RongzomFan

You cant be a Rongzom fan and stick to Madhyamaka

So is Namdrol's among many others. And he is a big Rongzom fan.

Jhanas are contrived conceptual states. Vajrayana uses stuff like kumbhaka, tummo and karmamudra which rely on physical mechanisms.

I don't know what Ashley Shaeffer is

So you won't jump on the Rongzom bandwagon?

If you haven't received any tantric teachings, then by all means stick with Madhyamaka.

I understand that you are attached to Madhyamaka. I was the same way. You have to get on board the Rongzom bandwagon.

No, you said the majority of the key Dzogchen adepts held the Prasanga view . I mentioned Dudjom Rinpoche, Dilgo Khyentse, Jamyang Khentse Wangpo, Jamgon Kongtrul etc. as a counterexample. I don't care about Madhyamaka or Other Emptiness. They are both equally false sutra level teachings. The actual subject at hand was Rongzom and Madhyamaka.

False logic. Gonpa Zangthal is chronologically later than Longchenpa, but is a throwback to Nyi 'bum's Eleven Subjects before Longchenpa fucked with it. http://www.atikosha.org/2012/09/a-preliminary-note-on-vimalamitras.html

I told Malcolm personally I threw Madhyamaka in the trash can, and he loved it.

bump

Don't worry Other Emptiness and Madhyamaka are both equally false for me. Both are sutra.

How so? Dudjom Rinpoche was a crazy mystical terton just like Longchenpa or Jigme Lingpa.

Yes, and Malcolm disagreed with that idea.

I apologize. You called them the "the original adepts". Which I am still laughing at.

Which is the 2 truths.

You said him and Jigme Lingpa are "the key figures". That's B.S. Yeah, maybe now in modern times, but not before Jigme Lingpa lived.

What about this one? http://vajracakra.com/viewtopic.php?f=27&t=1195&hilit=Rongzom&start=10#p13857

Malcolm: Longchenpa "too influenced by sarma" http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=5637&p=63968&hilit=Longchenpa+sarma#p63960 Malcolm: Superiority of Gonpa Zangthal to Longchenpa http://www.atikosha.org/2012/09/a-preliminary-note-on-vimalamitras.html http://www.dharmawheel.net/viewtopic.php?f=48&t=7522&p=89675&hilit=Wangpo#p89675

Absolutely not. Before Jigme Lingpa, Gonpa Zangthal was the primary nyingthig system. Longchenpa was not even that popular before Jigme Lingpa.

Longchenpa and Jigme Lingpa are not original adepts. WTF Dudjom Rinpoche and Dilgo Khyetse follow Jamyang Khyentse Wangpo and Jamgon Kongtrul I believe. Not 100% sure.

I already linked to several posts of Malcolm. You are clearly not correct.

I agree that a relative truth per Candrakirti is an object of deluded cognition. This is defined in Candrakirti's Madhyamakavatara VI.23 The object of perfect seeing is true reality, (ultimate truth) And false seeing is seeming reality. (relative truth)