Apech

Not just my voice ... its all shiny metal and tubes ... really ...

I meant that Steve was going to PM him and explain ... nothing sinister ...

It was unapproved because of copyright breach ... which is against the TB rules ... someone will be in touch. Meanwhile could you stop offering this material on here.

the aura of death lipstick, white powder on cheeks, very attractive.

Ah! Hats! (sorry carry on ....)

Sorry Chang but its supposed to be 5 syllables int he last line so ... snowflake in blizzard white sheets billow in the wind no hint of color.

... and?

Marbles, Your post has been read and your no additional comments noted. I want you to know that I have no comments to make on your no additional comments except to say not commenting is a comment and so I will not not comment on your lack of comment. Or if I did it would be 'no comment'. Thank you. A.

Don't worry I think you will always be funny.

Always happy to quote the bard.

Thanks for replying ... I'm not sure that describes the 'goal of Taoism' ... although there may be some who would agree. It depends on what school of Taoism you are addressing I suppose. Mostly they talk about Immortality as the goal ... although you debate what that means exactly (i.e. physical or spiritual). What I suppose separates Taoism and Buddhism is to do with what is considered to be 'real'. To a Taoist the Tao is real, all else ....Heaven, Earth, Man follow from this. The nature of the Tao is seen in nature, so you can look to natural ways of water for instance to see how the Tao behaves. To become one with the Tao (not the universe) is then for a person to become as natural as water, or air or earth and so on. A prison to me means a rational limitation on freedom. This can be physical ... like a jail or emotional (like some forms of conditioning) or mental like making people think that they are lesser somehow ... If the life is a prison then it would be a force which limited our freedom to act, feel, think and so on. While I see life as an organising and energising force not a prison. yes lets leave that elsewhere. Following on from what I said above I would see the yin/yang as not being an illusion (which I find quite an unhelpful word) but as a two-not-two ... a way of seeing life as a duality of forces which are fundamentally not two. Life as interfunction which is a kind of outpouring of the Wu ... it is not necessary to say one is real and one is not unless you are striving for a kind of mono ... what real means anyway is an interesting debate in itself. A.

V, Have you made a serious study of Taoism? From what you have written above it seems to me you have imputed all sorts of things onto Taoism which I don't recognise ... like 'desiring to be in harmony with the prison of life'. Where does Taoism say life is a prison and that one should want to be at harmony with it? Maybe you have been reading Shakespeare and have confused life with Denmark ... but even then "I could be bounded in a nutshell, and count myself a king of infinite space, were it not that I have bad dreams" ... if life is for you a prison ... then maybe thinking makes it so??? A.

I am - and some of the oil is from my own olives ... but I don't wish to gloat

I'm lucky enough to get olive oil from the local producer in the next village ... 100% genuine cold pressed with genuine stone press. It is a totally different thing to what I used to buy in the supermarkets in England. Watch out for anything that says 'pure' or 'light' ... its adulterated.

Short and simple .. why grow weary????

Rainy Day, Thanks for doing this translation BTW ... very interesting. I think the word you want is 'bellows' with an 's' and not bellow. Bellow means a loud noise that an animal might make, like a bull's roar. While bellows means an apparatus for blowing air for instance in a blacksmiths forge. It always takes the 's' and may be singular or plural ... sometimes it is called 'a pair of bellows' even though it is one instrument ... a bit like the lungs really.

Making mistakes is a necessary part of learning. Without mistakes you would not learn anything. You will notice that although the universe may be seen as 'perfect' it is not formally exact ... it has a chaotic randomness. Nature is like this. We are not, or meant to be like automatons ... we misunderstand, forget, bump into lampposts, laugh and get up again ... its life and its ok. That's not to say we should aim to get things wrong ... we are best to strive to to get things wright ... but when we fall short for whatever reason we can just look at what happened, understand and move on. Imagine two people, one has never put a foot wrong and sits in some kind of perfection while the other has been 'out there' ... made mistakes, learned, seen life as it is ... and returned. Which one is truly wise? Which one knows how things really are? And which one is maybe a little frightened of all that?

Ok I'm not really a Taoist in any specific sense but I'll have ago. 1. Heaven is a realm of pure equilibriated yang energy. It is part of the cosmos and of the order of things. As in 'man follows earth, earth follows heaven, heaven follows Tao, Tao follows its own nature'. If you mean heaven as in a place where you go when you die (Christian heaven well this is a different idea.) However its interesting that in a lot of languages the word sky and heaven are the same ... so heaven is part of nature like the sky. 2. Depends what you mean by God and what kind of Taoist you are talking to. There is no equivalent to God = Supreme being as far as I am aware. No god as a person ... although this is a big area for debate, what do we mean by person and can the function of being a person be excluded from Tao if it is absolute ..... 3. Separation of parts of being (hun, po ... other bits ... not sure here) ... depends on level of work achieved in this life if this leads to complete dissolving back into Tao or if spiritual immortality achieved. 4. Beliefs is a difficult word. I'm not aware of any creed as such or emphasis on 'having to believe'. In terms of internal alchemy type practice its more a case of building confidence through actual experience. I think Christianity distorts this idea into a kind need for 'blind faith' which I have not detected in any other religion, let alone Taoism. ???

Addressing OP on samsara and suffering. Samsara is a view of reality engendered by a mind which is grasping at things as possible cures for its own unhappiness. As in if I only had such and such I would be happy ... The grasping mind either achieves the desired object and realises that it does not give happiness or fails to and becomes frustrated/angry. This drives further grasping which repeats the cycle. All this is based on ignorance. In other words on not being aware of the true nature of the mind. Suffering is a component of samsara because the confused/ignorant min which drives it suffers from three types of dhukka ... that is pain itself, the loss arising from everything being temporary and basic conditioning. Suffering is inherent in samsara. But of course ... samsara is itself a false or distorted idea of what is going on. So the suffering is unnecessary ... essentially by dropping desire/wanting the cycle is ended. That's how I understand it.

Stretching to infinity The elastic band of life Snaps back forever.

Let us learn to write Our names first, or make a mark A sign of our own.

Did they find time to play a game of football in between all this?

Most clever politicians will not make any policy commitments in an election campaign because it ties their hands if they do get into office. No offense but the US is the worst for this ... all you hear is shining cities on a hill and together we can ... but no clue about how, when, what and so on. Maybe they should just shut all the candidates in a house together and film them interacting in real time ... people could vote them out by text and the last one in gets to be president. What do you think?

Agree totally about Euro-zone and Greece - although I believe their loans are tied into Euro so devaluing would not be the total solution. the Germans have suggested recently that Greece should loose sovereignty because of their position. I think the funding of candidates is the biggest issue. Gone are the days of individuals canvassing support from like minded people ... now we are sold an image/personality in very vague terms ... I would like to see each candidate given say one million from a central pot and not allowed to spend any more. OK the standard of advertising would go down but the debate would get better.

Softening my gaze ... Oh my god you're beautiful! So won't clean my specs.