thelerner

maybe.. that's what I'd be experimenting to check out. I agree that if you want permanent change getting fitter, particularly through cardio is the route. This is more to find out short term, if lowering the breath rate, lowers the heart rate. If so, how much and which breathing rhythm does it best. I'm sure somewhere on the net people have already done this experiment, but I feel like doing it myself. I assume slow breath = slow heart rate = tricks of fakirs; such as burying oneself.

That's great. Increasing the 'reps' to 40 helped me. I've been working on long breathing rhythms and there's a big difference between doing it after Wim Hof breathing and without. I was doing 8in 32hold 16out after Hof breathing and thought it'd be a little harder doing it normally. Turns out its much harder. The WHM makes long term rhythmic breathing much easier. It's either oxygenating the body very well or turning down some mechanism that controls the need for breath.

Unlike most tummo style things, Wim Hof isn't such an inner fire kind of technique. He doesn't stress generating heat so much, a little but not like most tummo system, imo. When asked he does say the source, mind/body control that allows him to swim under ice, is the same that allowed him to run a desert marathon without water. The breathing system seems to make it easier to ignore some body safeguards, for better or worse. (I believe on Everest he got some frostbite.. everyone has limits except Batman) And ofcourse he's a tough sonofabitch.

No.. it's love. Neutrino's are just a passing phase (of particles)

Exactly what I suspected. I just read through the thread for the first time. I'm sorry it got ugly. Religion, politics.. Mo Pai.. these things are hot and should be treated with .. more common courtesy then most.

We're in the middle of winter. It's cold, we're not as active and not getting as much sun. Beyond existential crisis's being melancholy is pretty common right now. Spiritualism can be as problematic as materialism if we're always looking for better and more. Seems to me Taoism is about adapting to your environment, accepting it, when its cold, your cold, when your sad, your sad. Its okay. Like the seasons this too will pass. Do your work, expand the aspects your life that will take you on the path you've chosen.

Welcome. Despite the name we tend to be a pretty wide open philosophy site. As I recall the site name is more influenced by the book Dharma Bums then Dao.

that stinks, as a fellow Mac user I'm using Firefox (43.0.4) and its working fine. A year or so ago after an update the spell checker stopped working on this site, then with another update it came back. Nice thing about Firefox is the addons like Addblockplus and youtubemp3podcaster which allows me to turn youtubes into mp3's, which I do quite a bit. Lately long lectures from Ajahn Brahm and earlier some nice hypnotic scripts. Nice to store them on an ipod for future listening.

Its been awhile since I've been doing Healing Tao stuff. I'll still run the orbit sometimes, but its always felt like more of a nerve/physical mantra, ie like a ball is rolling up and down along my spine and front rather then what some describe as the 'real' MCO which is a more powerful phenomena. Worthwhile, but after years, its not the kundaliniesque experience it should be. Note, I tend to be energy insensitive though. I think following the writing in Higher Existence https://highexistence.com/the-wim-hof-method-revealed-how-to-consciously-control-your-immune-system/ you can take the practice pretty far. They used to have a 25% off coupon. This morning I was thinking of how I do the Wim Hof Breathing. It's fast yet deep. Some describe it as hyperventilating, but I consider it slower then that and ofcourse controlled. When I concentrate on first expanding my stomach once it 'inflates' my attention moves to my lower ribs and I like to feel them expand a bit, then I fill up my upper chest, which tends to arch my back a little and spread my shoulders. I try not to 'pressurize' much. Keep it full without adding. Taunt but not uncomfortable. The out breath is quick and natural. Letting it go naturally without pushing out the last of it. What ever releases normally. On the last breath of the series I'll mentally try to keep a little more air in on the release, not by much, but a little. I'm about 2 or 2 1/2 seconds a breath including a tiny pause at the end to feel relaxed. That's how I do it, other may be a little different. Learning to breath that deep has helped me on another practice, Silent Grounds Yogic Breathing. I'm comfortable with there 8in 24hold 16out cycle and have started with the 8 32 16. After 8 or 9 repetitions tends to start feeling uncomfortable, but I'm getting used to it. And its a 56 second breath cycle! Maybe by the middle of the year I'll be able to do the 12 48 24 cycle (or beyond). Then I won't have to do Wim Hof at all. I can just find a cave and hibernate for the winter.

