening to the Tao at all levels. Being connected to this and the "other side" while still enjoying your human life. I don't know much else about it. Now I will tell you guys what I was told and that's it from me. No more gossip, no more speculating about my teachers. I have already had to endure enough here. Here is what I was told. Jenny does not recommend combining Red Phoenix with Yi Gong. She says they are different systems within Maoshan and not part of the same system. She said Yi Gong is all you need. it gives you everything. Sifu Max obviously differs in opnion. Also, I will tell you all the truth. after Max gave me the Red Phoenix transmission it doesn't feel like it is my decision or not whether or not practice Red Phoenix. my feeling is my Red Phoenix and Kunlun/Yi Gong practice have been integrated and are really one. I don't have a problem with that. Max is my first teacher of this system so I am fine doing it his way. However, if you really want to follow what Jenny says I would say just see her and not Max. Because my experience has been the Red Phoenix becomes a part of you after the transmission. I embrace it. I am cool with it. I like the practice. I also appreciate that I got Jenny's perspective. They ARE different. Jenny says you don't need anything besides Yi Gong and Max gives you a powerful transmission and Red Phoenix. Anyway, it was nice getting some more backround on these practices. It's cool to know that both Kunlun and Red Phoenix are Maoshan methods. It's possible Max's understanding is greater. It's possible Jenny's is greater. My intention is to practice and come to my own understanding. So follow your inner feelings. If it doesn't feel right to you do something else. This is the last time I will talk about my teachers here. Peace, Cam

My understanding is he wanted to protect their privacy. But most everyone who has taken even one workshop with Max quickly learns about his teachers. He went into detail with us in my first workshop about many of his teachers and experiences. You couldn't ask for more openness and trust than Max gave us at the workshops. Everything was very open and up front.

Follow your inner feeling. I saw those pictures before my first workshop with Max and found it interesting. Then I met Max and had my own experiences and those pictures aren't too big a deal after seeing Max a few times. I agree the marketing might be a little too much. I don't have a problem with it but have heard other's who do. Sifu Jenny, who I would consider the other prominent teacher of Kunlun in the United States, doesn't advertise at all. So if the marketing turns you off you might consider seeing her to learn the practice. Personally, I think they are both wonderful. But if it really bother's you and your still interested in learning from a Master I would highly reccommend seing Sifu Jenny. Cam

It sounds like you are being drawn to see Jenny more than Max. That's great. You should respect your inner feeling. If you see her tell her Cameron says hi. I told her I will practice Yi Gong(the original name of the Kunlun practice) for a year before asking her any questions. I hope she does atleast one more workshop for anyone else who wants to see her. Anyway, trust that the Tao will help you with a relaxed and peaceful mind. Cam

Transmission. This is an interesting distinction between these two great teachers. I won't attempt to distinigush there philisophical differences on Taobums. I mean, it's tempting, since I believe in many ways they probably correspond to other schools such as the Esoteric Buddhist and Taoist schools way of looking at things vs. the Advaita or Zen way of looking at them. I guess I am just in a space of being deeply appreciative of having studied Kunlun with both Max and Jenny. I consider them both my teachers. And I am able to integrate any differences in views no problem. At the end of all of the endless talk and gossip there position is the same. The key to getting anywhere is to do the practice. If you resonate with Jenny great. She is wonderful and I really hope any of you who want to study with her get the opportunity. I feel seeing her in some ways completed the circle for me. But that circle began with Max and his transmission. My path is to practice now.

How is the driving adventure coming along? Did you make it to LA? Did you ever get to hang out with Trunk? If your going to be coming to Arizona in the next few weeks give me a heads up. Cam

Awesome brother! I'll put some stuff up eventually. Thanks for adding some positive vibes to this thread