I shouldn't be looked upon as an expert (or even an intermediate) in the system. But I think so. In truth the breathing practice stays the same throughout the 10 weeks. Along with the cold showers that's the majority of the system. The showers get longer, by week 5 they're 10 minute, then actually go down and you do some full breath retention holds gently and carefully in the shower. In most ways those 2 practices are the main thing. Building up endurance. Do what you can without pushing too hard. Buying the course is worthwhile, not for any secret information, but it has the yoga and listening to and watching Wim Hof is inspiring. It outlines the course in a nice booklet, with explanatory videos, plus you read dozens of comments and clarifications from those doing the course as well as access to the Facebook site. The biggest warnings are don't do the breath hold underwater, you can drown. Watch your balance in the shower when doing retention holds, they're never longer then a minute in the shower. The breath holding isn't a competition, important since you have people posting unreal times and you don't need to be. I'm certainly on the lower end of what people are reporting. I've found on youtube 'The Swedish Iceman' is a great resource. He's a guy who's done the course as well as (I think) done sessions with Wim Hof. His videos tend to clarify some practices.

Here is a discovery. On youtube you can find some video's that have some of the audio's from Glenn Morris's Meditation Mastery course. Not every audio is there, and the quality is about the same as the cassettes tapes that I had in the early 90's (late 80's?). Many of his most important ideas and meditations are there. His system which evolved into KAP, is an interesting blend. His attempt to create the Jeet Kun Do of enlightenment systems, combining the best elements of Chi Gung, chakra theory and esoteric martial arts; taking the best from many systems and leaving out cultural baggage. He took a scientific approach using himself and students to experiment on. Never liked the title of his book, but the stories and methods are fascinating in 'Pathnotes of a Ninja Grandmaster'. Here is the link: https://www.youtube.com/user/HoshinRoshiRyu Many of his teachings are in the form of guided meditations. I highly recommend DaMos Cave exercise as well as the Secret Smile. If those click you can start walking through the elemental doors that he has laid out. Here is the Secret Smile in his words: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P1pi0_ViC4k If any one objects to this link, let me know and I'll get rid of it. Hoshin Roshi Ryu I believe was the organization that Dr. Morris founded and on the site it says: Dedicated to the memory of Dr. Glenn Morris and the preservation of his art and system. Thus I think its legit and very worthwhile. never mind. the link is kaput.

I'm on week 10 http://thedaobums.com/topic/39544-wim-hof-method/?p=650846 Summary from my thread: To summarize its been a worthwhile journey. Short and well defined. It's made me mentally and physically tougher. Taught me to breath bigger and better. It's made me face physical shock, like icy cold water, and see it as an illusion. To face intimate stress of breath retention and relax and push my limits. To move a little away from being a coddled person in a 24/7 controlled environment to a natural being who can take off there shoes, jacket and shirt in the snow and walk around (for a bit anyway). Trusting my body to react as 10,000 generations trained theirs to. Benefits.. Lets take the breathing. I've learned to breathe much better. I was able to jump into a practice that was beyond me earlier, ie doing the 8 - 20 - 16 (now 8 24 16) breath pattern. To fill up my lungs bigger and better then before. Learned to relax once they're filled. For the 16 seconds out, I have the mental and physical control to take my time. That 'yogic breathing' pattern isn't part of the Wim Hof Method but the practice has given me far better breath control then I've had before. I intend to see how far I can take such patterns. Breath links mind, body and spirit. The holds are also kinda miraculous. If someone said its possible to hold my breath 2 minutes 20 some seconds after exhaling I'd say they were crazy. The breath retention while unpleasant has helped develop will power and relaxation under stress. I also feel I've got a mental block here and once I get past it, maybe I'll get the 3,4 even 5 minutes holds some report. Maybe. In the practice there are periods of deep peace that feel very good. The inner vision lights up. The fluorescence behind the eyes show interesting lights and imagery. There may be some physical brain hacks going on. Blood being shunted to parts of the brain that unusually don't get much attention. I haven't been doing much of the yoga he calls for, despite that my flexibility has been improving. Some due to stretching using his breathing technique, part of of it might be the practice relaxes the body and takes away some unconscious restraints of the mind. I can squat down on my haunches (Indian Squat?) much lower and stay there . That used to give me problems. He calls for doing push ups, and my pushup numbers are higher. I'm doing a 2 or 3 sets of 44ish easy incline pushups and I'm seeing some definition from it. The cold showers have progressed nicely. Despite being on the swim team in highschool I've always been a wimp about cold water (cept for Aikido Winter Misogis). The gradual approach of the method has helped me man up. Its just a shocking sensation I can handle, after icy showers I don't shiver. Sometimes I even like'em. Some research shows it improves the immune system, stimulates the cardiovascular. I make sure to get the cold water in my arm pits to stimulate the lymph nodes there. There's even some writing on benefits of cold water on the head to help keep your hair so I make sure I hit there too. I've always had dandruff, but not any more, the Hof method and not using shampoo has cured it. I've been working on cold conditioning, going out in freezing weather without a jacket. Redefining what I consider cold, when its acceptable and when a jacket is needed. Let me add this: Cons: It's not a comfortable practice. Cold showers while invigorating are a bit shocking and long breath holds can feel like you're being choked. The course isn't cheap at $200 (http://highexistence...-immune-system/ might still have 25% off coupon making it $150). I get the feeling there is a significant attrition rate. Lastly and significantly there is some danger involved. Some of the exercises may be spiking your blood pressure. At some points your in the snow and could get frost bite. Your doing long retention holds in the shower and could faint or lose balance, same with being in a ice filled tub by yourself. There is risk involved. Which I accept. Matter of fact I like it. My life in my hands. A little risk to gain a new skill set. A little eccentricity because I'm an individual, breaking rules and taking names.

Nice site. On my monitor the white letters on black background are a little hard to read (or old eyes) in the meditation section. I'd love to see some pictures of people drinking the tea or the tea in pretty cups.

At Burning Man the camp I was in (Whiskey & Dust) had a platform and daily yoga classes. We had the most foul mouthed yoga instructor possible. She swore like a sailor, pretty much every pose came with came with a move your damn this or raise your fukkin that. I found it softened by the fact she and several other yogists were topless. ah yoga, i could sit back and watch it all day.

I'm hoping for someone to write a serious diary style thread on their Mo Pai practice. How what they've read influences what they're doing. How they've brought the different sources together. Hopefully people would mostly listen and learn without being critical and turning it into the usual arguments. Matter of fact I like seeing that for most any art and the Personal Discussion area is good for that because it allows the owner to erase posts that aren't on topic. It's good to read and perhaps even better for the writer. In the act of writing, like teaching, you end up learning more then when you started.

Unless you've been a mod, its hard to understand the time and aggravation the job requires. Thankfully it also provides a fair amount of camaraderie and humor plus it's nice to give back to the board. It also exercises the often flabby wisdom muscle and feels good when the board is humming along nicely.

bump. Wish we could get a map going again. The old one allowed members to put in a pin and there user name, if they wished.

Maybe a more physical solution could help. A few gi gung styles include rubbing the hands together vigorously until they're warm (or hot) then pressing them (bottom of palms) gently but firmly against your closed eyes til the hands cool and the eyes relax. It feels good. Seems to relieve tension. I find the more 'juice' I have the hotter my hands get. Afterwards there's a general light 'washing the face' movements done with the hands.

Long ago we had an old member who was quite the master of crazy wisdom. He went by the handle Ron Jeremy and once wrote "What good will your practice do once you're dead?" It seems flippant, but its actually quite important. How deep are you going? Are we at the surface or are we penetrating reality itself? How hard are we willing to work and what we making ourselves into?

I've been listening to Ajahn Brahm. Lately turning his longer youtube's into mp3's to put into my ipod for later repeated listening. Here's a good example: (5 ways to be a high achiever with low stress, a monks view)

Congrads on the weight loss. Ketosis and/or Paleo diet? I'm no expert or good example, but there many vegetables that are low carb and acceptable in either systems. If you're close to succeeding at the weight you want to be, consider taking some cheat meals or days to rebalance. Maybe you can add some greens. Salads.. how about roasted vegetables? They can be very satisfying and what can be more grounding then some root vegetables? Roasted or pan fried Shitake mushrooms can be nicely meatlike.

My natural instinct is to 'just sit'. Occasionally there is a fascination with interesting systems and individuals. Sometimes I'll dabble in them, see what I can learn, but I always go back to just sitting.

By the time emotions trigger thoughts which trigger an evil grin, one is usually going down hill too fast to take conscious action. Probably better to cut it off early at the emotion or thinking stage. There is an Indian (India) tradition of wearing stiff uncomfortable clothes which act as a constant reminder to keep upright and attentive. Similarly in the Jewish tradition you wear a hat to always be aware of God, and in the case of the orthodox your clothes are like a uniform, always reminding you of a strict code of conduct.

When shit hits the fan, we'll all need bigger tin foil hats.

You know what's a good practice for a opening the heart. Gardening. Watching something grow, being responsible for it. We tend to love, what we sacrifice for. Planting, protecting, enjoying.. gardening is an active form of metta. Even buying a single Amaryllis bulb and having it bloom is to see a fabulous living firework in very very slow motion. In the summer buy some cheap 40# bags of soil (or more $ organic soil), put a slit on the bottom and open them up on top, creates an easy to care for, ready to plant garden, just add seeds or seedlings, plant, water and protect. Put it on the front lawn so you don't forget it. By the middle of summer you can grab some tasty grape tomatoes every time you come and go. addon> While this is often given and often ignored, a gratitude journal; just writing down 2 or 3 lines of good things that happen throughout the day can hone your eye towards looking at the good. Which, when the world sucks, can simply be the good you do for others or yourself. Similarly its an old fashion kind of thing but counting your blessings is powerful. Even when things are crappy we can begin with thank you for our eyes, our ears, our mind, this place, this food, grass that is green and sky that is blue.. thank you for creating that bastard down the hall and remember if you want to get rid of him- that's fine with me.. what ever has significance to you.